Hat Sizing Help

[191145]

Okay, I have a 'Miller' fedora that is marked 7 1/4. I bought it new and it has always felt big/loose. In fact, I had put a strip of felt behind the sweat band to size it. Also, although it's no doubt a nice fur felt hat, I've never been really happy with the shape. Now I'm looking at a Todd's Downtowner (or maybe an Uptowner), so I measure my head and come up with 22 7/8". This is a 7 1/4 to 7 3/8 on Todd's chart. So, unless his sizes are different, it's going to be too big. 7 1/4 has been my hat size since I grew up, and your head really doesn't change a lot, even with weight gain/loss. I really hate to get into sending hats back and forth. Does anybody but me think I should order a 7 1/8?

[gwyddion]

Go by what Todd tells you based on your measurement: most sizing charts are off and differ from manufacturer to manufacturer. If anyone knows how Todd's sizing works, it will be Todd

Regards, Geert

[Indiana Bugs]

Sounds like the Miller is the one thats off. Id follow gw's advice.

[DR Ulloa]

Hat sizes vary from company to company, though you'd think it would be standardized. Your best bet would be to email the vendor and ask them what size you should get. Tell them what your head measurement is and they will know which size to send you.

Dave

[Chewbacca Jones]

As Dave says, size-to-measurement conversion will vary.
Also, you are mistaken about heads not changing. Hat size can change during adulthood. I was a 7 3/8 up until about 4 or 5 years ago. I was over 30 years old, and my head size changed. I can't even blame my hair because I cut it shorter than ever before! I own three Millers that fit great when I got them, but had to sell because they became too tight. I don't know, maybe becoming a Gearhead made my brain swell?

[191145]

Good one! I didn't want to say anything about fat on one's head, but I guess it can happen, as well as the reverse as in my case where I lost weight. But my hat was kind of big all along. I'll take a chance on a 7 1/4 and go from there. I had to pull the tape tight around my head to even get down to 22 7/8", so that Miller must be a big 7 1/4.

[Chewbacca Jones]

Probably. I wish you luck!

[BendingOak]

These are true sizes. You can compare this with other and find that all are off at the very least a little. I have no idea how they can be off but they are.


cm = inches US size


49 cm = 19.29 inches 6 1/8
50 cm = 19.68 inches 6 1/4
51 cm = 20.08 inches 6 3/8
52 cm = 20.47 inches 6 1/2
53 cm = 20.87 inches 6 5/8
54 cm = 21.26 inches 6 3/4
55 cm = 21.65 inches 6 7/8
56 cm = 22.05 inches 7
57 cm = 22.44 inches 7 1/8
58 cm = 22.83 inches 7 1/4
59 cm = 23.23 inches 7 3/8
60 cm = 23.62 inches 7 1/2
61 cm = 24.02 inches 7 5/8
62 cm = 24.41 inches 7 3/4

[191145]

Not surprising at all - sizes in apparel of any kind are completely subjective. You simply have to try any piece of apparel on. Unfortunately, this is a PITA by mail order, but it does keep the USPS and UPS in business.

[gwyddion]

That's why I said it would be best to ask Todd himself (Puppetboy on here by the way) as he knows what size would fit a head with your measurement best: he is the one selling them after all

Regards, Geert

[191145]

That's why I said it would be best to ask Todd himself (Puppetboy on here by the way) as he knows what size would fit a head with your measurement best: he is the one selling them after all

Regards, Geert

I appreciate your thoughts, but if you'll look you'll see he has already posted his sizing, so there's no point in bothering him with a question on what is already published. I'll just roll the dice if I decide to get one of his hats. They do look a lot more authentic than my Miller, but I like the quality of the Miller - it's just a little too big. I might wait until more is known about these hats and posted here.

[ajocampo]

It kinda makes it easier if you have a hat that has the size on it.
e.g. i have a 59fifty (the baseball caps), which has a big gold sticker with the size on it.
my 59fifty hat is 71/2 (59.6cm) and I got a 60cm Christy's Adventurer (actually, still waiting for it to arrive!

