Club Obi Wan

Yes, a sunny day in Boston. Here are the pics I promised of the WPG shirt:


Many more pictures may be found here: http://homepage.mac.com/glickc1/Hemingw ... bum27.html

A quick review: I like this shirt. It fits quite well. If anything, the body could be a bit more tailored, a bit tighter, more of a slim or athletic fit (though obviously a tailor could take care of that). I think the color is right on and it looks even better outside.

As for the screen accuracy; I am not really an authority in that regard. Obviously, the back seam is not SA, screen accurate, if you will, but it is not very noticeable as you can see in the pic.

It must be said that I had an issue with a missing button hole in the sleeve. A tailor fixed it for me and Jerry, of WPG, quickly contacted me to make amends. I appreciated his attention to the matter and the fact that he proactively stood by his product. Thank you Jerry.

I like this shirt and I recommend it. What do you think?

EDIT: Additional pics down the thread

HJ, the shirt looks really good!

My main concern was that the shirt not be GREEN, as some prototype pictures suggested. Your pics close the matter for me, I'm off to save up some pennies!

I think it looks mad - and I'm so pleased I have one on order!

I like it. I am not expert on screen accuracy and accept 'close enoughs'. The color looks very good sunlight. While looking at the shirt earlier I thought the size of the pockets were a bit too large. I do not think that is the case here, everything looks proportioned. As you mentioned, the shirt could use to be tailored for your frame. Either tailor it or gain some weight!

btw, the pants(LL Bean?), boots and hat look sharp too!

Glurrk wrote:HJ, the shirt looks really good!

My main concern was that the shirt not be GREEN, as some prototype pictures suggested. Your pics close the matter for me, I'm off to save up some pennies!

Thank you, Glurrk. It is not green at all. It is really quite a pale khaki.

Rob wrote:I think it looks mad - and I'm so pleased I have one on order!

Thanks Rob. I think you’ll like it when it comes. Let me know what you think of yours.

Feraud wrote:I like it. I am not expert on screen accuracy and accept 'close enoughs'. The color looks very good sunlight. While looking at the shirt earlier I thought the size of the pockets were a bit too large. I do not think that is the case here, everything looks proportioned. As you mentioned, the shirt could use to be tailored for your frame. Either tailor it or gain some weight!

btw, the pants(LL Bean?), boots and hat look sharp too!

Feraud, gaining weight wouldn’t really do the trick. There is a lot of shirt to fill. It is really quite baggy in its cut. I am a pretty big guy: 6’2" and 205 lbs. with a 44L suit size. I have bought some dress shirts that are slim fit or athletic cut that are less baggy in the body. This shirt is much more generous in its cut, but that’s OK. It is very comfortable. I could shrink it down a bit by washing it in hot water (I have washed it in cold water with no dryer).

BTW, I love these pants. They are LL Bean dress chinos in brown. I have never seen them in brown. I found these at the Bean outlet in North Conway, NH. The "boots" are actually shoes. You can’t tell with my pants covering them.

Also, there was a 40 mph wind on the roof also, which sort of puffed out the shirt.

Thanks for the comments.

Bottom line, if you want the shirt to be entirely screen accurate, you need to have it tailored to your body or have one designed that way from scratch, so to speak.

I hate to be critical, but I really don't see what has everyone in a tizzy over these shirts. I think that this shirt is probably the right size for HJ in the neck and sleeve length, but it is too wide in the shoulders, too full in the arms and too full in the body. We all know it has a un-screen accurate pleat in the back. It is made from a material that will shrink about 2 inches if you wash it in anything other than cold water.

I know a Wested is expensive, but by the time that you pay a tailor to make all of these alterations, you could have had a Wested. There were even people that were jumping up and saying that they were going to sell their Westeds so they could buy these shirts.

Heck, I even like my Walmart shirts better. I know that they are not screen accurate, but neither are these shirts. The Walmart shirt didn't have epaulets or pleats in the front, but what do you want? I bought them for $5.80 on clearance, but they fit well.

For me, when I want a screen accurate Indy shirt, I am sticking with Wested. I wish I had enough money to buy all of those Westeds that were in my size, at a discount, while you guys were selling them.

