Tony Nowak Leather Comparisons

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:03 pm

While at the QM Summit this past weekend, I suggested to Tony that we take pictures of the hides he had on hand so you guys could get a better idea of his leather offerings. He is also interested in what the fans have to say in regards to different types of hides you might like to see in a jacket. While he is keeping the shrunken lamb for the Raiders I, he is also looking for a less expensive option to offer those on a tighter budget.

I have done my best to take varied and detailed shots of these jackets. (Some close-ups of grain might be a tad blurred, sorry) They were taken in direct sunlight. Please keep in mind some of these jackets were prototypes or experiments in design, so please judge these based off the leather only, and kindly leave critique of design elements like pockets and straps to other threads. Thank you.

Jacket fronts: Top l-r: CS dark cowhide, Raiders I shrunken lamb, CS light cowhide. Bottom l-r: Raiders cowhide, Raiders lamb, Raiders "flat/matte lamb.

Large size image: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3237/302 ... 85ec_b.jpg
Original size image: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3237/302 ... ea4f_o.jpg

Jacket backs: Top l-r: CS dark cowhide, Raiders I shrunken lamb, CS light cowhide. Bottom l-r: Raiders cowhide, Raiders lamb, Raiders "flat/matte lamb.

Large image: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3181/302 ... c071_b.jpg
Original size image: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3181/302 ... a3d8_o.jpg

Left to right: Raiders cowhide, Raiders flat/matte lamb, Raiders I shrunken lamb:

indyrocks · Post by **indyrocks** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:06 pm

This is great Bink thanks so much for the detail! There are a lot of us chickens out here waiting for some cheaper options!

Do you know of any prices on these?

coronado3 · Post by **coronado3** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:07 pm

Did Tony mention any differences in price with the various hides?

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:07 pm

Since I already have my "holy grail," there was no reason for me to ask!

I am not aware of any prices, but I could always inquire...

Rundquist · Post by **Rundquist** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:10 pm

The other hides are a couple hundred dollars cheaper.

Indiana Strones · Post by **Indiana Strones** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:13 pm

Great job Bink!!

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:48 pm

I'm liking that shrunken lamb. Don't care about SA or not, it's just nice looking. Wonder how long it will last and keep looking that good.

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 2:22 pm

Raider S wrote:I'm liking that shrunken lamb. Don't care about SA or not, it's just nice looking. Wonder how long it will last and keep looking that good.

Thing is, I believe it is SA. ;-) Funny thing is that when they were all laid out, Lee Keppler kept saying that was his favorite hide of the bunch.

Hatch · Post by **Hatch** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:03 pm

I'd love to see what TN would come up with on the Steranko jacket from the original concept........Hatch

crismans · Post by **crismans** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:17 pm

Thanks tremendously for posting these!!

Gives my fevered brain even more to think about.

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:25 pm

i'm diggin that flat/matte raiders alot!!!! i love the colour and texture!!! too bad it's not darker.....i'd love to get a different jacket made out of that hide. beautiful stuff

....nice summary bink

indyrocks · Post by **indyrocks** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:31 pm

Indiana G wrote:i'm diggin that flat/matte raiders alot!!!! i love the colour and texture!!! too bad it's not darker.....i'd love to get a different jacket made out of that hide. beautiful stuff ....nice summary bink

You're a man of good taste G! I thought the SAME THING! It's just a really cool, alternative look. I really want to know these prices, I hope they're easier on my poor tattered wallet....

I think I just felt a tickle, is that you Bink?

Indiana Strones · Post by **Indiana Strones** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:32 pm

Which cowhide was used in the movie? Dark or light?

Indiana Strones · Post by **Indiana Strones** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:32 pm

Or both?

Indiana Williams · Post by **Indiana Williams** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:43 pm

Now that I see these pics I remember seeing a few of those jackets at his shop. I was so entranced by the shrunken lamb I didnt even think to ask Tony about them.

Post by **Holt** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:04 pm

Indiana Strones wrote:Which cowhide was used in the movie? Dark or light?

Or both?

strones,

look at this.you can see how many different shades of leather there was on the orginals.there is never any answer to which color is the most SA.dark brown.lightbrown.some even had rusty red tones.

McFly · Post by **McFly** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:04 pm

I just thought I'd mention that the Raiders Cowhide he's got pictured was AMAZINGLY soft. I thought it was lamb until Tony told me otherwise. He had me trying it on and after trying several of the others, it was my favorite - but I don't think I got to try on the shrunken lamb. The cow was very soft though, and the color was beautiful.

