Club Obi Wan

sebas

Hello all! :TOH: I haven't posted in ages... Here are some pics of my 1998 Wested that I took circa 2009. Cheers! http://a4.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/32/13a2a5a10abe4c98a23dbeed174fdae4/l.jpg http://a3.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/39/9c263b04e866410195adaced201cc894/l.jpg http://a4.ec-i...

sebas

Gotcha, guys. Thanks for clearing that up. Clearly, I have a lot of catching up to do.
Great looking jacket indeed!
Cheers, fellas!

sebas

First of all, a big hello to everyone! I haven't posted in well over a year. One thing about this Bantu Wind jacket: was it not noted or assumed that the side straps were attached with inseam stitching? ie, like the 90s Westeds? Hence all the past discussions on the similiarites between protoype-ban...

sebas

That sounds great, _. Best of luck and make sure you grill him about those unusual 90s Wested strap specs!
Cheers!
Sebastian

sebas

As to the Wested, there was no pattern 'found in the barn'. What was supposedly found was an unfinished jacket for Raiders that was never delivered to set (according to Peter) and was found in a pile of old unfinished jobs when they moved from their Ordinance St. address to the Little Wested locati...

sebas

Has anyone ever attempted to map out or diagram a sort of "Jacket Family Tree" or organization chart? It'd be interesting to visualize the jacket's different "lineages" and incarnations.

sebas

I'm guessing you mean the strap stitching on the panel? It's X-Box stitching and that is not what every Indy jacket made today uses. Even from Wested X-box is a custom request is it not? If you mean general stitching, I don't think it is exactly the same as every other Indy jacket out there today e...

sebas

a stitch for stitch jacket sebas no, but you can see it in the '90s era Wested. There are differences yes but look at the general jacket. Well, I guess we'll have to 'agree to disagree' on this one RC. That Keppler strap placement and exterior back panel stitching is what current Westeds have (as w...

sebas

Thank you for the clarification on the photos. That explains why it looks so much like a '90s era Wested Raiders jacket RC, to me that jacket looks nothing like a 90s Wested: the color, the pocket shape, and most tellingly: the (correct!) strap placement and stitching. I don't see the 'Hero' specs ...

sebas

Roger that, Michaelson. I'm not trying to build any real theory. Unlike many of you here, I'm not nearly knowledgeble enough on the subject matter to seriously surmise or bring to light anything of real value. I just have a lot of questions. Primarily revovling around those odd-ball Wested specs. If...

sebas

Zombie Jones wrote:

Schmucks? Come on, that's Pink Floyd!

sebas

Maybe this goes more in the thread that Sebas started since he's advanced this same question, but, as it was stated here, I thought I'd keep it here. Why do you believe that this is so? If Peter created a jacket that was remarkably close to the Cooper jacket, why did he suddenly revert back to anot...

sebas

Are you suggesting the Last Crusade jacket had the same strap placement and stitching as those '90s Leather Concessionaires jackets? Quite clearly, this is not the case. Compare this Smithsonian detail... http://farm1.static.flickr.com/52/140467006_1a807eabaa_o.jpg With a 98 Wested on the right... ...

sebas

_, this is excellent. As you cryptically stated in the previous Wested thread: "I think that there is an opportunity - and an obligation - to look at what we know, what we think we know, and what we believe. Thing that once seemed obvious before just don't feel that way in light of newer inform...

sebas

In reality, _, the only thing I'm curious about at this point is why Peter made those 90s jackets with the unsual strap specs, being aware (apparently) that they were just that: unusual. It makes you wonder. well, I honestly believe he just forgot and thought it was like that... why do I think that...

sebas

............ Like I said, I find it bemusing that Peter would apply these unsual, lesser-known specs on those 90s Wested just "for the heck of it." I mean, he was well aware of the "hero" specs as we can see in that Leather Concessionaries jacket above. Very weird. Having said t...

sebas

First, I've reread the whole string again, and I think where Sebas and I are not connecting is on this jacket. To me it is a pre-2000 wested/leather concessionaire. I'd bet dinner and rounds for everyone here that it is not a Cooper/USW. But I think that if we hold that aside, I'm following you, Se...

sebas

I'm sure there's some problems with this theory but it does help match up some disparate elements and it could explain why Wested's early jackets have some things in common with the Bantu Wind jacket (placement of straps, etc.). What you say makes a lot of sense, Crismans. Definitely something to p...

sebas

Indiana Holt wrote:why not go to the source itself and simply ask. non other then him can give a better answer to that...

