Ralfy wants a hat! Fed IV or Advintage Harrison?

[RiffRalf]

Hullo folks new member here. Like many I fell in love with the Indiana Jones hat way back when. I thought to myself "I would love a hat like that" but never thought I would actually be able to find one. Had a couple of so-so leather hats that never really fit too well and certainly did not get the Indy vibe. I had no idea this community existed either. Oh well, 30 years later and here we are
I shaved my head a couple of months ago so now I really need a hat!

I have a big noggin. 62cm round. I am also on the bigger side, 188cm (6'2'') and 240lbs.107kg, so I think I can handle a big hat, no taper like the "stovepipe" Raiders hat.

The FedIV seems a fine choice. The bunny FedIV can be at my door for $134 shipping included. That is about the same as the top People wearing it look great!

Or should I upgrade to the FedIV Delux? However .... the Advintage bunny Harrison can be at my door for $164-same price. Is the $30 worth the price difference for either? May be worth it so one does not have to tear one's hair out -which one no longer has- trying to do a good bash. Is the Advintage Harrison the smarter buy?

Now we're rolling. The Advintage Harrison beaver bunny mix can be at my door for $197. Another $30. Worth it?

But now we are getting into custom territory. An Explorador from Steele and Jones can be at my doorstep for $250. This will be a custom hat. I may be better off going that route. But then there is Northwest hats where the custom Cairo bunny retails for "only" $250, throw in $20 for the S/H and one is still under $300. .. and one would be supporting a lone craftsman plying his dying trade ....

Leaning towards going for a bunny FedIV as a trial, see if I am actually going to wear a hat full time, or going the whole hog with a Northwest hat .... but leaving room to consider an Advintage Harrison. i did notice that the Advintage maxes out at 62cm and I am right there, maybe a little over at 62.25cm ....

To recap: Bunny FedIV vs Advintage Harrison bunny? Worth the extra $30?

Go custom with Steele and Jones or Northwest? Worth the extra $80-100 (110-130 from the FedIV, that's an extra FedIV....)?

I appreciate replies!

[CatManDoo88]

With respect to Fed or Advintage, I think a big question is how important screen accuracy is to you? I had the same debate between a Fed and the Harrison when ordering my first hat a month ago. The Fed is nice, but I understand that its not as stovepipe in shape and can taper. Also, the Fed is a darker and not the correct sable colour. The Harrison in Raiders Sable is really nice looking and screen accurate in colour. For these reasons, I went with a Harrison and was very happy.

Also, be careful where you are measuring your head. A lot of measuring guides say to measure just above your ears and an inch above your eyebrows. I find that measuring there results in a hat that sits much too loose and low for my taste. If you look carefully, the Raiders hat actually sits a good bit higher on the head. You need to be mindful of your own head shape and how you like your hat to fit. Your size might be a bit smaller than you think if you want to wear it a bit higher.

[Howard Weinstein]

Hey, Ralfy. The Fed IV is a great entry-level hat...but, having had both, I think the Harrison is better, and worth the extra money for the bunny/beaver mix.

The Harrison felt is smoother and thinner, but the hat still feels sturdy. Also, AdVintage just introduced 2 great new colors -- the Raiders Sable is pretty much screen-accurate; the otherwise nice dark-brown Fed IV really isn't. You'd also need to change the ribbon and bow to make the Fed IV closer to screen-accurate. The Harrison is pretty much perfect right out of the box.

One other factor: you're a big guy. The Fed IV's side-brim is actually slightly narrower than a true Indy hat -- 2-3/8" vs the Harrison's accurate 2-5/8". That 1/4" may not seem like much, but it makes quite a difference in how the hat looks (even on me, and I'm only 5' 8"). I suspect that would make a considerable difference in how the hat looks on you.

Here's my Harrison bunny/beaver in Raiders sable, Last Crusade bash. Please let me know if you have other questions.

