Club Obi Wan

Hello,

Long-time lurker, first-time poster. I'm about to purchase a Wested OTR. After spending a week reading up on the differences between the Raiders and ROLA jackets, I'm now more confused than when I started.

I'm looking for some clarification on how the two models are sized, and also some advice on which would be best to suit my needs.

I like the fact that the ROLA is more screen accurate than the Raiders, but I'm worried about its durability. In particular, do I have to worry about the lack of leather facing on the zipper?

More importantly, I'm worried about the ROLA's fit. My chest size is about 44 inches, and my waist size is in the 38-40 inch range. I know that the ROLA has a "slimmer" cut, but what exactly does that mean? In reading through various threads, some say that the ROLA is tapered, and some say that it is not. Is it? If so, how much? Would that cause a problem for someone of my girth?

The other thing I'm confused about is sizing. As far as how much extra chest room is in the ROLA, I've read everything from 2 to 6 inches. Exactly how big are these things? I live in Chicago, so while this will primarily be a spring/fall jacket, I'd like to be able to put a sweatshirt underneath it if I need to.

In your expert opinion, which jacket do you think is the better choice for me?

Thanks,
Mike

spend a few more bucks and go custom.


welcome btw

Thanks Holt. I've considered going the custom route, but I'm hesitant for a couple of reasons. First, I want to be able to use the jacket when I get it. But in Chicago, there's a period of about 3 weeks when the temperature is between 30 degrees and 90 degrees, and we're in that period right now. So my fear is that the custom jacket will arrive just in time for me to not need it.

Secondly, after reading various threads here, I don't really have the utmost faith in Wested's ability to follow directions. As it stands, I have a custom LC that I got from them about 8 years ago, and they forgot to put the snaps on the storm flap. I think I'd feel more comfortable buying one of their OTR jackets.

But either way, I still have the same concerns regarding Raiders vs. ROLA.

1. Is the zipper or any other element on the ROLA going to be a problem over time?

2. What does it mean that the ROLA body is "slimmer?" Is it tapered? If so, how much? Too put it bluntly, am I too fat to comfortably wear a ROLA?

3. How much extra room is in a ROLA? 2, 4, or 6 inches? Is this the same as the Raiders?

Thanks again for the help.

Not to hijack your thread , but my questions may fall in this camp w/ regards to Westeds' sizing concerns as well if I could ask please:

1.) To those who have purchased a Wested standard off-the-shelf ROLA washed goat (the ones made in India), what are their sleeve lengths? I mean, on their website, they simply list what size you can order, size 40, 42, 44, etc. but there are no other listings on what the sleeve lengths on each of those are, lol. When you click on the "Custom ROLA" you can a choice of sleeve length, but not on the standards. I wrote to Gemma, but I have yet to hear back from her. I can try writing to her again, but in the meantime, does anyone know what the sleeve length may be on one of the size 40R "off-the-shelf" jackets are? I'm assuming that these are made w/ the same measurements used in their own jacket sizing chart on their website?

2.) Binkmeisterrick had mentioned that Goatskin tends to shrink. I'm assuming that regardless of manufacturer, Wested, G&B, USWings, etc., they all have a tendency to shrink when wet, but I know this is probably a dumb question to ask, but does the jacket have to be totally saturated to shrink or what happens if it gets wet in the rain, but not totally saturated? I guess I'm just trying to figure out an appropriate sleeve length for a jacket should mine get wet since I'm rather hard on clothing and looking to wear a jacket in all sorts of weather elements.

Should I order something w/ an extra 1/2'' inch in length perhaps just to be on the safe side? Are Westeds' more inclined to shrink that say, the G&B Expo, or, like I mentioned, goatskin is goatskin and has the potential to shrink regardless of manufacturer?

Thanks for your time and for the guidance!
Aaron

mumbles3k wrote:Thanks Holt. I've considered going the custom route, but I'm hesitant for a couple of reasons. First, I want to be able to use the jacket when I get it. But in Chicago, there's a period of about 3 weeks when the temperature is between 30 degrees and 90 degrees, and we're in that period right now. So my fear is that the custom jacket will arrive just in time for me to not need it.

Secondly, after reading various threads here, I don't really have the utmost faith in Wested's ability to follow directions. As it stands, I have a custom LC that I got from them about 8 years ago, and they forgot to put the snaps on the storm flap. I think I'd feel more comfortable buying one of their OTR jackets.

But either way, I still have the same concerns regarding Raiders vs. ROLA.

