akubra hat pros and cons

icemanfred · Post by **icemanfred** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:19 am

I have read alot and learned alot here in just one day.

I came across this hat, within my budget:
http://www.davidmorgan.com/product_info ... ts_id=1128" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I thought I would ask for some feedback. pros? cons?
pics from owners?

thanks

Texan Scott · Post by **Texan Scott** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:50 am

In that price range, you might consider a custom hat from Garrison:

http://garrisonhatters.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Post by **Indiana Jeff** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:37 am

I agree with TS 100%. Can't beat a custom made hat and you can't beat David's work or service.

If you're going to go with an Akubra, I'd recommend the Federation line through hatsdirect.com. The folks at hatsdirect worked with members here to develop the Fed line to be an Indy hat. The Akubra David Morgan sells is not very close.

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:38 am

Just for the record, here is the list from a quick search of all discussions regarding this particular DM Akubra.

search.php?keywords=David+Morgan+Advent ... mit=Search" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Regards! Michaelson

Texan Scott · Post by **Texan Scott** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:48 am

I know the author was asking about Akubra, but in a price range that is very close, going with a custom hat that a person has customized-made to fit, whose hands has touched and preselected the felt, band and other materials, is a clear winner in my mind. Bow and ribbon work will be very, very close to film. The skills of a good hatter can really transform a raw body into a work of art. FYI, if you have not considered it already?

ChrisMD · Post by **ChrisMD** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 10:09 am

Texan Scott wrote:I know the author was asking about Akubra, but in a price range that is very close, going with a custom hat that a person has customized-made to fit, whose hands has touched and preselected the felt, band and other materials, is a clear winner in my mind. Bow and ribbon work will be very, very close to film. The skills of a good hatter can really transform a raw body into a work of art. FYI, if you have not considered it already?

Extremely well said.

Banky · Post by **Banky** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:04 am

I'm new here and don't have a custom Indy hat. That being said, the Fed IV deluxe is an outstanding hat. I opted to go with it because of Akubra's renowned durability in the hatting world and I actually use it as a field hat. The girlfriend and I have recently taken up hiking and I've put nearly 20 miles of sweat, weather, and general less than gentle treatment into the hat and it's taken it all shrugged it off. Really imho it comes down to budget as well as use. Could I afford a hat by one of our fine SA hatters here? Sure. Would I feel right about traipsing through woods and weather in one? Probably not.

Charybdis · Post by **Charybdis** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:09 am

Well said, banky. I went with the Fed IV in the end due to price, mainly but also it's looks for the most part. Good thing is, this hobby has so many options now!

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:09 pm

Akubra makes a good dependable hat. I have several - some over 30 years old - and their quality remains consistent.

Their Heritage felt is very nice, but the Imperial quality stands up well over time too.

But (there's always a but) the felt is fairly stiff and you are stuck with standard sizing so for most people you'll end up ordering a little large and using their foam tape to adjust it down. You can work them to soften them up, but the sweatband has a wire reed in it that will bend and never straighten out right if it gets crushed.

For the same or slightly more you can get a custom made hat from Garrison and for a bit more than that you can get one of John Penman's rabbit felt hats which will fit perfectly, will feel all around better from the outset and will stand up to anything you can throw at it.

In the end, if you're serious about having a good hat, paying a bit more at the beginning will save you money over the long run because you'll end up going there eventually anyway.

Banky · Post by **Banky** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:29 pm

Penman may be the exception. I've handled a few of his hats, though have not owned one myself. Their owners say they've taken anything thrown at them. I won't speak to Garrison or AB, As I've never handled either of them. Still my point remains, do I want to be out in the woods, rain, hail, dust, sweating profusely, etc in a hat I've paid $300+ depending upon the maker and material used? (Garrison excluded I'm aware his price for rabbit is on par with the Fed IV) The answer is most likely no. Perhaps you boys make more than me, but 300 bucks is quite an investment to me regardless whether or not I can afford it. A custom hat is 100% the way to go in my mind for costume or if you just want to wear an Indy hat everyday, But for wearing the #### out of the hat and getting the "Indy look" without breaking the bank, the Fed IV is the way to go. Like I said, comes down to budget and how you intend to use it. There is no be all end all answer at the end of the day.

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:35 pm

The Akubra is about as good an 'outdoorsmans' fedora as you can get, as it was created to be used in Australian outback. Most of their felt is mixed with hare fur (a tougher, coaser hair) and does a great job for the price.

