Club Obi Wan

So it is said the shorter the whip the easier it is for cracking, but how do guys go with cracking longer whips such as the pretty standardized Indy 10ft??

I don't know about shorter whips being easier but faster for sure.

Practice. I wanted a 10ft, so I got one. I read a little on stance/form for cracking and just went outside with the 10 footer and started practicing. I went through the motions slow and got a feel for it and then speed up and once I got the feel for it.

Practice indeed. Everyone wants a 10'. Just Iike indy. But whaty they don't undersand is a 10' whip on an 8' handle limits you. Sure you can do what what indy does, rather basic cracks, but the showey stuff takes a faster whip.
For me it was Gery Deer and Royce Vallejo who opened my eyes. Gery doesn't teach whip lengths over eight feet, and Royce doesn't recommend you order one over eight. Both these men use their whips not as something to be hung on the belt ala a ficitional charecter, but use them as part of they way they make their living. And that says something.
Sure I have my 10' but I use it for..um...it looks cool. Not very fast, rolls out nice cracks loud, but after doing my forward, side and overheads I get a little bored. Right now I have two whips on order, both on a 10" handle foundation. A 6' from our own Louie Foxx and an 8' from Royce. These'll get the majority of use as my show whips. Along with my 5.5' stock whip. Because after the "Wow, just like Indy" wears off, you want to do more. My advice is get a whip that will allow you do do so. If you want to do do the Singleton Special and the more showey cracks, yes you can do it with a 10' but I've found it's not pretty and it's rather slow. But it can be done. Good luck!

I would agree. The 10 footer looks fine on the belt. But as far as praticing and learning the 6 to 8 foot range is the way to go. Don't get me wrong... for certain cracks, I love the way a 10 or 12 footer rolls out lazily and just cracks. For quicker cracks, multiple cracks, target cracks, the smaller length is much more versatile. Having said that, shorter whips are almost too fast. I don't they are easier at all. I love cracking a 4 footer. But the action is so quick, it really isn't a good length for a novice to start on. Just my opinion...

A 4' is a wicked whip! I've beat myself silly with mine. What I got for learning with a 10'!

hollywood1340 wrote:A 4' is a wicked whip! I've beat myself silly with mine. What I got for learning with a 10'!

LOL.. that's what I started on too! When I switched from a 10 footer to an 8, my skill level went up exponentially.

thanks for your help guys. The whip I have is a 9ft. I thought 8ft for cracking and 10ft for looks so I orded one in the middle. I only ever learnt a side arm crack and wanted to have a play with some others.

starks_6 wrote:thanks for your help guys. The whip I have is a 9ft. I thought 8ft for cracking and 10ft for looks so I orded one in the middle. I only ever learnt a side arm crack and wanted to have a play with some others.

And I did that too. The 9 has the grace of the 10, but almost the speed of the 8. I had a pair made for me by the famous Paul Stenhouse. I drove him nuts.... I wanted a 10, but I realized I already had about 5, 10 footers. I had lots of 8's. Then we started thinking 9's. And I wholly like the 9's for the reason you stated.

Here's my set from Paul:


Sorry for the old pics. I am trying to get Paul out of retirement. Maybe his old work pictured here will do it:

I like only the 10'. When I was a teenager I had an 8' redhide (latigo) bullwhip which I felt was too short for what I wanted. I never used it as a climbing/swinging tool; just for cracking. I learned how to make whips and tried to make a 10'er, but the longest I ever made ended up being about 9 1/2'.

I find a 10', 8" handle whip easy to crack. I don't notice any speed problem, but I can see how shorter whips are better in some ways. I can do all the cracks with it that I want to do, including the full overarm throw/cattleman's. In Australia a short handled bullwhip was often looked on with disdain in the rural areas; the old country traditionalists would only use a stockwhip. But if you train yourself to get used to such a whip there is no problem in my opinion.

Jon

Well, I’m a firm believer that a well-rounded whip handler should be able to properly know how to use a whip regardless of the length, with in reason; so whether it’s a 3 ft bullwhip or a 25 ft bullwhip the principles are essentially similar. I’ve taught a lot of people how to use whips and for someone just starting out, I personal find that 6ft and 8 ft bullwhips are ideal. I tend to shy people away from the shorter whips (under 5 ft) or long whips 10 ft and over at least until they have mastered basics fundamentals skills of whip cracking.

Short whips are the way to go if your working in confined spaces like indoors or on stage, etc, but the downfall is that due to the short length they are extra fast and if and when you make a mistake you'll know it really quick and don’t have that time to recover from those mistake as you could with a longer whip. Also with the shorter whips you don't always have the luxury of being able to align them on the ground, which is a very helpful exercise when first learning, you don't always get the feel of the whip rolling out in that essential hair pin like motion as it being thrown either. So it can sometimes make them tricky to work with and learn on at first, though not impossible.

The trouble with starting out with a 10 ft whip is that it’s a lot of whip to deal with. So while your first learning and especially if you don’t have some one to actually teach you; you tend to try to get it to crack by forcing it to crack. You end up putting too much muscle into your throws making them very awkward and potentially dangerous to yourself. Basically your working against the whips own design, so not only are you increasing your chance of hitting yourself, but you also reducing the chance of successfully learning the subtleties of whip control. So you start picking up bad habits that need to be correct later on . With long whips too, because of their length and weight they tend to wear out the new thrower faster, which makes practicing less enjoyable and less efficient. Thats my take on it.

