Club Obi Wan

*This is not a bash comparison, merely a product to product comparison as that is what was available on the day. I realize this is a LC AB offering with Lee's Raiders. I loved both hats, but merely think between these two particular 'models' I preferred the Keppler with the Raiders bash. You'll have to excuse me sometimes in my posts as I have developed into somewhat of a Raiders snob. I'm working on it.*

I had the unique opportunity during the Queen Mary Indy Summit
in Long Beach a few weeks ago to physically check out
both the AB Deluxe Fedora Last Crusade model and Lee Keppler's newest Raiders offering. Two more beautiful hats out the to make our choice even harder.

Here's how they shaped up to me.

Keppler in front, AB in back.


Right off the bat I could see that both fedoras were made from high
quality beaver felt. The AB looked a little lighter, and wasn't as stiff
a felt as Lee's.
Both 100% pure Beaver Felt.
Keppler on left. AB on right.


The larger Raiders crown and more robust shape of Lee's hat immediately
had me leaning towards his lid as I prefer the Raiders Raven Bar
look and the darker color and Lee has hit this one right on the mark.
The AB hat with the LC crown of course had a more of a conservative 'square' look to it, perfect for LC fans.
Keppler on left. AB on right.


Lee's ribbon is spot on Raiders and have excellent color and weave. Lee had these ribbons specially
made to match his own strict color and weave requirements. Even the double bow is just right.
Keppler:


The AB had the finer, dressed up feel to the ribbon along with the softer felt. Again great for LC.
AB:


Both hats featured an elegant liner and leather sweat band.
Ab on left. Keppler on right.


In the end, both hats are splendid offerings. The AB is a
beautiful dress fedora with a very soft feel, but in the end
the $400+ S & H and a four to six month wait time has me
ultimately leaning toward the super accurate and little bit more reasonably
priced Keppler Fedora which will ultimately be offered at less than
$300 and will have a much shorter wait time if any. Plus, he'll
hand bash it to any scene you like and he's a pleasure to deal with.

In Conclusion:

My vote ultimately went to Lee for his very sturdy, accurate,
and reasonably priced offering. As with all of us, if I were rich, I'd probably
have a fedora from each for all occasions.

Great job Lee! Keep up the great work.

That Keppler does look awesome! That felt looks so rich and soft. I know this hat will be a hit. I'm not in the market for another brown fedora, but if I was, this would be it!

Dave

Thanks for posting, Wade! It's about time someone showed better pics of the hat. It'd be nice to see a side by side comparison of the hats with the same bash though, especially since the AB shown looked like a CS bash next to a Raiders. Still, I wish I had seen this hat earlier in the day when I did. Nice job, Lee! As for price, he quoted me $299, which is technically under $300. ;-)

Nice pics Wade, but don't forget that the AB has a CS bash, not a raiders, wich explains the difference in looks. the AB can also be ordered with a Raiders bash. ;-)

That being said I do like Keppler's new hat

Regards, Geert

Also, the AB Deluxe uses a different beaver felt. Lee's 100% beaver shares the same Winchester felt as Steve Delk's standard AB. If you purchased a recent AB from Steve, it will match the color of Lee's. I compared mine as such. ;-)

Nice comparison. In this case, aren't you comparing a Raiders styled hat against a CS styled hat? There will be a marked difference, as we can see by the photos.

Agreed, bink, it would have been nice if a comparison had been made between a standard AB and Lee's new hat. Other than the styling, that would have been a 1:1 comparison on felt.

Lee always produces nice stuff.

Regards! Michaelson

hi wade,

just a few corrections to make note of or perhaps ask for confirmations on.........you mentioned the AB was a deluxe but it looks like one of Steve's.

also, comparing a CS hat to a ROTLA hat is not apples to apples as far as shape/creasing/bashing/and overall volume. (ie - the CS hat is suppose to look more "squarish" )

the keppler is a factory produced hat whilst the AB is a handmade custom.

other than that, that is an excellent report of your findings sir. thank you for sharing.

that keppler beaver raiders is gonna be one bad mamma jamma when the orders start falling on to people's heads. great job lee!!!!

Michaelson wrote:Nice comparison. In this case, aren't you comparing a Raiders styled hat against a CS styled hat? There will be a marked difference, as we can see by the photos.

Agreed, bink, it would have been nice if a comparison had been made between a standard AB and Lee's new hat. Other than the styling, that would have been a 1:1 comparison on felt.

Lee always produces nice stuff.