I know that it is good to have alternative choices, especially if they are in different price ranges. I think Jerry is probably aware of this shirts shortcomings and they will have production changes that will improve the shirt. It is a good start, but not quite there, yet.

Hemingway Jones wrote:Also, there was a 40 mph wind on the roof also, which sort of puffed out the shirt.

HJ, buckle up your chin strap, so you don't lose your Adventurebilt! It looks like a long way down.

Bufflehead Jones wrote:

Hemingway Jones wrote:Also, there was a 40 mph wind on the roof also, which sort of puffed out the shirt.

HJ, buckle up your chin strap, so you don't lose your Adventurebilt! It looks like a long way down.

That's why you see that I had to take my hat off!
I think you made some really good points. But, the Westeds come in S, M, L, XL, so, and judging by what some of the folks have written, they fall short of what we have seen on screen. This being our ideal:

Bufflehead Jones wrote:

Hemingway Jones wrote:Also, there was a 40 mph wind on the roof also, which sort of puffed out the shirt.

HJ, buckle up your chin strap, so you don't lose your Adventurebilt! It looks like a long way down.

Yea, the high winds explains the warped look it has in some pics.

Good looking shirt, though it does seem a little big. Its really a shame that it doesn't have a more trim fit. Were about the same size HJ. I'm 6'3" and about 190. I'm afraid that they would be too big on me.

HJ, look at that picture of HF. That shirt is a really tight fit. He has several buttons unbuttoned, but that top one is really straining a bit. I am 6' 3" and 215 lbs. so we are all about the same size. I figure however it fits you, is about the same way it will fit me.

I'm far too trim for that shirt. The full body cut would swallow me whole.

I also believe that the snug fit helps the shirt to lay open like indy's shirt always does. I've noticed that when I wear a loose fitting shirt like that it tends to lay shut. But If I put on a snug fitting shirt it lays open like Indy's. Just a little food for thought.

Bufflehead Jones wrote:I know a Wested is expensive, but by the time that you pay a tailor to make all of these alterations, you could have had a Wested.

Right... but it's my understanding that the Wested isn't a form fitting, perfectly fitted shirt, either and you're ordering along the lines of S, M, L, Xl and so on.

In that case, wouldn't you have to be very lucky to get a form fitting Wested? Thus neccessitating a tailoring on it, too?

Rob,

You are correct in that Wested only comes in off the rack sizes. I got a perfect fit from Wested, so maybe I was just lucky.

One thing that I have noticed on clothes made in England is that they have a tighter fit than what I usually find in the States. I guess the Brits must prefer a more tailored fit and people in the US prefer a baggier fit. I don't think I would change anything about my Wested shirts if I was to have them tailored.

ClintonHammond wrote:Maybe it's that people in the US are bigger?

heh

Historically that has been true - and not even necessarily 'fatter' but just 'bigger'. Of course, now it's 'fatter' too.

It must be said, however, that the UK is the most overweight country in Europe, however, so the cut of UK clothing will probably go 'more American' as time goes by.

It will be 'European' cuts that are the most svelte.

Nice pics Hemmingway, and great view you got there.
I like the heavier fabric it seems more "adventurous" than a normal dress shirt.
But it is wide (for my taste) and that makes the whole shirt a bit out of proportions.

On The "US and UK being fatter than the rest" subject. New studies here in Denmark shows that we (the Danes) grow fatter at the exact same rate and on the same curve as the US only we're 7 years behind the US, so in about 7 years I'll fit the WPG shirt.

-K

Bufflehead Jones wrote:HJ, look at that picture of HF. That shirt is a really tight fit. He has several buttons unbuttoned, but that top one is really straining a bit. I am 6' 3" and 215 lbs. so we are all about the same size. I figure however it fits you, is about the same way it will fit me.

Bufflehead, I agree totally. Harrison’s shirt is disco-tight! Actually, you can tell it was custom tailored for his frame. It is a very slim fit, more slim than the other films. I wish we could achieve this. Looking at photos of shirt offerings from the Main Page, it looks as if the MBA was spot on.

It is true that clothes from the UK are much slimmer in their tailoring.

K on the run wrote:Nice pics Hemmingway, and great view you got there.-K

Thank you very much.

