Keppler Crystal Skull vs. Adventurebilt Crystal Skull

[Rundquist]

One of the great things about living in So. California is that it is undeniably the Indygear capitol of the world. We’ve got Lee Keppler, Tony Nowak, Gibson & Barnes, and Todd’s costume (though I have yet to visit him myself). Until only a few years ago, we also had Fritz, without whom Indiana Jones would not be wearing an Alden 405.

Anyway over the years I’ve become friends with Lee Keppler. Occasionally I go to the local gunshows and hang out with him. On occasion I snap pics of his latest offerings as well. He’s not a computer savvy guy, (not that I am). Yesterday I took my camera to take some pics of his new Crystal Skull 100% beaver hat. As luck would have it, there was a fan there who happened to have his CS AB hat there as well. I took the opportunity to compare them.

Lee has always made a good product. He’s sort of an Indygear legend. But as good as he is (and as good as I expected his hat to be), I expected there to be some differences between his offering and the Adventurebilt AB (the standard that all Indy hats are measured by). I was amazed that in the end there was not an appreciable difference between the two hats whatsoever. It blew me away. They looked the same, and all the materials were the same. The only “Indiana Jones” edge that I would give to the AB was that the ribbon bow had a downward crease in the front. I think that Lee is still working on the details of the bow, but this one was clearly better than the one on the Raider hat from that other Keppler/AB thread.

Anyway I’ll let the pictures do the talking. I personally would still never wear either hat, but I will say that the (identical) felt used on both hats was the thinnest 100% beaver felt that I’ve seen. It’s still not right for Raiders though (or a dress fedora for that matter). But at least it doesn’t quite feel like a cowboy hat on your head (something I hate). It feels like something inbetween. That’s something for a beaver felt I suppose. Cheers

Keppler on the left/ AB on the right



Keppler on the bottom/ AB on the top
http://images43.fotki.com/v1386/photos/ ... 128-vi.jpg

Keppler on the right/ AB on the left
http://images44.fotki.com/v1420/photos/ ... 124-vi.jpg

Keppler on the left/ AB on the right
http://images48.fotki.com/v1411/photos/ ... 122-vi.jpg
http://images43.fotki.com/v1386/photos/ ... 130-vi.jpg

Keppler on the bottom/ AB on the top
http://images45.fotki.com/v1422/photos/ ... 127-vi.jpg

Keppler on the Top/ AB on the bottom
http://images47.fotki.com/v1398/photos/ ... 123-vi.jpg

Keppler on the right/ AB on the left
http://images47.fotki.com/v1404/photos/ ... 125-vi.jpg
http://images42.fotki.com/v1378/photos/ ... 128-vi.jpg

Keppler


http://images46.fotki.com/v1393/photos/ ... 154-vi.jpg
http://images43.fotki.com/v1390/photos/ ... 153-vi.jpg
http://images46.fotki.com/v1413/photos/ ... 133-vi.jpg
http://images44.fotki.com/v1420/photos/ ... 132-vi.jpg
http://images44.fotki.com/v1417/photos/ ... 134-vi.jpg

AB


http://images46.fotki.com/v1395/photos/ ... 136-vi.jpg
http://images43.fotki.com/v1390/photos/ ... 138-vi.jpg
http://images44.fotki.com/v1419/photos/ ... 137-vi.jpg

Bow detail:

Keppler
http://images42.fotki.com/v1380/photos/ ... 140-vi.jpg

AB
http://images44.fotki.com/v1417/photos/ ... 139-vi.jpg

[WhipDude]

Thanks for the review. That's really awesome. I'm amazed how much alike they really are. Did Lee mention when his site would be up? The price of these? When they are available to the general public?
The liner in his hat looks superb. Very warm fancy feel to it.

[Rundquist]

Thanks for the review. That's really awesome. I'm amazed how much alike they really are. Did Lee mention when his site would be up? The price of these? When they are available to the general public?
The liner in his hat looks superb. Very warm fancy feel to it.

As Indy would say "He's working on it", with regards to the site. I'd give him a call. I believe that they're $300. Cheers

PS- I really thought that I would see some differences. But there really were none.

[DR Ulloa]

Now this is a fair comparison and the Keppler look great next to the AB. It really does look amazing and seems to be the best choice for a pure beaver Indy hat but don't want to spend the time waiting for an AB...of course I would advocate going with Penman, but if you want instant gratification, this hat is it. The bow work isn't a good as the AB but it is a much better than most offerings out there. The ribbon itself, however...Lee...great work! That ribbon is great! My hat is off to you.