Roger that, Holt. Good idea. I'll drop Peter a line and report back.

sebas

As for the variances in a few older Westeds, here's a thread I made a year ago. I just fixed all the links, and the pictures they link to are very big. http://indygear.com/cow/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=37213&p=532264#p532264 Thanks for this DeWayne. Those pictures are fantastic. However, it's a p...

sebas

Thing is, and just saying this as a side comment and nothing more....isn't that the charm of a custom hand made jacket? No two are alike? Just a thought. Indeed, Michaelson! While most Indy jackets these days offer standard SA specs it's nice to have one -that while altogether not accurate- still h...

sebas

Interesting info, guys. I dug that pic up in an older thread. I'll go back and see if I can discern its age. Regarding mine, in 1998 I simply ordered a "Raiders authentic lamb" and sent Peter my measurements. It came as you see above: inseam sidestrap stitching and attached to the hand wam...

sebas

Okay, now I'm really confused. I recently found these pics of an old Leather Concessionaries jacket in an old thread: http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h133/sandwmdl58/Jacket001.jpg http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h133/sandwmdl58/Jacket002.jpg Very interesting, because this is clearly a jacket wit...

sebas

Respect is what happens when one does the right things for the right reasons. One does not get respect by saying or doing things that are easy. Uh...okay. Look, I'm not looking for "respect" nor am I trying to say or do anything that's "easy" or any of that nonensense. I'm just ...

sebas

Also, the less scrupulous tend to use them 'creatively' to confuse. If ankle-biters put as much effort in participating for honorable reasons... Well, fill in the blank… _, while you're greatly revered by everyone on this forum (especially those of us that have been here for years) as an authority ...

sebas

Thanks for the link RC. I thought that thread was dead and gone years ago! I'll have a gander...

sebas

My thoughts after several rounds of Butterfield jacket threads are close to RCs. Due to the many similarities between that jacket and late 90s/early 2000s, I think that the Butterfield jacket is an early LC/Wested jacket that was distressed Last Crusade style. I'll admit that the distressing is rem...

sebas

Sebas, I'm reading what you say and I look at the pictures. I'm sorry, but I think this is a case where you see a silk purse but I see a sow's ear. That Wested you show a pic of looks just like the one I wore (proudly at the time) to examine Terry Leonard's jacket. I came away disillusioned with pa...

sebas

According to David Hack, sebas, it's a Cooper made jacket using the original pre-production WC supplied patterns, and not a Wested. Thanks for the info Michaelson. I'm aware it's not a Wested, but again, the specs (the pockets, the lower sidestraps) are the same as on those early Westeds. Would it ...

sebas

Thanks for the info and insight, _. According to my info -mostly past threads- those were pictures of a Butterfields auction of Martin Grace's jacket. More to the point, the only thing I'd like to know more about is the reasons why the 90s Westeds looked like they did. Having made LC just a few year...

sebas

That's some interesting info there, Mike. (It'd be great to see some images of those jackets!) The questions that stand out in my mind are: -Why wouldn't Peter simply continue producing the same Keppler-spec jacket in his early Westeds? -What accounts for those differences on the early Westeds? -Las...

sebas

After reading the Last Crusade article on the main site, there were a few things that jumped out at me. They have to do with the Lee Keppler-Wested link. According to the official account, the following is true: 1. Peter Botwright patterned the LC jackets based on a Lee Keppler-made Raiders jacket (...

sebas

RC Signals wrote in the recently locked post:

The jacket pictured is Lee Kepplers jacket from the mid '80s, and likely the basis for your '90s jacket.