As to the discussion about high end custom vs. the lower end stuff.....I, too, used exactly the same argument to hold off upgrading to a higher end hat. Experience finally told me you get what you pay for, as for the price of a really good custom, you will probably go through at least 3 of the lower end hats before you have to have the custom cleaned and rebuilt.....something you can't do with the less expensive examples.

So, in the long run, it's all in what you're willing to do.......pay more now, or pay the same over a period of time to replace the less expensive ones that wear out with use.

As Banky says, there's no 'be all-end all' answer at the end of the day......but there are pros and cons to be considered, and each weighed against the other as to which gives you the best 'bang for your buck' over the long haul.

If you're a daily wear fedora wearing member, I HIGHLY suggest you shoot higher. and give serious consideration to the custom suggestions...but if you're an occasional fedora wearer, go for the Akubra. It will suit your purposes perfectly.

Regards! Michaelson

Banky · Post by **Banky** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:09 pm

You can certainly have Akubras rebuilt, cleaned etc. I do it on a regular basis. I work part time at the Brass Rooster here in Milwaukee as the refurbish-er/cleaner. We've taken hats that their owners feared were trash and given them new life. (I'm talking felt hats in general here, not just akubras). Nearly anything is possible with the correct tools, and time. Granted just about any vintage hat is going to be made of a higher quality felt than is possible to produce today. I'm certainly not saying a factory made akubra is going to be better than a custom hat but it certainly isn't a "throw away" hat by any means.

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 3:21 pm

Never said you couldn't rebuild an Akubra! I've had it done myself.

Quite the contrary.

That said.... I've just found their longevity does not match a hand made custom, and I've been a daily fedora wearer for well over 40 years now.

I also worked with Ron at HatsDirect and Steve Delk (pre- AdventureBilt) to work on the creation of the Akubra Federation line, so I'm well aware of Akubra's and their abilities. They're great production hats.

Others experiences will vary.

The Brass Rooster? http://brassrooster.com/The_Brass_Rooster/HOME.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Glad to meet you!

Regards! Michaelson

Texan Scott · Post by **Texan Scott** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:07 pm

If cars had progressed as much as computer technology, today a Rolls Royce would get a million miles to the gallon and cost just $1.95.

Put a turbo under the bendable oaskter and let's just see what we get?

Probably it'd just mean he would get tired faster, but I say its worth a try...?

...get busy BOakster!

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:22 pm

Yeah, and if you do, keep it around $150, which is the bottom line and budget of this posters question. BO's hats start at $275. At least a Garrison starrts at the $150 price range.

That said, if you can save your pennies to that level, BO's is a good choice to start out with as well.

Peters Brothers customs start out at $225.

As you can see, you're not THAT far away from ordering something hand made and custom built for you by one of our member craftsmen here.

Regards! M

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:34 pm

Back in 2004, when I found this site and lurked a few years before joining, I bought my first Akubra (Federation III back then). It was a great first Indy hat. I wore it for almost three years before getting my first Delk Adventurebuilt. The Akubra has always been a good quality hat an attainable cost. I wasn't going to put 300 bucks in a hat starting out. After wearing my Akubra for a while, I began to wonder what the difference was compared to a more expensive hat. Thus the venture began.
Akubra's are wonderful hats. They're one of a few hats I will reblock because they can take it.
If you are asking yourself "which is the best Hat I can get first", I can't help you there. Ultimately, only you can decide. If budget is driving the devotion, you can't go wrong with the Akubra. Get it. Wear it. Enjoy it.
I plan to use this as the title of a movie. In the spirit of Eat, Love, Pray. Its about this kid who is on the quest to find a hat and travels around the world trying to answer this question and meets different folks along the way that guides him on his internal struggle .............

..... Sorry, I was rambling.

LLS

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 4:39 pm

Local Land Surveyor wrote: I plan to use this as the title of a movie. In the spirit of Eat, Love, Pray. Its about this kid who is on the quest to find a hat and travels around the world trying to answer this question and meets different folks along the way that guides him on his internal struggle ............. ..... Sorry, I was rambling.

LLS

Yes....yes you were.

jlee562 · Post by **jlee562** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:01 pm

There's also something to be said about the fit of a custom hat!

Post by **Dalexs** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:34 pm

jlee562 wrote:There's also something to be said about the fit of a custom hat!

