Club Obi Wan

Especially not being much of an Indy-Fedora fanatic, I was surprised that today, when I rewatched Raiders, how much BETTER Indy's hat looked in KotCS than in Raiders!

I mean, the hat just looks so slouchy, worn-in, beaten up, and the felt looked tired and almost dead in Raiders, but in KotCS, that hat was simply... alive, I guess is the best way to describe it.

I guess AB finally did it. They out-Raider-ed Raiders!

I also think that the Crystal Skull hat is my favorite. I love the Raiders hat and the beaten up look works really well and I love it, but the CS hat is a different animal. In fact, the bash that I like most from Raiders is from scene in front of Kipu Falls where the hat looks most...undistressed...if that is a word. The hat looks greatest here because I think it is most full of life, much like the Crystal Skull hat.

Dave

I used to dislike the Raiders hat for the same reasons, but I've changed my thinking. I mean, all of the movie hats were nice (yes, even ToD), and I love that the CS hat is an AB. But the Raiders hat really matches best with the character of Indy. Indy is rumpled, slouchy, beaten, worn, dirty... but still useful. So is his hat. I'd gladly wear a CS hat, and my own Raiders is the clean "dressy" type, but as an actual movie Indy hat, I'm sold on the Raiders. Of course, we all know that AB could have done it if the job called for it.

Castor Dioscuri wrote:Especially not being much of an Indy-Fedora fanatic, I was surprised that today, when I rewatched Raiders, how much BETTER Indy's hat looked in KotCS than in Raiders!

Careful... that's borderline heresy 'round these parts.

I hate to say it, but to me the CS hat was just too... perfect. All of the time. It got dirty, it got wet, but it always sprung back into pristine shape. It's not AB's fault, of course... Mr. Pollack just didn't let the costume, for lack of a better word, weary.

The Raider's hat was far more beaten up, but that also gave it far more character.

WeeMadHamish wrote:The Raider's hat was far more beaten up, but that also gave it far more character.

I have to agree... I watched Raiders again this week and the hat really is the best of the bunch. It easily had the most character, and seemed to match who Indy was the best as well.

And I love the fact that AB made the hats for CS, but I'd also have to agree that they just looked too perfect throughout the film.. which in part is a testement to ABs quality. The hats lacked a certain character, though...but perhaps they matched Indy's more mellow character just perfectly.

LJ

The hats "too perfect" appearance is in no way the fault of Steve or Marc.
Like you stated, it's a testament to the craftsmenship, but not what most fans would want Indy's hat to look like in the film.
Thats what the filmakers wanted. If it were up to the AB boys, those hats would have been dead ringers for the Raiders hats.
Just ask them.
'Blues

I agree with the remark that the CS hat was too 'clean' most of the time. However, this is movie continuity issues... Indy in general stayed very "clean" compared to the older movies when he was thrown into the dirt, dragged behind cars, drilled against a rock wall by a tank, etc.

I loved in Raiders that the hat (and his outfit) reflected perfectly what the character was going through...you could TELL that the hat was with Indy through thick and thin.

Those of you that wear your fedora (or ANY hat) can tell when it's gone through wear and tear (sun discoloration, dirt, thrown around, etc.)

I've always felt like Indy's hat was a direct link to his youth.
In raiders, the flamboyant really out there bash on that thrashed hat seemed to reflect a sense of youth and outgoing never stop fighting sort of charisma. To me the raiders hat always screamed, I can beat you till your down, and then some....The bridge hat in Tod had this same feel to it, but I feel like after that the hat lost this look to it.....and then it just became the hat on the head of a old man. Would Indy have looked younger if he wore a raiders hat in this film? I personally think so.

It's also testimony to how well a rabbit felt hat holds up, and how well a 100% beaver felt hat holds up to extreme abuse. That's why Steve went on the search for a material that WOULD hold up to Indy's real adventurers.

It's plain, as has been pointed out above, a rabbit felt just can't handle it, where beaver can.

It had very little to do with how the costumer handled the hats between shots...it had to do with the material the hat was made from more than anything else.

Regards! Michaelson

Michaelson wrote:It's also testimony to how well a rabbit felt hat holds up, and how well a 100% beaver felt hat holds up to extreme abuse. That's why Steve went on the search for a material that WOULD hold up to Indy's real adventurers.

