Club Obi Wan

Whilst it’s a question about Indys Jackets, I’ve put this here due to the fact it’s not a question strictly pertaining to details about the jacket itself. Please move if I’ve got this wrong.

I was just thinking about the ‘weathering’ on his jackets. Much of what we see is wear and tear from years of use. Bearing in mind his jackets, in the films, are either ‘lost’ or taken to destruction, being dragged under a truck etc. , how to they get to the beautifully worn appearance we see in the films. I have a new jacket and, though I plan to have many more years wearing it, I can’t see me getting it to look like Indys without sand paper etc.

This is meant to be a bit of fun. I know his jackets looked like that, as the script dictated it. However can anyone give a ‘reasonable’ explanation as to how he manages to appear in perfectly worn jackets every time. Except the end of TOD, which by some miracle looks like a brand new jacket.

It's a Catch-22 though, isn't it? Haha. The jackets used in the films were new jackets professionally distressed to look worn, but not dilapidated into rags, as that would have compromised Dr. Jones' mostly dignified appearance.

To achieve this, you need to take a new jacket and do the same. The distressing isn't truly reflective of realistic wear, as you stated. If you wear a jacket for years, it's going to develop a patina and look worn, but it's not going to reach that level of distress without it's structural integrity becoming compromised in the process. I like to look at it similarly to film makeup in a sense. They needed the jacket to look a certain way to achieve a desired effect, but that doesn't mean it aligns with reality. Just like how most cosplayers modify and distress their own gear. It's art, not wear and tear.

there is something about a well worn jacket, hat or shoes that becomes part of a person. I have a pair of Alden's that I wore everywhere and in every type of weather, rain or snow, to do yard work, etc. They wouldn't have that look by 'distressing' them. The pair of shoes wouldn't have turned out that way, even had to resole them.

A pair of leather gloves will even take on the lines in your hands.

Someone posted they brush up against a brick wall any chance they get while wearing the jacket. Good for a few scrapes. Mine has held up well on the outside, but the inside of the jacket is a different story...

Also, in case you haven't seen it,

There's an entire section dedicated to care and distressing of items such as the Jacket. There's some good info in there that might help

backstagejack wrote:Also, in case you haven't seen it,

There's an entire section dedicated to care and distressing of items such as the Jacket. There's some good info in there that might help

Thank you very much for reminding me of this. My question however was really about the ‘real world’ that Indy lived in. I’m not sure how long he had his jacket, before the start of Raiders, but the chances are being dragged under the truck would have destroyed it. Then he has another jacket, that appears to have seen a lot of action in TOD. I’m not sure how long there was, between the two films for the jacket to get this wear. It can’t have been more than a handful of years. Continuity aside it took a heck of a thrashing there too. He then had a new jacket in Last Crusade. Now I know all the jackets are different but the LC is the most obviously different of the first three seen.

I was just thinking over how ‘he’ ended up with jackets looking as they did, over such a ‘short’ period of time.

Interesting. I'd never assumed Indy wore the same jacket, with all that travelling he does, working on archaeological sites, lots of rough country and extreme climates, as well as then getting into scrapes, I think I's always assumed he was well known at the menswear store, a frequent customer .

Wotalark wrote:Interesting. I'd never assumed Indy wore the same jacket, with all that travelling he does, working on archaeological sites, lots of rough country and extreme climates, as well as then getting into scrapes, I think I's always assumed he was well known at the menswear store, a frequent customer .

I’m with you on the “Another four pairs of trousers, and eight shirts, Dr Jones?” I was just thinking that his jackets would either have been ‘destroyed’ or lost long before they obtained such lovely worn look. I’m at a loss as to any potential workable theory. It looks like I’ll have to chalk this one up to ‘it’s a film’.

ah, real world. Yeah this is kicked around alot.

Real world..... he wears a different jacket. No one that does what he does to clothing can wear the same thing for 20 plus years. There's a good reason there's no bullet hole in the arm in LC (plus storm flap buttons added) or CS.

Also, TOD is before raiders so It could be the same jacket before Raiders as it's only a year apart and it receives little damage in TOD. But those jackets have differences as well. AS Indy says in LC, "This happens to me all the time." So maybe he had an adventure between Raiders and Tod as well? Though when the guy has time to teach is beyond me.....