Until it blows off your head on top of a mountain and you wathc your investment go sailng off in the breeeze!

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 6:37 pm

Yep. I've heard that story a few times too.

Post by **Tennessee Smith** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:00 pm

Well, my two cents... I've owned 2 Akubra's and 1 Garrison. For the price, feel, and quality I'd go with the rabbit Garrison. My main complaint with the Akubra is the felt stiffness, whereas David's hat was loose yet still has never lost its bash.

There's also something to be said about a handmade hat that's made for you. No guessing on sizes or hoping it fits.

Abidingly,
-The Dude

micsteam · Post by **micsteam** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:14 pm

Garrison's standard Raiders fedora in rabbit goes for $175.00 and $200.00 for Streets of Cairo plus $15.00 s+h. His hats are SA (screen accurate) will take a beating, great customer service, and the turn around is pretty quick for a custom hat ask ChrisMD or other members here. Try this http://www.garrisonhatters.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Hope everything works out for you, if you go for the Garrison you won't be sorry.

icemanfred · Post by **icemanfred** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:40 pm

Thanks for all the info.
I have alot to think about.

so why is it so important that the felt be so soft?
I have worn cowboy hats for about 20yrs.
I am pretty rough with them. I have them in varying qualities of beaver.

My main concern it the shape. and how well it holds it shape.
never had rabbit fur. this will hold it shape well.

might be worth it just to have it shaped right.

jlee562 · Post by **jlee562** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:56 pm

Softness of the felt is really up to personal preference, IMHO.

If you want a Raiders hat, and one specifically that looks, and acts like the one seen on film, you want a thinner, floppier felt. The stiffness or floppiness of a felt does not necessarily correspond to its ability to hold a crease (or "bash" if you prefer).

Indiana Blooze · Post by **Indiana Blooze** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 7:59 pm

Dalexs wrote:
jlee562 wrote:There's also something to be said about the fit of a custom hat!
Until it blows off your head on top of a mountain and you wathc your investment go sailng off in the breeeze!

Or up Michigan Avenue

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:00 pm

In general fedoras are supposed to be "soft felt hats."

The need for the Raiders hat to be soft is to replicate the floppiness of the hat in the movie, which was pretty much run through the wringer. It's that floppiness combined with the fact the hat has a dimensional brim and is turned clockwise that creates "the look."

A good hat, be it beaver or rabbit, will hold its shape pretty well. Rabbit is a bit miore susceptible to tapering if it gets wet, but any of the customs can be reblocked.

My regular wear hat is a beaver felt Penman that I can fold in half, roll up, shove in a duffle bag or saddlebag, then unroll, recrease and have it look just like it did before it went through all that. I have a Garrison in rabbit and have no doubt it could do the same thing.

icemanfred · Post by **icemanfred** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:01 pm

Looking at the garrison hat.
I really like the pinch on the crown.
but , is it me or is the brim too wide?

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:06 pm

I'm not sure of the question directed (kinda at me). To make a production hat (factory made) especially under the $200 marl. You haveto give up something. The easiest way is to cut back on the quality materials being used. The other is how the hat is put together or made. No factory can make a high quality hat for under $200.

Now, after saying that. To call any factory hat under $200 great would be telling a lie. I think the federation is a good quality hat at a real affordable price. The word great is thrown around too often when it ones to the akubra hats especially that price rang. Please, don't take me as knocking the fed 4. I'm not, I'm just saying what it is.

Another FYI. The factory that makes the Henry (which is out of that price area but I want to bring it up to make a piont) also makes some of the cheapest hats in the world. I have learned over the pays several years that all factories are able to make a high quality factory ( production hat) but the companies that outsource their hats to these factories don't want to spend a lot for their hats. If you only knew how much some of these production hats cost the companies, you would be

.

The reason for this is easy. The companies want o make the most amount of $$$$$$$$ and they go for the cheap hats. That's the number one thing they care about. The number one seller of hats is the DP hat and I don't mean just the Indy offering. These hats ost very little to make. The companies don't care because the costumer doesn't care about quality. The first thing the consumer looks at is the price tag. This is the single most reason why you have sub par hats being made today compaired to the past. It's not that they can't it's because the consumer drove the car there.

