Club Obi Wan

Hi all,

After years of being a member here and lurking about, I finally broke down and bought my first Indy fedora.

I did some research here first, and thought that Todd's Downtowner would be a great way to get my feet wet, since I wanted a ROLA style hat, and the price is fair and reasonable.

Let me make it clear that this thread is not a slight on Mr. Coyle at all. The hat seems to be of good quality, the product was true to what was represented, the service was impeccable and I got it within days of ordering. Todd's is not the problem. The problem is that I look like a doofus in this hat, and not at all like IJ.

I studied ScreenUsed's 'streets of Cairo' hero hat, and I think Todd did an amazing job replicating the look if that fedora with his 'Downtowner', but the crown height just makes my particular head/face type look ridiculous. My wife laughed her ### off when I put it on! Lol.

Is there a hat out there with a lower crown, that would suit my 'look' better? Perhaps a TOD or LC?

I wear a suit to work every day, and had delusions about sporting an Indy fedora from time to time, but clearly this hat isn't going to fill that role...

Help my brothers!

Thanks!
Sean

I don't see a way to host pics here? Does COW have an option to gist images?

As far as I know a hosting site like photobucket is the only way to link pictures here, but I could be wrong.

The downtowner is for sure a SOC looking hat...maybe just a little reshaping will give it a slightly "classier" look. Just an idea.

The higher crown is something that many have found takes some time to get accustomed to. Wear it around the house, wear it in your car, anyplace you feel comfortable that only strangers will see you. In a surprisingly short time you'll be wearing it everywhere.

Consider that your wife has heard how a single gear purchase is like that first use of a highly addictive substance. She may be employing a carefully thought-out strategy to maintain your joint financial health. Don't let it get to you. If she really loves you she'll stop laughing eventually...

LJ

Yeah, sooner or later you'll get used to it... and so will the other people around you.

Dopey, sneezy, sleepy....you're supposed to look like Indy. The thing about the downtowner is that it is supposed to recreate the SoC, used worn, distorted look, ie less formal, so that may be one reason why it looks a little out of place with a suit on. Dress it down a little, with adventure shirt and see if it makes a difference?

I'm not really a fan of the "Downtowner" hat....Personally I thought it looked a touch TOO Indy for it to be worn with much else "normal-gear"-wise...It's VERY SOC..So, it may be that...I went with a Fed IV and loved it...In black so it meshed well with my usual suit for work too....But I now love all three of mine (Two Fed's and an Adventurebilt, and one Penman upcoming..) and wear them all with suits with no problems at all...(and no one laughing...)

To be honest, it may just be that it does take time to get used to having so much height above you with that style of hat...My first Fed IV was a shocker to me, and took a few wears to get "used" to the feel and height...But it doesn't seem off at all now, and the photos I took of when I first got it show the same height...So it was just my being new to that style of hat...

Now, in anything less I feel "half-dressed"....Funky..

I reckon that's probably a major reason behind the uneasiness...

One way to solve this is to go with a custom hatter. Tell them your concerns and maybe send them your picture and let them design a fedora that suits you better while still giving off that Indy vibe. It will cost more but in the end paying less for a hat you will never wear really gets you no where. Good luck!

Beaverlid

Maybe get some backlash here, but lower crown and some taper ( not a tapir ) do tend to be a bit more acceptable to contemporary eyes. With that, you may consider something a little more 'Temple of Doom-y'.
In fact, I went to one of my local hatters the other day and - here's a cat who's been around for many years - he questioned the height of my Adventurebilt's crown. I don't think he was even referencing it in relation to my face; just that it was too tall. When I explained to him that it was intended to be that way, and leaving out that it was built (bilt?) as an Indiana Jones replica, he didn't go on about it. I think, after so many years of lower, more tapered crowns, he'd become accustomed to that aesthetic, himself.
The SOC style is a bit exaggerated, and going ToD may be swinging the pendulum too far back the other way, so I'll also second the Federation for a starter hat. Being open crowned, you'll be able to experiment with deepening the center dent, bringing in taper via the pinch, etc..., all while maintaining the 'Indy' elements.
As another choice, and an invitation to a kick to the shin from other members, you may honestly consider an old Stetson Temple for a modern look from a hat with some Indy pedigree...