Which all leads to me to the theory Indy gets all his stuff custom made specifically to emulate the same gear over the years with tweak. Which explains why he has different hats, jackets etc in every movie.

It also explains why his clothes emulate military design but they are most definitely not surplus gear as all of his clothes have design elements that are not in WWI or WWII surplus.

But that's how I see it, it's fine if others don't. and yes, I know, it's a movie. But it's a movie that aside from fantastical elements towards the end of every adventure has been set in a very real world and time period.

Raider Of The Lost Ark wrote:Whilst it’s a question about Indys Jackets, I’ve put this here due to the fact it’s not a question strictly pertaining to details about the jacket itself. Please move if I’ve got this wrong.

I was just thinking about the ‘weathering’ on his jackets. Much of what we see is wear and tear from years of use. Bearing in mind his jackets, in the films, are either ‘lost’ or taken to destruction, being dragged under a truck etc. , how to they get to the beautifully worn appearance we see in the films. I have a new jacket and, though I plan to have many more years wearing it, I can’t see me getting it to look like Indys without sand paper etc.

This is meant to be a bit of fun. I know his jackets looked like that, as the script dictated it. However can anyone give a ‘reasonable’ explanation as to how he manages to appear in perfectly worn jackets every time. Except the end of TOD, which by some miracle looks like a brand new jacket.

I don’t think the jackets look perfectly worn to be honest. The Raiders jacket looks good with subtle wear, the others look artificially distressed to me, especially the LC version which looks clumsily sanded along each seam. I like the pattern however.

Not sure the script would have said much more than the costume looks like it’s seen previous adventures. How this is achieved is up to the costume folk.

Indy is just meant to be wearing soldier of fortune work clothes, which by definition look more characterful and plausible if worn.

Unfortunately for me Indy’s costume has become like a superhero costume, with just a few minor mods on the same theme each movie. I would have liked a lot more changes across each film just to make it more real and keep it interesting.

Wotalark wrote:Interesting. I'd never assumed Indy wore the same jacket, with all that travelling he does, working on archaeological sites, lots of rough country and extreme climates, as well as then getting into scrapes, I think I's always assumed he was well known at the menswear store, a frequent customer .

Heh! Yes indeed; after all we see his shirt and trousers pretty much ruined in ToD but he’s got a new set ready for Raiders- his jacket gets a hole in there (and potentially his hat and jacket get left behind on the boat). And then in Crystal Skull the whole outfit gets presumably incinerated by the army after the nuke, but he’s got a fresh set ready for Peru!

Raider Of The Lost Ark wrote:Except the end of TOD, which by some miracle looks like a brand new jacket.

It doesn't look brand new at the end of ToD. it's distressed, falling apart and it's even got holes in it. You can see this in the close ups. It looks ready to be retired, which fits in nicely with a different less distressed looking jacket making it's appearance in Raiders.

But the question how does it always look distressed in the movies, the clue is in the dialogue. ''I follow you on many adventures".

Yeah the one at the end of ToD is the worst condition it ever looked: the leather is actually flaking off in some areas isn't it?

Well I keep wondering why I haven't chimed in on this thread "yet".
I'm a fan of distressing my jackets, I'm an impatient guy and can't wait the 20+ years it's going to take, heck I'll be in my grave waiting on an archeologist to dig me up.

Any way I think that S&J does a great job in distressing, and when they offered up the truck chase jacket, I snagged one.

Here's my understanding/opinion.
Raiders jacket the distressing was very subtle, yes it looked it, but it was mostly fullers earth or some such which made it look that way, that's why the truck jacket looked really distressed, he just got dragged over 80 grit sand paper for how long.
In the beginning when he's in the temple and nocking of the spiders, if you look at the pleat, you can see how different it looks, almost non-distressed.
(see pic)


Now my Wested, I've had for some time and I've done some distressing, almost to the point it looked like my truck jacket.
Wested had a grey undertone, so I did the brown leather dye thing and like I said it looked like my truck jacket.
With the dye job, it just reminded me of the truck.

Going to put together a history of what I've done soon.