Dave

[IndyFalco]

...if you want instant gratification, this hat is it.
Dave

Freeze it there.

Those are the PERFECT WORDS.

Lee, talked to me about this new creation of his (100% beaver) when he planned to introduce it at the summit. He hadn't shown me the hat, but I knew it was going to be GREAT.
Well darn it Lee, how can I save money for textbooks when you've got such STELLAR hat out there

Good Job

[Michaelson]

Fantastic comparison shots.

In reading the comparison, don't forget we are still comparing a custom to a production hat, and therefore they will not fit the same.

I've owned one of Lee's hats, and it was a great hat....but it's shaped more for a round head than my long oval, so therefore was not the most comfortable hat for me. Any AB, on the other hand, is custom shaped to fit MY head, and so is the most comfortable of the two.

So, when doing this comparison, keep in mind there's also 'fit over finish'. I can only speak for myself, but no matter how good a hat looks, if it doesn't feel good on my head, it rarely gets out of my closet.

Ok, had to get that off my chest after reading this.

Lee makes good stuff, no matter what you're looking at. Just make sure it will work for YOU when you ponder purchase.

If you have an odd shaped head like I do, a custom (regardless of who the maker is) will always be your best route.

In this case, it appears Lee has hit one out of the ballpark when it comes to a production hat that has as many 'bells and whistles' as one can get without going custom.

Regards! Michaelson

[binkmeisterRick]

Nice! This is more along the comparison we needed to see. There are some differences in the block shape which can be seen when comparing the hats from the back (the AB is straighter while the Keppler rounds a little bit) and the ribbon Steve uses is different than the Keppler, but overall, this looks like an excellent option! Well done, Lee!

While I also agree with the "factory versus custom," as well as the "instant gratification" views, this looks like yet another good choice for fans and a hat which looks like it fits the bill quite nicely. If I had all these hat choices when I joined, it would've been far more difficult for me to choose!

[DR Ulloa]

There are defintaly differences in the block. I noticed them immediately. Not a bad thing, but different. I don't think Steve offers his old Raiders block anymore, so this is a good way of getting one. I also think that custom is the way to go, but some don't. For those, this hat exists and more than fits the bill.

Dave

[WhipDude]

So my question for all you fedora experts, why isn't this as good as handmade? Other then hand sewn parts and custom sizing and accuracy?

[Mulceber]

Well there are the things you just mentioned. Also, there's the fact that you can get the shape (ie. what head shape it will fit) customized on a custom block, whereas on a factory made you have to just accept what they give you. Also there's the fact that a factory generally won't be willing to reblock the hat they made when you need it, whereas a custom hatter will. Those are the things which come to mind, anyway. -M

[DR Ulloa]

I liken it to buying a suit off the rack as opposed to going to a tailor and having him make you a suit. The off the rack one is a nice suit and it fits well, but the tailored one is a custom fit and made especially for you. You cannot get the attention to detail with a factory hat that you can with a custom, not to mention the fit. Handmade is always better and yeilds a longer lasting product, if we are talking about the same materials, which we are in this case. It is not to say that the Keppler is bad; its a great hat and by the looks of this it will be a hit, you just really cannot compare a factory hat to a custom hat.

Dave

[binkmeisterRick]

So my question for all you fedora experts, why isn't this as good as handmade? Other then hand sewn parts and custom sizing and accuracy?

Well, you could argue that it depends on the hatmaker...

Also, it depends on the factory hat. Most factory hats aren't as well made as the Keppler and are "disposable," for all intents and purposes. They're just nothing to write home about.

When it comes down to it, the Keppler should last you a good long time, just like the AB. It's the same felt, so it should be able to handle the same amount of abuse in that regard. The differences may not be a concern to many, but to some, it could be pivotal. You could also argue that much of it is subjective.

With a production hat, you generally get your hat quicker than you would a custom. Since the factories are set up to produce a high volume of hats quickly, it's easier for hatters to have them on stock and ready to sell. These kinds of hats are sold in all the standard sizes, so if you wear a standard size, you're generally good to go.

One of the issues some factory hats have is that when the sweatband is sewn in, depending on the stitching and the quality of the felt, the process effectively perforates some hats. So when you pull them over a hat block during a reblock, you run the risk of tearing the brim clear off. (Steve has had this happen before.) With a hand-sewn sweatband, you don't run into this problem.