[RiffRalf]

... the Fed is a darker and not the correct sable colour. The Harrison in Raiders Sable is really nice looking and screen accurate in colour. For these reasons, I went with a Harrison and was very happy.

Also, be careful where you are measuring your head. ....

Thanks you make some good points. SA is not -that- accurate to me. As long as the hat captures the gestalt of the raiders hat I am happy. I am not really an indy fanboy, don't get me wrong I love the character, but have no need to emulate him. I just love the hat. I did however notice the warm Raiders sable colour and would totally order that when given the choice. But like my original post mentions, with the Advintage beaver bunny mix I am $50.away from a true custom hat at which time not just my head circumference but also my lengthwise and transverse diameter is going to be taken into account and I may well end uo.with a much better fitting product.

Good point in regards to the measuring also. I have a large head with a high dome so I would probably not mind a lower sitting hat.

Oh if only I lived near one of the hat stores I could just walk in and be fitted in person!

[RiffRalf]

....the having had both, I think the Harrison is better, and worth the extra money for the bunny/beaver mix.

The Harrison felt is smoother and thinner.... the Raiders Sable is pretty much screen-accurate..... The Harrison is pretty much perfect right out of the box.

.... The Fed IV's side-brim is actually slightly narrower than a true Indy hat -- 2-3/8" vs the Harrison's accurate 2-5/8". That 1/4" may not seem like much, but it makes quite a difference .....

Here's my Harrison bunny/beaver in Raiders sable, Last Crusade bash. Please let me know if you have other questions.

Thanks! I "was afraid" that peeps would say the Harrison is the better choice! The hat looks wonderful in pictures including yours. The Raiders Sable seems such a warm beautiful colour, or like my designer ex wife would say "hue" that is quite enchanting. The felt also looks smoother than the FedIV that seems quite a bit coarser than the Harrison and more upmarket choices.

Not having to faff about with the bash is an attraction too.

Good point about the brim. In itself I probably would not mind a slightly smaller brim

I like the Crusade bash. It may be a bit more "suitable" than the Raiders bash if you catch my drift

I have seen some vids in YouTube about getting the bash in. I guess one can always choose to steam the hat uo and change the bash from one variant to the other, go with or without Raiders turn , etc.

I wonder has anyone changed the bash and brim yo a more dressy "Sinatra" of you wish sort of look? I saw a FedIV somewhere that the owner changed to a teardrop crown and it looked great.

[davidd]

Coincidental that you should post this now, as earlier today I was "fussing" with my Fed IV Deluxe in the mirror. I think I figured out why it doesn't look quite "right" to me: the diameter relative to the brim width.

I wear a 61, similar to your size. The original Raiders hat was a 58, I believe. The brim dimensions of the original hat are not "upsized" when the hat size is increased on the Federations, so the brim ends up looking too narrow. Similarly, the crown ends up looking a bit shorter than it should.

Check out the recent thread about the original Raiders hat that is going up for auction. There are some great photos. I can't get the same jaunty slope to the front of the Fed that the original hat has, that high crown and long front brim dip look. I can't get the crown to slope backwards like it should without it hitting the top of my head. I believe it's because my hat is larger in diameter, but the brim width and crown height have not been scaled accordingly.

On my size 61 head, the Fed IV Deluxe (in dark brown), despite my attempts all summer long to wear it a lot and to shape it slowly, looks, to my eye, like an "old man's hat" rather than a jaunty adventurer's hat.

Because of your size requirements, I would suggest you look at some of your other options rather than at the Fed IV.

[RiffRalf]

Coincidental that you should post this now .....

On my size 61 head, the Fed IV Deluxe (in dark brown), despite my attempts all summer long to wear it a lot and to shape it slowly, looks, to my eye, like an "old man's hat" rather than a jaunty adventurer's hat.

Because of your size requirements, I would suggest you look at some of your other options rather than at the Fed IV.

Thanks, great input. That is why I came here, to see if I could learn from other's experiences.

