Club Obi Wan

Maybe it will be possible to arrive at some kind of consensus on Todd's jackets for overall durability, once and for all.

My feeling is that a good leather jacket can only be tested by time (wear over a short period is just one indication). A good jacket will perform year in, year out, like some of my bike jackets which are 20 plus years and are still immaculate (if a little scuffed). ;-) Todd's product has only been around for a little while.

CM wrote:My feeling is that a good leather jacket can only be tested by time (wear over a short period is just one indication). A good jacket will perform year in, year out, like some of my bike jackets which are 20 plus years and are still immaculate (if a little scuffed). ;-) Todd's product has only been around for a little while.

good points. this can only be a "thus far" poll, but as a Todd's owner who knows that the jackets have been around at least long enough to gauge some degree of wear (in part due to the thinner material), i was interested to see how people would vote at this point, even while acknowledging that the jackets are certainly far from having the many years of testing that other brands have had. Todd himself seemed curious about the results of such a poll when he responded to my PM, so that was the inspiration behind this.

I am interested (of course) in the results of this poll. I do listen to feedback on my products.

A question: Define "adventuring". Do you mean a trip to Walmart, hiking, rock climbing, camping... what? I can't think of many outdoor activities where a leather jacket (let alone lambskin) is appropriate. Just for my own understanding, I'd like to know what you're planning to do in a lambskin jacket. I'm no expert, but I don't recall seeing a lot of leather gear in the sporting goods stores I've been in. Does "adventuring" have a real-life definition, or is it more of a hypothetical "If I were Indiana Jones" kind of thing?

I appreciate the poll! I can't wait to see your responses.

Todd

Puppetboy wrote:I am interested (of course) in the results of this poll. I do listen to feedback on my products.

A question: Define "adventuring". Do you mean a trip to Walmart, hiking, rock climbing, camping... what? I can't think of many outdoor activities where a leather jacket (let alone lambskin) is appropriate. Just for my own understanding, I'd like to know what you're planning to do in a lambskin jacket. I'm no expert, but I don't recall seeing a lot of leather gear in the sporting goods stores I've been in. Does "adventuring" have a real-life definition, or is it more of a hypothetical "If I were Indiana Jones" kind of thing?

I appreciate the poll! I can't wait to see your responses.

Todd

hi Todd! thanks for the input.

yes, "adventuring" is a little vague, but it's meant to basically cover whatever indy fans do when they spend a day out hiking around in their gear (i think everyone needs to admit that they've done this at least a little bit, or would like to). in general, i'm thinking this would just be some outdoors-y kind of traipsing around, etc.

personally, your jacket is perfect for me. i love it, it was a great purchase. i'm definitely a fan.

I think that Lamb holds up just fine the years to come.by that I mean normal wear in the park.high shcool reu.or a boat trip.normal day to day stuff...

I myself am a ittle afraid of Lambskin jackets..for example you have the lambskin about 6 years and just then you start to fall in love with it because it has been turned into THE Indy jacket of LOTS of caracter and weathering,and then what happens it maby cuts.snags.tears which wouldnt have happend so easilyif it was a stronger hide......6 years of hard wearing a lambskin jacket for what? nothing..well not nothing,but you get the picture...

now I have thought of this before...if you had made the custom made Todd's jacket in goatskin, then the rain, the storm, the hiking trips, the mointain climbing.etc, will be just fun and people cant whait until their next hard weather hiking trip in the bush or something with oone of the best Indy jackets out there..

if I was to go hiking in the forest with lambskin I would be scared for every branch i meet.no matter what vendor the skin came from...

just my 2 cents.

my bests,
Holt

Indiana Holt wrote:I myself am a ittle afraid of Lambskin jackets..for example you have the lambskin about 6 years and just then you start to fall in love with it because it has been turned into THE Indy jacket of LOTS of caracter and weathering,and then what happens it maby cuts.snags.tears which wouldnt have happend so easilyif it was a stronger hide......6 years of hard wearing a lambskin jacket for what? nothing..well not nothing,but you get the picture...

Imagine poor Indy's pain in Raiders when his beloved jacket gets a bullet-hole in the sleeve!

yep.but cooper patched it up nicely for him before TofD..or was it B&N's ?.......no wait minute..

Puppetboy wrote:I am interested (of course) in the results of this poll. I do listen to feedback on my products.

A question: Define "adventuring". Do you mean a trip to Walmart, hiking, rock climbing, camping... what? I can't think of many outdoor activities where a leather jacket (let alone lambskin) is appropriate. Just for my own understanding, I'd like to know what you're planning to do in a lambskin jacket. I'm no expert, but I don't recall seeing a lot of leather gear in the sporting goods stores I've been in. Does "adventuring" have a real-life definition, or is it more of a hypothetical "If I were Indiana Jones" kind of thing?