Regards! Michaelson

Very true - it isn't really accurate to describe the Keppler as more accurate, Wade. They're modelled after different movies. In some ways, I'd actually say the AB is more accurate though, since they've got the authentic ribbon. -M

whoa......looks like alot of people beat me to the point this time. i better be faster outta the blocks. time to get some java

Indiana G wrote: that keppler beaver raiders is gonna be one bad mamma jamma when the orders start falling on to people's heads. great job lee!!!!

Agreed, especially with that price tag for a 100% beaver fedora from the hands of Lee Keppler!

Regards! Michaelson

I think from the pics this is the best offering Lee has yet put out. I'd love to see one in person.

Great job, Lee.

wow! that new Keppler looks fantastic! In fact both hats look great!
I hope to see more pics of the Keppler in the future!

Sometimes I forget to be as specific as possible with my posts here. I will try and observe the technicalities in the future.

Please read again for the 'revised' version of the review.


W

Both are fine looking hats. Both look authentic to the film & Indian Jones idea - and both look to be constructed by gentlemen who understand, know, and love hats. Having both might be the reasonable choice.

I ordered the AB last July and look forward to wearing it, not because of AB's association to the film, but because fedoras true to the period aren't fully understood by contemporary hat-shapers.

If you scour the films of thirties and forties - even twenties - you'll see the higher crowns and complementary ribbons. James Cagney in G-Men sports a fedora similar to the Ab and Keppler. And Bogart, of course, in the Maltese Falcon wears a good looking fedora. But many contemporary fedoras have shorter crowns and narrower brims. I suspect these more compact hats emerged during the fifties when cars were becoming streamlined, with lower tops. I have read that car tops had more to do with the disappearance of hats than JFK's skipping his.

I have no doubt I'll be more than pleased with AB. But the Keppler is sorely tempting. Heck, you can't have too many hats. (Best stored upside down at 62 degrees...)

One more hat...

One hat I really want is the one John Huston wore is Chinatown. A fedora with a distinctive western flair. Hard to find.

I think the main reason people choose low-crowned hats now though is because they don't want to stand out. But yes, in the 50's it probably was due to the lower tops in cars. -M

That's true.

My 1950 Plymouth touted the fact it had a high roof line, unlike OTHER cars of it's day, where a man or woman could wear the tallest hat they wanted and not worry about it touching the roof. So far it's been true. NONE of my hats come anywhere near the roof, but in other cars of the era that are owned by several of friends, my '50's lower crowned hats work MUCH better than the higher '30's style fedora crowns.

Regard! Michaelson

Indiana G wrote:that keppler beaver raiders is gonna be one bad mamma jamma when the orders start falling on to people's heads. great job lee!!!!

I agree. Mine (got it last month) certainly is:

I've got a fastback Mustang which has a really low roof and my hats enver touch the roof. Don't let JFK get off easy on this.

Dave

Actually, I forget the details, but the thing about Kennedy causing it is a myth. -M

Back to the topic of the thread...

agent5 wrote:I think from the pics this is the best offering Lee has yet put out. I'd love to see one in person.

Great job, Lee.

5, if you've seen a current AB from Steve's shop, the felt is identical. The biggest difference is that Lee's is a factory produced hat, but it's nicely done at that. Wade's pictures do this hat more justice than any passing shots I have of it.

I'm currently looking for a new hat to buy in the next few months. I'm glad you posted this. I'd almost be curious to see how it compares with the Henry. Hopefully Keppler gets his website up soon.

Lee's blend fedora is what you can compare the Henry to. You can never compare a blended fur hat like the Henry to a pure beaver like this Keppler.

Dave

just a few corrections to make note of or perhaps ask for confirmations on.........you mentioned the AB was a deluxe but it looks like one of Steve's.

Indy G is right, that is NOT an AB Deluxe, as far as I can see. (Liner and sweatband look nothing like anything I've ever seen in one of Marc's hats)I'd say it looks like a STANDARD Adventurebilt made by Steve, NOT an AB Deluxe which is only made by Marc. Considering the amount of confusion that exists between the two versions of AB, it's an easy enough mistake to make, but you might want to change the title of the thread and the info in it to reflect that this is a regular AB, not a Deluxe. ;-)

Either way, the Keppler and the regular AB pictured here are both swell looking hats.

DR Ulloa wrote:Lee's blend fedora is what you can compare the Henry to. You can never compare a blended fur hat like the Henry to a pure beaver like this Keppler.