I hope you can make the FedIV work for you after all

[Howard Weinstein]

Coincidental that you should post this now, as earlier today I was "fussing" with my Fed IV Deluxe in the mirror. I think I figured out why it doesn't look quite "right" to me: the diameter relative to the brim width.

I wear a 61, similar to your size. The original Raiders hat was a 58, I believe. The brim dimensions of the original hat are not "upsized" when the hat size is increased on the Federations, so the brim ends up looking too narrow. Similarly, the crown ends up looking a bit shorter than it should.

Check out the recent thread about the original Raiders hat that is going up for auction. There are some great photos. I can't get the same jaunty slope to the front of the Fed that the original hat has, that high crown and long front brim dip look. I can't get the crown to slope backwards like it should without it hitting the top of my head. I believe it's because my hat is larger in diameter, but the brim width and crown height have not been scaled accordingly.

On my size 61 head, the Fed IV Deluxe (in dark brown), despite my attempts all summer long to wear it a lot and to shape it slowly, looks, to my eye, like an "old man's hat" rather than a jaunty adventurer's hat.

Because of your size requirements, I would suggest you look at some of your other options rather than at the Fed IV.

Davidd --

I bought 3 Fed IVs (2 dark brown, 1 Moonstone gray) before I realized they had that standard 1/8-1/4" side-brim discrepancy compared to the known dimensions of the Raiders hat (as listed in the main indy Gear website section on the fedora). Not that they're being sneaky about it -- the Hats Direct website clearly lists the brim dimensions as 70 x 63 mm (2.75" x 2.48"), but I overlooked that info. 2 of my Feds barely measured at 2-3/8" on the brim sides

One of my Fed IVs did come off the assembly line with a full 2.5" side brim, and that looked noticeably better than the shorter ones.

When I discovered the Harrison, I parted with all the Fed IVs. I wonder why, in trying to make an affordable hat that otherwise nails the crown shape/dimensions of a good Indy fedora, the folks at Hats Direct and Akubra opted for the smaller side brim. To me, that detracted from what is otherwise a great hat and led me to seek other options.

[Howard Weinstein]

... the Fed is a darker and not the correct sable colour. The Harrison in Raiders Sable is really nice looking and screen accurate in colour. For these reasons, I went with a Harrison and was very happy.

Also, be careful where you are measuring your head. ....

Thanks you make some good points. SA is not -that- accurate to me. As long as the hat captures the gestalt of the raiders hat I am happy. I am not really an indy fanboy, don't get me wrong I love the character, but have no need to emulate him. I just love the hat. I did however notice the warm Raiders sable colour and would totally order that when given the choice. But like my original post mentions, with the Advintage beaver bunny mix I am $50.away from a true custom hat at which time not just my head circumference but also my lengthwise and transverse diameter is going to be taken into account and I may well end uo.with a much better fitting product.

Good point in regards to the measuring also. I have a large head with a high dome so I would probably not mind a lower sitting hat.

Oh if only I lived near one of the hat stores I could just walk in and be fitted in person!

For me, it's not so much "screen-accuracy" as it is how the hat looks and feels when I'm wearing it. I thought the wider brim and nicer felt of the bunny/beaver Harrison made it by far the better hat choice for me. But my budget kinda hits the limit at around $200, so the Harrison was by far my best option.

As you note, if you can afford to/want to spend more, you do have other choices on the menu. Whether it's a hat, shirt or car, my feeling tends to be, "Buy the best one you can afford without breaking the bank."

Whatever you ultimately decide, I hope you get a hat you love wearing

[RiffRalf]

....

Check out the recent thread about the original Raiders hat that is going up for auction. There are some great photos. I can't get the same jaunty slope to the front of the Fed that the original hat has, that high crown and long front brim dip look. I can't get the crown to slope backwards like it should without it hitting the top of my head. I believe it's because my hat is larger in diameter, but the brim width and crown height have not been scaled accordingly.