Below is a pic of my three jacket showing levels of distressing, it has to
look good or it looks like you bought it a clothing store.

And here's a front & back of what it looks like now
But I wanted a jacket that wasn't distressed, ya I said it.
So I hit it with dark Pecard's twice.



It's not achieved the look I desire in a jacket that's distressed, but not over board.
Sorry for the wall of words

Croft

They look great. Who are the makers of the three pictured together?

Daaaang, beautiful jackets Croft

Yes, good pics Croft. I haven't distressed my Legacy Raiders yet, and what you've done there is the road I'll go down. The legacy Raiders leather is quite a dark deep brown as new, and the undertone is just a lighter brown.

As a guy who has never given his jackets the water treatment, I have often wondered this. At the beginning of both Raiders and Crusade, Indy takes a plunge and totally submerges his jacket in water. After those "water treatments", would he end up with a nicely weathered jacket, or a destroyed jacket?

And comparing the two movies, in Raiders, he submerges the jacket in what I assume is freshwater for maybe a minute before climbing out of the water, and then takes off in a plane with an open air cockpit, with the strong winds blowing through his jacket. Compare that to Crusade, where he swings into (I assume) salt water, and while there is no way of knowing how long he was in that water, I think it is safe to say he was in it long enough for the entire jacket to become fully saturated. Is it possible for a jacket to survive that? Is there anyway the jacket he wears through the rest of the movie is the same jacket he wears in the opening?

I always thought the hats must've been fairly knackered after those especially, would they?

Thanks guys.
Sorry for not posting Mfg.
Top: Wested hero
Middle: S&J ToD
Bottom: S&J Truck chase

And as far as the condition of any jacket worn in any of the movies that gets the water treatment, I’d have to say the next time you see him and it’s dry, it’s just another jack, as they have several on set.
This is how we’ve gotten to the Hawaii jacket, Raven bar, Bantu wind and Cairo.

My two cents.

Croft

Yes, you are right. The filmmakers use a lot of jackets while making the movie. What I was wondering is what would happen to the jackets in universe. For example, as someone else mentioned, Indy's shirt at the end of Doom was shredded, so he must have replaced it by Raiders. So in universe, how much weathering might have happened to his jacket after swinging into a South American river?

Actually, he got the water treatment at the beginning of Temple of Doom as well. As was also mentioned before, the jacket at the end of Doom is one of the times the jacket looks the most weathered, even though he doesn't wear it through a large part of the movie. So maybe, in universe, getting the jacket soaked during an unexpected river raft ride, and then walking around in the intense India heat really did a job on the leather.

rafferty74 wrote:As a guy who has never given his jackets the water treatment, I have often wondered this. At the beginning of both Raiders and Crusade, Indy takes a plunge and totally submerges his jacket in water. After those "water treatments", would he end up with a nicely weathered jacket, or a destroyed jacket?
Is it possible for a jacket to survive that? Is there anyway the jacket he wears through the rest of the movie is the same jacket he wears in the opening?

Leather is strong. I have washed over a dozen leather jackets in my washing machine with detergent. No damage. Just loosens up the hide. The main risk is to the lining should it shrink or tear in the machine (front loader is the way to go less abrasive).

rafferty74 wrote: So in universe, how much weathering might have happened to his jacket after swinging into a South American river?

So maybe, in universe, getting the jacket soaked during an unexpected river raft ride, and then walking around in the intense India heat really did a job on the leather.

Waster doesn't damage jackets. There's a reason leather jackets were worn by police and workmen before nylon was available.

Yes, and no. Water causes leather to release any oil protection which needs to be replaced after a thorough soaking. That’s why it’s stiff when it dries.

If it’s not dried fairly quickly, it will start to rot…so the material is resilient, but not infallible if not treated occasionally.

Regards! Michaelson

Those are some gorgeous jackets, Croft!!!

You're makin' me drool!

Thank you Canyon, I'll send you a bib for when ever you cruise the site.

My Wested has gone through some passes.
Distressed, but the grey undertone.
So I distressed more and leather dyed. But although I liked it, reminded me to much of my S&J Truck.
So tow coats (fine coats) of Pecard's brown lotion and it looks awesome in person, trying to find the best lighting to really show it off.
And I've watered down my jackets heavily, but always treat them once dry.

