Club Obi Wan

Hey guys,

Just had a thought about the sizing of the brim on a Raiders style hat, specifically the brim width.

I have an AdVintage Riaders hat that fits me perfectly and looks great. However every time I watch the film its like I'm looking at my hat
but with a smaller brim width. Specifically the distance from the ribbon to the edge of the brim.

Now I searched for the dimensions of the screen used hat and they're on this forum somewhere. I broke out the calipers and measured
my hat, AdVintage nailed it. Its the exact right size.

But when I wear it it looks huge, almost like a cowboy/western hat or something designed for more shade coverage vs the Indy style fedora.

Is this just an optical illusion? I know the Raiders hats are a little taller and wider than the ones we see in the other films. But I'm considering
trying another hat and I wonder if theres one out there that would look a little better on my head.

Anyway, have any of you noticed the same thing? Maybe its just my head shape vs Ford's? Maybe its the angle of camera lens they used vs me just looking in a mirror?

Appreciate any thoughts you may have.

First of all, does your hat have the Raider's turn or not? The turned hat throws off the dimensional cut of the brim and makes parts of it look larger or smaller than an un-turned hat.

Second, what size are you? Apparently Harrison Ford was around 58 or 59 cm. If you're a smaller size (like me over here with a super small 56 cm noggin) it would affect the brim width since the brim is the same dimensions as the larger size. Same goes for someone with a substantially larger head, if the brim width is the same as Harrison's size 58/59, it will look a bit smaller on them. If AdVintage graduates their blocks, then the crown height will go down with smaller sizes and up with larger ones. But since the brim width is the same as the specs on the site, then that means that it could look a bit larger or smaller depending on the head, despite the crown being proportioned differently to match your head size.

Lastly, as you said, it could be head shape. Ford's long oval head stretched the front and back of the hat, bringing the sides of the brim to curl upwards. I have a bit of a more round oval head, so my brims remain rather flat unless I really work the shape into them. That can make the brim look larger than it really is.

-WNY Indy

That makes sense.

I have a rather large size. 62cm if I remember right. My hat does not have the turn built into it.

Its one of those things where it looks really close sometimes, and then other times I look at a photo of me in it or in the mirror and it seems
very different.

I still love the hat and everyone knows its an Indy hat as soon as they see it so no complaints really.

I'm just wondering if I decide on a second hat what I should do or which vendor to pick to make it look a little more like the film.

Hmmm... see, with a larger head size, I would expect the brim to look a bit smaller if it was the original specs. But there are so many factors that play into proportions with hats. Not having the turn might play into the hat looking a bit different if you were comparing the brim to that of a turned hat, but if you compare it with the un-turned hat in the opening sequence then I would expect the proportions to look similar. In my opinion, the un turned hat earlier in the film can appear to have a larger brim in some cases since it is much flatter and the dimensional cut hasn't been thrown out of whack.

How old/ "broken in" is this hat? It is possible that the break line between the brim and the crown has not softened up and is making the brim more rigid/sticking out more, which could contribute to it looking larger. Oh, one last question, do you have a Harrison or one of the AdVintage custom hats?

I feel you with something looking super close but then different at times. Hats can be real chameleons at times and look so very different depending on angles, lighting, head shape, etc. And for people like us who are trying to achieve the look of such a specific hat like Indy's, it can be even trickier to really nail down the "perfect look."

I'm wondering if you wouldn't mind uploading a picture of the hat? I'm interested to see how the proportions come across...

Well, there is no shortage of information on here about good vendors for hats. I unfortunately can't be of much help since I've only owned an Akubra Fed IV Deluxe and a Raiders hat that I made by hand myself. I have visited Herbert Johnson in London and got to try on a few hats there. I was blown away by their hats, but I've not owned one, so don't take my word for it. There are folks here who have owned so many hats from so many vendors who hopefully will chime in with recommendations.

-WNY Indy

Good info man thank you.