On my size 61 head, the Fed IV Deluxe (in dark brown), despite my attempts all summer long to wear it a lot and to shape it slowly, looks, to my eye, like an "old man's hat" rather than a jaunty adventurer's hat..

I did look at those pics (and the brouhaha about the rebashing of the hat, it looks like a re-bash and not a spontaneous had sag to me no matter what the vendor says but that is not for this thread ). I also looked at your hat unwrapping session on the FedIV thread. I still like your hat I have to say I do see what you mean with the smaller brim, I can imagine that it would be more noticeable on the head. I think you may have pushed me toward the Advintage Harrison but probably towards the full bunny as for $200 for the bunny beaver mix I am getting into custom territory.

Oh, and I would definitely get the dark brown. The fawn is nice as well but I think the brown is more Indy-like.

[RiffRalf]

......

Agreed on both. With your and DavidD's comments I am swaying towards the Harrison.

Also agreed on the second statement. OTOH, you get to an area of diminshing returns. I like value for money. That works 2 ways. For not much more than the beaver mix Harrison one can get a Steele and Jones or Northwest custom hat .... but I would not spend $500 or more for a Herbert Johnson.
One has to draw the line somewhere.

[davidd]

I did look at those pics (and the brouhaha about the rebashing of the hat, it looks like a re-bash and not a spontaneous had sag to me....

I agree; but fortunately for us "big head" guys, there's no point in bidding on it anyway!

I have to say I do see what you mean with the smaller brim, I can imagine that it would be more noticeable on the head. I think you may have pushed me toward the Advintage Harrison but probably towards the full bunny....

Yes, the smaller brim on a larger head looks and feels even narrower. Personally, it's the too-short feel of front and back brim that I don't care for.

An advantage to the Fed IV is that there's no wait time, other than for shipping. The hats are in stock. Shipping from Australia to the US usually takes ten days to two weeks, so you don't have to wait very long. I'm not sure what the wait times are like from the other companies. When you start getting in to custom hats, the wait time can be considerable.

[CatManDoo88]

....

Check out the recent thread about the original Raiders hat that is going up for auction. There are some great photos. I can't get the same jaunty slope to the front of the Fed that the original hat has, that high crown and long front brim dip look. I can't get the crown to slope backwards like it should without it hitting the top of my head. I believe it's because my hat is larger in diameter, but the brim width and crown height have not been scaled accordingly.

On my size 61 head, the Fed IV Deluxe (in dark brown), despite my attempts all summer long to wear it a lot and to shape it slowly, looks, to my eye, like an "old man's hat" rather than a jaunty adventurer's hat..

I did look at those pics (and the brouhaha about the rebashing of the hat, it looks like a re-bash and not a spontaneous had sag to me no matter what the vendor says but that is not for this thread ). I also looked at your hat unwrapping session on the FedIV thread. I still like your hat I have to say I do see what you mean with the smaller brim, I can imagine that it would be more noticeable on the head. I think you may have pushed me toward the Advintage Harrison but probably towards the full bunny as for $200 for the bunny beaver mix I am getting into custom territory.

Oh, and I would definitely get the dark brown. The fawn is nice as well but I think the brown is more Indy-like.

The 100% rabbit Harrison is a great hat. It's what I ordered. Great colour and excellent felt quality. It's really light and thin with excellent pouncing for a factory hat. I honestly don't think the 20% beaver makes that huge of a difference. The conclusion in one of the longer threads about felt here was that felt quality is more important than whether it is beaver or rabbit. Penman's Adventurebilt Legacy is 100% rabbit. Rabbit also wears cooler than beaver, so if you want something to cover your head in the summer sun, the rabbit has advantages. However, rabbit doesn't have the same resistance to wet weather as beaver.

[jlee562]

If you have the means for custom, there's no reason you should even consider an Akubra.

Akubra makes nice hats at a good price.