Thanks for posting these pics, Rick!

Shane

Post by **Tennessee Smith** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:13 pm

Thanks Bink, any idea when the Raiders I shrunken lamb will be offered?

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:15 pm

Tennessee Smith wrote:Thanks Bink, any idea when the Raiders I shrunken lamb will be offered?

that's the chosen hide for the Indy 1.

Baldwyn · Post by **Baldwyn** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:24 pm

That matte lamb is crazy! He shoulda used that for Crystal Skull! It looks similar (not quite as dark tho) to the Smithsonian LC jacket. He's going to sell out of Indy I's before he sells out of Indy IV's.

Baldwyn · Post by **Baldwyn** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:27 pm

BTW, CS dark and CS light look like the same leather to me. I'm guessing CS dark is the unwashed version (where did I read this? That they constructed the jackets out of the leather after it was washed to make it look distressed? Certainly true of the Mutt jacket, I can't definitively say this of Indy's). Wish I knew about the choice!

agent5 · Post by **agent5** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:30 pm

Thanks, Bink. I'm really digging the regular lamb. Seems to have some grain and character to it. Not as distinct as the rest which I like.

I honestly think this is the thread people have been waiting for. We're all about choices. ;-) I always say, the more the better.

Stopping by the summit just reiterates everything I've heard about Tony from everyone who's met or spoken to him. He seems to be a very good sport. Whether anyone gets a jacket from him or not the community benefits greatly by his presence.

That matte lamb is crazy! He shoulda used that for Crystal Skull!

I could be wrong as I've been known to be lately, but wasn't that Bernie's choice? I was under the impression that Bernie told Tony what he wanted and Tony delivered. I agree it looks better but I'd always thought that was Bernie's call, not Tony's.

Baldwyn · Post by **Baldwyn** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:53 pm

agent5 wrote: I could be wrong as I've been known to be lately, but wasn't that Bernie's choice? I was under the impression that Bernie told Tony what he wanted and Tony delivered. I agree it looks better but I'd always thought that was Bernie's call, not Tony's.

Good point!! Could very well be.

gwyddion · Post by **gwyddion** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 5:23 pm

_ wrote:Nope - It was always the cowhide...

I believe he meant that it was bernie's choice to make, what type of leather was used, in stead of Tony's.

Regards, Geert

Baldwyn · Post by **Baldwyn** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 5:51 pm

_ wrote:Sorry, my reply was cut short by a "work question"...

Bernie told Tony what he wanted, but did not specifically pick or designate a leather. Tony picked the cowhide, made the jacket, and Bernie accepted it. The cowhide he makes CS jackets by default is essentially identical.

There was an early iteration - pre-Tony's involvement but I don't remember if it was Wested or one of the other jacket makers... Anyway, I only saw a pic, but it was supposed to be a "good pic" and it looked orange. Like pigskin. Never saw that leather come up again - Bernie quickly dismissed it...

Didn't mean to come off short...

You mean this jacket?

Hey, so what do you know about the distressing, _? I had read that they tried to wash Mutt's jackets and it didn't work out. So then they washed the leather and THEN made the jackets, and that did the trick. Is this true? Is that what they do for Indy too? This was done because hand distressing all the jackets would be too much work/time. It's a shame. The hand distressing is what gives the original Trilogy's jackets their charm, I htink.

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 6:39 pm

McFly wrote:He had me trying it on and after trying several of the others, it was my favorite - but I don't think I got to try on the shrunken lamb. The cow was very soft though, and the color was beautiful.

Shane, you DID try on the shrunken lamb! Don't you remember trying on my jacket aboard the QM? ;-) I agree on the cow, though. That was my next favorite hide. The flat lamb was nice, but I wasn't nearly taken with it as I was the shrunken lamb, cow, and the regular lamb. Heck, the regular lamb was so soft you could make Linus' blanket out of it!

Post by **Tennessee Smith** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 6:58 pm

Indiana G wrote:
Tennessee Smith wrote:Thanks Bink, any idea when the Raiders I shrunken lamb will be offered?
that's the chosen hide for the Indy 1.

That being the case, he nailed it. The other leathers look nice, and its a nice option to offer, but his original looks perfect to me.

scot2525 · Post by **scot2525** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 6:58 pm

I have refrained from posting regarding TN Raiders I jacket because it did not look right to me and several other members that are far more informed than I however after viewing the first two pics that Bink posted the shrunken lamb that Tony chose as his standard hide does look dead on to the Raiders jacket. I must ay these are the first photos that do that hide justice.

crismans · Post by **crismans** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 8:39 pm

scot2525 wrote:I have refrained from posting regarding TN Raiders I jacket because it did not look right to me and several other members that are far more informed than I however after viewing the first two pics that Bink posted the shrunken lamb that Tony chose as his standard hide does look dead on to the Raiders jacket. I must ay these are the first photos that do that hide justice.