Dave

I’d agree with that. Lee’s 100% beaver is made out of the same felt (literally from the same felt producer) as the Penman & the Adventurebuilt. Lee’s blend hat is made out of a rabbit/beaver blend, as is the Henry.

The one thing that Lee’s blend has going for it over all other hats (as far as I can tell) is that it has a color that’s closest to Raiders. I use to have online arguments with Fedora years ago about what was the correct color for Raiders. He said it was darker, I said it was lighter. At this point I don’t think that anyone would argue that the CS hat is darker than the Raiders hat.

There are so many good choices now, I almost wish that I had an Indy hat, but it’d only be “another artifact collecting dust”. Heck, I would have never gotten rid of my Optimo Indy’s if I still wanted one. Those were great.
;-)

Just to clarify for everyone following this thread:

The hat pictured above is an Adventurebilt made by Steve Delk and personally bashed to his Crystal Skull specs. This is NOT an Adventurebilt Deluxe as posted.

Also, the hat was delivered late October/early November of 2008. So it is a very new hat in terms of age... It's only been out of the box once before...

May as well compare apples to apples here.

Here is my Raiders fedora. Once I snip off a bit from the bottom of the bow(it is showing), this one is fixin to be mailed. Please feel free to use my photos to do a side by side comparison, so we can see how the hats vary. But first, let me say great job Lee!!! And very happy you decided to go the beaver route. Our hats will outlast you and I.


Ok, here is my Raiders fedora with a 4 1/2 inch height on the front pinch.



And here she is with a 4 3/4 front height on the front pinch.





Here she is kicked back.





And here she is front the non bow side.




And here is my fav. Compare it to the one when Indy is in the tent with Marion and Sallah, and you get the shadowy side shot of Indy's hat.




Then there's the back view.



And another from a different angle.


And finally the bow.



Not my best bow, but I would wear it so.........and the little piece of ribbon showing beneath the right side bottom of the bow will be snipped off! Before I mail it out to Mr. Knapp. ;-)

Lee's ribbon is spot on Raiders

Did you see in hand the original Raider's ribbon? The reason I ask, is because we were told that the AB ribbon is what HJ used way back when. The content of rayon may have changed, but the color is supposed to be the same.

On the bows, neither Beaver Brands or mine are a perfect match to the film, but, to me, mine look closer. Some of mine look better than others. But all have a flying v visible, that occurs naturally when I put the little crease in the bow. Also, the Beaver Brand pinch in the bow is TOO HIGH. Let's call a spade a spade here. This is a very anal retenive bunch here, and I am surprised one of our stitch Nazis has not already posted as such. Wait, I just did it!!! Fedora

wadventure wrote:Lee's ribbon is spot on Raiders and have excellent color and weave. Lee had these ribbons specially
made to match his own strict color and weave requirements. Even the double bow is just right.

The AB had the finer, dressed up feel to the ribbon along with the softer felt. Again great for LC.

Knowing that the AB uses the original Raiders ribbon, this part of the review caused me to chuckle just a bit.

Kind of reminds me of when Darthbish tried to claim that his Fed4 had a better block than the AB. I really wish people would do their homework on these things. -M

Superb hat. The AB Deluxe I ordered will be well worth the wait.

Do Lee's hats have a taller crown than the Adventurebilt, as it looks, or is it just the bash that makes it taller?
FWIW, My .02 goes for the AB in the lineup.

Kind of reminds me of when Darthbish tried to claim that his Fed4 had a better block than the AB. I really wish people would do their homework on these things. -M

I am in a peculiar position here. I am a vendor. But only chimed in because my hat was being compared to another, with one being a Raiders and the other a CS.

I welcome comparisons. I will put my hat along side any other. The above comparison to me was not genuine. The original one, that is.

But Lee is a friend, so I certainly never want to say anything negetive about the hats he has made for him at Beaver Brands. He was the original vendor of Indy gear. And a heck of a nice guy. And his hats are good buys. And very suitable for Indy fedoras. Plus, he has upgraded as time has passed, and has not been satisfied with the status quo. Kudos to Lee!! It gives us so many choices today, when compared to yesteryear.

But with that said, I personally still think my ABs are not only as close as you can get in blockshape, but they are top of the line hats. When the original poster said the ribbon and bow were more accurate, I spit out my mouthful of coffee! Any Indy nut can see the bow's crease is way too high. It should be more or less centered in the bow itself. But nuff of that stuff.

