Block making advice?

[mark seven]

I would like to make my own block to use for re-blocking my hats to replace my old hatshaper.

I had an idea to find a hat with a nice crown shape,bigger than my hat-size and use the inside of the hat as a mold to make my block.I've been searching for a long time to find the right hat.

Then,I found an old Homburg hat at a bargain price( smaller than my size) but has a crown-shape that is the EXACT size and dimensions of the block that I am looking for..if you imagine the Crown of this hat being a block-this is exactly what I'm looking for for my block!

Is it possible to make a mold of the outside of this hat?,has anyone here done this?,if so what materials do I need to make the mold and what do I make the block from?,what should I use to seal the hat felt?
I have had experince of using Alginate and dental stone(my thoughts for block-material?),but would be willing to try other materials reccomended(my wood-working skills are not up to making a wooden block).

Basically,I would love to have an exact-copy of the crown of this hat to use as a hard-block,any thoughts/advice? appreciated!

Here's the hat..

[DR Ulloa]

If you line the inside of the hat with a plastic bag and pour some plaster in there, it should do the job. By the way, that is a beautiful hat! It looks a lot like the one worn by Russel Crowe in 3:10 to Yuma.

Dave

[mark seven]

Thanks Dave,but if I mould the inside of this hat the block will be too small,I need to mould the outside of the hat so I get an exact copy of the outside of the crown without losing any size..yes it is a beautiful hat,I would like to mould it without damaging it if I can.

[Ohio Jones]

You could always make a reverse mold. Make a container that you could suspend the hat into. Fill the inside of the hat with something to make it rigid (paper towels..ect) .....wrap the outside of the hat with plastic.....suspend the hat into the container......fill up the container with plaster or something along those lines.....when it is dry you can remove the hat.....then you can spit that mold and seal it. Strap or bungee those halves together...and pour in your medium for the hat block. Let that dry and pull it apart.

I have seen them do that for replicating bones and such for museum pieces...but you might only get one use out of the negative mold.

Should not be that hard. I have done small things like that...but I make my blocks out of wood.

Cheers

[BendingOak]

I don't understand why you would want to make a mold of the outside of the hat? You will need to account for the felt.

[Ohio Jones]

I don't understand why you would want to make a mold of the outside of the hat? You will need to account for the felt.

From what I gathered is that the hat in the picture is a little to small for his head...if I read it right?

[BendingOak]

Ho much smaller?

[mark seven]

The circumferance of this hat's crown is 22"-same as my hat-shaper block-the difference is in the proportions-this hat is a little bit shorter and narrower than the hat-shaper block(and not so domey),which is exactly what I want.
I find the hat-shaper is too wide and tall for my face-shape and height.

[DR Ulloa]

My suggestion would be tho make a mold of the inside of the hat and send it off to someone like Richard Lamode to have him size it up. It would cost you a bit, but it would be worth it if that is what you really want. If the hat is too small for you, I don't think making a cast of the outside will be enough. This would be the only way to do it, I think. Or at least, the most effective way.

Dave

[mark seven]

Dave,you have to imagine that the outside of the hat in the pics is not a hat but a finished block..I need to take a mould of the outside of the hat,pour something into the mould and cast a block from the mould and then I should have a block that is an exact copy of the hat.The hat is exactly the right shape and size to make a nice block for me..it's just..right!.I'll take some pics tommorrow of the hat-shaper and Homburg side by side for comparison(just pretend that the outside of the hat is a block-until it IS a block! ),it's really not that far off the hat-shaper,just shorter and narrower.

[WalkingEye]

Ohio is right, make a mould of the outside of the homburg. if you want to make a reusable negative mould you have to make it in two pieces. you have to make a ### at the middle of the crown that is the same shape as the contour of the hat then make the mould of one half, remove the ### and carve in a couple of registration holes in the wall of the mould then treat the surface area that will join the second half of the mould with a release agent like vaseline. then cover the other half of the crown with more plaster. by doing this you don't have to break the mould to get the hat out and you can get about a half dozen or so casts from it if you are careful.

finally, a use for those 4 years of art school as a sculpting major!

if you need any help let me know.

[mark seven]

Thanks guys! ,any tips for reinforcing the inside of the hat without damaging it?.I was thinking of putting clingfilm over the crown to protect it.

[WalkingEye]

how stiff is the hat?
you could cover the inside of the hat as well with clingwrap then paper mache the inside to make it nice and stiff. you would need to build up enough thickness of paper mache to make it rigid.. though that would be rather time consuming. or you could try tightly bunching up newsprint or any other kind of paper and stuffing the inside of the hat.

remember... like Ohio said, once you make the negative mould you have to treat it to be able to make a positive cast from it especially if you are using plaster on plaster.

[Ohio Jones]

My suggestion would be tho make a mold of the inside of the hat and send it off to someone like Richard Lamode to have him size it up. It would cost you a bit, but it would be worth it if that is what you really want. If the hat is too small for you, I don't think making a cast of the outside will be enough. This would be the only way to do it, I think. Or at least, the most effective way.

Dave

I actually have a block that is 23 3/4 in circ. I measured around a hat body that was drying and that measured 24 1/2 inches.

[mark seven]

Here's the hat with the hat-shaper for comparison..



I'm ordering Dental Stone and plaster bandages from Tiranti,looking forward to making my first block!

[Fedora]

You can do what an old custom hatter here showed me a few years ago. He took a hat that he wanted a block to look like, and used fiber glass on the inside of the hat, to make the hat sturdy. I think he used the sheets of the stuff, not sure, but its the same stuff you use to repair car bodies. You build up several layers on the inside of the hat to make the entire hat hard. He had some that you could actually stand on, without them breaking. Once you harden the hat in this manner, you could then cut off the brim and voila, you have your hat block. Sure the outside would be felt, but I have seen many old blocks in hat shops that were sized up to the next size, just by pulling a hat body over the wood block, and tacking the body at the bottom of the block. Of course, you cut the brim off of the body first. Then, if you needed to use the block for the size the block was made for, you just pull off the body, and you have the smaller size.

This guy, Walt, also made blocks by just coating the inside of the hat with this fiber glass stuff, and once he got enough layers to reinforce the hat, he would sand off the felt, therby having a copy of the hat, in the size of the particular hat. Fedora

[mark seven]

Thanks Steve! ,I can pick up a fibre-glass kit tommorrow.

[Snapbrim76]

Good luck with that Mark Seven, hope it works out well. Maybe you could make a block can't wait for tomorrow to see the 'Holy Grail'.