Mine is a custom hat from advintage, its a few years old now. But I don't wear it much and its never seen outdoor wear or any elements.

I'll try to find a picture here and put it up. But I think the issue is more my head than anything.

I also noticed if the hat is pulled lower on my forehead and I'm looking more down at the mirror/camera it seems to look a little better. A lot of the shots from Raiders are Ford looking forward with his head tilted more down vs a more relaxed upright gaze. Maybe I'm over analyzing it but that seems to make a bit of a difference.

It would be cool to try a few different ones on like you did at Herbert Johnson. Maybe I'll get the chance one day.

It's interesting that you posed this question. I am currently having Roberto at Steele and Jones make a Raiders fedora for me. As part of the process he looks at photos of me wearing my other hats, including one I have from Advintage. His comment on that hat was that it seemed too tall for me and the brim seemed too wide. When I look at the comparison photos he's right, but I'm not sure why.
Hope you find your answers.

interesting data point for sure.

This whole thing just sounds like an excuse to go hat shopping again!

From what I've read on this forum, Richard Swales gave at least two separate answers as to what the brim width on the Raiders hat was. Perhaps, of the two widths Swales provided, the wider has become accepted as the brim width, making the brim look wider than some scenes in the movie. Since Swales eyeballed trimming the brim with scissors I have a feeling the brim width could have varied from hat to hat. Current day Indy hat makers are usually more precise. It's possible that could contribute to the brim width not looking quite right.

It's also important to keep in mind that the dimensions that look proportionally correct on Ford will not always look correct on the rest of us. So the brim width may be exactly what it was in the movie, but look different on different people. Sometimes, it might be best to scale the proportions to yourself rather than try to go with the proportions that look good on Ford. But that's hard to do when ordering a hat online, even a very very bespoke hat from a top notch company. I have heard of folks trimming down the brim on a hat if it didn't look right on them, even if it was the exact screen used dimensions. But that is a bit of a tricky modification since it is quite permanent.

-WNY Indy

Well it could be all sorts of factors, not least of which being you're just not used to seeing yourself in the hat and/or you're still just kind of self conscious about it. But the most important thing in all of this is to remember you're NOT Harrison Ford and the gear will wear differently on you. Doesn't mean it doesn't look good, it just means you have to make it your own.

But I'm actually kind of surprised Thomas kept the brim dimensions with a crown that big. They'll often cut it slightly wider to maintain the dimensions -- pretty sure HJ does that, along with S&J. Often people complain about the crown height on a hat that big and the ribbon looking too small as a result; I once got into a big argument here with someone with a head that big who just didn't want to accept the ribbon width can't change and the crown was blocked higher to aesthetically compensate for the width making the ribbon appear thin. It was like they refused to accept they had a head substantially larger than Ford's and that was going to affect everything.

But it could just be your features. Do you have a thin face and build? Ford has strong cheekbones and facial features in general which keeps viewer attention on the face. Without that, along with the unshaven beard, the hat can look like it's eating you. But that's not unusual; just go look at period photos, some people look like their lid is devouring them. The 2 5/8" brim is quite wide and unusual and distinctive but not for everyone. If you want to get a Fed which has 2.5" brim sides and see if that works better for you and go from there.

flyit14 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2024 1:30 pm Good info man thank you.

Mine is a custom hat from advintage, its a few years old now. But I don't wear it much and its never seen outdoor wear or any elements.

Hmm. I wonder is it possible that, by not wearing it much (and never outdoors), you're simply not accustomed to how the hat looks on you...? I suspect if you wear it more, not only will it conform to your head and take on its own personality, but you'll get comfortable with how it looks. As someone mentioned, you could also try adding a little more curl to the brim sides, which will make them look a little narrower.

Is this your first Indy fedora? Do you have other similar hats that you've worn more often? If you haven't been a hat guy before (other than maybe baseball caps), then, yes, it may take a while for you to "own" the look and not feel a little self-conscious (lots of us felt that way at first).