While some dig a screen-accurate lid, wear what you feel comfortable wearing.

And one of the keys to feeling comfortable in any kind of lid is to WEAR it. When it becomes a part of you, you're not as self-conscious about it and that affects how you look in it.

A great bit of advice I got from the book "So You're Going To Wear The Kilt" is don't assume that every laugh, chuckle, whisper, shout, etc., you hear on the street is directed at you when you are wearing something new. In your "normal" attire, pay attention to how many of those sounds you hear all the time.

Kudos on wearing a real hat, and not adding to the sea of baseball caps being worn poorly!

Oh, and

I too just got my Todd's Downtowner in the mail and I too look ridiculous in it even though the hat is INCREDIBLE! I am happy with it sitting on my desk as I gawk at it.

Can't tell you if you look "dopey" without pics. Using the [*IMG][/*IMG] tags (without the asterisks) with the photo URL in between will get you a viewable photo here. Conversely, you can just copy/paste the link without any additional code. I am pretty sure that the board automatically makes links into something we can click so we can go look at the photo elsewhere.

On to how you look in the hat. When I first wore a tall crowned fedora, I felt the same way. I felt like I stuck out like a sore thumb, that I looked ridiculous, "dopey," etc. Seriously, I felt like any time I ever heard anyone laughing in public that they were laughing at me and how silly I must look in the hat.

In time, I got used to the look on me, and felt fine about it. Going from wearing ballcaps or no hat at all to wearing a tall crowned hat is definitely a shock. It's going to take some time to get used to. As for your wife laughing at you ... I hope it was all in good fun, and that she was laughing WITH you and not AT you.

Speaking generally, I'll NEVER, for as long as I live, understand how someone's significant other could be so crass as to laugh at their spouse for their choice of dress. Obviously, if you come out of the bathroom wearing a clown suit or something similarly ridiculous, even I would expect to be laughed at. Outside of anything that extreme, I feel like laughing "at" someone for something like wearing a tall crowned fedora is inappropriate and insensitive.

"Honey, what do you think of this hat?"
"PFFFFFAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA"

Honestly, some people do look dopey in the SA dimensions. Sometimes I catch myself in the mirror at the right angle and I think my Fed IV is too tall on me.

However, that having been said, I'll echo what others have said above. Sometimes it just takes some getting used to, especially if you're not a hat wearer. As I wear some sort of fedora nearly every day, I've become pretty accustomed to wearing them, and no longer feel awkward in a wide brim hat, nor one with a taller crown. As such hats are a rarity and a bit of an anachronism, people, including ourselves, simply aren't used to seeing people in them.

In my opinion, a screen accurate Indy hat does not work for everyone. I really wish I could pull it off myself, but the the truth is I can't... at all. The brim is far too wide and the crown is far too tall for my face. Plain and simple.

There are a huge variety of hats out there for a reason. Different hats look better on different people based on size and shape of people's heads and faces. My head is far too skinny to wear such a large hat. I look best with a 4 1/2 inch crown and a 2 1/8 inch brim.

One day, I would love to approach a custom hatter and have them make me and Indy style hat to my specifications. Of course, it wouldn't be an accurate Indy hat at all, but it would be in the same spirit.

Forrest For the Trees wrote: One day, I would love to approach a custom hatter and have them make me and Indy style hat to my specifications. Of course, it wouldn't be an accurate Indy hat at all, but it would be in the same spirit.

And THAT is what this hobby is all about to me! If you ever do, I would love to see those pics! It would probably go really well with that Hercules...

Travis

Pics plz.

