Indy Pants Details
Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 3:09 pm
Hey All,
I thought since there were lists of jacket details (agent5, Holt's list, etc.), I'd like to see a list of Indy pants details. Also, the Mods keep deleting links to the other site where I did this originally.
I make costumes with some regularity and know these kinds of lists are really helpful to beginners searching for or making their own stuff. I also know lists like these drive costumers crazy because they can be quite "nit picky". On the whole though, I think they are worth while.
Most of the pictures come from our own KT Templar and his wonderful thread showing (moth eaten) screen used pants. The consensus was that they are “Raiders” pants.
I will be borrowing other people’s pictures quite heavily, so if I post a picture that's yours, and you don't like it, say so, I'll pull it.
The chief details are mostly around the waist. The first thing I notice is the lack of a waist band.
All seams and pleats go right to the top of the pants, like (at least) American BDUs. The illusion of a waist band is created by top stitching (like BDUs). This line of top stitching also secures an internal waist band (facing) on the inside.
That band (facing) is the white fabric. After talking to Todd, the area in the middle of the waistband facing is a rubber “hold you shirt tail in thingy” (not sure what the right name is). While we're here, notice the five fly buttons, a slider hook and eye, and a waist band button. You can also see white suspender buttons if you look closely.
Next on our tour around the waist, there are seven belt loops. These are about a half inch wide, and one and three quarters inches long, and have no top stitching. Their locations are: one on the back center seam, one on each side seam, one over each back pocket, and one on top of each "major" front pleat (more on this in a minute). These belt loops are about one half inch down from the top of the waist and have their stitching securing them to the pants on the inside of the loops, not on the outside.
Next, the pleats: There are four pleats on the front of Indy's pants. Two pleats are on each side of the fly placket. I'm going to call the pleats closest to the fly placket the "major" pleats and the ones closest to the pockets the "minor" pleats.
Pants are designed so that the fly placket edge that opens is centered in the front of the pants. The "major" pleat is nearly centered between the side seam and the fly placket. The "minor" pleat is about centered between the "major" pleat and the side seam. The depth of the "major" pleat, that is, how deep the fold of fabric is, is about one inch. The depth of the "minor" pleat is about one half inch. These proportions are visible through the fabric in the "waist band" area. Move from the "minor" pleat toward the side seam about one half inch and you've arrived at the pocket.
Pockets: The front pockets are straight, or nearly so. They have top stitching along the front edge about a quarter inch in. The back pockets are spaced about the same distance back from the side seam as the front pockets are forward from the side seam. They are covered by flaps. The back pocket flaps also have top stitching in about a quarter inch along the edge of the flap. Here is a drawing of the back pocket flap based directly from these screen used pants. (I didn't draw it. Serrecuir did.) The dimension is pretty accurate for HF's size.
Notice that the flaps are mounted inside the pocket, not fastened on the outside. (See the top picture.) Both the front and rear pocket details are very similar to BDUs. Above the pocket is a seam, it is used for shaping the pants to the (hopefully) tapering part of the trunk of your body. Most pants today have vertical seams in this area. Indy's sloped toward the side seam (forward) for some reason. This seam is centered over the pocket in the area below the "waistband". That is, it starts at a point of one end of the pocket, and ends over the opposite point at the "waistband" top stitching. (See the “schematic” below.) This seam, of course, runs on to the top of the pants, but can be ignored visually because the belt covers all the seams in the "waistband".
The pockets are lined in brown (black?) fabric and are constructed pretty much like... BDUs. And the back pockets have the same buttons as the fly and waist band button. These appear to be khaki colored buttons, about one half inch in diameter (22L). The thread for both the buttons and the button holes matches the button, not the pants.