The one thing that Lee’s blend has going for it over all other hats (as far as I can tell) is that it has a color that’s closest to Raiders. I use to have online arguments with Fedora years ago about what was the correct color for Raiders. He said it was darker, I said it was lighter. At this point I don’t think that anyone would argue that the CS hat is darker than the Raiders hat.

The color of Lee's rabbit hats, were indeed the best color out there. I fully agree! And, Rundquist my friend, you were indeed the winner of our debate years ago. I was fooled by some of the low light scenes in which the hat appeared a reddish brown. The new film proved without a doubt that the original hats were lighter in brown.

Marc and I realized this later on, and could have went with a lighter brown, but both had seen lighter brown hats, bleached out by the sun that were no longer accurate in color. We figured if we went darker, once ours bleached out, they would be close to the right color. Yeah, we figured our hats would last long enough for the bleaching to occur. I have gotten back some that I made oh, 5 years ago, that were so much lighter in color than when I sent them. So, it seems to work.



In the end, we buy the hat that appeals to each of us. And lord knows, there are a multitude out there today that are worthy Indy fedoras. Sure, I think mine are the best, but heck, I am extremely predjudiced!!!! If I see one that looks better than mine, I have no qualms about tweaking my blocks!!! But on these factory hats, that is very hard to do, as they have a limited inventory of blocks these days. Most of the vintage blocks are no longer used, and the inventories have been culled down to just make and sell, what will sell. Not much variety anymore in blockshapes. Unless you go with someone like Art, who has a huge collection of vintage blocks. And the go to guy for anyone seeking very vintage- esque fedoras, or any other dress hat for that matter.


The first thing I noticed about Lee's new hat is he got rid of the front slant that was a bit too much when the hat was viewed from the side. The slant on the front pinch. This was always a weak area on his prior hats.

I had sent out a very good block to Beaver Brands last year, for Lee, and perhaps they had him some blocks made to replicate it. I know they never sent my block back to me!!!!! A number 25 vintage block. This new hat looks like it could have come off of that same block that I sent, or a copy of it. Definetely an improvement over his older hats. If this is the case, beat that new Keppler Beaver up, and sit on it a few times, and you will be very pleased with the results. Fedora

Fedora wrote:

The one thing that Lee’s blend has going for it over all other hats (as far as I can tell) is that it has a color that’s closest to Raiders. I use to have online arguments with Fedora years ago about what was the correct color for Raiders. He said it was darker, I said it was lighter. At this point I don’t think that anyone would argue that the CS hat is darker than the Raiders hat.

The color of Lee's rabbit hats, were indeed the best color out there. I fully agree! And, Rundquist my friend, you were indeed the winner of our debate years ago. I was fooled by some of the low light scenes in which the hat appeared a reddish brown. The new film proved without a doubt that the original hats were lighter in brown.

Marc and I realized this later on, and could have went with a lighter brown, but both had seen lighter brown hats, bleached out by the sun that were no longer accurate in color. We figured if we went darker, once ours bleached out, they would be close to the right color. Yeah, we figured our hats would last long enough for the bleaching to occur. I have gotten back some that I made oh, 5 years ago, that were so much lighter in color than when I sent them. So, it seems to work.

Can't argue with that. ;-)

Not to belabor a point, but I was just thinking. It is hard to get a good bow in a factory made hat. First of all, they are probably not Indy fans, and really don't know what the bow is supposed to look like. Or, if they do, they have to do these very fast for production reasons.

And that is one of the reasons, the guys like me, Marc, John Penman, and 3M$ sell hats, although it can be a slow process to get one. We actually TRY very hard to recreate the proper Raiders bow. Now, mine are not yet perfect, using the film stills as a reference, but they are alot closer than most factory made bows. And this is just another reason why custom made Indy hats are in demand, even with the slow production times. Here is one I just finished, and not the other one posted above. Different hat, but again my attempt at recreating the Raiders bow.




And you can see the "flying V" in this shot. Again, not perfect, but I can assure you, I spent a lot of time making this bow.



But we have to thank goodness that there are factory hats out there, that don't require the long wait. And Lee's new offering is certainly in the top 10 per cent of desirable factory hats.


I would have never posted on a thread about the new Keppler IF a bad lookding CS fedora had not been used for a comparison. I thought it was a TOD looking hat. And I just made one not long ago.

So, back to the merits of Lee's new offering! Like I said, this felt, being from my feltmaker, it will outlast both Lee and I. Neither of us are Spring chickuns' ;-) I might just have to buy me one of Lee's new hats so I can see what a factory hat looks like, using the bodies that I use.