Croft

Arch Stanton wrote:

It's like there's no real movie being made but just a lot of publicity shots of HF standing around in an Indy costume. There is never any film or set equipment in the shots, background or otherwise; only practical lighting with him just "off" set or whatever. I wonder if Disney is putting much value in this one. Their approach to this makes HF look like a general fan in costume who's making a low-budge home movie or something.

Maybe they're trying something new with marketing but none of these BTS images feel right in terms of movie promotion. Certainly not in keeping things secret or making then appealing. Could be a red herring in order to launch a movie nothing like what's been shown these past few months. CGI - Younger Indiana Jones and storyline-wise. A shiny penny in another direction perhaps. But this stuff, so generic somehow.

Anyway, yes, weathering on this jacket as well.

That’s actually the best shot of what this Jacket will look like, very truck chase vibe.

And ya all these just standing around shots, like someone is sneaking shots.

Very anxious to see one in full gear

Croft

New jacket looks like lambskin..the "off shoulder" is here too..anyone have a idea who could be the manufacturer of the leather jacket for this movie,or it was just made by costumes department of Hollywood-Disney studios ?

I'm sure "top men are working on it"
Like S&J, ah the possibility's of yet another jacket for my growing collection.

Croft

I think this one may be the hardest to replicate yet!

Thunderspy wrote:I think this one may be the hardest to replicate yet!

I agree haha! At the same time, so far this jacket seems to have the most story in it (aesthetic wise).
Raiders body with the collar and d rings of last crusade. Plus, if you look closely, it has the bullet hole stitched on the left arm. So it's like they're telling us that this is the same jacket from Raiders but with a few tweaks.

A couple more really nice shots here: https://www.instagram.com/p/CU3rzt0szti ... hare_sheet" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Ford looks AWESOME! Even old, he looks like the same tough man as he did in Raiders.

LostRaider25 wrote:

Thunderspy wrote:I think this one may be the hardest to replicate yet!

I agree haha! At the same time, so far this jacket seems to have the most story in it (aesthetic wise).
Raiders body with the collar and d rings of last crusade. Plus, if you look closely, it has the bullet hole stitched on the left arm. So it's like they're telling us that this is the same jacket from Raiders but with a few tweaks.

…and now the Disney/Cooper jacket’s ‘backward’ straps are screen accurate!!

@LostRaider 25 I agree. I think this jacket tells more of a story than any of the others. I especially like the repaired bullet hole. I’m just trying to work out how he got it back. Does anyone know where the ship he was on ended up, and what the cost of shipping it to America was likely to be in the late 30’s?

I think they were sailing to England weren't they? Is that mentioned or did I imagine that?

http://indygear.com/cow/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=72236" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Bag strap discussion.

I just deleted/edited all the bag strap comments/posts that highjacked' this thread.

Let's get this one back to weathering of the jacket, if you don't mind.

Regards! Michaelson

Wow, I had not seen those pics until now. Very weathered jacket.

Personally, I don't go for the real weathered stuff. I have to look presentable in public after all!

And we now know that his socks are black or very dark brown!!! OK, Magnoli, you making the official Indy sock??

LawranceOfArabia wrote:Hey all, been trying to find images of the original screen used Raiders Jacket, anyone know where I can find one? Lots of the LC jacket displayed at the Smithsonian but can’t find equivalent images of the Raiders jacket, any leads?

There are only two out photos out there to my knowledge. This one https://imgur.com/NjojFp8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and this one https://imgur.com/W2HVdGQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. Note that this was not the only jacket used in raiders.

The Indy 5 jacket seems to be the most Raiders-like jacket of any of the sequels. Perhaps this jacket is only used for the time-travel scenes taking place in the past. But... why on Earth did they install those shiny D-Rings instead of black buckles? They stick out like a sore thumb.

Maybe they knew the strap-ends had to face backwards, so reversing the strap orientation was their solution? Weird, seeing as how Brandon has the screen-used Raiders jacket and he has a relationship with Lucasfilm...

Likelier scenario is that only weirdos like us notice these things...