I, of course, did not refrain from posting because I don't have the social graces to keep my mouth shut, otherwise, I echo your thoughts exactly. Not to throw off on the camera skills of the first buyers but it was Castor's and these picks that have really sold me on the shrunken lambskin.

But the matte lambskin looks awesome as well (wish it was the color of the regular lamb but you can't have everything) and the cow looks nice. I wouldn't normally consider cow for a Raiders but those in the know are saying how soft and pliable it is.

I think my heads going to explode.

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 8:42 pm

I, of course, did not refrain from posting because I don't have the social graces to keep my mouth shut

i definitely gotta remember that one......

bigrex · Post by **bigrex** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 9:44 pm

Wow, such detail, I think my favorite is the Raiders Cowhide although the shrunken lamb doesn't look too bad in those photos. It would be interesting to hear quotes for jackets made in each hide as that might also affect my choice

By the way the pockets on the Raider Shrunken Lamb jacket are stunning!

Post by **Dalexs** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 10:41 pm

I never thought I'd hear my self saying this...
But after Rundquist posted something a few weeks ago, I was working from home and just decided to throw my 6 year old Seal Goat Expo in the washer.

Same basic recipe you mentioned, and I have to say, the difference was rather impressive (just don't tell Michaelson I did it...

)
(It even fits a bit better now!)

Dalexs

ReturningSon · Post by **ReturningSon** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 12:19 am

Well, what I need are some actual prices on these, especially that "matte lamb" which looks awesome! Are they lower or the same?

Baldwyn · Post by **Baldwyn** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 12:24 am

_ wrote:
Baldwyn wrote: You mean this jacket?
That looks like something a bit more tame. The orange stuff I saw never made it to the jacket stage - that I know of... Is that one of Peter's?

Anyway, on distressing and Mutt's jacket? Many things were tried - and I understand washing was tried and was an idea they partially got from here - though I know the "vintage repro" crowd has been using hot water to break-in hh for years.

I will, however, claim to be the first I know of to actually run a jacket through the hot-wash cycle with detergent and bleach... It was either that or burn it, as it had been HEAVILY exposed to Poison oak. I myself had two consecutive daily doses of 10ml (2 gigantic 5ml syringes each) of cortisone, plus a 5-day oral treatment of the stuff. Nasty stuff got into my tear ducts...

Anyway, it nicely broke-in a chrome tanned Expedition...

I washed my CS as well. Cold water only. Tumbled on low to 90% dry, then wore it on a 90-degree afternoon. Drank a lot of beer - Corona with lemon to keep hydrated.

A good jacket laughs at stuff like this...

KT said it was one made by Peter that was sent to Bernie.

I remember that washing machine episode from back in the day!! It sounded so scary but the outcome sounded so good (I don't remember you posting pics). Man, everything seemed so innocent and new. I remember you scraping your goatskin Expo across a nail accidently in your garage. That's what sold me on my Expo. I don't know what it is about the washing. I've seen broken in jackets worn for many years turn out even better with the process.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 3:30 am

_ wrote:
Baldwyn wrote:Back in the day...
Man, that was probably August of 2001...

I think that may have been Peter's last jacket before Bernie pulled the trigger. All the jackets that did not make the grade were taken apart. I didn't get why then, but it had to do with making sure nothing was floating around that they did not have control of. They were weird days - everything was "locked-down" and we were resigning NDA's over and over - usually associated with an actor letting something slip or a make-up artist with a cellphone camera nosing around where he should not have been. It was not pleasant, and I honestly felt we would have been better off if no new movie had been made...

Lots of water under bridges. And now Dalexs is washing his Expo! Isn't that one of the signs of the apocalypse?

That particular jacket was made at the same time as the last sample to Bernie. It was a veg tanned lamb, very heavy and a nice jacket. Not quite as orange as the picture makes it look but still too light in colour.

Yes, weird times.

I do tend to wash most of the jackets I get "second hand" but usually don't have the heart to wash the new ones! It does really help the look and feel. New ones... I like to have the 'new time'. lol

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:53 am

wow to me the lamb one looks like a GB.