It's plain, as has been pointed out above, a rabbit felt just can't handle it, where beaver can.

It had very little to do with how the costumer handled the hats between shots...it had to do with the material the hat was made from more than anything else.

Regards! Michaelson

This is rabbit and its served me well for 5 years, and it served someone else well before being sold after 3 years...yes, that means 8 years. Guess the hat and you get 10 points...


also, keep in mind, its very difficult to get the distressing to appear on film. Bernie, or whoever it was, may have done some distressing that looked great to them, but because of the lighting, none of it showed up.

Keep in mind that, when they were distressing the Raiders clothes, they real nocked the heck out of that hat before hand. They sat on it, stepped on it, etc. Then, they let Harrison play with it. So, they really wanted it to look beat. I think that mentality changed as the films progressed.

I agree that the KOTCS fedora was just a bit too new looking all around. As already pointed out, it has nothing at all to do with the craftsmanship of the hat as Steve and Marc provided what was asked, but the lack of distressing on the hat which left it's personality kind of flat with me. A bunch of Fullers dumped on it does not make a distressed hat. I also doubt highly that it had anything to do with that it was a beaver hat. They can do as much distressing as they feel is necessary to get the achieved look. I guess in the end they went with what they wanted, which fell just a bit short in my opinion. Still, it was much better than TOD or LC.

Well, you have to admit his hat used in New Mexico DID look better than the rest of the film, if you're talking about the 'distressed'look.

Like the Raiders hat, it WAS hot in the New Mexican sun, and Ford was perspirating in the heat, just like he did in the desert in Raiders with his rabbit HJ. Once again, it appeared the beaver held up much better than the rabbit.

MRam, that is a fine looking rabbit fedora. Is it old felt too?

Regard! Michaelson

Mola Ram wrote:

Michaelson wrote:It's also testimony to how well a rabbit felt hat holds up, and how well a 100% beaver felt hat holds up to extreme abuse. That's why Steve went on the search for a material that WOULD hold up to Indy's real adventurers.

It's plain, as has been pointed out above, a rabbit felt just can't handle it, where beaver can.

It had very little to do with how the costumer handled the hats between shots...it had to do with the material the hat was made from more than anything else.

Regards! Michaelson

This is rabbit and its served me well for 5 years, and it served someone else well before being sold after 3 years...yes, that means 8 years. Guess the hat and you get 10 points...


also, keep in mind, its very difficult to get the distressing to appear on film. Bernie, or whoever it was, may have done some distressing that looked great to them, but because of the lighting, none of it showed up.

I have one of the screen used KOTCS hats that Harrison wore, and I can tell you that it is heavily distressed on the ribbon, and the interior. The hat has mud smears( or at least paint that is supposed to look like mud), dirt/ sweat looking marks, and some sort of white powder that is "dust" all along the ribbon. I am pretty sure my hat was used in the jungle chase scene. There are a number of ribbon marks/ disstressing patterns that line up perfectly, but then in another take from the same scene they are off a bit. So I can not be 100% certain. In the jungle chase scene the hat goes through a couple transitions, where you can see there was more than one hat used (semi clean- real dirty). Also in the various still photos from that same sequence, you can see there is some good wear to the hat. The screen used hat is very hard/ stiff in the bash, and the brim is still in almost perfect condition. I am not sure if that is how Steve made them for the film versions, or simply a reaction that beaver pelt has to water etc on the set while in use. The hat that Steve made me is also very hard in the same points of the bash, but not as "hard" as the screen used version. I think that Western Costumes who distressed the wardrobe may have had a hard time trying to "smash" the hat up, which is a testament to AB! Then again, Harrisons costume was very "clean" throughout the film, which should have showed age throughtout the adventure to stay more in tune with who Indiana Jones is. Hope this helps a bit with the above quote.

Mola Ram wrote: This is rabbit and its served me well for 5 years, and it served someone else well before being sold after 3 years...yes, that means 8 years. Guess the hat and you get 10 points...

That's a gorgeous color. Is that a Tawny-Fawn Federation DX? What colour is it? I really like it!