Also, a word about size estimates. Since the web belt is one and one quarter inches wide, (actually one and five sixteenths, I checked all five of mine) we can compare that width to other widths (and heights) and make good approximations of the real dimensions (in HF's size). For example, if the web belt is one and one quarter inches wide, then we can infer that the "waistband" is one and three quarters inches wide. The belt loops then are one half inch wide, and one and three quarters inches tall. Also, they are positioned about one half inch down from the top edge. The top stitching on the fly placket is about one and three quarters inches over from the edge. These numbers are only approximate.
Top stitching: (See the “schematic” below.) Top stitching appears to be dark brown, or maybe black. Top stitching is used on the "waist band", the fly placket, and the pockets. There is a small tack at the bottom of the fly placket, also there is some construction top stitching along the front pockets in the "waist band" area. Also, top stitching attaches the back pocket flaps to the pants.
There is also another line of “construction top stitching”; it is the line just below the top of the waist. It’s easy to find this stitching on the inside of the pants, not so much on the outside. I’ve checked every pair of pants I own, including dress pants, and every one of them has this line of stitching, even blue jeans (and BDUs). However, no picture that I have clearly shows this line of stitching on the outside of Indy’s pants. Some pictures do seem to have something there, so I’m going with it. Does anyone have a picture to help out with this? No other place on the pants has top stitching (clears throat, belt loops!).
You can see that the seam inside the pants is a plain seam. The edges are serged and ironed open (flat). Serger thread matches the pants color. There is no top stitching on any leg seam.
That pretty much sums up the upper area of the pants. A word about fit though, the upper part of the pants should fit closely from about the hip line (widest part of pants) up. From there down the pants fit loosely, like BDUs do. From the hip line down, the pants taper evenly to about a nine inch military hem opening (in HF’s size).
The military hem: I’ve already written about that here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=39008
A last few notes: I just noticed that I didn't give the proportion for the seam above the back pocket. It's .65 to .35, that is: about one third to two thirds. Here is a “schematic” of sorts:
I’ve redrawn it several times. I think these details are at least pretty close. Anyway, there you have it. If you are a costumer, my apologies, I know I've stepped on all of you at least a little.
Dan S
I thought since there were lists of jacket details (agent5, Holt's list, etc.), I'd like to see a list of Indy pants details. Also, the Mods keep deleting links to the other site where I did this originally.
I make costumes with some regularity and know these kinds of lists are really helpful to beginners searching for or making their own stuff. I also know lists like these drive costumers crazy because they can be quite "nit picky". On the whole though, I think they are worth while.
Most of the pictures come from our own KT Templar and his wonderful thread showing (moth eaten) screen used pants. The consensus was that they are “Raiders” pants.
I will be borrowing other people’s pictures quite heavily, so if I post a picture that's yours, and you don't like it, say so, I'll pull it.
The chief details are mostly around the waist. The first thing I notice is the lack of a waist band.
All seams and pleats go right to the top of the pants, like (at least) American BDUs. The illusion of a waist band is created by top stitching (like BDUs). This line of top stitching also secures an internal waist band (facing) on the inside.
That band (facing) is the white fabric. After talking to Todd, the area in the middle of the waistband facing is a rubber “hold you shirt tail in thingy” (not sure what the right name is). While we're here, notice the five fly buttons, a slider hook and eye, and a waist band button. You can also see white suspender buttons if you look closely.
Next on our tour around the waist, there are seven belt loops. These are about a half inch wide, and one and three quarters inches long, and have no top stitching. Their locations are: one on the back center seam, one on each side seam, one over each back pocket, and one on top of each "major" front pleat (more on this in a minute). These belt loops are about one half inch down from the top of the waist and have their stitching securing them to the pants on the inside of the loops, not on the outside.
Next, the pleats: There are four pleats on the front of Indy's pants. Two pleats are on each side of the fly placket. I'm going to call the pleats closest to the fly placket the "major" pleats and the ones closest to the pockets the "minor" pleats.