Back to sizing, if you have a odd hat size or head shape, many production hats may not work for you. Again, production hats are generally designed for the average wearer, so the oddball head is often out of luck. With a custom hat, you can have it sized to your exact measurements and head shape, assuring a perfect fit. It's kind of like buying an off the rack dress shirt versus a tailored one. One will fit alright, while the other will fit perfectly all around.

The finishing on a custom hat is often nicer, too. If hand pounced, the finish is usually more luxurious than if done by an automatic sanding machine. The human hand can feel the subtleties more than a machine can, meaning the custom hatter will be more particular and precise about the quality of the pounce job.

Hat blocks and styling is also an issue to some. Some hatters have custom blocks they do not share with other hatters. This is true of Adventurebilt.

Then there's the fact that some just plain prefer a custom hat. There's something about having a hat made just for you, to your exact specifications. You know it's your hat, and no one else's.

As for the Keppler 100% beaver versus the standard AB, both are nice hats and share the same felt. I wouldn't be ashamed to own a Keppler. But there's something about my custom hats which nothing else can match. It's a certain touch of yesteryear and days long go that you seldom see anymore since there are fewer custom hatters around as the years progress.

Ultimately, it comes down to what you prefer. ;-)

[Michaelson]

..... Other then hand sewn parts and custom sizing and accuracy?

What's left? ;-)

Regards! Michaelson

[Mulceber]

I think Bink answered it better than anyone could. -M

[Jakob Emiliussen]

Wow, those are very similar... But, is it just me, or those the Keppler look rounder in the brim than the AB (this is not a critique, just a pointing out of a (percieved) difference) - might just be the angel of the photo...

[Mulceber]

I dunno. In the first pic the keppler brim looks rounder, but in the second the AB does. I'd say they're pretty much the same. -M

[Jakob Emiliussen]

I dunno. In the first pic the keppler brim looks rounder, but in the second the AB does. I'd say they're pretty much the same. -M

And right you are.... Maybe I should remember to put in my eyes when I'mlooking at pictures

[Rundquist]

Like I said in my post, there is no appreciable difference between the two. I would venture to say that if you see a difference it is because of the different focal point of the hats to the camera lens. Plus I was barely able to balance both hats on the box. There is no difference in the ribbon color either. If you see one then it is because of the way color comes out in a digital picture.

I’ve owned many, many custom hats over the years. In general the things that people are saying are true. You can get the hat made to your liking. However in this case (for the most part), there is no difference in the hats. If you had a really off-shaped head or needed some real adjustment, then I would go with a custom hat. If you wanted a real change to the Indiana Jones hat, then I would go with a custom hat. Other than that, in this case they’re the same.

The real draw of a custom hat is that you can get it your way. In this case though, almost everybody wants the same hat. Fedora’s bow detail is better at this point for an Indiana Jones hat. But I don’t expect that Lee’s bow detail won’t follow suit. It’s only a matter of time before the woman that does his bow gets it right. In another thread they were talking about how bow detail is better on a custom hat and it made me laugh. There’s not a machine that sews on bows. Besides, what’s so “custom” about a Raiders bow? There’s no invisible stitch. There are not different color ribbons to balance like on other “custom” hats. Once you nail it, you nail it. There’s not much “art” involved in that one. Talking about a “custom” Indiana Jones hat is like putting a $2000 paint job on an AMC Gremlin. There's not even a bound edge on it.

I’ve had over 20 “custom” fedoras in my life. They were all very different. But in this case you’re talking about a hat that you all want to be the same (for the most part). There’s nothing really custom about it. The sweatband in the Keppler was sewn in at least as well as the Adventurebilt. Keppler can crease an Indiana Jones hat as well as anyone. Again, I didn’t see an appreciable difference between the two and I held them in my hand and examined them both.

PS- I'm just giving you guys the info. For many the most important thing is still to get the hat from the guy that made it for the film. Cheers

[Michaelson]

Talking about a “custom” Indiana Jones hat is like putting a $2000 paint job on an AMC Gremlin. There's not even a bound edge on it.

We must be talking at 'cross purposes'. There's custom, then there's 'custom'.

If you're talking about 'details' sure, I can agree....but if you're talking specific fit to an individual's head 'custom', then I don't agree. There's a HUGE difference. It might look great, but feels like crud when you're wearing it.