I live in Maryland, and in addition to Indy fedoras, I have many western hats I wear often -- with even wider brims! I did feel self-conscious at first, because hardly anybody wears wide-brimmed hats these days, and you certainly don't see a lot of western hats around these here eastern parts. The truth is, most people don't notice or care what hat I'm wearing -- and those who do notice often say, "Great hat, man!"

So I'd suggest wearing your excellent AdVintage hat proudly and often!

Howard Weinstein wrote: ↑Sun Dec 29, 2024 1:28 pm

flyit14 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2024 1:30 pm Good info man thank you.

Mine is a custom hat from advintage, its a few years old now. But I don't wear it much and its never seen outdoor wear or any elements.

Hmm. I wonder is it possible that, by not wearing it much (and never outdoors), you're simply not accustomed to how the hat looks on you...? I suspect if you wear it more, not only will it conform to your head and take on its own personality, but you'll get comfortable with how it looks. As someone mentioned, you could also try adding a little more curl to the brim sides, which will make them look a little narrower.

Is this your first Indy fedora? Do you have other similar hats that you've worn more often? If you haven't been a hat guy before (other than maybe baseball caps), then, yes, it may take a while for you to "own" the look and not feel a little self-conscious (lots of us felt that way at first).

I live in Maryland, and in addition to Indy fedoras, I have many western hats I wear often -- with even wider brims! I did feel self-conscious at first, because hardly anybody wears wide-brimmed hats these days, and you certainly don't see a lot of western hats around these here eastern parts. The truth is, most people don't notice or care what hat I'm wearing -- and those who do notice often say, "Great hat, man!"

So I'd suggest wearing your excellent AdVintage hat proudly and often!

Thats honestly a good point. I have noticed even in the film the look changes a lot. Flatter brim, more curled brim etc. I recently watched the scene where Indy is talking to Belloq in the cafe in Cairo. That scene is pretty close to how I look in the hat and to me the brim seems wider.

To your point about not being used to wearing it thats absolutely true. I'm not much of a hat guy in daily life so when I wear the indy hat its usually halloween or something. Like I said above no one mistakes what it is by any means. Its just that I notice the difference. Not a huge deal though.

I should break out the stetson more often haha!

Illinois_Jones wrote: ↑Sat Dec 28, 2024 1:52 am Well it could be all sorts of factors, not least of which being you're just not used to seeing yourself in the hat and/or you're still just kind of self conscious about it. But the most important thing in all of this is to remember you're NOT Harrison Ford and the gear will wear differently on you. Doesn't mean it doesn't look good, it just means you have to make it your own.

But I'm actually kind of surprised Thomas kept the brim dimensions with a crown that big. They'll often cut it slightly wider to maintain the dimensions -- pretty sure HJ does that, along with S&J. Often people complain about the crown height on a hat that big and the ribbon looking too small as a result; I once got into a big argument here with someone with a head that big who just didn't want to accept the ribbon width can't change and the crown was blocked higher to aesthetically compensate for the width making the ribbon appear thin. It was like they refused to accept they had a head substantially larger than Ford's and that was going to affect everything.

But it could just be your features. Do you have a thin face and build? Ford has strong cheekbones and facial features in general which keeps viewer attention on the face. Without that, along with the unshaven beard, the hat can look like it's eating you. But that's not unusual; just go look at period photos, some people look like their lid is devouring them. The 2 5/8" brim is quite wide and unusual and distinctive but not for everyone. If you want to get a Fed which has 2.5" brim sides and see if that works better for you and go from there.

I'd say I have a more narrow face than Ford. And I've never really spent any time looking at anyone else in a Fedora than him. I'm well aware that it'll never look the same on my head as him.

I might look into another hat with a slightly smaller brim, or a custom one where I can specify different aspects of the hat. Like I said this is all just justification for collecting more indy gear!