Like everyone here has basically said, it just takes some getting used to. I find stingier brims and lower crowns suit my face much better, but it even took time to get used to wearing those. Now they just feel "right" and I can throw on one of my fiance's ABs or other tall crowned hat and not feel funky about it.

Yeah, it's a matter of perspective and getting used to something that you've never worn before. Now, I used to wear cowboy hats all the time so I was used to see & being seen in a hat with a wide brim and tall crown. When you have a 4" brim for so many years the Indy brim sure seems small in comparison. It takes one a little time to get used to wearing such a lid, and wearing it is the key. You wear it until folks can't recall a time when you didn't wear the lid and they identify you with the hat. Heck, even your spouse will lose you in a store or crowd if you take the lid off or wear a different hat. Happens to me all the time. I wear a different hat out and about and my wife can walk right by me and not see me, it's almost a cloaking device.

Also, another thing to do is handle the hat a lot. Make it yours. When it comes out of the box, it has traveled for some time and what ever creases were in it as they boxed it up have relaxed quite a bit. Try deepening the center dent a bit more and see if it will touch the top of your skull, this will help with crown height in proportion to your face. Play with the hat, make the front pinch yours, stamp it with your personality, but above all, wear it. If you've never worn such a hat, a lot of folks will react in a way that you don't expect. Mainly because it is something that is different and they are not used to it, as you are not used to seeing your self in such a hat, thus you get the Dopy response from your brain. Give your brain, and everyone else around you some time to get used to the fact of wearing this hat. Plus, if it is really in the SOC shape it may not go well with a suit but jeans and a dress shirt or casual shirt may work better with it. But if you look to the past in photos, a lot of men had a shabby hat on their head with a suit. It's just that they owned the hat for a long time and handled it a lot so it got rumpled and gained "character" so it became a part of them and if they got a new hat it looked out of place for a while. It's sort of like in grade school when you got a hair cut, other kids were used to how your hair looked, and then one day you pop up with shorter hair and all of a sudden they can see your face or ears. They giggle a bit, poke some fun, but eventually get used to it. Again the key is owning the look, making it yours and not caring what others think.

And like others have said here, lets see some pics. Maybe we can be of help with the image of the hat on your head if we can see how it sets. Most of all, just be your self and own the look.

Cheers!

Dan

It's probably not the hat that's the problem. I go through the same thing with my wife. In fact, I've just put the thing away permanently, rather than hear "Please don't put that on" or "please don't wear that when I'm out with you" anymore or even "you looks stupid in that". I just gave up. My wife hates the hat, and as any man knows, they'll nag you into an early grave if you let 'em, so I boxed the hat.

Yes, the screen specs will not work on everyone, unless you have Ford's facial shape, hat size and head shape. That is why off the shelf hats are not always pleasing, but do fit within many budgets. That is the trade off.

Remember, Ford was fitted by a costume designer that made the hat to the specs that made him look good. And that is the key to getting an Indy hat that compliments you, instead of making you look like a.. well, pick which word you like the best.

Also, remember that back in the 30's many dress hats were taller crowned hats, and as time passed the crowns became shorter and shorter, for fedoras especially. It is hard to find an off the shelf fedora today that is not short crowned, as Stetson does not make th em any taller than 5 inches open crown today for dress hats. But that was not always the case. So a taller crowned fedora is very 1930ish in looks, instead of 1960ish in looks.

Steve! You've returned!

jlee562 wrote:Steve! You've returned!

Yep. http://indygear.com/cow/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=51944" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

maboot38 wrote:It's probably not the hat that's the problem. I go through the same thing with my wife. In fact, I've just put the thing away permanently, rather than hear "Please don't put that on" or "please don't wear that when I'm out with you" anymore or even "you looks stupid in that". I just gave up. My wife hates the hat, and as any man knows, they'll nag you into an early grave if you let 'em, so I boxed the hat.

Off topic, but this makes me sad.