From my limited experience I think they got most of the details right. The fit of anything is limited due to everyone being a different shape and preferred comfort. Calling a shirt 'fitted' will not necessarily work with everyone.

The WPG is a welcomed addition to the Gear. It could use a bit of tailoring in H.J.'s case. A nice shirt tho'.

Here are a few additional pictures.

Now that one looks like its cut to fit me. I am 5' 10", 250 with a v kind of shape and bit of a paunch , but my freakin arms and shoulders are so big from excercising ( I KNEW that fitness would be the end of me !)that my Wested, which now fits in the waist, is still if not more snug on my arms and chest.

I may have to snag one.

Enjoy it HJ !

Ken

Hemingway Jones wrote:...and judging by what some of the folks have written, they fall short of what we have seen on screen. This being our ideal:

I'm still a fan of the re-dying . It's the only way so far that I've seen to get the closest possible color to the screen color as it appears on film.

http://www.rabittooth.com/shirtB&E01.jpg


-Rabittooth

One thing that seems to be a common thread among all of us gear heads is the fit more so than the accuracy. While I agree that the WPG shirt is not screen accurate because of the pleat (which, I might add was NOT in the prototype according to Jerry), it is, in my opinion the closest to the color of the original shirt as seen on screen in Raiders. With that said, it follows that there is no way any of us could ever hope to have the exact shirt, so close enoughs will have to do. It's one thing to buy any Indy shirt from Wested because they are making them from Noel Howard's patterns, it's another thing to assume that the fit is going to be the same as that of what Ford shows in the movies. Remember: all of the costumes have been made to fit Ford's stature. Now they're trying to mass produce a shirt that will have a generalized fit. They only way to have a shirt that fits would be to take one of your Indy shirts, go to a tailor, show him or her what you are looking for and have him or her make you one (or three, which was the minimum amount that I HAD to buy in order for him make it). You could try having the Wested or WPG shirts refitted by your tailor, but the result could be worse than if it was just worn as is. Just a thought...don't kill me!

Personally, as a "one more slice of pizza" guy myself (I'll diet someday...) I like a shirt with a little more room. The NH and Wested shirts for me personally were a little too tight for my tastes in the waist. Again, that's my own taste. For a shirt that looks "Indy" - with a little more room, this shirt may be the ticket for myself. Remember, not all of us have Harry's body and a tight fitting shirt may not look or feel good on everyone. It's all about variety. For the price, this seems a great deal. And as for the pleat in the back, so what. Wear a jacket.

Seriously, just remember that a few years back we NEVER had these choices for gear. Jackets - Fedoras - Bag alternatives - Whips - now shirts. This is a GREAT time for this hobby, enjoy it while it lasts.

Hemingway,

Here is my two cents on all of this. First of all, nice pictures! - especially of Mt. Chocorua. That has got to be one of the most photographed mountains in NH. Instantly recognizable. Of course you cans see it from virtually everywhere from Ossippee to North Conway. I have bunch taken from the same area, I think. It looks as if you are at the rest area with the dirt driveway near the small bridge that you cross to get to the Liberty Trail and the Brook Trail, right?

Anyways, If you truly want a custom-look for your Raiders shirt, I think that any shirt will need to be altered to fit the way you want it, for the most part. I have 5 Noel Howard shirts and I tailor fit one to look good and left two alone as they are more functional (and less apt to rip due to being too tight.) The last two are still in their wrappers

It is all a waste of time unless you have can attain a shape that warrants the tight fitting shirt though. I am trying to get back to that point. Here is a shot from last year. Even though it is untucked, it still fits a lot closer than the non-tailor made shirts.

rick5150 wrote:Hemingway,
Here is my two cents on all of this. First of all, nice pictures! - especially of Mt. Chocorua. That has got to be one of the most photographed mountains in NH. Instantly recognizable. Of course you cans see it from virtually everywhere from Ossippee to North Conway. I have bunch taken from the same area, I think. It looks as if you are at the rest area with the dirt driveway near the small bridge that you cross to get to the Liberty Trail and the Brook Trail, right?