Your analogy to the $2000 paint job on a Gremlin was a good one regarding the 'details', but I am aware of more than one Gremlin that has been totally customized UNDER the hood and won best of show in many HUGE custom car shows here in the U.S., so it's all in how you define the word. ;-)

Regard! Michaelson

[Rundquist]

Talking about a “custom” Indiana Jones hat is like putting a $2000 paint job on an AMC Gremlin. There's not even a bound edge on it.

We must be talking at 'cross purposes'. There's custom, then there's 'custom'.

If you're talking about 'details' sure, I can agree....but if you're talking specific fit to an individual's head 'custom', then I don't agree. There's a HUGE difference. It might look great, but feels like crud when you're wearing it.

Your analogy to the $2000 paint job on a Gremlin was a good one regarding the 'details', but I am aware of more than one Gremlin that has been totally customized UNDER the hood and won best of show in many HUGE custom car shows here in the U.S., so it's all in how you define the word. ;-)

Regard! Michaelson

I hear you with regards to feel. "Feel" is the whole reason that I wouldn't wear either hat. Beaver feels like a pressure cooker on my head. In this case though, both hats feel the same. I tried them on. I was amazed.

[WhipDude]

I just thought of something and figured this would be the thread to ask.

As you have held the hat Rundquist as well as a few others...how is the plastic on the liner? I have a Fed III and the 1st year the plastic was ok. But plastic on liners over time becomes annoying as it cracks and looks terrible and holds moisture inside the plastic.

Is this plastic thick and tough? Basically I'm not up for another hat where the liner's plastic cracks or holds moisture or makes the hat even less breathable.

[binkmeisterRick]

WhipDude, you can always very carefully cut the plastic top out of the liner and make it look as if it was never there. I did this with my FedIV and it does help the hat breathe better. I wouldn't let the liner be the deciding factor on whether or not to buy a hat, though. That said, my recollection is that the plastic on the Keppler is pretty similar to the Akubra.

[darthbish]

quick question.....and it may sound silly, but we don't have Beavers "Down Under".
Rabbits obviously breed like rabbits, so there's no shortage of their fur. Are beavers bred "over there" for this purpose, or are wild ones used??

[Michaelson]

Wild, and they breed like rabbits up here.
;-)
Regards !Michaelson

[binkmeisterRick]

Beavers breed like rabbits? Does that make a "crosshare?"

[DR Ulloa]

I think thats how we get blended fur hats.

Dave

[theinterchange]

My Keppler CS hat looks more like the AB now.. the pinch is tighter with use/wear. I need to post a photo or two of it now after some months of use and slight abuse [out in several downpours and such]

Randy

[DR Ulloa]

Is your Keppler the blend or beaver, Randy?

Dave

[WhipDude]

Please do theinterchange! I would like seeing some more comparison shots. Especially on somebodys head.

[jkdbuck76]

Also there's the fact that a factory generally won't be willing to reblock the hat they made when you need it, whereas a custom hatter will. Those are the things which come to mind, anyway. -M

Hi. I'm still kinda' "fedora-dumb", but why would a hat need
to be reblocked?

Thanks!

Jkdbuck76

[Piker]

Also there's the fact that a factory generally won't be willing to reblock the hat they made when you need it, whereas a custom hatter will. Those are the things which come to mind, anyway. -M

Hi. I'm still kinda' "fedora-dumb", but why would a hat need
to be reblocked?

Thanks!

Jkdbuck76

They need to be reblocked because when this critter sneeks into your house and messes with your hat:



You get Tapir!

[Rundquist]

Also there's the fact that a factory generally won't be willing to reblock the hat they made when you need it, whereas a custom hatter will. Those are the things which come to mind, anyway. -M

Hi. I'm still kinda' "fedora-dumb", but why would a hat need
to be reblocked?

Thanks!

Jkdbuck76

Depending on things like felt density, felt materials, and manufacturing techniques, felt can shrink a bit over time with use. A beaver hat supposedly will really not need to be reblocked anyway, barring abuse. Dirt doesn’t really show on a dark brown hat either. The ability to have a hat worked on in the future (for most hats) can be a big factor in deciding which hat to get. Lighter shades need to be cleaned (a reblock goes with the cleaning). However, I would say that it’s less of an issue with a beaver Indy hat.

[Indiana G]

i always enjoy seeing those tapirs piker

i want one to play fetch with......but.........

.....not in my hats though!