So, I now endeth the lesson in what a proper Raiders bow should look like. Hopefully some of the new folks just learned something! Fedora

I just got back from the Big Reno Gun Show, (What a madhouse!!) and read the latest posts. The phrase "good job" means a lot to me, coming from you, Steve. I thought you had your block back. I'll see that you get it. I sent the BB factory a pic of Desi's "Screen used Fedora" bow as a model, but I'll see if I can yank their chain to improve on the details. i'll see if I can get a CS hat photographed over the weekend. Apples=Apples. By the way, what size hat do you wear? Don't be a stranger.

Fedora wrote:Not to belabor a point, but I was just thinking. It is hard to get a good bow in a factory made hat. First of all, they are probably not Indy fans, and really don't know what the bow is supposed to look like. Or, if they do, they have to do these very fast for production reasons.

And that is one of the reasons, the guys like me, Marc, John Penman, and 3M$ sell hats, although it can be a slow process to get one. We actually TRY very hard to recreate the proper Raiders bow. Now, mine are not yet perfect, using the film stills as a reference, but they are alot closer than most factory made bows. And this is just another reason why custom made Indy hats are in demand, even with the slow production times. Here is one I just finished, and not the other one posted above. Different hat, but again my attempt at recreating the Raiders bow.




And you can see the "flying V" in this shot. Again, not perfect, but I can assure you, I spent a lot of time making this bow.



But we have to thank goodness that there are factory hats out there, that don't require the long wait. And Lee's new offering is certainly in the top 10 per cent of desirable factory hats.


I would have never posted on a thread about the new Keppler IF a bad lookding CS fedora had not been used for a comparison. I thought it was a TOD looking hat. And I just made one not long ago.

So, back to the merits of Lee's new offering! Like I said, this felt, being from my feltmaker, it will outlast both Lee and I. Neither of us are Spring chickuns' ;-) I might just have to buy me one of Lee's new hats so I can see what a factory hat looks like, using the bodies that I use.

So, I now endeth the lesson in what a proper Raiders bow should look like. Hopefully some of the new folks just learned something! Fedora

Steve,I think you nail the flying V. Even the stitches is in the right place.

Steve,I think you nail the flying V. Even the stitches is in the right place

Thank you my friend. But, I still see imperfections. Really, anyone can get this close. It isn't rocket science or anything like that. Just a folded over crease. I spend alot of time on my bows, and more time than most factories are willing to put into it. Gotta keep production up!! They can't take the time needed in most cases, although I have seen a few factory bows from the UK that looked really good. One was on a Lock's hat. A perfect flying v. Fedora

John Penman. I just viewed your thread on your hats, and I am really impressed. Especially with your bow work. Dude, you are better than me. My hat is off to you! Fedora

Fedora wrote:John Penman. I just viewed your thread on your hats, and I am really impressed. Especially with your bow work. Dude, you are better than me. My hat is off to you! Fedora

That has to be the greatest possible compliment on John's work...like Pablo Picasso telling Romero Britto that he is better than he ever was.

Dave

Yeah, I gotta agree with Doc, THAT had to be one of the nicest compliments for John to hear (...or...read)
Are we right about that, John? Are you still grinning from ear to ear after reading that?

As one of the folks who've posted some of the most recent pictures of Mr. Penman's latest batch of hats, I've got to say (again) that the bow on his hats is
JUST
PERFECT.
...And believe me when I say I'm a bit of a fussy guy about the look of the bow (Tex? You here?) ...and John's stands up to the most intense of inspections.
You can say that about the whole hat, really...
High Quality Stuff start to finish.
Mitch

(Hmmm... Whoa! I'm just now realizing how I'm aiding and abetting in getting us way, waaay of topic! Sincere apologies, Mods!)

Mulceber wrote:Kind of reminds me of when Darthbish tried to claim that his Fed4 had a better block than the AB. I really wish people would do their homework on these things. -M

..
I'm sorry?.....when exactly did I say those words??..Coz I just checked my last 127 posts, and I'm preeeeeeetty "they're" not there.
By all means, quote me if I have and I shall stand corrected, but if I haven't. Don't put words into my mouth.

Cheers

I won't quote becuase there are simply too many statements to begin quoting each one, but read through this thread that you started a couple months ago:

viewtopic.php?t=33034&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Dave

Guys, everybody likes what they like. Everyone has opinions. Who cares, really? Fedora made hats for Crystal Skull. If there was one man that is the father of Indygear, it is Lee Keppler (no disrespect whatsoever to Michaelson). They both offer different products for different wants and needs. They’re both good choices.