Something else, very important, and easily overlooked: stand back from the mirror several feet when you're checking out your hat. It makes all the difference in the world in terms of perspective, how your eyes process the information, relation to surroundings, etc... It really makes a big difference, and I hope I can get some longtime hat wearers to back me up on this one.

TheSavoryTrim wrote:

maboot38 wrote:It's probably not the hat that's the problem. I go through the same thing with my wife. In fact, I've just put the thing away permanently, rather than hear "Please don't put that on" or "please don't wear that when I'm out with you" anymore or even "you looks stupid in that". I just gave up. My wife hates the hat, and as any man knows, they'll nag you into an early grave if you let 'em, so I boxed the hat.

Off topic, but this makes me sad.

That is sad and I'm sorry you're partner isn't supportive of the hat. I would probably want to wear mine regardless just in spite. I'm lucky that my wife is a huge Indy fan too. She also loves the hat on me, says it is sexy. I can't argue with that compliment!

When I made my hat I actually made the brim just a little bit shorter, not but an 1/8" overall but the effect seemed to mesh better with my face. The tall crown just takes a little while to get used to, but you wear a fedora long enough and a baseball cap seems odd fitting.

Best Regards,
'81

A hat's dimensions are key. I have both a Fed III and a IV. Although the III is only slightly larger in all dimensions (brim width and crown height), there is a significant difference between the III and IV on my head. The IV looks perfectly proportioned to me on my own head whereas the III gives the impression that the hat is wearing me. It's just a bit too much hat for my face and head.

All Indy hat shapes are not created equal.

UPDATE WITH PICS!!!

Dopey or no?

Definitely not Indy, but again that's not the fault of the 'Downtowner', I juat dont think I have the right face shape for the hat....







Which of our talented artisans make an Indy fedora with a smaller crown. The feedback I am getting is that perhaps a TOD style would be a better fit?

Thanks,
Sean

It's almost as if the hat is the wrong size. I definitely see what you mean about the fit and look of it. Hmmm.

maboot38 wrote:It's almost as if the hat is the wrong size. I definitely see what you mean about the fit and look of it. Hmmm.

I wear a 58 or 59, I ordered a 58 from Todds and it's a little snug.

It looks too small to me.

A reworking of the bash could help some, but it still looks too small, especially on the profile shot.

JMO.

The brim seems too small to me, am I right?

I feel the brim should be longer. Of course, I could be way off course here. But you don't look dopey.

RaidersBash wrote:It looks too small to me.

A reworking of the bash could help some, but it still looks too small, especially on the profile shot.

JMO.

Hmmm... It's a little snug, but not too tight. In retrospect, I shouldve ordered a 59. But, how would a bigger size fix the issue? The shape and crown height are just "off", would an even bigger hat help?

Really appreciate the advice!

Concur with the sizing up, primarily because it will almost certainly shrink a half a size ( doesn't AB intentionally go just a hair big, so that the hat can 'settle' to the right size? ). That's the nature of a hat of that quality*. Sizing up will also lessen the radical slope of the front of the brim and give the hat less of an overall...pointy?...look.
Also, don't be afraid to play with it ( after you go up a size ). Mess around with the crown. Bring in the top dent, etc..., 'til you get the shape you like.


*a modern rabbit body hat, I mean, not the ABs. The Christys' hats definitely lose half to a full size, so I'm basing my statement around that experience.

I think you should look good in a fedora, but there is definitely something not right about that hat on your head. Something about the front on view makes it look pointy on top instead of the straight up stove pipe look which I think should look good on you. Maybe it's the sizing like others have suggested, but, to be honest, I've never seen a picture of a Downtowner that I've liked, and it's always because of that pointy crown.