I can't and won't Put my name on anything I myself wouldn't wear. Sorry to say I don't see The Penman hat co. Putting out a production hat for under $200 anytime in the near future. I'm sorry but it has always been my stand piont to make a highest of quality of material and craft. I have been working with 3 different felters to get better quality felt bodies to get them the way I think they should be. I have focued on that area of the hat biz not the low end production.

I leave that to other who are willing to take that route. Right now there isn't a better production hat then the akubra federation. For a indynfan just starting out not a bad starting piont. Much better then we had when all this started. Also I really don't want to be anyone first hat but I will strive to be there last hat.

John

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:08 pm

icemanfred wrote:Looking at the garrison hat.
I really like the pinch on the crown.
but , is it me or is the brim too wide?

Custom hat. It can be cut to size.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:21 pm

As someone who owns Penman, Garrison and Adventurebilt hats I can easily tell you the brim (at least the one on my Garrison) is not too wide. It compares favorably to the Adventurebilt. I think my Penmans are a fraction wider - probably why I like them so much.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:31 pm

Everyone's eye is different when it comes to that hat (raiders). It can be how the transition piont from front/back to the sides of the dimensionally cut brim. Mine is cut exactly the same as what Swales did ( minus the nubs

). I had a templet mad from what Steve used from a early hat that Swales cut. I cut the demension cut different then anyone and it's a copy of swales. There are other who think the cut was different and every person cuts it differently. Again we are really nitpicking here. To 99% of people wouldn't even care but this is indygear, right?

ChrisMD · Post by **ChrisMD** » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:37 pm

micsteam wrote:Garrison's standard Raiders fedora in rabbit goes for $175.00 and $200.00 for Streets of Cairo plus $15.00 s+h. His hats are SA (screen accurate) will take a beating, great customer service, and the turn around is pretty quick for a custom hat ask ChrisMD or other members here. Try this http://www.garrisonhatters.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Hope everything works out for you, if you go for the Garrison you won't be sorry.

"Im your huckleberry."

What turn around? I never had time to turn all the way around! I was told I think several months? Cant remember. Whatever the wait, it was like 2 weeks early or something. Probably more. I had it just in time to show everyone up at my brothers wedding. I absolutely love my Garrison. Next is a Garrison newly unveiled TOD, then a Penman Last Crusade. Penman's videos show he's a smart cookie with all the contraptions hes made to safely store a hat. Creativity is something you are born with and as far as im concerned they are hitting homeruns daily. I can speak personally for Garrison hats since I own one, and wear it almost every day. Its a beast. My big butt has sat on it, ive had it camping in the MD humidity, at the shooting range with brass being rained down on it, and it has continued to be tough. Color has lightened in the sun to the IDEAL Raiders color just as promised. If it gets smashed it pops right back into shape. Seriously, get one. Here it is in action:

http://youtu.be/Iu_1QPIwYhc" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

icemanfred · Post by **icemanfred** » Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:12 am

ridgegunner58
what do you mean by:
Rabbit is a bit miore susceptible to tapering if it gets wet

Post by **Indiana Jeff** » Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:31 am

On the whole beaver fur felt is denser and more resistant to shrinking after getting wet, which is what causes hats to taper. As Michaelson mentioned, Akubra mixes wild hare fur in with the domestic rabbit fur to add a degree of coarseness to the felt. This helps it felt tighter and resist shrinkage and tapering.

Rabbit fur felt is still durable, especially the felts used by any of the custom hats common to this forum, but is less resistant than beaver felt.

This is the reason Adventurebilt chose beaver felt for Kingdom of the Crystal Skull because there was going to be so much filming in/around water. The beaver felt would hold up better than rabbit.

There are plenty of members that have beaten the snot out of their rabbit felt hats (many Akubras at that) in all kinds of weather with nary a taper.

Unrelated to the felt per se, but worth mentioning again is size. I happen to measure 23" for my hats which puts me in between standard hat sizes and cm measurements. For me, going with a custom hat allows for me to get the exact 23" rather than a too small 58cm or too larger 59cm. I'm a daily hat wearer so it's worth it to me in the long run to have hats that fit perfectly and I know will hold up for years and years and then can get cleaned/reblocked to go more years and years.....

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

shade88 · Post by **shade88** » Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:33 pm

icemanfred wrote:ridgegunner58
what do you mean by:
Rabbit is a bit miore susceptible to tapering if it gets wet

I'm not ridgegunner58, but tapering is when a fedora starts to lose its block shape and starts to revert to its original cone shape. It usually happens slowly over a longer period of time, but heavy rain and/or steam could cause it to happen faster.