1. Is the zipper or any other element on the ROLA going to be a problem over time?

2. What does it mean that the ROLA body is "slimmer?" Is it tapered? If so, how much? Too put it bluntly, am I too fat to comfortably wear a ROLA?

3. How much extra room is in a ROLA? 2, 4, or 6 inches? Is this the same as the Raiders?

Thanks again for the help.

what I ment is that you can go custom by letteing them make an of the rack size. they do that. when going this route you can ad the correct details.

Rola is slimmer body cut. higher armholes. trimmer fit. between 2-4'' chest room.

radiers is full body cut. bigger armholes. looser fit. between 4-6'' chest room.

Captain D wrote:Not to hijack your thread , but my questions may fall in this camp w/ regards to Westeds' sizing concerns as well if I could ask please:

1.) To those who have purchased a Wested standard off-the-shelf ROLA washed goat (the ones made in India), what are their sleeve lengths? I mean, on their website, they simply list what size you can order, size 40, 42, 44, etc. but there are no other listings on what the sleeve lengths on each of those are, lol. When you click on the "Custom ROLA" you can a choice of sleeve length, but not on the standards. I wrote to Gemma, but I have yet to hear back from her. I can try writing to her again, but in the meantime, does anyone know what the sleeve length may be on one of the size 40R "off-the-shelf" jackets are? I'm assuming that these are made w/ the same measurements used in their own jacket sizing chart on their website?

2.) Binkmeisterrick had mentioned that Goatskin tends to shrink. I'm assuming that regardless of manufacturer, Wested, G&B, USWings, etc., they all have a tendency to shrink when wet, but I know this is probably a dumb question to ask, but does the jacket have to be totally saturated to shrink or what happens if it gets wet in the rain, but not totally saturated? I guess I'm just trying to figure out an appropriate sleeve length for a jacket should mine get wet since I'm rather hard on clothing and looking to wear a jacket in all sorts of weather elements.

Should I order something w/ an extra 1/2'' inch in length perhaps just to be on the safe side? Are Westeds' more inclined to shrink that say, the G&B Expo, or, like I mentioned, goatskin is goatskin and has the potential to shrink regardless of manufacturer?

Thanks for your time and for the guidance!
Aaron

STOP worrying! it will not shrink - SHRINK. water is a goatskins best friend. all leather will shrink alittle when wet but thats normal.

ad 0.5'' extra in sleeve length cuz they will bunch up at least 0.5'' after wearing it a while. getting wet or not. if not caught in the rain your body heat will take care of getting them bunch up over time. so they will shrink just alittle anyway.

and yes you should have posted this question in your own thread 8 threads down below.

I bought my ROLA because I read that they were slimmer fitting. Then I went to the Wested store and discovered something interesting. The ROTLA (English made) OTR's are all slimmer in the waist than the ROLA (Indian) OTR's. The ROTLA OTR's are slightly tapered. The ROLA OTR's are not.

The only thing I think I've read about the ROLA OTR that is correct is that the quality is great. It is for this reason only that I would buy the ROLA OTR.

Also, every ROLA OTR that I saw looked exactly the same as the one hanging next to it. Though the ROTLA OTR's may fit better, you're still rolling the dice when you order one because the workmanship and quality control just isn't as good as the Indian manufacturer.

Thanks guys. Now I have a few more questions.

1. Since the ROLA OTR is not tapered, would a size 46 ROLA fit about the same as a size 44 Raiders, or would there be other weird disproportionate elements?

2. What does the higher armholes on the ROLA do to the fit? Is it hard to get a sweatshirted arm through those things?

Also, Dr. Evil, how much extra chest room is in your ROLA OTR? I've read so many different things about this, that I'm wondering who's talking about the Indian jackets vs. the UK jackets and whether their sizing has changed over time. Since you said that all of the Indian jackets you saw were consistently sized, it seems like your jacket might be a good indicator as to what the deal is at this particular moment.

I wear a size 42 and have a 37 inch waist. I have to pull in the side straps all the way on my ROLA OTR. It is that baggy. I would just stick with your jacket size. You could probably get a sweatshirt under there, if it's not too large.

The arms on my size 42 ROLA are 27 inches in length. The back is the same length also.

Thanks, Dr. Evil. It sounds like we're close to the same proportions, so a size 44 ROLA would probably work for me. Just to be on the safe side, would it be possible for you to measure the chest on your jacket?

Thanks again for all the help.

and yes you should have posted this question in your own thread 8 threads down below. - I apologize there Holt - My crazy puter' had difficulties posting and only allowed me to post in this thread - which seemed topic similar ...But, thank you for clarifying my jacket shrinkage concerns!