Absolutely right. I knew you would know. Thanks for the compliment on the pics and I am glad that you went in to have a look. I have a lot of pictures up on that site. As you know, I love wandering through your backyard. There are so many adventures to be had all over NH. And Chocorua is one of my favorite mountains; "The Matterhorn of NH", as it is sometimes known. Of course Mt. Washington is the most majestic mountain in the northeast with Khatahdin being a close second (if one were to rank mountains!).

rick5150 wrote: Anyways, If you truly want a custom-look for your Raiders shirt, I think that any shirt will need to be altered to fit the way you want it, for the most part. I have 5 Noel Howard shirts and I tailor fit one to look good and left two alone as they are more functional (and less apt to rip due to being too tight.) The last two are still in their wrappers

It is all a waste of time unless you have can attain a shape that warrants the tight fitting shirt though. I am trying to get back to that point. Here is a shot from last year. Even though it is untucked, it still fits a lot closer than the non-tailor made shirts.

I couldn’t agree more, Rick. A tighter fitting shirt wouldn’t bother me. I am in OK shape. My L.L. Bean oxford shirts that I wear for work are slimmer. For adventures, I don’t mind a baggy shirt.

Minnesota Jones wrote:It's all about variety. For the price, this seems a great deal. And as for the pleat in the back, so what. Wear a jacket.

Seriously, just remember that a few years back we NEVER had these choices for gear. Jackets - Fedoras - Bag alternatives - Whips - now shirts. This is a GREAT time for this hobby, enjoy it while it lasts.

Amen to that, my brother. It is a good time to be a gear fan with Fedora, Wested, Todd, TAG, WPG, and all the rest turning out products, we have a lot of choice and what works for one may not work for all. It is lucky for us that we can choose.

JerseyJones wrote:Now that one looks like its cut to fit me. I am 5' 10", 250 with a v kind of shape and bit of a paunch , but my freakin arms and shoulders are so big from excercising ( I KNEW that fitness would be the end of me !)that my Wested, which now fits in the waist, is still if not more snug on my arms and chest.

I may have to snag one.

Enjoy it HJ !

Ken

Thanks Ken, I will. This is my first shirt beyond an unaltered L.L. Bean. I may eventually try to get one of each shirt ever offered.

Rabittooth wrote: I'm still a fan of the re-dying . It's the only way so far that I've seen to get the closest possible color to the screen color as it appears on film.
-Rabittooth

Rabbit, I agree about the redye, but you have to admit that the WPG color is pretty exceptional.

ij1936 you make a lot of good points.

Nice shirt matey, got one the same, only paid 7pound for it Got it for my re-enacting, ohhhh looks like i'll have to get some indy gear now seen as i've got 3 revolvers and other stuff

Where is the nice pants from?
-K

The shirt looks nice, but I think the arms are way too baggy. the body is one thing--one can always tuck it in more around the back. But having too much material in the arms will make any shirt look over-sized. Of course, if you're normally wearing a jacket with it, the shirt will look just fine.

I'm waiting for replacement pants from Wested--the first pair I ordered were too snug in the waist. When I get them, I'll post pics of me in my Noel Howard shirt AND Wested shirt for comparison along with ALL my gear because I am finished!

K on the run wrote:Where is the nice pants from?
-K

LL Bean, dress chinos.

Feraud wrote:

K on the run wrote:Where is the nice pants from?
-K

LL Bean, dress chinos.

Hey Feraud, get out of my closet!

Hemingway Jones wrote:Hey Feraud, get out of my closet!

If anything is missing, I didn't do it!

without the risk of me sounding too much like a flirt, Hemmingway, I really like the pictures. You look great.

Stop it, you lot!

MJ and HJ, I agree with you that it is great to have all of these choices. Especially when they are spead out over different price ranges.

There are some things that I really like about this shirt, but obviously there are some things that I don't care for. This is a brand new product and may be tweeked some along the way. For me, the Wested gives me more of what I am looking for. Another great thing about choices, the Wested fits me, but may not fit someone else. For those that don't get a good fit in the Wested, this may be exactly what they are looking for.

It is a good thing about this forum that we can look at a product and kick ideas and opinions around. Sometimes people have changed my mind about things when they have presented valid points.

Color:
A

Sizing:
A
Love the choices of neck size and sleeve length

Fit:
D :evil:
Way too full in the sleeves and body. This would be okay for a casual shirt, but not for an Indy shirt.

