MurphyWhips Shellac help (please).

[KeepaySF]

Hi folks,

I'd intended my first post to be something less needy than this, but may I ask whether anyone knows exactly how to dissolve shellac flakes? I purchased shellac from MurphyWhips.com but as no instructions were included (as has been mentioned elsewhere here) and I can't find any on their website (insofar as dissolving the flakes, how long it takes, ratio of alcohol to material, etc.) I am at a loss. Google wasn't much use on this question.

If I can trouble anyone to take the time to respond, I'd appreciate the help. (I've been reading the site for over a year now...amazingly kind people on here). Hopefully, I can contribute something useful to the board myself soon.

Thanks!

P.S. I love MurphyWhips and have no beef with them....I'm just too green to know the details on this particular item.

[deadringer]

Hi KeepaySF

Check this link out it will help you http://www.apwa.org.au/forum/viewthread ... read_id=79

Cheers
Chris

[Canuck Digger]

Well the process is pretty simple; mix pure alcohol to the flakes and let time do its job. But the reality is a bit different. There are a few considerations to keep in mind.

The cut.
This means the ratio of alcohol to flakes. The more alcohol, the thinner the shellac will be. I prefer using 1 1/4 litre of alcohol to (I think this was the amount of flakes) 250 gr. of shellac flakes.

The process.
The flakes are pretty hard and the smaller each flake is, the quicker it will dissolve in the alcohol. So if you want, you can try to cruch them a bit before. If not, no biggy, it'll dissolve anyway, but it may take a bit longer. If you see any impurities try to take them out before you poour the alcohol, otherwise you can always strain the mix later on. You will rappidly see that the flakes will gather at the bottom of you jar (a big 1.5 L glass pickle jar works really well) and will turn into a glob. This is normal. Try to stir it once in a while over the next few days to help it along.

The denatured alcohol is very volatile so be sure to not place it near any heat source.

The alcohol is usually sold in 1 litre bottles. Get two. You will need a bit more than one litre for your first mix and over time the alcohol will evaporate a bit when you open the jar to use it, and it will effectively concentrate the mix, so you may need a bit extra once in a while to keep it the same consistency. If it is too light, it will not work very well and you will need to apply lots of coats. Invertly, if it is too thick, it will crack once the leather is flexed (I've had problems with it being too thick due to evaporation). All I can say is that it is always a good idea to do a test run on a piece of scrap leather before applying it to a whip. Apply two light coats with drying time in between each, and once properly dried, flex the leather a bit and see if it cracks or not. It's a lot easier to adjust the mix than to take the shellac off an entire whip...

There are many sites online that talk about this.
Good luck

Franco

[KeepaySF]

Thanks Chris (who btw has some killer handle designs, among other great stuff, on his http://www.deadringer.com forum!) for the incredibly helpful link and Franco for a full-length white paper on the topic - you guys are awesome.

[Canuck Digger]

Always a pleasure to help out others as I was very fortunate to receive a lot of amazing help upon my start. What goes around...
Cheers,

Franco

[KeepaySF]

Franco....

Thanks again....just repurposed a pickle jar!

Take care,
Keith

[louiefoxx]

You might want to try buying a can of premixed shellac and thinning it down...it's much less work!

Without checking my notes I think I dump the can of shellac into a container, then I fill the empty can up with thinner and dump that into the container with the shellac, so it's about a 1 to 1 ratio...but don't quote me on that I didnt' check my notes.

Originally I tried using flakes and didn't get very good results (probably user error).

xoxo

Louie
http://bullwhips.org

[KeepaySF]

Hi Louie,

Thanks for the tip....the 1:1 ratio sounds like a rational place to start at least. What do you use to apply the shellac?

Meanwhile, I followed Chris' link and got great info on alcohol types and thinners and I'm following Franco's opus - dissolving in a pickle jar right now. I also took his advice to crush the flakes to an extreme and tortured them in a blender on "Liquify" until they were mostly dust....

[louiefoxx]

I used to use a paint brush, but I didn't like the cover that it got. Right now I'm using a piece of scrap wool to apply it. I put on rubber gloves, dip a piece of the wool into the shellac, wring out the excess and then use that to apply it. The wool really gets into the nooks and crannies better than a brush.

I'm working on an 8 foot bullwhip right now and will probably be shellacing it late today or tomorrow. I'll try to remember to take pictures or video of it when it do.

xoxo

louie
http://bullwhips.org

[Bernardodc]

KeepaySF,

Franco's post and advice were spot on, he really covered everything you need to know there. As he said, you'll have to experiment a bit with the cut, and also keep adding small amounts of alcohol as it evaporates.

The following article was helpful when I first started using shellac:

http://www.homesteadfinishingproducts.c ... hellac.htm

I start with a 2lb cut, and then I thin it down by eye to the consistency that I have found works best. Then I keep adding alcohol to keep the consistency the same.

I use a brush with good results. If the cut is too thick, you'll see the brush strokes though. As Franco said, the key is finding the right cut. I also found that humidity and the alcohol you use affects the drying time. Keep that in mind if you plan on adding a second or third coat.

Hope that helps.

Good luck,

Bernardo

[Canuck Digger]

Keith you are in the presence of masters here, and no I don't mean myself loll, they have a lot of experience and helpful info on all aspects of this art.
Cheers,

Franco

[KeepaySF]

Guys I'm overwhelmed....thanks again Franco, Chris, Louie and now Bernardo - btw on that score, I googled for humidity averages and range for my city (San Fran - hadn't realized that %~ morning to afternoon was so substantial) and now am looking to cross-reference with alcohol evaporation rates....

Can you imagine how complex, say, a four-year college degree in whipmaking could be? I feel like I need to go back to school and add degrees in engineering, organic and inorganic chemistry, meteorology, physics, art, manufacturing, emergency medicine (I've cut my fingers more frequently and FAR more deeply in the last 18 months cutting kangaroo hides than in entirety of the rest of my life. Those teflon coated medical blade are stunningly eager to drink my blood.) marketing, packaging, photography and website design...did I miss anything?

All the best,
Keith

[louiefoxx]

It seems like I always have a cut on left thumb!



Picture is of an old cut, my current cut isn't photographing well.

xoxo

louie
http://bullwhips.org

[Canuck Digger]

Yeah,
that sounds about right, hehehe.

Be careful man, them blades are awful nasty when they bites ya.