I appreciate the poll! I can't wait to see your responses.

Todd

Todd,
Any plans to make your jacket into a tall/long? I know you have the custom, but I'd rather not spend the $350 extra for one. If you could offer the long/tall for $200, I'm game.

Indiana Holt wrote:yep.but cooper patched it up nicely for him before TofD..or was it B&N's ?.......no wait minute..

you mean peter patched it up nicely for LC as the TOD jacket survived to go raid the lost ark

I wear my Todd's standard EVERY day and have encountered almost every possible climate condition, be it hard rain or blistering heat.

It's held up like a champ.

Having said that, I'd be all over a goatskin Todd's custom if made available!

Love the jacket, but had to vote "Somewhat Durable." After regular wear - but not everyday use - I have quite a few loose threads. Especially around the pockets, which I do not use. None of my Indy jackets from other makers have this issue. A few loose threads from the bottom of the lining also. The leather is breaking in nicely though.
-Ben

Have you guys seen what I've DONE to my Todd's Standard !?!?!?!!?...
viewtopic.php?t=31180&highlight=


Let me mention that since I posted that thread I have distressed it even further using the same measures as described in that thread plus a little more creativity. This jacket is definitely as conceited_ape mentioned, "It's held up like a champ."

Durability isn't an issue here. I mean seriously, this jacket was dragged in gravel, pounded onto concrete, tied to the back of my wrangler & driven through a canyon, scrapped by knifes, ran over by my car (twice on accident, should have learned the 1st time) and... managed to take a water drenching. All of this without loosing a single stitch, a single tear on the jacket, not even a loose thread. Jackets don't rip just because their thin. And of all the Todd's standards on C.O.W, I think mine has taken the worse beating. But mostly importantly, it proves the durability of this jacket.

Now... adventuring aside, I doubt many of you will ever do what I did to my Todd's, but if the question were "Can this jacket actually withstand brushing up against harsh surfaces and still be intact?"

Oh yea, It can
This jacket stands up to whatever I can throw at it

Yes Falco, but I don't think I need one of those Todd's jackets...

Indiana Strones wrote:Yes Falco, but I don't think I need one of those Todd's jackets...

Meaning?

Hehe... ask Falco...

Indiana Strones wrote:Yes Falco, but I don't think I need one of those Todd's jackets...

Beware of his peer presure technique strones, It is LETHAL

Regards, Geert

I agree, if Todd did a goatskin jacket, I really trhink they would become a best seller.

Texture on the coyle's standard
seems to work

gwyddion wrote:

Indiana Strones wrote:Yes Falco, but I don't think I need one of those Todd's jackets...

Beware of his peer presure technique strones, It is LETHAL

Regards, Geert

Hey... Hey... Hey... I haven't peer pressured you for a Todd's.....yet ;-)
But Elastic cuffs though... those are great

hahahaha.

Todd's in a washed goat hide....*dreams.... dreams*. Now THAT would be something, no? ;-)

I just received my Coyle's standard jacket today. I'm very impressed with the fit and attention to detail. I've paid more money for less quality so I'm very happy with it. My initial impression is that it's a great jacket that should hold up just fine to everyday wear for a VERY long time to come. I cannot speak for the adventuring aspect since I'm really not able to do much of that, but I think that it would do just fine.

Personally, I think that some folks give way to much credit to the strength and durability of any item made up leather and thread. It is only a *jacket* after all, made of leather and thread, and no matter what kind of leather or thread is used, and no matter how well it is constructed, in the end it is still just a jacket and will suffer damage just like any other jacket made of the same materials.

Of course I'm willing to make an exception to IndyFalco's jacket. I mean, among other abuses, dragged by a jeep through a canyon??! And still no loose stitching? That thing needs to be analyzed by the military so we can issue Indy jackets just like it to the infantry for use as body armor!

I would be all over a Todd's in goat. That would be close to my ultimate Indy jacket.

Thinking of "costume" jacket, I've been trying to determine why Todd's jacket would be labled as such initially? Maybe it has something to do with the name, "Todd's Costumes"? I think people sort of took that banner and ran with it, thinking that due to the thinner leather, made of lamb, etc., it must be a costume piece, not durable, and easily destructable. It's interesting that there are two views of it: it is called the most screen accurate Indy jacket, and at the same time, some say it is flimsiest. Maybe it is the most underrated Indy jacket out there? While it holds the title of it "most screen accurate" at present, it is the most inexpensive you can currently find on the market.