I wouldn't say dopey. But, it doesn't look like it fits you and the crown looks way tapered. Try a shot where you are looking more at the ground so we are looking straight on at the nat instead of looking up at it. The angle of the shot gives the hat the effect that it is seriously tapered. Straight on it should be almost boxy with the distinctive camel humps. Like I and others said previously, don't be afraid to play with the crown. you may need to press the center dent down a bit more to where it will touch the top of your head.
Also, looking at theses shots I would agree that it appears to be too small on you, I think a size up is in order. Try a couple more pictures so we can assess the shape a little better by dropping your jaw & looking down or bring ing the camera up higher above eye level so it almost hides the eyes. This way we don't see the underside of the brim at all, but a good basic straight on shot that shows more of the top of the brim. Same goes for the side shot.

So you get more of a result like this...


And this...


And this for the profile, looking down more...


The way your shots are now it looks seriously tapered. Plus, using Screen Used hat as reference, well that one is 30 years old and has had time to warp, deform and do all kinds of funky stuff in all that time in all kinds of environments. Let's see what yours looks like from a better frontal shot and we can go from there. Then we can tell if it is tapered a bunch like it is shown in your pics or fairly straight.

Hopefully that rambling made some sense.

Cheers!

Dan

To be honest I think it's a combination of the brim being rather narrow from the from and the taper going on toward the top that makes the hat look rather unnatural on you in those shots... I think your face would suit something less slanted personally, and the height wouldn't be an issue in that event...From the side there is no problem, and it's only when the narrow peak can be seen from the front that the issue becomes one at all...

You would probably be far better off with a full on straight sided hat from any of the better vendors, Steve being first on my list, but given your options money wise perhaps Akubra for the Fed being a very good one?

Your face is a touch long perhaps? But not impossibly so....I would hazard a guess that it's a combination of the taper you have in the Todd's and the unused aspect both making what you see as "dopey"...If you're too shook from the comments though then yes, playing it safe with a shorter brim would certainly be the safe bet...

If you want to get closer to Indy (staying tall) I'd back the Fed (or, if you have the cash, see what Steve or John can work out for you in a personalised design perhaps?)...

Not Dopey, Bashful maybe... or Grumpy?

It looks to me like a good part of it is the size. Do you have another hat or cap that you feel good about? Does it sit at the same level around your head? Does it feel like that's where you want it to sit? I personally feel best when the brim is just a hair above the points of my ears and lower on my forehead than yours seems to be (Of course, that's a matter of taste and opinion, so there's lots of other preferences.)

LJ

Girl input time!

though its the same as everyone elses "Its not you, its the hat" lol I think you'd look fine wearing a fedora, just one that fits better. And with more 5 o'clock shadow, then bam. Perfectly fine.

Maybe you should get your picture taken from a farther distance. I noticed that if the camera is just arm's length of you, it makes the hat look tapered... especially because most people tend to tilt their head backwards to get maximum distance.

I back the Fed as a good starter hat. And it's relatively affordable.

Perhaps you could also look into scoring a vintage lid off of eBay, perhaps something a bit shorter to sort of ease you into wearing a fedora.

To be honest with you, I think you do have a couple of things working against you as far as the hat and its fabled perch atop ur cranium. The real deal SoC Raiders hat exhibited reverse taper above the ribbon. This hat looks like it was made for a Conehead (maybe there was something to the notion of Indy and his encounter with aliens? ). I mean, it is pointy, instead of boxy and I think your assessment is right, the crown may be too high. As nearly as I can estimate, the Raiders fedora was around 4 1/2" (bashed) in crown height. Of course, you can take these basic measurements and adjust them to your features and preferences.

A pretty good hat to break out with is the Fed. IV, or I'd recommend the Henry, if you want to take your fedora wearing seriously in the future. jmo.

often when people who don't wear hats want to try my fedora [once I've confirmed they don't have a hat size that will stretch it] they put it on the back of their head - which indeed does look goofy. I think this is because they think it should follow their hairline. It may be as simple as finding the right amount of forward tilt. It should be level when your head is upright.
I admit when I got my first fedora it seemed far too tall compared to the actually very stingey modern hats I had been wearing. Now, however I feel all other hats look cheap on me.