But the overall quality of the components is not high. The leather is frankly, cheap. The felt, while durable to rain and the elements, is roughly finished (i am speaking in a relative sense to high end hats). The ribbon, unremarkable. Akubra/Hats direct could make nicer hats, they just don't feel the higher price point is worth the extra labor ("we have decided to keep the hat as low priced as possible...")

I've often made the analogy that Akubra is the Honda/Toyota of the hat world. You give your Akubra some minimal care and it should keep going and going. But if you are looking for luxury, it misses the mark. And I drive a Honda, so I cast no aspersions! I just think the Fed gets oversold.

[RiffRalf]

Well I ordered a Harrison Raiders full bunny variant from Advintage . It seems the Raiders sable colour is not available in my size as the order would not go through in my size bit it worked for the sable one. I read a lot of threads and it seems a great value. I did request one without the "Raiders turn" so it will lose SA but may be a bit more "suitable."
Thanks all

[RiffRalf]

If you have the means for custom, there's no reason you should even consider an Akubra. ..... Akubra/Hats direct could make nicer hats, they just don't feel the higher price point is worth the extra labor ("we have decided to keep the hat as low priced as possible...")

I've often made the analogy that Akubra is the Honda/Toyota....

I do, I can also go out to dinner with the Lady of the Manor and blow a couple of hundred bucks in one evening, not every day or every week but every now and then,, but I don't want to spend $300-500 on a hat that is going to be collecting dust as I don't yet know if I will actually get the wearing mileage out of it. For $135 or $170 I can take a trial run. Or if I lose it or it gets knocked it's a bit easier to shrug it off. Will I love it I may end up with another hat. Or more you guys know the feeling I'm sure

Honda's and Toyota's are fab these days. No season to go fancy badge nowadays

[Jeremiah]

Hats are meant to be worn. Boots are meant to be worn. Jackets are meant to be worn. Yeah, if you are intending on just a conversation piece I would spend less. If you want rock solid wear, you have many options.

[Howard Weinstein]

Well I ordered a Harrison Raiders full bunny variant from Advintage . It seems the Raiders sable colour is not available in my size as the order would not go through in my size bit it worked for the sable one. I read a lot of threads and it seems a great value. I did request one without the "Raiders turn" so it will lose SA but may be a bit more "suitable."
Thanks all

Weighing all the variables, I think you made a solid choice and you'll be happy with it. And if you're like most of us, wearing a fine fedora will seem odd at first, but pretty soon you'll be wearing it often. And, odds are, you'll get compliments from strangers -- not many people wear these hats these days, but a hat like this simply looks good. Let us know how you like it when it arrives

[Charybdis]

I agree. The AdVintage is a great hat. And when the time comes to get another hat (and oh, that time WILL come!) you can go custom at that point...well worth it!

[RiffRalf]

I agree. The AdVintage is a great hat. And when the time comes to get another hat (and oh, that time WILL come!) you can go custom at that point...well worth it!

My crystal ball and my tea leaves, and that crow that just flew by, seem to indicate a similar pattern....

[RiffRalf]

Hats are meant to be worn. Boots are meant to be worn. Jackets are meant to be worn. Yeah, if you are intending on just a conversation piece I would spend less. If you want rock solid wear, you have many options.

Absolutely! But don't we all have a jacket, a pair of shoes or a shirt that we bought and then for some reason it did not agree and we don't wear it anymore?

[Indiana Jeff]

Indeed, what I think Jeremiah is referring to is members who buy a piece of gear and then are afraid to wear it for fear of "messing it up."

One of the greatest thing about this hobby is the gear worn by Dr. Jones is practical and can be used in everyday life. Unlike say, Stormtrooper armor. (Not that there's anything wrong with owning Stormtrooper armor. )


Regards,

Indiana Jeff

[CatManDoo88]

Well I ordered a Harrison Raiders full bunny variant from Advintage . It seems the Raiders sable colour is not available in my size as the order would not go through in my size bit it worked for the sable one. I read a lot of threads and it seems a great value. I did request one without the "Raiders turn" so it will lose SA but may be a bit more "suitable."
Thanks all

Enjoy! My first order was the same except in Raiders Sable. The regular sable is excellent as well. I believe all of the Harrisons are without the Turn. If I recall correctly, the only way to get a Harrison with the Turn to order Open Crown and bash it yourself. Also there are several scenes where the Hat in Raiders is not Turned. For instance, the opening scene in Peru when Indiana is introduced is a hat without Turn, so it is still screen accurate.