Indiana Strones · Post by **Indiana Strones** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:06 am

Indiana Holt wrote:
Indiana Strones wrote:Which cowhide was used in the movie? Dark or light?

Or both?
strones,

look at this.you can see how many different shades of leather there was on the orginals.there is never any answer to which color is the most SA.dark brown.lightbrown.some even had rusty red tones.

Yes, you're right.

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:37 am

Dalexs wrote:I never thought I'd hear my self saying this...
But after Rundquist posted something a few weeks ago, I was working from home and just decided to throw my 6 year old Seal Goat Expo in the washer.
Same basic recipe you mentioned, and I have to say, the difference was rather impressive (just don't tell Michaelson I did it... )
(It even fits a bit better now!)

Dalexs

Where that 'fainting' smilie when you need it?

Regards! Michaelson

Post by **Holt** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:08 am

cloth jacket...I am sure that it was much like Peters today offering.the denim raiders.

so if you guys want a screen acurrate ''dust run'' get the denim wested ;-)

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:11 am

_, check page one of your own thread. That's where the cloth jacket post was made:

viewtopic.php?t=35794&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

;-)

Regard! Michaelson

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:12 am

I still do not get how he keeps missing the piped pocket flap ! I mean, its clearly visible in the movie!

This is the jacket he claims to have copied.

Post by **Holt** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:13 am

Dutch_jones wrote:I still do not get how he keeps missing the piped pocket flap ! I mean, its clearly visible in the movie!

on which jacket ;-)

jacksdad · Post by **jacksdad** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:13 am

first thanks blink,
second I really like that cowhide Indy 1 looks cool might have to look into that one.

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:13 am

Indiana Holt wrote:
Dutch_jones wrote:I still do not get how he keeps missing the piped pocket flap ! I mean, its clearly visible in the movie!
on which jacket ;-)

two of the raiders jackets in the picture above don't have it, while 2 others have.... I don't get that.

Post by **Holt** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:21 am

yeah but I am sure the the pockets with the piped edge is a request from members to make it more SA in their opinion.

I know members has showed Tony a picture saying I want a 100% copy of this pocket.and Tony delivered with piped edge and all

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:42 am

Indiana Holt wrote:yeah but I am sure the the pockets with the piped edge is a request from members to make it more SA in their opinion.

I know members has showed Tony a picture saying I want a 100% copy of this pocket.and Tony delivered with piped edge and all

Thats not the point, he had That exact jacket ( so he claims) so it should not matter if its a request or not, he should have copied every detail, not improve the jacket.

ReturningSon · Post by **ReturningSon** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:49 am

Like I stated earlier, has Tony annouced prices on these jackets yet?

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 10:00 am

Dutch_jones wrote:I still do not get how he keeps missing the piped pocket flap ! I mean, its clearly visible in the movie!

It amazes me how few people actually read the first post of any given thread:

Please keep in mind some of these jackets were prototypes or experiments in design, so please judge these based off the leather only, and kindly leave critique of design elements like pockets and straps to other threads. Thank you.

Oh, well. I guess that's expecting too much.

Also keep in mind that Tony had these jackets on hand for the sake of sizing them on people who wanted to purchase a jacket from him as well as to show different leather types. These were not jackets for direct purchase.

Don't Call Me Junior! · Wed Nov 12, 2008 10:59 am

_ wrote: There were 14 jackets. There are 2,658 members out here. Assuming everyone has two eyes, that is 14,149,757,584,576,900,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 possible permutations of varying perceptions dependant on video quality, eyesight, how many beers one has consumed, medications, blah, blah, blah... That is the reliability of SA.
.

I feel like I'm watching an episode of numbers! ;-)

The spirit of what you are saying here is so true. Look how many different permutations there are when we're all looking at just one jacket or one picture of a jacket. Different things are more obvious to some people than others. There will never be a true holy grail jacket that everyone agrees on.

My aunt is a psychiatrist who talks often about how everybody's journey is different. Even if two people spend all of their time together, eat and drink the same things, do the same things, watch the same things the will NEVER see them exactly the same way. Everyone's true personal goal and perspective is uniquely their own.

I think that is what makes this group so interesting and what keeps most of us coming back.
To paraphrase a friend of mine who often likes to recite a quote - If there are two men putting together a plan of action for a project and they agree on everything, one of those men is unnecessary. Welcome to Club Obi-Wan!

And, as Bink has said, this thread is about leather so I'll move along now.

coronado3 · Post by **coronado3** » Wed Nov 12, 2008 11:08 am

Tony's jackets are like BK... You can have it anyway you want it!