Club Obi Wan

Standard Christys' @#$% ribbon work, but nice proportions, the 1/2" twixt sides & front must swoop like a champ.

Found at http://www.tailsandtheunexpected.com/ha ... rilby.html

I wonder if they'll get into a tussle with HJ for using the same name as their fedora offering?

Regards! Michaelson

Maybe not since it's the Poet Trilby? I dunno...

Why do they call their fedoras...Trilby's? I thought Trilby's were different......

I did too.

Here's the 'Wiki' explaination for what it's worth:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trilby" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I always thought them more of the 'stingy brim' style.

Regards! Michaelson

I agree with M. I thought, by definition, a trilby was a small brim and crown hat. Perhaps Christy's is trying to cash in on the stingy brim, trilby style craze; but with a more 'standard' fedora. Seems like a poor marketing idea to me. I suppose their hat may come up in a search for 'trilby', but a customer looking for a trilby wouldn't buy that hat any more than I would a trilby.

Hm, I took a gander at the site and even their 'Indiana Jones' offering is being called a trilby even though it is listed as having a 'wide 3' brim.'? Maybe there's some legalese going on by calling their hats trilbies instead of fedoras to be able to offer Christy's hats 'exclusively.'

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

or maybe it's a british thing? haha who knows...


The hat doesn't look too bad actually....


Not a bad website actually...some interesting stuff. Liking the pants that are made for braces.....I can't find any pants with suspender buttons anymore and refuse to wear the clip on ones.

Hopefully one of our UK friends will chime in soon.

Is 'trilby' and 'fedora' interchangeable terms over there?

Regards! Michaelson

Michaelson wrote:I did too.

Here's the 'Wiki' explaination for what it's worth:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trilby" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I always thought them more of the 'stingy brim' style.

Regards! Michaelson

Interesting...I did a quick search and truthfully forgot the source, but the answer was really simple: 'a man's soft felt hat with an indented crown...'
To me, that would mean one thing: A Fedora! Words, sometimes are kind of like life -- they are just what they are -- words -- no more, no less, just another's view on which to call something. Fun, is it not? W>

My understanding is 'fedora' is more of an umbrella term with 'tribly' being a specific style of fedora so named due to the play referenced. Similar to 'suit', 'shoes' or 'boots'; but there are different variations under that.

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

Very definitely not interchangeable in my experience, I always thought the trilby and bowler style to be worn with suits, more formal really.

For me, growing up in the UK, the trilby was a narrow brimmed felt hat - sort of things you'd see at the races, horse trainers etc. When I was trying to get an Indy hat in the 80s it was a real pain, because I had no idea what it was I was really after. When I described what I was looking for, people always thought of a trilby!! I even got given a couple - really nice, from Locke & Co - but nowhere near an Indy. Only a couple of years later did I see the term "fedora" coined in an issue of "Guns & Ammo" in conjuncture with a competition to win an Indy hat. Not that that helped - still took me a further 20 years to get hold of one!!! In fact, I think it's still not a common term in Britain.

Over the years people have miss used the terms. Just like petersham and grosgrain ribbon.

John, can you clarify what you mean? Are you agreeing with the above given 'definitions' for fedora and trilby or are there other misuses continuing to be used here?

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

Fedora would be a blanket term for soft men's hat. Trilby would be a short brim fedora but have seen it used in replace of fedora. The terms are used differently depending on the era or location. Like bowler and derby. Same hat but different countries call them by a different term.

Lot of people call the Indy ribbon a petersham but that's incorrect. Petersham is a un-finished edge ribbon. Can be a high quality ribbon but isn't a men's hat ribbon. Finished edge ribbon would be a grosgrain ribbon ( hat grade quality ). There are both types of grosgrain ( hat grade and non hat grade).

It seems quite common for the man on the street to call any hat with a brim a trilby over here.I put it down to un-educated chaves,but maybe its more widespread than I thought.

It's to be expected. Fedoras aren't as common place as they used to be. The information about them never really got passed down.

BendingOak wrote:Fedora would be a blanket term for soft men's hat. Trilby would be a short brim fedora but have seen it used in replace of fedora. The terms are used differently depending on the era or location. Like bowler and derby. Same hat but different countries call them by a different term.

Lot of people call the Indy ribbon a petersham but that's incorrect. Petersham is a un-finished edge ribbon. Can be a high quality ribbon but isn't a men's hat ribbon. Finished edge ribbon would be a grosgrain ribbon ( hat grade quality ). There are both types of grosgrain ( hat grade and non hat grade).

That's true....bowler and derby are interchangeable nowadays even though there was a difference. I guess trilby just stood out so much to me cause I'm just very much not used to hearing it.

But to be fair, most people think fedora is an operating system.......

backstagejack wrote:

BendingOak wrote:Fedora would be a blanket term for soft men's hat. Trilby would be a short brim fedora but have seen it used in replace of fedora. The terms are used differently depending on the era or location. Like bowler and derby. Same hat but different countries call them by a different term.

Lot of people call the Indy ribbon a petersham but that's incorrect. Petersham is a un-finished edge ribbon. Can be a high quality ribbon but isn't a men's hat ribbon. Finished edge ribbon would be a grosgrain ribbon ( hat grade quality ). There are both types of grosgrain ( hat grade and non hat grade).

That's true....bowler and derby are interchangeable nowadays even though there was a difference. I guess trilby just stood out so much to me cause I'm just very much not used to hearing it.

But to be fair, most people think fedora is an operating system.......