What throws things is the height of the hat in the first head on shot. A hat shouldn't be as tall in appearance as your head.

I think the brim width is just fine myself.

The crown looks about a half inch or more too tall to my eye.

If it were pushed in more from the top, I think you'd be ok.

Overall, it's the height that makes it look odd.

You'll be amazed how just the adjustment of a single measurement can completely change the appearance of a fedora.

Regards! Michaelson

Ok all,

On the size issue. Just re-measured my head using a hat tape. The measurement is 22 5/8 inches or a hat size of 7 1/4 (or 58 for the metric folks).

The above hat is a little snug, honestly, and it is a 58.

The experts opine that I should order a bigger size.

My question is, how much bigger? a 59? a 60?

Please advise?

(If a 60, there are a couple nice hats available on the Board - an Akubra Fed IV and a Henry - both a 60....)

Thanks!
Sean

If youre a true 58, then I wouldnt go any bigger than a 59. Im a true 59, always buy a 59, and never have a problem.

Yup....What Bugs said...

I'm a 59 and a bit, so always go to 60cm, and although at first it's a touch big, after a day or so it usually starts to conform well to my head and shrink slightly through wear...So it always pays to go one size up unless the hat is custom made for you..In which case they'll add (or not) what they think they need to make the hat perfect for you...

Regards..

I'm not gonna sugar-coat this. You look dopey. But a more accurate statement would be that that hat looks dopey, and in my opinion, would look dopey on just about anyone. Get yourself a finely tailored hat from one of our esteemed vendors/colleagues (might I suggest John Penman?) and he will make a hat for you that will make you look so good, your wife will insist that you buy another to go with the rest of your clothes. Seriously, man. That hat ain't right.

DHW

PS Once you get a nicely tailored hat, you will look AMAZING in it. A great hat accentuates any face, and you are from a lost cause, my friend. Your mug is as good as any, and I know the right hat, (an Indy hat as much as any), will really bring out your features. Don't give up. Call John Penman. Seriously. You won't be sorry. (John pretty much makes all my hats, so I am biased, by the way!).

DHW

A new hat will always look and feel awkward at first. I personally find that after wearing it for a while, playing with the center dent and pinch, sweating in it in and yes even wearing it in the rain a few times it starts to "meld" with you. Give it a chance I say. For my first fedora my wife laughed as well. But now, 6 years later, she's providing me advice on how to break in a new one or how to adjust the pinch. She's even gone so far as to order me my first Penman. I'm glad I kept her around.

Penman, Penman, Penman. The man makes remarkable hats, and he's the sweetest guy, seriously. Husbandu has his "Watchmen" and I love it. Whenever I think of "Indy Hat" I think of ABs and Penmans.

Obi Sean Kenobi wrote:

RaidersBash wrote:It looks too small to me.

A reworking of the bash could help some, but it still looks too small, especially on the profile shot.

JMO.

Hmmm... It's a little snug, but not too tight. In retrospect, I shouldve ordered a 59. But, how would a bigger size fix the issue? The shape and crown height are just "off", would an even bigger hat help?

Really appreciate the advice!

Your biggest problem is the block shape, IMO. This just isn't a great block shape for an Indy fedora, and block shape is everything when it comes to these film hats.

If I were you, I would send this to an Indy hatter here(not me) and get the crown's shape brought into different specs, which will also shorten the crown when a fuller block is used. Since most hats will eventually need to be reblocked anyways from shrinkage, go ahead and do it early, instead of buying another hat. I guarantee you, you will be very pleased by doing so.

I'm in agreement with others here. It's not you, it's the hat. You have a large enough head to pull off a proper Indy hat. This one isn't cutting it, IMO. The crown shape seems wrong. Too tall, too tapered. Can you send it back? Try a Fed IV, as it's only a bit more expensive. Obviously an AB or Penman would be a huge step up, but costs more.