Rabbit felt is more likely to taper quicker than a beaver felt fedora because a the rabbit felt does not have as many fibers; which means the fedora won't hold up as well against the elements.

Texan Scott · Post by **Texan Scott** » Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:00 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rCTuXAbyTI" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

...here is what we mean by too much taper!

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:01 pm

Texan Scott wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rCTuXAbyTI

...here is what we mean by too much taper!

How come I knew it would be the cone heads.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Tue Jun 04, 2013 11:18 pm

A picture always helps. The two hats in the photo below started out the same. They are both Herbert Johnson Poets made of rabbit felt.

The hat on the left was originally not quite as boxy as the one on the right, but was close. IT has tapered.

The one on the right was given the Steve Delk treatment back when Magnoli was selling HJs.

And just to compare apples to apples and oranges the two hats in the picture below are both Penman hats.

The one on the left is my Cairo, which is rabbit. The one on the right is my every day Penman beaver felt hat. (The one that gets rolled up, shoved in a duffel bag or saddlebag and has been everywhere I've been for the past 3 or 4 years and has been re-blocked once.)

icemanfred · Post by **icemanfred** » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:30 am

Okay , thanks for those pics. I understand better.
so eventually it will loose shape and need to be re blocked.

I guess my concern is rain, then. and having a drastically differnt hat before and after getting caught in rain.
all my other hats a beaver. Never had a problem with rain.
so I understand how they hold up.
Just a little leary of a new material.

But then again, when caught in the rain. I dont just stand there, like a zombie, and get soaked.

Post by **Indiana Jeff** » Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:49 am

Keep in mind too that a hat needs to get soaked to its core to really worry about tapering unless it is really cheap felt, which the Akubra is not. Most rain situations will not cause that level of soaking.

If you haven't already, check out this thread dedicated to the Akubra Federation. http://indygear.com/cow/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=28726" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Wed Jun 05, 2013 3:36 pm

If you have only beaver hats, its going to be a big step back.

The akubra fed in rabbit will NOT hold up as good or better then any beaver hat. It's the nature of the beast.

icemanfred · Post by **icemanfred** » Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:31 pm

I thought the federation was beaver?

the reason I am talking about rabbit is because I am now thinking about a Garrison hat.
I just cant afford the beaver version.

I am a cowboy hat person.
its just the Indie fan in me that wants this hat.
So If I am getting one. I cant break the bank on it.

I came to the forum to buy my son a hat. which I did.
while I was here looking around I really liked what I saw.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:54 pm

Nope. Not beaver. Their Heritage felt is really nice but it is rabbit.

I'm afraid you're looking at $400 plus for any IJ fedora in beaver.

Would it help if I told you it's worth every penny?

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Jun 06, 2013 7:49 am

Keep thinking about that rabbit Garrison. I think you're right on target with your requirements, but better yet it will be a custom. Home run no matter what the material!

Regards! Michaelson

icemanfred · Post by **icemanfred** » Fri Jun 07, 2013 3:18 am

Done! Order placed for the Garrison Hat!
thanks to all those who responded.

ChrisMD · Post by **ChrisMD** » Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:16 am

icemanfred wrote:Done! Order placed for the Garrison Hat!
thanks to all those who responded.

Great choice! Mine is awesome. As a fellow cowboy hat guy, you'll feel how soft the Garrison is then worry about its durability. Rest assured, it is TOUGH. Took me a while to feel comfortable wearing it like I should because I have beaver cowboy hats that are stiff and heavy. In fact my Garison is tougher than my Bailey's I got in Cheyenne

david_h · Post by **david_h** » Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:17 am

Smart move ordering the Garrison. I have the rabbit version and it has been subjected to rain, snow, heat, sweat and is still looking as good as new.

At the price David charges it is just a fantastic deal.

I hope you'll be posting photos when the hat arrives.

Pete#9 · Post by **Pete#9** » Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:53 am

I have a Fed Deluxe and love it . A superb product and made by a company who really know how to make a quality long lasting hat. A fair price too considering what some are charging for a "Raiders" hat.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Charybdis · Post by **Charybdis** » Fri Jun 07, 2013 1:11 pm

That's the cool thing about this topic: so many choices and so many reasons, but in the end, it's what YOU want that makes all the difference. I know you will be happy with your purchase!!