I suppose that it would be similar to the UK term for the hood of car being a 'bonnet' instead of 'hood.' While we are on the subject though, John; if I am not mistaken many western style hats, of old, were also considered fedoras too, were they not? And, with this, what is the major difference? W>

Don't know about western hats being called fedoras, but I do recall a thread in which either Michaelson or Steve Delk shared that "back in the day" western hats were made with very little stiffener and were floppy while fedora dress hats were hard as nails. Over time the preferences switched to the more 'common' use of how much stiffener is used today.

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

I read and heard that but haven't seen any proof on that so I'm still up on the air on that one. anything is possible. The diffenition of fedora is a soft men's hat so that would conflict with that. Again I have no proof on it.

I think if you look at any old western movie, you'd immediately notice that old western hats were thin and floppy. I'm thinking in particular of a few shots in "The Searchers" where John Wayne's huge brim is flopping in the wind. "Western weight" felts just don't do that anymore.



The term "fedora" originally described a type of hat which we would think of as more of a bowler/derby or Homburg type hat.

E.G. this late 1890's ad:

Or:

I looked up 'history western style fedoras,' and this is about all I could come up with. Will look deeper into this. This is really facinating me. W>

http://www.ehow.com/about_5041049_histo ... -hats.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Even in that article it's really hard to pin it all down.

BendingOak wrote:Even in that article it's really hard to pin it all down.

Exactly! That's why I said I need to look harder and further. I am just not certain where to start, thus far internet searches aren't gleening a lot, perhaps a trip to the 'ol library is in order. I am really interesting in more info about this. Don't know why, but it just kind of peaks my interest. Especially the 'western fedora' angle to this. I have seen a few hat retailer web sites over the years with 'Western Sytle Fedoras' offered, custom and otherwise. Thus, I would like to find a 'time-line' link between these and what we consider to be regular 'fedoras,' if there truly is any difference. This could be fun. W>

John, what's the name of that old hat making book that's out of print? There may be some information in there, even if cursory in terms of different techniques for dress/fedora vs. western hats.



Regards,

Indiana Jeff

Hi Guys

There has always been a distinction in the UK between a fedora and a trilby, same as in the USA. Trilby's didn't really appear until crowns were lowered and brims shortened in the 50's/60's. I always think it is strange that the trilby style became popular compared to the cool look of a fedora. I suppose it was just fashion and time for a change. Strange that a web site selling hats doesn't know the difference!

cheers

stones

Thanks, stones!

Regard! Michaelson

Indiana Jeff wrote:John, what's the name of that old hat making book that's out of print? There may be some information in there, even if cursory in terms of different techniques for dress/fedora vs. western hats.



Regards,

Indiana Jeff

Had a few extra minutes this afternoon and answered my own question. There's actually two books mentioned in the thread. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=44770&hilit=Scienti ... Renovating" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Regards,

Indiana Jeff

It's a great book but it doesn't clear up that at all. Good lucking looking for a clear answer because you won't find one. My understanding is the trilby is a type of fedora.

The Fedora takes its name from Princess Fedora Romanoff, a character in a Victorian melodrama written for Sarah Bernhardt and first performed in 1883.

The Fedora has a flexible brim and can be worn up or snapped down; hence its nickname the 'snap brim'. And that brim is rather wider than that of its close relative, the Trilby, giving the Fedora a more flamboyant and artistic style.

A style popular today for both men and women.

Found this on the Christys' site.

The0w3n5 wrote:The Fedora takes its name from Princess Fedora Romanoff, a character in a Victorian melodrama written for Sarah Bernhardt and first performed in 1883.

The Fedora has a flexible brim and can be worn up or snapped down; hence its nickname the 'snap brim'. And that brim is rather wider than that of its close relative, the Trilby, giving the Fedora a more flamboyant and artistic style.

A style popular today for both men and women.

Found this on the Christys' site.

Ok, I'll buy that, but one question. If this comes from 'their' web site and is 'their' explaination for the differences between the two, then how can they call this new offering (The Poet) a trilby ? Is it not, by 'their own' definition - a fedora ? W>

The Distinguished Gentlemen from Topeka makes a good point.


Regards,

Indiana Jeff

I found the explanation on their site (nothing to do with the hat). There must be something where if the brim width is over a certain size then it is a trilby.

The0w3n5 wrote:I found the explanation on their site (nothing to do with the hat). There must be something where if the brim width is over a certain size then it is a trilby.

No, it would have to be under a certain side to be a Trilby...(from you previous post): And that brim is rather wider than that of its close relative, the Trilby, giving the Fedora a more flamboyant and artistic style. W>

WConly wrote:

The0w3n5 wrote:I found the explanation on their site (nothing to do with the hat). There must be something where if the brim width is over a certain size then it is a trilby.

No, it would have to be under a certain side to be a Trilby...(from you previous post): And that brim is rather wider than that of its close relative, the Trilby, giving the Fedora a more flamboyant and artistic style. W>

Whoops, my bad.

The0w3n5 wrote:

WConly wrote:

The0w3n5 wrote:I found the explanation on their site (nothing to do with the hat). There must be something where if the brim width is over a certain size then it is a trilby.

No, it would have to be under a certain side to be a Trilby...(from you previous post): And that brim is rather wider than that of its close relative, the Trilby, giving the Fedora a more flamboyant and artistic style. W>

Whoops, my bad.

Hey, no harm no foul! The whole subject seems to be mutating on it's own and creating even more and more confussion ! Perhaps the easiest way to look at the issue is by paraphrasing an old expression: "One man's Triby is a Fedora to another and vice-versa ." W>

Hey, no harm no foul! The whole subject seems to be mutating on it's own and creating even more and more confussion ! Perhaps the easiest way to look at the issue is by paraphrasing an old expression: "One man's Triby is a Fedora to another and vice-versa ." W>

No one has ever spoken truer words.