Members such as Weston, Falco and to some degree, Alf, have basically field tested the jacket and then some. Each time, it has held its own. There is only one way to find out, however....the ol' tried and true one step distressing method.....drug by a truck! Get a rope, or a whip will do in a pinch! ;-)

I agree with Texan Scott: I think the durability of Todd's jacket is gravely underestimated. Falco took distressing to an extreme level and it held up, Weston jumped off a cliff only to land on a slope with pointy rocks, roled down that into some more pointy rocks (who hasn't seen those pictures)and it held up. I personaly wouldn't try that kind of stuff in a Todd's, but that has to do with self-preservation/fear of heights, not with doubts about durability.

Members here have proven time and tim e again that Todd's jacket isn't flimsy at all and that appearances (weight, thickness) can be very decieving.

Regards, Geert

Puppetboy wrote:I'm no expert, but I don't recall seeing a lot of leather gear in the sporting goods stores I've been in.

Appearently, they did not have any baseball gloves in your stores.
(I am just kidding here, I know what you mean.)

While the "sporting goods" stores do not carry a lot of leather gear, that is not an indicator that leather is not used for tough situations. Leather becomes heavier and impractical when wet (and stiff when dried), so it would not work for sports where you are exposed to rain, for example. Heck, my goalie pads and gloves and such were all leather back in the day.



The new materials are preferred for their water-repellency and their light weight.

Plus, the outfitting stores like L.L. Bean and Cabellas certainly carry leather jackets. They were good enough for our military for many decades too.

Leather, by nature is tough stuff and the chosen material for motorcyle jackets for a reason. Rolling imparts very little abrasion to a jacket. It is the sliding, scraping and sudden stops while doing either that will make their marks.

[Captain Obvious switch off]

Maybe the durability should be addressing loose stitches, torn pocket flaps, ripped underarm seams, tree branches poking holes or making marks, etc. While not necessarily adventure-related, these things can happen and if they do, then the garment is ruined. If your jacket rips when you lift your arm to hail a cab, it is not too durable.

By the way, I am not implying that any of this has happened with a Coyle jacket. I am just trying to help define "durable."

Rick,

I know what you mean. Leather is good for some protective gear like gloves, shoes, padding, etc. My point is that leather is not a popular fabric for tough outdoor use, especially not lambskin. I'm not sure that the military leather jackets were for protective use, either, were they? Were they issued to soldiers or just to top brass and pilots? Someone can instruct me here, I'm sure.

I guess the point of my musing is what the expectations are of a lambskin jacket. (I've heard all the stories about the 50 year old lambskin bomber jacket that survived falling through a tree when your grand dad's parachute failed to open, and then deflected enemy bullets and it's still in perfect condition today). I'm just trying to be realistic about what you should reasonably expect from a garment. But let's not get sidetracked. Please, continue with the poll.

Todd,
I am absolutely in love with your jacket. i have had mine for almost a year now and i think the durability is great for a lambskin.

I think the goatskin suggestion is a great idea, both standard and custom.

IndyFalco wrote:Have you guys seen what I've DONE to my Todd's Standard !?!?!?!!?...
viewtopic.php?t=31180&highlight=


Let me mention that since I posted that thread I have distressed it even further using the same measures as described in that thread plus a little more creativity. This jacket is definitely as conceited_ape mentioned, "It's held up like a champ."

Durability isn't an issue here. I mean seriously, this jacket was dragged in gravel, pounded onto concrete, tied to the back of my wrangler & driven through a canyon, scrapped by knifes, ran over by my car (twice on accident, should have learned the 1st time) and... managed to take a water drenching. All of this without loosing a single stitch, a single tear on the jacket, not even a loose thread. Jackets don't rip just because their thin. And of all the Todd's standards on C.O.W, I think mine has taken the worse beating. But mostly importantly, it proves the durability of this jacket.

Now... adventuring aside, I doubt many of you will ever do what I did to my Todd's, but if the question were "Can this jacket actually withstand brushing up against harsh surfaces and still be intact?"

Oh yea, It can
This jacket stands up to whatever I can throw at it

falco, you're a madman... ;-) but you make a heck of a case for the strength of the jacket. more or less settles the issue as far as i'm concerned.

i've never seen anyone work so hard at distressing- kudos!

Wow, Falco my bones hurt listening to your distressing techniques. However that certainly makes anything I can throw at it seem mundane.

Everyone has their own expectations of what a leather jacket should be able to handle. I for one like a good quality and feel of a leather jacket, and though there are many more durable materials out there, Todd's lambskin is a good choice. If it were goat, again a good choice but that changes the cost. I know my jacket will not last as long as others will, and that is ok. I would look to another manufacturer for a different material and expect to pay more. Todd has provided us with a good, lesser expensive jacket, which for many of us has been just what we were looking for.

Regards,

Soup