[BendingOak]

It kinda makes it easier if you have a hat that has the size on it.
e.g. i have a 59fifty (the baseball caps), which has a big gold sticker with the size on it.
my 59fifty hat is 71/2 (59.6cm) and I got a 60cm Christy's Adventurer (actually, still waiting for it to arrive!

Please do not go by baseball cap sizes. Their sizes are almost never like hat sizes.


The best thing is to have someone take your measurements 5 times and take the average. Use Todds chart only or contact him. I'm sure he would rather you contact him to make sure you get the right size the first time around.


John

[Restless Dreamer]

and always note that often sizes of different brands don't match. as I said in another topic, I have a Henry 58 which fits me a little big, and a 59 Christy's that fits me just right. there's always a bit of randomness, in hat sizes!

[Texan Scott]

You wouldn't want a hat that fits exactly 22 7/8, as you measured. Better to get it a little bit larger, then with wear, you will experience some shrinkage, so it will fit better, than the other way around. Trust your initial measurment and comparison. I am exactly that size and normally order a 59 cm.

[riothamus]

Oak, that's interesting since I now measure a 22 7/8 and I ordered my hats from Fedora at 23 1/8 (when my head measured 23) and now they are quite loose. I've worn my brown hat a lot and it did snug up some, but not enough. If I ordered 23 1/8, would Fedora had made it a little larger to allow for the shrinkage you mention?

I even find my 59 Fed III and Fed IV are loose now when they once fit well after wearing them for a while. I've ordered a couple of Fed III's in size 58, one of which they said was true to size and one was a little larger. I'm hoping they fit with my current head size. I passed on one of Fedora's recent sales because he said he's 22 7/8 and it was snug on him. We'll find out when the Fed III's come in!

Excelsior!
Riothamus

[BendingOak]

Oak, that's interesting since I now measure a 22 7/8 and I ordered my hats from Fedora at 23 1/8 (when my head measured 23) and now they are quite loose. I've worn my brown hat a lot and it did snug up some, but not enough. If I ordered 23 1/8, would Fedora had made it a little larger to allow for the shrinkage you mention?

I even find my 59 Fed III and Fed IV are loose now when they once fit well after wearing them for a while. I've ordered a couple of Fed III's in size 58, one of which they said was true to size and one was a little larger. I'm hoping they fit with my current head size. I passed on one of Fedora's recent sales because he said he's 22 7/8 and it was snug on him. We'll find out when the Fed III's come in!

Excelsior!
Riothamus

I'm confused. Why did you order a 23 1/8 when your measurements is 23????

[Fedora]

I'm confused. Why did you order a 23 1/8 when your measurements is 23????

I think he added the extra for shrinkage! Ok, when I ask for 3 head measurments, I average them out, and THEN I ADD AN EXTRA 1/8 an inch to the average, to take care of inevitable shrinkage. If he added 1/8 and then I added 1/8, the hat is gonna be too large.

The best way is just to give the hatter your measurements, without adding anything. I make my own hats with the extra 1/8 added, because I sweat profusely in this humid heat we have in the South. When new, my hats are just a little loose, not bumping the top of your ears loose, but just a bit loose. And 1/8 an inch generally will suffice.

When I got my Henry, it was a 58 or 7 1/4, but was loose. In a couple of weeks, it fit perfectly. Because leather is gonna shrink, its just the nature of the beast. And there is nothing worse than a too tight hat. Gotta take a couple aspirin to wear them if they get this way. Of course, I would have no problem as I own a complete set of differently sized hat stretchers, but I would rather my own hats to shrink a bit to fit. Just seems to work out better in this manner. If the leather is good stuff, it won't shrink anymore after that initial shrinkage. Or this has been my own experience over the years.

Of course, I recall buying a hat once that had fake leather. Couldn't tell it by its appearance. I found out when I went to stamp my initials in it. My vintage machine would not punch out the holes. It was some sort of synthetic leather, and was hot as blazes. But, it wouldn't shrink!! And yeah, I changed it out real fast once I discovered what it was. I am an organic guy.

[BendingOak]

I follow your lead as well Steve. I add an 1/8 inch.