Forrest For the Trees wrote:The Indy 5 jacket seems to be the most Raiders-like jacket of any of the sequels. Perhaps this jacket is only used for the time-travel scenes taking place in the past. But... why on Earth did they install those shiny D-Rings instead of black buckles? They stick out like a sore thumb.

Maybe they knew the strap-ends had to face backwards, so reversing the strap orientation was their solution? Weird, seeing as how Brandon has the screen-used Raiders jacket and he has a relationship with Lucasfilm...

Likelier scenario is that only weirdos like us notice these things...

As some have said, including myself, it looks like a blend of the Cooper jackets they sold at the parks and a standard Wested. Personally I'm going with a pseudo conspiracy that just like the boots they're going with a slightly independent design from makers they know and are thus under Disney's control and sell the "official" rights. My guess is they know full well the hardware -- if they are in fact replicating the Raiders jacket they knew enough to leave out the snaps, so they must have known about the buckles.

Illinois_Jones wrote:

Forrest For the Trees wrote:The Indy 5 jacket seems to be the most Raiders-like jacket of any of the sequels. Perhaps this jacket is only used for the time-travel scenes taking place in the past. But... why on Earth did they install those shiny D-Rings instead of black buckles? They stick out like a sore thumb.

Maybe they knew the strap-ends had to face backwards, so reversing the strap orientation was their solution? Weird, seeing as how Brandon has the screen-used Raiders jacket and he has a relationship with Lucasfilm...

Likelier scenario is that only weirdos like us notice these things...

As some have said, including myself, it looks like a blend of the Cooper jackets they sold at the parks and a standard Wested. Personally I'm going with a pseudo conspiracy that just like the boots they're going with a slightly independent design from makers they know and are thus under Disney's control and sell the "official" rights. My guess is they know full well the hardware -- if they are in fact replicating the Raiders jacket they knew enough to leave out the snaps, so they must have known about the buckles.

Wouldn't that rely on big evil Disney (getting slightly tiresome) thinking that enough people would care about having an exactly perfect facsimile right down to the D rings in order to sell the official rights? I know there's some people on here who care, but it doesn't seem a massive industry they'd be that worried about breaking into. And the official jacket is whatever they say it is, it doesn't have to be unique to the others or even accurate to what's on screen- it just needs a licensed logo on it.

Maybe instead of everything being about how awful and evil Disney are (and I'm not aiming this specifically at you but also the people in the spoiler thread who say it'll be bad because Disney are involved, or people saying they'll react to the possible strike in the most evil way they can etc. etc.), the costume designer just did it because they liked it? Or because they used suppliers they know and have good rapport with, or suppliers who could supply in time etc. - or even maybe just items that Ford himself preferred. If Disney were so desperate to make cash at any cost (and I'm not saying they're not a business that isn't slightly too big and has dodgy sides) then why didn't they make this film eight years ago.
Sorry for the rant, I'm just getting a bit tired of every post on this movie here being variants on 'this is awful because Disney are doing it'.

That back image of the jacket is facinating, so much tape pucker especially around the strap anchors.

That's a detail I love, wish jacket makers could reproduce that at least as an option. I wonder if it was a combo of mesh support tape and cow gum that produced that?

KT Templar, I might be mistaken, but I think S&J said they do it, the tape thing.
Reach out to Diego, he does amazing work, I can attest as I've post many pictures of my Truck Case.
No tape mind you, because at the time it wasn't offered.

And then again, I might be wrong.

And as far as Disney is concerned, what ever jacket maker they went with, there's always tweaks, so long as they keep the essence of the the gear, that's what's important to me.
Know if they went with a leather hat........ I'd be a pass for me.

Croft

Indiana Croft wrote:
Know if they went with a leather hat........ I'd be a pass for me.

Croft

Hey, don’t give them any ideas! They’re evil, or haven’t you heard?

Regards! M

Thunderspy wrote:

Illinois_Jones wrote:

Forrest For the Trees wrote:The Indy 5 jacket seems to be the most Raiders-like jacket of any of the sequels. Perhaps this jacket is only used for the time-travel scenes taking place in the past. But... why on Earth did they install those shiny D-Rings instead of black buckles? They stick out like a sore thumb.

