Bullwhip for Bullwhip Borton

Bernardodc · Post by **Bernardodc** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 4:50 pm

Hey all,

The bullwhip featured here was made for our own BullwhipBorton. It is an 8ft, Raiders style plaited in kangaroo hide. The basic premise was to make the closest thing to the screen used Raiders whip documented by Sergei some time ago. Dan provided me with some pics and a few more specs and details. For example, he specifically wanted the same shape of the turk's head.

Well, I like challenges, so I took my time and did my best to meet his specs. Needless to say I'm very happy of the resulting whip.

I sent him the pics below, and so far he is extremely pleased. The whip arrived this morning, and I'm looking forward to hearing his comments. I'll let him report what he thinks of it, and the overall experience.

Enjoy!

Bernardo

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b323/ ... iders2.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b323/ ... to-069.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b323/ ... to-059.jpg

jabahutt70 · Post by **jabahutt70** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 5:24 pm

The whip looks awesome, Bernardo! Everything looks spot on. I was wondering, as I know you pride yourself in building the closest looking and handling whip to DMs Indy whips, about the transition in your whips. From my own experience and others' info, Morgan doesn't bind the transition area of handle and thong, or at least not very heavily. Do your whips replicate this, or do you put a bit heavier binding in this area? I've been curious, and just figured I'd ask you. Your whips look fantastic!

Steve.

Shtick · Post by **Shtick** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 5:34 pm

That is fantastic! Is this something you will offer regularly? If so, may I inquire as to the price?

Also, it appears as though your reference whip is a 10-footer. Is that the case? Or is it just coiled more tightly?

Cracker · Post by **Cracker** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 9:02 pm

Beautiful job Bernardo !

Jim

midwestwhips · Post by **midwestwhips** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:13 pm

Hi Pschtyckque,

I had the privilege to actually hold this whip in my hands a few years ago(2004 I think) in Las Vegas before it was sold to it's current owner. It is definitely an 8 footer. It was very supple and extremely broken in, and it did coil very tightly. Another neat thing about it was that it was very thin in diameter compared especially to modern Morgan whips. It reminded me of, and was similar to, some of Joe Strains older work that I have seen. If I had $40,000 at the time, I would have snatched that whip up!

Bernardo,

GREAT JOB!!! as always. You really nailed the knots and look of the handle. I am sure BWB is extremely pleased. I look forward to hearing his thoughts on the whip. I still plan on making a version/copy of that whip whenever I can get some spare time to. What are the diameter measurements of the handle and transition?

Keep up the great work my friend!!!

Regards,

Paul Nolan
www.midwestwhips.com

Shtick · Post by **Shtick** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 8:59 am

Wow. That is a really tight coil for an 8 footer. Very cool! Time to save my pennies!

winrichwhips · Post by **winrichwhips** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:24 pm

Great looking whip!

Not to be a party pooper, but I did spy a couple differences between the del Carpio and the original:

-is it just me or does the original look to have a smaller diameter thong than the copy? 'Cause in the original it looks like there is no swell in the thong after the handle, but the copy looks to get slightly larger in diameter off the handle.

-I also think in the original the ring knot is actually centered a little past the end of the spike, because in other pics of the whip I've seen it looks like the ring knot tapers towards the thong. So, instead of a symetrical ring knot like in the copy, the ring knot would have it's buldge closer to the handle end.

-There's also an extra piece of kangaroo lace tied through the original's wrist loop. I think it was a tie used for DM's tag, and instead of being untied the tag was ripped off and the tie remained.

I've been asked to copy this whip a couple of times in the past, and Bernardo got way closer than I ever did, though the details mentioned above are a couple of the things I felt important with this whip.

-Adam 'spoil sport' Winrich

louiefoxx · Post by **louiefoxx** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:35 pm

Adam,

I think if you look close at the middle picture of the pairs of pictures on the left one you can see the lace (probably with bernardo's tag??) on it.

xoxo

Louie

winrichwhips · Post by **winrichwhips** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 2:22 pm

Ah, yes. I stand corrected! Thanks, Louie.

-Adam

Bernardodc · Post by **Bernardodc** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:48 pm

Steve, Jim,

Thanks for the kind words. For the transition area, DM doesn't add any binding, and I follow him in that regard too.

pschtyckque wrote:That is fantastic! Is this something you will offer regularly? If so, may I inquire as to the price?

Also, it appears as though your reference whip is a 10-footer. Is that the case? Or is it just coiled more tightly?

Yes, it is my regular Raiders model with a couple of different details, like the knot shape. Price is the same ($380). As Paul pointed out, the documented whip is an 8 footer.

midwestwhips wrote:
Bernardo,

GREAT JOB!!! as always. You really nailed the knots and look of the handle. I am sure BWB is extremely pleased. I look forward to hearing his thoughts on the whip. I still plan on making a version/copy of that whip whenever I can get some spare time to. What are the diameter measurements of the handle and transition?