My point to everyone is to havevsomeone measure you a few times 3-5. Take the average and give it to the hatter or retail shop. Let them size you up. Don't over think it and don't add anything.

John

[ajocampo]

yeah I heard that, too, and I agree to measure your head multiple times. I guess it just so happened that my baseball cap size is the same as what I measured my head to be.

[Indy35]

That's why I said it would be best to ask Todd himself (Puppetboy on here by the way) as he knows what size would fit a head with your measurement best: he is the one selling them after all

Regards, Geert

I appreciate your thoughts, but if you'll look you'll see he has already posted his sizing, so there's no point in bothering him with a question on what is already published. I'll just roll the dice if I decide to get one of his hats. They do look a lot more authentic than my Miller, but I like the quality of the Miller - it's just a little too big. I might wait until more is known about these hats and posted here.

Although I agree that it can seem a bit repetitive to ask a question about a hat size, when he has already posted, its in your best interest and his, that you make sure that your exact head measurement lines up with his sizes. I do this with every vendor, except the custom guys, just to make sure. I did it with my Henry and all of my Akubras, it worked out for me, and the vendor's love not having you ship a hat back!!! I've never had a vendor get mad at me for asking. Its tough when you have a head size that is truly "in-between" the typical stock sizes. So its just being safe, and most vendor's are quite aware that everyone seems to roughly have their own sizes.

[riothamus]

I'm confused. Why did you order a 23 1/8 when your measurements is 23????

I think he added the extra for shrinkage! Ok, when I ask for 3 head measurments, I average them out, and THEN I ADD AN EXTRA 1/8 an inch to the average, to take care of inevitable shrinkage. If he added 1/8 and then I added 1/8, the hat is gonna be too large.

I think then this is why my hats are too large. When discussing size with Fedora originally back in Oct '07, we agreed to make it 23 1/8 to allow for more hair during the winter as my hair was really short at the time of ordering. So now, add my head shrinking 1/8 (for whatever reason) and the extra 1/8 that we added for hair, and the extra 1/8 Fedora added for shrinkage... Yikes. I really need a resize/reblock. I've put some papertowels in one hat, and it just doesn't feel right. Fedora, I've sent you several emails about sending my hats in for a resize sometime in the next several months. Hopefully we can make contact about it as I'd really like my hats to fit for the next cool season.

Excelsior!
Riothamus

[fuzzjunk]

Does anyone ever order a custom hat between sizes? lets say between 22 1/8-22 1/4?

Also, would the amount that someone perspires directly affect how much shrinkage takes place in the end? or just the rate that the shrinking occurs. Maybe I'm just over thinking this.

[Chewbacca Jones]

As somebody who sweats a lot, I can tell you that I worry about shrinkage all the time. If I happen to have an exceptionally sweaty day, I often throw in a hat stretcher overnight just to be sure. It might not be necessary, but it helps me sleep peacefully. I can tell you that no correctly sized custom hat in my collection has ever shrank up enough to be a problem. This includes Steve's and John's work.

I can also say that I have order "in bewteen sizes" - but since most custom hatters ask for a measurement rather than a hat size, the whole process is much more precise. Mistakes can happen, but 95% + of the time, they'll get it right. If not, the god ones will make it right.

[ajocampo]

lol I'm getting kinda anxious now about the size of the Christy's hat I ordered
and so to relieve my anxiety, I've been measuring my head numerous times lol...

Ordered 60cm...measuring 59cm around my head; never got a measurement over 60cm.

[Fedora]

Fedora, I've sent you several emails about sending my hats in for a resize sometime in the next several months. Hopefully we can make contact about it as I'd really like my hats to fit for the next cool season.

You have? Let me wade through the emails to find yours. I do get behind on em, as I get in so many each day. Be glad when the old days return so I don't get behind. And yes, they will return once I get caught up. And with my pricing now, even with Indy 5, this won't be repeated. Indy 4 really gave me more orders than I could do in any sort of timely manner. I think if they do make Indy 5, I am gonna offer just a limited number, like Tony did with the jackets on Indy 4. Then once those are sold, I am retiring and leaving the hatmaking up to my other friends here, John and LLS and Marc. Fedora