Dr. Evil - Just to double-check - The off-the-rack ROLA Washed Goatskin jackets made in India are not quite as tapered as the off-the-rack ROLA jackets made at Wested, but they're (the India jackets) are better in quality/durability overall (vs. the Wested ROLA)? So, in other words, even though the India jackets are not 100% screen-accurate, it's a trade-off between the two more or less. But if one tends to be better in durability, that's got my vote, lol.

Thank you again and I think we're leaning towards a possible purchase, lol,
Aaron

The thing about the Indian ones is that they do come off a factory line, therefore they are very consistant.

The UK made ones are a mix of OTR's and returns. Most of my jackets are from the UK made rail because people have ordered jackets way too short for them and they have fitted me!

Captain D, KT Templar brought up a great point. He said that a lot of his jackets were returns. I think I actually own one, too. I went to Wested and Peter, an awesome guy, by the way, came out with all sorts of stuff, one of them a beautiful horsehide that I bought that day. So, I'd reccomend calling him. Do it on a Saturday about the time they open and he'd probably rummage through his stuff to find something that fits you perfectly.

KT Templar also brought up another good point, the India jackets are certainly factory line items, whereas the in-house Westeds are hand-made. You can tell on mine, but I don't care about the a-symetrical aspects of my jacket because it looks amazing.

As far as durability goes, I do think the in-house Westeds are just as durable. They just aren't made as uniform. The stiching isn't so strait, but it's tight. I don't have threads popping out or anything.

So, it's a hard decision, really. They're both durable. The in-house jackets seem to fit better and look good. If you go with in-house, I reccomend raiders. I think you'd be fine with a tapered jacket, too, by the way. This jacket doesn't look good baggy.

I would personally say go a size up? On my off-the-rack Wested, I ordered a size up from my normal jacket size, and it ended up a perfect fit. Baggy and fitted at the same time, and able to sneak a sweater underneath.

However, as far as wearing sweaters are concerned, and please feel free to correct me on this, but I always thought that wearing a sweater under a jacket can 'stretch' it out. Maybe it's my OCD speaking, but I have designated 'sweater' leather jackets, as I'm too afraid if I wear a sweater with my favorite leather jacket, it would permanently alter the fit... Maybe nothing significant, but still...

Thanks for the advice, Castor. Under normal circumstances, I won't be wearing a sweatshirt underneath. I'd just like to have the option.

Is your OTR a ROLA? How much extra room is in the chest?

All great info - thank you much!

As far as sizing goes, in general, for the India made jackets, here was my question and reply:

Dear Wested Leather,

I just had a quick question if I may ask please about this specific jacket listed on your website - the standard Indiana Jones jacket made in India (Raiders' ROLA Washed Goatskin for $189.16 in United States dollars):

http://www.wested.com/raiders-rola-wash ... -177-p.asp

May I simply ask what the sleeve lengths are from the top of the shoulder down to the cuff for:
1.) Size 38
2.) Size 40

Thank you for your time and reply,
Sincerely,
Aaron

And, the response:

Dear Aaron,

Many thanks for your email, the sleeve length for the ROLA Jacket on a size 38 is 24.5 inches and the 40 jacket sleeve length is 25.

Cheers Gemma

At first glance, the sleeve measurements seem rather long - Originally, I was leaning towards a size 40 (if I went with the India made jackets), but based on this response, I may end up purchasing a size 38 especially since I typically wear a 24'' inch sleeve length and the added 1/2'' inch may work well, as Holt suggested, w/ the slight shrinkage that may result from the elbows/ride-up effect. Thought that I would pass this info along for those thinking about ordering one of these OTR India made Wested jackets...

All the best,
Aaron

If you think the rest of the jacket is a good size go with the 38 then Aaron. Otherwise go with the 40 as it's easier to shorten sleeves than lengthen. Wear and wrinkling could easily accommodate that little extra length.

So I bought a size 44 ROLA, and I think it was the right choice. It seems to fit me fairly well. I think size 46 would have been okay too, but 44 seems to fit me the way it's supposed to. For those who are curious, it measures 49 inches at the chest and 44 inches at the waist.

In comparing it to my custom size 40 LC, everything is bigger (obviously) except the armholes, which is to be expected.

However, one thing I've noticed in comparing the two is that when I extend my arms in front of me, the new jacket feels tight in the back. This happens whether the jacket is zipped or not. At first, I thought that this was due to the higher and smaller armholes. But in looking at jacket, I can see what look like two white strips of elasitc inside the lining, going across the back, at about armhole height. It seems like these are the cause of the tightness. As far as I can tell, my old LC doesn't have them.