Pants are designed so that the fly placket edge that opens is centered in the front of the pants. The "major" pleat is nearly centered between the side seam and the fly placket. The "minor" pleat is about centered between the "major" pleat and the side seam. The depth of the "major" pleat, that is, how deep the fold of fabric is, is about one inch. The depth of the "minor" pleat is about one half inch. These proportions are visible through the fabric in the "waist band" area. Move from the "minor" pleat toward the side seam about one half inch and you've arrived at the pocket.
Pockets: The front pockets are straight, or nearly so. They have top stitching along the front edge about a quarter inch in. The back pockets are spaced about the same distance back from the side seam as the front pockets are forward from the side seam. They are covered by flaps. The back pocket flaps also have top stitching in about a quarter inch along the edge of the flap. Here is a drawing of the back pocket flap based directly from these screen used pants. (I didn't draw it. Serrecuir did.) The dimension is pretty accurate for HF's size.
Notice that the flaps are mounted inside the pocket, not fastened on the outside. (See the top picture.) Both the front and rear pocket details are very similar to BDUs. Above the pocket is a seam, it is used for shaping the pants to the (hopefully) tapering part of the trunk of your body. Most pants today have vertical seams in this area. Indy's sloped toward the side seam (forward) for some reason. This seam is centered over the pocket in the area below the "waistband". That is, it starts at a point of one end of the pocket, and ends over the opposite point at the "waistband" top stitching. (See the “schematic” below.) This seam, of course, runs on to the top of the pants, but can be ignored visually because the belt covers all the seams in the "waistband".
The pockets are lined in brown (black?) fabric and are constructed pretty much like... BDUs. And the back pockets have the same buttons as the fly and waist band button. These appear to be khaki colored buttons, about one half inch in diameter (22L). The thread for both the buttons and the button holes matches the button, not the pants.
Also, a word about size estimates. Since the web belt is one and one quarter inches wide, (actually one and five sixteenths, I checked all five of mine) we can compare that width to other widths (and heights) and make good approximations of the real dimensions (in HF's size). For example, if the web belt is one and one quarter inches wide, then we can infer that the "waistband" is one and three quarters inches wide. The belt loops then are one half inch wide, and one and three quarters inches tall. Also, they are positioned about one half inch down from the top edge. The top stitching on the fly placket is about one and three quarters inches over from the edge. These numbers are only approximate.
Top stitching: (See the “schematic” below.) Top stitching appears to be dark brown, or maybe black. Top stitching is used on the "waist band", the fly placket, and the pockets. There is a small tack at the bottom of the fly placket, also there is some construction top stitching along the front pockets in the "waist band" area. Also, top stitching attaches the back pocket flaps to the pants.
There is also another line of “construction top stitching”; it is the line just below the top of the waist. It’s easy to find this stitching on the inside of the pants, not so much on the outside. I’ve checked every pair of pants I own, including dress pants, and every one of them has this line of stitching, even blue jeans (and BDUs). However, no picture that I have clearly shows this line of stitching on the outside of Indy’s pants. Some pictures do seem to have something there, so I’m going with it. Does anyone have a picture to help out with this? No other place on the pants has top stitching (clears throat, belt loops!).
You can see that the seam inside the pants is a plain seam. The edges are serged and ironed open (flat). Serger thread matches the pants color. There is no top stitching on any leg seam.
That pretty much sums up the upper area of the pants. A word about fit though, the upper part of the pants should fit closely from about the hip line (widest part of pants) up. From there down the pants fit loosely, like BDUs do. From the hip line down, the pants taper evenly to about a nine inch military hem opening (in HF’s size).
The military hem: I’ve already written about that here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=39008
A last few notes: I just noticed that I didn't give the proportion for the seam above the back pocket. It's .65 to .35, that is: about one third to two thirds. Here is a “schematic” of sorts:
I’ve redrawn it several times. I think these details are at least pretty close. Anyway, there you have it. If you are a costumer, my apologies, I know I've stepped on all of you at least a little.
Dan S
