Brim flip on the right?

gabrielle · Post by **gabrielle** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 6:24 pm

I've been messing with the bash on my Jimmy Pierce and have it to perfection now, but I can't seem to get the right side of the brim to flip up, like in the Raven Bar scene. How do I make the brim flip up on the right?

Falco09 · Post by **Falco09** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 6:35 pm

The brim flip is caused by the turn. To put it simply: if your hat ain't turned, your brim don't flip.

gabrielle · Post by **gabrielle** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 6:41 pm

Falco09 wrote:The brim flip is caused by the turn. To put it simply: if your hat ain't turned, your brim don't flip.

lol

Thanks...

Chewbacca Jones · Post by **Chewbacca Jones** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 8:51 pm

I have seen hats with my own eyes, in person, that had the flip without the turn. Many will herald me as a fraud, but it's true. In some cases, the right hat and the right hand skills will get it. But the biggest advantage is if you have a long oval head and wear a regular oval hat. That works as well as the turn, from what I've seen.

Kentucky Blues · Post by **Kentucky Blues** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 7:14 pm

I can vouch for what Chewbacca Jones said... Several of my hats have a flip in the brim, as well as a turned effect from the brim, merely because the hats are a regular oval, and my head is a long oval. My theory's that my imperfect head causes the hat to warp as it stretches. I also theorize that that's why Ford's hat did what it did, but this isn't the place for that. Anyway, if your head, for whatever reason, actually fits your hat, you might not get a flip in the brim without a turn.

-Daryl

gabrielle · Post by **gabrielle** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 7:24 pm

But if I turn it then the pinch is off center.

Kentucky Blues · Post by **Kentucky Blues** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 7:35 pm

Yeah, that's kind of a problem. I'm pretty sure that the location of the pinch is a big part of the turn, as in you turn the hat when it's open crowned and then put the bash in it's new center. BUT I'm no expert on turning, as I for one am not a fan of the turn...
-Daryl

Marcus Brody · Post by **Marcus Brody** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 8:01 pm

You turn it before you bash it.

Also the theory of the turn is pretty much untouchable imo. Just watch any scene in Raiders where the distortion on the brim is prevalent and you'll notice the bow's way to far forward to not be turned.

Putting a long oval head into a regular oval hat is no substitute for the turn, and here's why. The turn does not create symmetrical effects. Just looking at any scene from Raiders with the turn, each side of the hat is not identical looking. Also, as a result of the turn and the dimensional cut, the brim droops significantly more on one side.

Kentucky Blues · Post by **Kentucky Blues** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 8:09 pm

There isn't symmetry on my regular oval hats. And on some of them, it seems that the bow is more forward then it should be. But like I said, this isnt' the place for discussing turn theory. I'm just backing up the idea that a regular oval hat on a long oval hat can produce a wonky brim with some swoop to it.

-Daryl

Chewbacca Jones · Post by **Chewbacca Jones** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 8:37 pm

Daryl's right. Particularly on soft felt hats (which is what the Raiders hat was), head shape has much to do with symmetry of shape and all that. On a real head, the long oval pull is not likely to be dead center front and back, so the pull would be uneven.

As to the location of the bow; the Raiders hat had a hand placed ribbon. I own eight hand assembled hats, and the bow is off center on half of those. Plus, I have a factory hat with no turn that has the bow in the exact location as the "turned" Indy hat.

In short, Brody; the evidence, while compelling (and proof of the best short cut), remains inconclusive, and thus quite touchable. Doesn't mean your wrong. Just means you may not be right.

gabrielle · Post by **gabrielle** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 8:42 pm

Lol, the great turn conspiracy!!!

#

Marcus Brody · Post by **Marcus Brody** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:36 am

I'm just backing up the idea that a regular oval hat on a long oval hat can produce a wonky brim with some swoop to it.

I'm not debating that either, but the effect still isn't the same unless your head or hat is significantly unsymmetrical. The only way to prove this would be to get an outline of your head and the hat to see if your head pushes the hat diagonally enough to create the bird beak visible from one side and the flip on the other. I have a round oval head and putting my head in to a hat turned 90 degrees will not create the correct brim distortion, it will be super reverse tapered and lots of bird beak brim, but no flip. The only natural way for me to achieve the SOC brim is by turning the hat so much that the bow is over my eye.

In some cases, the right hat and the right hand skills will get it.

Yeah, the flip sort of can be be had by manipulating the hat correct. Since I don't feel like changing the bow, I generally have to resort to a slight turn and I curl the bow side a lot more while creating more of a angled bend on the other side. It's not perfect, but it gets me decently close to getting the brim right.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 11:04 am

gabrielle wrote:But if I turn it then the pinch is off center.

Thats the Raiders hat.

morethanatimelord · Post by **morethanatimelord** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:46 pm

the pinch on my hat is slightly off centre because i thought it looked that way on the raiders hat