Pleat in Back:
F
Hate it.

Price:
C
Mid-price offering.

Material:
C
Concerns about it's susceptibility to shrink.

Quality Control:
B
HJ had the only problem reported so far.

Customer Service:
A
So far, so good.

Overall Rating:
C

New Overall Rating:
B
Just because HJ told me to.

Well, that's how I would rate it. I must admit that I have not seen one in person and mainly I am going by pictures and what people that have seen it have said. And of course my opinion can change at a moments notice. Your opinion may vary.

Feraud wrote:

Hemingway Jones wrote:Hey Feraud, get out of my closet!

If anything is missing, I didn't do it!

Invasion of the Closet Snatchers

Feraud wrote:

Hemingway Jones wrote:Hey Feraud, get out of my closet!

If anything is missing, I didn't do it!

Only a few skeletons and you can have 'em!

Canyon wrote:without the risk of me sounding too much like a flirt, Hemmingway, I really like the pictures. You look great.

Why thank you Canyon! I appreciate that! And hey, I'm a single guy so feel free, flirt away. I need the positive reenforcement.

Bufflehead,
Hey Bufflehead! Duck!!! -Sorry couldn't resist.

Listen, I agree with you rating system, except that I give the WPG a "B" and I'll tell you why: Jerry attempted it. He went to all of the trouble to offer this shirt and did a pretty good job. I, for one, am very pleased. So, I think you should mark on a curve and add points in for a much appreciated effort.

HJ, I thought I was grading on a curve. You will notice that your extra credit essay pushed the overall rating up to a B. My opinion does change at a moment's notice.

Bufflehead Jones wrote: B
Just because HJ told me to.

Well, that's how I would rate it. I must admit that I have not seen one in person and mainly I am going by pictures and what people that have seen it have said. And of course my opinion can change at a moments notice.
HJ, I thought I was grading on a curve. You will notice that your extra credit essay pushed the overall rating up to a B. My opinion does change at a moment's notice.

You're a good man, Bufflehead, and very reasonable.

I still giggle about this topic...

In the past we've seen people pull out shirts that look pretty ordinary - they might even be missing the line of stitching down either side of the shirt - and everyone's all, "Fantastic! That is so close!"

We get this shirt, which is pretty darn amazing, with a pleat that no one sees most of the time, and it's like the world has collapsed in on itself. Let's get some perspective on the pleat, people.

ClintonHammond wrote:

I think fit is a bigger issue than the back pleat

I agree, who's gonna see the back pleat anyway?

Rob wrote:I still giggle about this topic...

In the past we've seen people pull out shirts that look pretty ordinary - they might even be missing the line of stitching down either side of the shirt - and everyone's all, "Fantastic! That is so close!"

We get this shirt, which is pretty darn amazing, with a pleat that no one sees most of the time, and it's like the world has collapsed in on itself. Let's get some perspective on the pleat, people.

Well Rob, if you have to have someone draw a picture for you, then here it is. All those shirts that you speak of, are shirts that were made as casual clothes by the manufacturer with no thought of Indiana Jones whatsoever. They were made to sell to people that are not gearheads. They were found at the mall or in catalogs or at Walmart.

A gearhead happened to see those shirts and said, "hey, this shirt is pretty close". Of course these shirts don't have the pleats down the front, as that is a pretty rare feature and a very distinct feature of Indy's shirt.

That is definitely not the case here. This shirt was made for one reason and one reason only. It was made to be a replica of Indiana Jones' shirt. It was designed from the ground up to be a screen accurate replica. That is why you are paying a higher than normal price for this shirt. That is what it was advertised to be. Adding a pleat in the back, no matter how unobjectionable it is to you, makes this shirt a failure in it's quest to be an Indiana Jones shirt.

This is a nice shirt. But, nice shirts are a dime a dozen. An Indiana Jones shirt is a rare thing. With some changes, this shirt has some promise. As it is, it is just a nice shirt at a premium price. With two changes, adding the pleats and epaulets, Mrs. Deadlock was altering the same Walmart shirt that I bought for $5.80, into a more screen accuate Indy shirt than this one. Even buying two shirts to have some extra material and paying her to alter the shirt, you end up with a more screen accurate Indiana Jones shirt at a fraction of the cost. For the price of this shirt, you could end up with a Indy wardrobe starter kit.