So here are my questions:

1. Is the tight fit in the back normal (i.e. how it's supposed to be)?

2. Is the tight fit caused by the elastic strips?

3. What purpose are the elastic strips supposed to serve?

Thanks again for the help.

The tight fit is the result of the '80's cut. It should be a rather snug fit overall, much like the old saying goes, "fits like a glove". It should not however feel restrictive. You should have complete freedom of movement, as if the jacket were a second skin, ideally. Anything that feels even the slightest bit restrictive might increase the risk of splitting a seam, I would think. The '80's cut tends to be such a snug fit, that you'd be hard-pressed to wear a sweater underneath. As such, the ROLA cut is not recommended for "layering" during colder days.
There is in fact an elastic in the back. That is used to hold the side pleats closed, as they tend to flare out and open up otherwise. The strap should be (semi) unnoticeable as well.
I hope this gives enough insight
Ravenswood

mumbles3k wrote:..

However, one thing I've noticed in comparing the two is that when I extend my arms in front of me, the new jacket feels tight in the back. This happens whether the jacket is zipped or not. At first, I thought that this was due to the higher and smaller armholes. But in looking at jacket, I can see what look like two white strips of elasitc inside the lining, going across the back, at about armhole height. It seems like these are the cause of the tightness. As far as I can tell, my old LC doesn't have them.

So here are my questions:

1. Is the tight fit in the back normal (i.e. how it's supposed to be)?

2. Is the tight fit caused by the elastic strips?

3. What purpose are the elastic strips supposed to serve?

Thanks again for the help.

Are you holding your arms out in front of you in a way you would driving a car or just holding them straight out?
Just holding ones arms straight out is an unnatural pose.

Does the back feel tight when just doing this with your arms straight out or does it generally feel tight? The back should not feel tight.

Elastic in the back of a Raiders jacket seems odd, but if it's there it should not make the jacket feel tight, it should give with movement. It is after all, elastic.

It's there as someone said, to keep the action back pleats closed.

Hey, D....I think you may want the 40...you can always have length taken off later (most leather repair places can do this for you) if need be....but you can't put leather back on!

I've learned that lesson the HARD way, FARRRR too many times.

And Mike....if you're ordering OTR, I would just order whatever size sport coat I wear if I were you. I think I'd also go with the Raiders jacket...seems more fully cut and will be generally less restrictive for you.

Hope that helps.
Regards!
Indydawg

Ravenswood wrote:The tight fit is the result of the '80's cut. It should be a rather snug fit overall, much like the old saying goes, "fits like a glove". It should not however feel restrictive. You should have complete freedom of movement, as if the jacket were a second skin, ideally. Anything that feels even the slightest bit restrictive might increase the risk of splitting a seam, I would think. The '80's cut tends to be such a snug fit, that you'd be hard-pressed to wear a sweater underneath. As such, the ROLA cut is not recommended for "layering" during colder days.

I think this is what I'm noticing. While it definitely feels snug, mainly around the shoulders, I can still move my arms in any direction, and can even cross my arms completely and grab the back of my left shoulder with my right hand and vice versa.

As for it being tight in the back, I've looked at myself in the mirror since my last post, and at no point is the leather tight on my back. So what I must be feeling is the just the elastic. It's not really uncomfortable. I think it just took me by surprise because I didn't know of its existence.

Now that I'm aware of the elastic, the only point at which the jacket can seem skin tight is the shoulders. Which leads to...

RCSignals wrote:Are you holding your arms out in front of you in a way you would driving a car or just holding them straight out?

I actually drove while wearing it today. I noticed it a bit, although it's much more noticeable when I hold my arms straight out.

What I've found is that the sleeves start slightly below my shoulders. If I pull the shoulders up a bit higher, then it feels fine.

I realize that I'm trying to talk about something using terminology that I'm not very well-versed in, but does what I'm saying make sense?

Thanks again.

Hi there Dawg' ...yeah, I was debating between the 38 and 40 sizes. I was just taken aback at the sleeve length for the 40R...it just seemed that the length was rather long for that fitting. The 38 would probably fit alright, but definitely give that Raiders' 80s fitting/second skin look. I realize that this is a dumb question, so please forgive the ignorance - but to have the sleeves shortened, does that show on the rest of the sleeves? In other words, do you see stitching, etc. or are they simply glued up from under? I'm just a lil' weary bout' seeing stitching that wouldn't be SA, lol