Maybe they knew the strap-ends had to face backwards, so reversing the strap orientation was their solution? Weird, seeing as how Brandon has the screen-used Raiders jacket and he has a relationship with Lucasfilm...

Likelier scenario is that only weirdos like us notice these things...

As some have said, including myself, it looks like a blend of the Cooper jackets they sold at the parks and a standard Wested. Personally I'm going with a pseudo conspiracy that just like the boots they're going with a slightly independent design from makers they know and are thus under Disney's control and sell the "official" rights. My guess is they know full well the hardware -- if they are in fact replicating the Raiders jacket they knew enough to leave out the snaps, so they must have known about the buckles.

Wouldn't that rely on big evil Disney (getting slightly tiresome) thinking that enough people would care about having an exactly perfect facsimile right down to the D rings in order to sell the official rights? I know there's some people on here who care, but it doesn't seem a massive industry they'd be that worried about breaking into. And the official jacket is whatever they say it is, it doesn't have to be unique to the others or even accurate to what's on screen- it just needs a licensed logo on it.

Maybe instead of everything being about how awful and evil Disney are (and I'm not aiming this specifically at you but also the people in the spoiler thread who say it'll be bad because Disney are involved, or people saying they'll react to the possible strike in the most evil way they can etc. etc.), the costume designer just did it because they liked it? Or because they used suppliers they know and have good rapport with, or suppliers who could supply in time etc. - or even maybe just items that Ford himself preferred. If Disney were so desperate to make cash at any cost (and I'm not saying they're not a business that isn't slightly too big and has dodgy sides) then why didn't they make this film eight years ago.
Sorry for the rant, I'm just getting a bit tired of every post on this movie here being variants on 'this is awful because Disney are doing it'.

At what point did I EVER say Disney was awful and evil?

And yes, the movie is likely going to be bad. It's just the way things are. It would likely still be bad if LFL were still independent and Spielberg and Lucas still involved. There are large forces at work that conspire to make far too many films not very good anymore. And I could not care less one way or another; I'm not the demographic they're after and haven't been for quite some time and it doesn't bother me. I watched KOTCS a total of ONE time and don't care to see it again. It doesn't harm my enjoyment of the first three or my enjoyment of the gear. It's a bad movie and I moved on from it during the end credits 13 years ago. I'm not remotely invested in this new film, I've got better things to do. Though you certainly seem to be. People are curious about the jacket and why the straps are reversed and I offered a likely corporate explanation. You're the one moralizing it.

And yes licensing agreements can be quite lucrative. The "official" jacket is whatever Disney says it is because they own the property. And sometimes it's not just about money, it's about control. Such is late stage capitalism.

End rant and now back to the jacket.

When people buy the "indiana jones jacket" at the park they are more likely to identify it as identical or extremely just like the one in the latest film without noticing things like different straps, body lengths, etc., than the film one has. Also, the hat is darker brown to better look like the color of the "Indiana Jones hat" they'll have in the stores as well. It is very standard dark brown now like the official merchandise hat has been for ages.

Film jacket: Prominently shiny D-rings, yes. They make the rest of the jacket look artificially aged next to them. No wear, scrapes, rust on them... They're magic D-rings!

bantufo wrote:When people buy the "indiana jones jacket" at the park they are more likely to identify it as identical or extremely just like the one in the latest film without noticing things like different straps, body lengths, etc., than the film one has. Also, the hat is darker brown to better look like the color of the "Indiana Jones hat" they'll have in the stores as well. It is very standard dark brown now like the official merchandise hat has been for ages.

Film jacket: Prominently shiny D-rings, yes. They make the rest of the jacket look artificially aged next to them. No wear, scrapes, rust on them... They're magic D-rings!

Well yeah, and it's also what they can manufacture at scale. And it may be that flipping the straps is for that reason as well; I don't know, I'm not a jacket maker, but it may be easier/cheaper/faster to attach the straps the other way around. My larger point is that it's deliberate; people made that choice for reasons. And those reasons are corporate: either legal or practical. My guess is it's a combination of both. They know very well how the original was and chose not to do it that way for reason(s). It's their business and I don't really care; I'm certainly not in the market for one of those jackets, I have too many already.