Thanks a lot Paul. As you know, I value a lot your opinions. The diameters are: thong 24mm, handle 20mm.

Adam 'spoil sport' Winrich,

)

I know you have a sharp eye Adam, and that you have a party popper spirit as well! LOL

Actually it's good that you pointed out those differences, because they are intentional. You see, when Dan placed his order and sent the pics, the first thing I said was that I won't be able to make a thong that thin without altering the construction (core, 2 bellies, 2 bolsters, overlay). He was OK with the thong being slightly thicker than the original.

As for the ring knot, yes, you are right, on the original the knot looks like it's a bit over the end of the spike. I preferred to place it exactly at the end of the spike. I don't like the way ring knots look when they are over the thong. It's like they are falling or something.

Regarding the lace on the wrist loop, yes, to me it looks too like the owner didn't bother to untie the tag, and simply ripped it off. Dan asked for an extra lace in addition to the one I use for my tag. Since he asked me to sign the tag, I'm sure he's going to keep it intact, and at the same time he'll have the lace hanging there like the original whip.

Hope that explains the differences.

Bernardo

LemonLauren · Post by **LemonLauren** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:27 pm

Absolutely amazing! Your comparison pics side-by-side really help me see exactly how much effort you put into the littlest details - particularly in the knot. Thanks for sharing all the pics.

)

Bernardodc · Post by **Bernardodc** » Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:43 pm

Thanks Lauren

) those comments are much appreciated. Now that you mention it, it was a pain trying to match the angle of the camera in those shots, and then putting them side by side in Photoshop, but I think it was worthwhile the effort and extra time to show the similarities.

Now that I think about it, there's another intentional little difference: the orientation of the wrist loop in relation to the thong. I did it the way DM does it now. For some reason on the original whip the orientation is "off". Perhaps because it's a very old Morgan...

Looking forward to seeing more pics of your whips. Your plating looks very smooth and consistent. I can tell you are extremely talented. I think you are ready to start cutting your own sets. Try first cutting them free hand though...because if you start with a lace cutter, you'll find it much more difficult later.

Regards,

Bernardo

Satipo · Post by **Satipo** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 6:14 am

Bernardodc wrote:Now that I think about it, there's another intentional little difference: the orientation of the wrist loop in relation to the thong. I did it the way DM does it now. For some reason on the original whip the orientation is "off". Perhaps because it's a very old Morgan...

Excellent work, Bernardo!

Regarding the "orientation of the wrist loop in relation to the thong", I gathered from this forum that the loop was meant for hanging the whip, rather than putting your wrist through, which, if the whip is coiled, would make your choice of orientation more appropriate. The other orientation seems more suited to the "wrist loop" idea.

Texas Raider · Post by **Texas Raider** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 12:20 pm

Great job!

Yes, I've sent all these pics to Adam for the "spec" perfect whip a long time ago. I'll get some pics of it up...it may be going up for sale.

The location of the wrist loop was the first thing I noticed.

Awesome whip!!

TR

winrichwhips · Post by **winrichwhips** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 3:24 pm

Awww, if I'm a spoil sport it's just 'cause I'm jealous

I wish I could make an Indy whip that looked that good.

Once again, great work Bernardo! Your attention to detail with the Morgan-style bullwhip cannot be matched, not even by Morgan himself these days.

-Adam

Boggstandard · Post by **Boggstandard** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 4:41 pm

Bernardo,
What great work you are doing.
I have certainly enjoyed the whips I own, which you have made.
I seems you are reaching new heights of artistry- congratulations on your success.

whiskyman · Post by **whiskyman** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 5:26 am

Great work (as always!) Bernardo! That really does look very close.
Funny thing about the wristloop position. I'm sure I've seen a recent Morgan where the wristloop was the same as on on that old whip. I wonder if there's a reason or whether it's not something Mr. Morgan is concerned about. Personally, I prefer the wristloop positioned the way Bernardo has it. I just think it looks better.

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 4:08 am

Ok, sorry about the delay in my reply here, I know Bernardo has been waiting patiently for my thoughts on this whip.

The whip arrived last Thursday, less then a week after it was sent. It was beautifully made, Bernardo really put a lot of work and effort into it and it clearly showed. He really hit the mark to get the look of early 80s style Raiders of the Lost Ark bullwhip that I was hoping for. He matched it up to the whip that Mark Allen sold as best he could, although as pointed out already there where some minor adjustments in his whip, from the original design but that wasn’t an issue to me.