Bufflehead Jones wrote:With two changes, adding the pleats and epaulets, Mrs. Deadlock was altering the same Walmart shirt that I bought for $5.80, into a more screen accuate Indy shirt than this one. Even buying two shirts to have some extra material and paying her to alter the shirt, you end up with a more screen accurate Indiana Jones shirt at a fraction of the cost. For the price of this shirt, you could end up with a Indy wardrobe starter kit.

Very, very true Bufflehead, but sadly for us Mrs. D is taking a break. And guess who is next on her list??? Yup; Hemingway Jones. I am patiently waiting for her return.

I'll reiterate:

ij1936 wrote:....there is no way any of us could ever hope to have the exact shirt, so close enoughs will have to do.

ij1936 wrote:I'll reiterate:

ij1936 wrote:....there is no way any of us could ever hope to have the exact shirt, so close enoughs will have to do.

Naw, George will do anything for money, maybe one day he will auction one off.

Bufflehead Jones wrote:Well Rob, if you have to have someone draw a picture for you, then here it is. All those shirts that you speak of, are shirts that were made as casual clothes by the manufacturer with no thought of Indiana Jones whatsoever. They were made to sell to people that are not gearheads. They were found at the mall or in catalogs or at Walmart.

Yes, I'm well aware of this, but you want to be patronising (probably because you are one of the people who has criticised the pleat the most, so probably feel my words are criticising you), so go on...

Bufflehead Jones wrote:That is definitely not the case here. This shirt was made for one reason and one reason only. It was made to be a replica of Indiana Jones' shirt... Adding a pleat in the back, no matter how unobjectionable it is to you, makes this shirt a failure in it's quest to be an Indiana Jones shirt.

A failure? Right. So given that I have never, ever, ever, ever, seen any of the replica shirts universally praised (heck, people can't even agree on the what colour they should be, let alone the details), can we use such emotive language to describe Wested shirts? MBA shirts and so on? Are they all failures? They must be, in your world.

Personally, I'd prefer this shirt with something small to worry about, like the pleat, than (I think) the MBA shirt which looks far too pink for most people's tastes, even though we're assured that it's the right colour for the shirt, and it supposedly looked different onscreen.

Bufflehead Jones wrote:As it is, it is just a nice shirt at a premium price.

So at about half the price of the Wested, what should the Wested be referred to as? A super-duper premium price? See, this is the thing which people have pointed out across numerous threads. For its price, this shirt is quite amazing.

You, meanwhile, seem to have a huge problem with it. It's a shame you have to drop into people's threads when they are quite happy with their purchase, and bang-on about it in such disparaging terms.

Rob,

I have been eagerly awaiting your retort with bated breath. I knew that I would not be disappointed. I agree with you. The Wested price should be considered Super-Duper Premium.

Bufflehead Jones wrote:Rob,

I have been eagerly awaiting your retort with bated breath. I knew that I would not be disappointed. I agree with you. The Wested price should be considered Super-Duper Premium.

Such a shame you can't see the wood for the trees with this shirt, BJ. And disappointing that you diss the choice of many COW members in doing so.

Here is a thought.

If people really want a custom shirt then why not get exactly that. I know Pyro had great sucess with a company called mycustomtailor.com recently. Well why not send them a shirt that everyone agrees is the closest we have to style (eg - Noel Howard), and this be the style. Then they can tailor it to the individual's needs as to fit, choice of fabric, color etc - as I understand you can even send them your own fanbric.

I am sure if we spoke to them and explained that if this was done on the basis of potentially several orders then they would be quite helpful (that was my experience with them even just making enquiries).

Ken

I'll re-reiterate!

ij1936 wrote: They only way to have a shirt that fits would be to take one of your Indy shirts, go to a tailor, show him or her what you are looking for and have him or her make you one (or three, which was the minimum amount that I HAD to buy in order for him make it).

I've been toying with that idea again. The three Custom Tailored shirts that I just sold through COW were the result of doing just that! For those that bought them, I have heard no complaints on the look or fit save one: there was a small tear on the shoulder of one of the shirts from a previous adventure. Other than that, I believe that those who purchased the shirts are happy.