Dan

I use a 10 mostly but It's fun to crack my nephews 8. I can do many different cracks with my 10 footer. I think I've made up a bunch...lol

For someone wanting to learn a wide variety of cracks and tricks with a bullwhip, I'd say a 6ft or an 8ft is perfect. My very first whip was a 6ft Joe Strain, and it's still the whip I use when I want to learn anything new with a bullwhip. Anything shorter, and it's hard to easily understand what effect your movements are having on the whip and how it's cracking. Anything longer, and the whip becomes a bit unwieldy for a beginner trying to perfect different types of cracks in different planes. There is something to be said for the beauty of a 10 or 12 foot bullwhip, slowly and lazily rolling out to produce an incredibly powerful feeling crack. But if you're a beginner and you're really interested in practicing and learning a variety of cracks, I think the best first whip length would be a 6ft or an 8ft.

Yes, I agree. Best technique comes from knowing how to use all the different lengths of whips. An 8' is probably universal for most uses. I can also see that a 6', and shorter, would be very useful too.

Im gonna have to have a play this weekend. Im a little unfortunate in that I used to live on acreage but have since grown up and moved so my neighbours are pretty close lol. I have some work to do for a chap on a 55 mercury monterey this weekend and hes on a reasonable size property so I may have a play there. Ill be honest, Side arm crack is easy enough but if I can throw a few forward cracks id be stoked!

Chiming in late here, as I've had a big event at work this past Thursday that we finally got through.

But, Hollywood, Sergei, BullwhipBorton, and LemonLauren are spot on. A 6-8 foot bullwhip is really idea for beginners.

Any longer than that, and there's more length for the whip to change directions and "drift out of plane" while it's rolling out into the crack, hence, you end up with sloppy cracks or no crack at all, (plus, in order to build up that muscle memory, you'll need to practice a lot. Anything above 8 foot requires a lot more space to safely practice in. Nothing ***** worse than trying to focus on getting a new crack down when you're worried about hitting lights in the ceiling, or getting your popper/fall hung on a tree branch, shrub, stump.)

Any shorter than that, and that whip is usually too light and too fast to really feel how the whip is moving and learn effectively. Also learning on shorter whips, (4's and 5's.) I've noticed a great propensity to hit oneself.

I have a whip student who has a great little 5' 8 plait single-belly whip from Paul Nolan, and she's doing great with it. Now, before she got that, she already had a pretty good mastery of Circus, the Overhead and the Sidearm that she worked on with my sixes and eights, and I'd already drilled into her head all of the things about not muscling the whip, and "Cracking in Planes" and the "Railroad Tracks" exercises utilized by all the good whip instructors out there.

Once you've got your six basic cracks down, (the 3 loop cracks: Circus, overhead, and S-crack AKA the "Reverse" and the 3 flick cracks: The forward, the sidearm, and the underhand,) then start playing with other lengths of whip, find out what you like, and go from there. Some people like shorter whips to start hammering out fast volley and rhythm routines. Some people like to go longer to get that slow, pretty roll.

I started out on a 6 foot cowhide, (from RacerX here on COW,) moved to an 8 Joe Strain Lonestar, and then went back to a 6 foot Jacka. I now have an 8 foot Indy Whip from Nolan, and am looking into getting another 8' from Paul or Terry Jacka, (the actual answer is one from each of them, but we'll have to see how finances work. I need to pick up some 9mm ammo, have to upgrade my bass drum pedals and add a couple more cymbals for my drum set, and I'm currently eyeing a couple .38 Webley MK IV pistols that I really like. I have too many loud expensive hobbies!)

I'll also go out on a limb here, and say if you want to move outside of bullwhips with your whip artistry, a 6-8 foot bullwhip is probably still the best thing to start out on. Because of the long, separate handle on stockwhips, their action is a little more precise, and a little more effortless, so in general, moving from a bullwhip to a stockwhip is a little easier for most folks that going from a stockwhip to a bullwhip.

Same also goes for snakewhips. Because you've got a rigid handle on a bullwhip, they're a little easier to control than a snake. Once you've got the basics down on a 6-8' bullwhip, moving from one TYPE or LENGTH of whip to another is much easier.

That's not to say that you can't start out on a stock or a snake or a 10 foot whip. Just saying that your progress might be a little bit faster with a 6 or an 8.

All the best, and happy crackin!

-The Other Dan

thefish wrote: I have a whip student who has a great little 5' 8 plait single-belly whip from Paul Nolan, and she's doing great with it.
-The Other Dan

Pics?

I think I remember the whip you're talking about, Dan. 8 plait single belly 5ft, chocolate 'roo? Correct me if this isn't the one, but I think this is the picture Paul's got of it up on www.midwestwhips.com in the photo gallery... Very simple, very functional, not too expensive for a 'roo whip, and I thought it was a pretty color too. I got to test crack it a couple of times before Paul sent it out, and it had a nice action. Seems like it'd be fun to do some targeting with, and not too short to practice a good variety of other cracks too. Pretty good choice for a beginner. Glad to hear she's getting along well with it.

-Lauren

That is indeed it, Lauren. I had the photo somewhere, just couldn't find it, and was going to post that same picture.

Yeah, I had a couple days to play with it before it went to the owner. If it had stayed here much longer, I would have been sorely tempted to keep it. ;-) Unlike many of the 5 footers I've thrown, this one did flick cracks REALLY easily. Incredibly fast fluid and accurate.

She got it for her 20th birthday from her fiance' and then took it on a rather prolonged trip into the jungles of South America for a couple months, (she's a Plant Biology Major.) I supplied her with a good assortment of poppers and a good amount of leather conditioner for her trip.

EVERY time I've seen her since, she has her whip with her.

She's very petite, so the size and weight are just perfect for her. About the equivalent of a 6 foot whip for us more normal sized people ;-)

Yep, Pauls whips are very snake like they flow very fluidly like water rushing forward.

I plan on getting a special one from him sometime soon, something like a 20 to 24 plait, (if I ever finish trucking school) .

As usual,, awesome work all around in a any plait.


Kudo's to Paul.


All the best.



Jim J.