[RiffRalf]

...Enjoy! My first order was the same except in Raiders Sable. The regular sable is excellent as well. I believe all of the Harrisons are without the Turn. If I recall correctly, the only way to get a Harrison with the Turn to order Open Crown and bash it yourself. Also there are several scenes where the Hat in Raiders is not Turned. For instance, the opening scene in Peru when Indiana is introduced is a hat without Turn, so it is still screen accurate.

I really like the warm Raiders Sable colour but I did not want to wait until the Raiders Sable comes in. I think I like the regular sable also, a bit "colder" in hue I think and may actually pair better with my regular outfits. I thought as much about the hat not having a "turn" in some of the scenes, I seem to have read that somewhere and even seen a picture of it one of the threads I have seen on this. The "turn" would probably bug me.

Now the wait continues ....

[Forrest For the Trees]

Good choice. I have Penman's Everyman hat, which is more or less the same hat the Harrison. Leaps and bounds better than my Akubra Federation.

[RiffRalf]

So it has been a while.... took me a while to figure out where to do my fileshaing from as photobucket is now $$$

But anyway, here it is my Advintage Harrison... it arrived in September very nicely packaged















At first glance this is a very nice hat, well put together, nothing like what you see in the regular men's store.







I have a big head, 62.25cm, 7 7/8 inch. Got a size 62. It was a bit tight at first, got a hat stretcher from Amazon and had it on it for a few days. Not sure if I really needed it. At this time it is nicely broken in and fits quite well. Some early pics














It has been an almost daily companion since I received it except for during the really cold days when a woolen hat that covers the ears was required. Its first "adventure" was a hike up the Delaware Water Gap with my lads. It has come with me on a trip to NZ to visit my ailing mother also but I made no pics of that.



It took a bit to get used to wearing a hat and getting used to the somewhat large dimensions of the hat but now I am used to it it really does not faze me anymore. I find it very comfy to wear on my shaven head and feel almost naked, or at least not completely dressed, when I go out without my hat.



A recent pic with my most recent object of desire. I had a 1978 Z1000 back in the 80s. Now there is a new-old classic .... resist .... resist ....



Overall I have enjoyed the ownership and can heartily endorse getting an Advintage Harrison.

I have had quite a few great comments from people. My GF laughed at first but when I asked whether to wear my grey flat cap or the Indy she chose the Indy .... her best friend was all gushy about how dapper I looked and a taxi driver honked and wanted to know where I got the hat ...

I wanted something a bit lighter for the spring and summer so I ordered an Olafvur hat from Mikael at Hufvud in Sweden who has a few posts up here in this forum also







My crystal ball says will probably own a grey Clipper/Airplane for the next autumn season also ...

[Indiana Jeff]

You have chosen wisely.

Brown, tan and grey will suit you well for all wardrobes.

Unless you decide you need a black, and a moss green, and a pecan and a.....


Regards,

Indiana Jeff

[Ridgerunner58]

[A recent pic with my most recent object of desire. I had a 1978 Z1000 back in the 80s. Now there is a new-old classic .... resist .... resist ....]

Resistance is futile . . .

[Charybdis]

Looks fantastic!

[RiffRalf]

Thanks for looking all

[Indy_Dave]

Lots of good info in this thread! I hadn't realized that the Federations didn't adjust brim size as the hat size went up. That's probably the reason they never looked right on me (size 62) but I couldn't place why. My issue with the Federation is the top bash always touched the top of my head, even if I didn't bash it that deep. They are good, sturdy hats though.