But I could argue that Graham Thompson of Optimo hats makes a hat that embodies the screen used Raiders hat better than any offering of both Fedora or Lee. His block is probably a little wider and therefore not as “accurate” as either Lee’s or Fedora’s, but his felt is more “right” for the screen used Raiders hat. But it won’t hold up as well as either of these beaver offerings. But maybe you could care less about a “Raiders” hat and want an LC.

My point is that we all have different criteria for picking a hat. I have seen both Lee’s hats & Fedora's hats. They are definitely on par with each other and are suited for whatever your particular needs are. My particular need is that I don’t “need” an Indy hat. So I’m relatively unbiased when I make these statements. Look at the pictures & talk to the vendors. Then make up your own minds. Cheers

DR Ulloa wrote:I won't quote becuase there are simply too many statements to begin quoting each one, but read through this thread that you started a couple months ago:

viewtopic.php?t=33034&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Dave

Oh puh-leeeese..
I asked a question re: people's fascination with AB's and said "I'm the first to admit that I'm new to this whole thing, but as I look lovingly at my Fed, I find it hard to believe that there could be a better hat out there."

If anything that's pride in something that I've just purchased, not a claim that it's "better blocked"

Honestly... I really wish people would do their homework on these things.

Mulceber wrote:Kind of reminds me of when Darthbish tried to claim that his Fed4 had a better block than the AB. I really wish people would do their homework on these things. -M

how bout when indy g claimed his block was better than steve and marc's raiders blocks???








(just kidding)

Indiana G wrote:

Mulceber wrote:Kind of reminds me of when Darthbish tried to claim that his Fed4 had a better block than the AB. I really wish people would do their homework on these things. -M

how bout when indy g claimed his block was better than steve and marc's raiders blocks???








(just kidding)

Don't be too hard on yourself, G. You've only made two hats and they look frawsome! I'd say your block is as good as any other block out there. The back reverse taper on your last hat is testament to that.

Runquist, I agree that both these hats are great. As far as color goes, I have always liked Lee's shade of brown more. I have his blend hat and the color is perfect Raiders. I would agree with Optimo's felt. I have never seen one in person, but even in photos you can tell that that is the closest possible Raiders felt out there. As far as construction, though, there is no way a factory hat like the Beaver Brand, will be as done up as well as the AB or the Optimo.

Dave

I have to jump in here for a sec. Marc's felt from ABD is by fare the best in every way.

As for optimo, he makes a fine hat but in my opinion can't come close to a raider hat ( and do I have to say CS hat) as Steve's hats. The list of things Steve and Marc get right that others only can get close is to long to list.

As for Steve's color felt. The color is a little darker than a raiders hat but will lighten up with a bit of wear.

again, I think no one comes close to Steve and his ribbon ( except for Marc) and how he puts the bow together and how it is tacked on. I have went over the raiders bow so many times and he has nailed it.

keppler looks like a fine hat but I would have to see one in person to completely comment on it. Pure beaver felt gives it a big plus but you con not compare a factory hat to a handmade one. It's just not fare to either person.


A hatter that is a Indy fan is going to get all the small details (that most will never notice) correct.

Wow, I assume those first photos are of the new Keppler that is not yet offered? It looks really scrumptious for lack of a better adjective.

BendingOak wrote:I have to jump in here for a sec. Marc's felt from ABD is by fare the best in every way.

As for optimo, he makes a fine hat but in my opinion can't come close to a raider hat ( and do I have to say CS hat) as Steve's hats. The list of things Steve and Marc get right that others only can get close is to long to list.

As for Steve's color felt. The color is a little darker than a raiders hat but will lighten up with a bit of wear.

again, I think no one comes close to Steve and his ribbon ( except for Marc) and how he puts the bow together and how it is tacked on. I have went over the raiders bow so many times and he has nailed it.

keppler looks like a fine hat but I would have to see one in person to completely comment on it. Pure beaver felt gives it a big plus but you con not compare a factory hat to a handmade one. It's just not fare to either person.


A hatter that is a Indy fan is going to get all the small details (that most will never notice) correct.

I agree whole-heartedly. I was simply commenting on how the Optimo felt looks and how, from the photos I have seen, it reacts. To me, it seems dead on Raiders. No one makes hats like Steve and no ones bows are as great as Steve's...except for Marc...and you, John.

Dave