I seriously doubt that, RC. If that's the case why is the strap placement on the both jackets so radically different?

sebas

In my view, a key question to be answered is: -Why are the patterns of the early (90s) Wested's and the Bantu Wind/Martin Grace jackets so similar? Some refresher pics of the 90s Wested compared the Grace Jacket. http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/18/l_66cf06bf28ab49aebf46308692b5d1df.jpg ...

sebas

The pocket size is accurate, however on the Marin Grace jacket (as well as the early Westeds) have the side strap sewn directly on the bottom of the hand warmer openneing. Interesting nonetheless. What jacke is this again RC?

sebas

In my view, a key question to be answered is: -Why are the patterns of the early (90s) Wested's and the Bantu Wind/Martin Grace jackets so similar? Some refresher pics of the 90s Wested compared the Grace Jacket. http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/18/l_66cf06bf28ab49aebf46308692b5d1df.jpg ...

sebas

Dutch_jones wrote:Sebas that is a LC jacket in the picture. Martin Grace's jacket is from another year of auction I believe.

Don't think so... That's the Martin Grace jacket from Raiders...

sebas

In my view, a key question to be answered is: -Why are the patterns of the early (90s) Wested's and the Bantu Wind/Martin Grace jackets so similar? Some refresher pics of the 90s Wested compared the Grace Jacket. http://c4.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/18/l_66cf06bf28ab49aebf46308692b5d1df.jpg h...

sebas

Hi guys, It's been a while, but I'm popping in to give my two cents. As I pointed out several months ago, the "fake punch" picture and the Bantu Wind jackets differ for two reasons: -The Bantu Wind has internal straps, the "fake punch" picture does not. -The Bantu Wind yoke and a...

sebas

Hey guys. Fair enough, and thanks for the photographic examples Eric. However, there's still the issue of the inseam vs. external straps which are clearly different in these pictures. Also, I think the sleave seam lines up with the yoke seam, which -again- varies. Here's a pic, which -granted- is qu...

sebas

Hey Planton, As I mentioned previously in another thread, I very much disagree that the jacket in the b&w promo pic you posted is also the Banut Wind jacket. To me, they're clearly different jackets. As you can see from the photos below, the Bantu Wind's jacket side straps has inseam attachment,...

sebas

Great-looking jacket, indy1936. I love the grain and color. Having said that, those cargo pockets indeed are tiny. Temple of Doomish. A bit of a hybrid jacket, I suppose.
Cheers.

sebas

Eric, just checking out the thread. WOW just WOW!!!

Amazing jacket you have there.

One for the books. I love all the screen cap comparison photos too. Sending you a big high-five from Spain!

sebas

Here's one of Spielberg wearing a bona fide Indy jacket!!

sebas

If he's (Peter) known this all this time that the jacket had 'marks', why post this information now? It's been asked in the past, but no response until today, and we've been hammering at this information since Indyfan.com came on line in 1995. http://a181.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/121/l_e64...

sebas

http://www.indygear.com/cow/viewtopic.php?t=35315 It is not.. see picture of back versus sleeves, front, collar of mine posted above and on pg 15 of this forum,also it's real texture and grain, variable and definitely not embossed or stamped as Peter stated...it's the real deal...again the pics pos...

sebas

Here's an example of different texturing on the same jacket. Compare pocket flaps. http://a181.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/121/l_e645fe0e455d92e310f09b1c4d704f74.jpg Nowak has that textured surface all over the jacket which seems to be over-kill. I mean, it's impossible that -at this juncture-...

sebas

I disagree. Looking at the cover of the catalog, it looks like the strap is connected near the seam, not the pocket. Certainly not at the bottom of the opening like your jacket. Point taken! It could be attached further back, as you point out. It's a tight angle in the pic. However, the lower strap...

sebas

HOLY ####!!!! :shock: :shock: :shock: Besides the cargo pocket size and the collar, this Martin Grace jacket has yet another EXACT similarity to the 90s Westeds that no other jackets have: The strap is placed lower, connecting to the bottom side of the cargo pocket itself!! (Holt, what's the techina...

sebas

Again, it goes to show that the older 90s Westeds were indeed a lot more SA than most gearheads care to admit, folks. The cargo pocket size are a good indication. The newer Wested's (as are Todd's) pockets are much smaller and squared off. Notice the Martin Grace jacket has no piping either, like th...

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