The pictures posted here didn’t do the whip justice. The work was extremely clean and precise, over all the plaiting was very tight, the seam work as straight and the sets all cut nearly identical in width. The whip had a very had smooth taper and great weight and balance, it felt very substantial. I think he did a really good job with it; it reminded my lot of the David Morgan bullwhips that I had gotten in the mid 90’s.

Bernardo has been a pleasure to deal. I’ve known him for some time now, though this was the first time I placed an order with him. He was very helpful and willing to listen to my suggestions and implement them into this whip with great success. His customer service has been very good, and he really went the extra mile to work with me and make sure I was pleased with the whip.

Unfortunately though U.S. Customs damaged the whip during their inspection of it. The plaiting just above the handle was sliced into. Needless to say I was very disappointed as this was a great whip, so both to my and Bernardo’s “frustration” (to put it mildly) with Custom’s disregard for the handling of my whip, It is going to be returned for replacement.

BTW The wrist loop placement on the Morgan bullwhips seems to vary, at least on the ones I have or seen. I don't think he really has a set placement for them, least not on older whips.

Dan

whiskyman · Post by **whiskyman** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 4:37 am

WHAT!!!! That's terrible news! I sincerely hope Bernardo is able to claim damages. Was that the regular US post or a courier?

winrichwhips · Post by **winrichwhips** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 11:24 am

OMG that totally *****!!! I've seen some stuff on the National Geographic channel about drug mules from Peru, I wonder if customs didn't think there was cocaine in the whip

What's going to happen to the damaged whip? Go back to Bernardo?

-Adam

Bernardodc · Post by **Bernardodc** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 12:07 pm

Well, as you guys can imagine, this have been really heart breaking. Yesterday was a sad day for me, and to say that I was angry would be an understatement.

I send all my whips well protected in a big and heavy card board box, along with a plastic bag and all, so that they arrive in prestine condition, and they usually do! but nothing can protect them from the reckless hands (and the cutter) of a customs inspector. I sent the whip tied with a leather lace to keep it coiled inside the bag, and apparently they cut through that lace without much regard to what was beneath (the whip thong), so that's when the damage happened.

Dan is returning the whip to me. As he said, I will replace it with a new one, and I'll do my best again to match the previous whip. I guess the damaged whip will have to stay with me.

Bernardo

Shtick · Post by **Shtick** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 12:40 pm

Oh, that's horrible! Is there any hope that it can be salvaged? How deep was the cut? Completely through strands, or just a surface cut?

So sorry to hear of its mistreatment.

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 1:01 pm

Yeah, the Whip is going back. It was sent by US Post, Since the damage seems to be accidental, I am really hoping Bernardo can claim damage so he can get compensation, Unfortunately as I understand it’s not an easy thing to do as they seems to have free reign over what they can do to an item to inspect it. Despite the frustration of the situation, Bernardo has really been really bending over backwards and going above and beyond to resolve it.

I’ve heard horror stories of whips being cut open and completely taken apart, literally destroyed by customs. It doesn’t appear that this one was intentionally cut open for inspection, it looks more like carelessness with a box cutter either when they unpacked it or cut the leather ties to uncoil the whip. The whip was also recoiled in a very odd way, just kind of all wrapped together and tangled around itself.

Dan

Cracker · Post by **Cracker** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 1:03 pm

Man, I can't imagine how disappointing and frustrating this is to both of you.
Jim

WhipDude · Post by **WhipDude** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 12:36 pm

I guess you didn't pay for insurance on it?

Texas Raider · Post by **Texas Raider** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 8:46 pm

Customs,,,I hate those guys!

TR

Texas Raider · Post by **Texas Raider** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 8:51 pm

Here's a few shots of my Winrich whip made using those same dimensions and the spec sheet- it's for sale in the bazaar-

[img]http://i14.ebayimg.com/05/i/000/ ... .JPG[/img]

[img]http://i1.ebayimg.com/03/i/000/c ... .JPG[/img]

TR

giovanniceleste · Post by **giovanniceleste** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:40 am

Bernardo
Great job and great looking whip!!!

Ciao Dan congratulations for the choice of whip and whipmaker.
I am sorry for the terrifying episode of the inspection package. :evil:
Good cracking
Gio

Canada Jones · Post by **Canada Jones** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 2:15 pm

I was enjoying this thread about your new whip until I read the disaster at customs. That is a terrible story. One summer I was in England and sent a friends daughter some chocolate for her birthday. They destroyed the whole package - opening it all etc. Of course I was never able to get my money back - just too much effort - paper work etc. In this case i think it would be worth the effort. I too wonder where the heck these custom inspectors get off.
Nice looking whip though.
best
Canada

Marc · Post by **Marc** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 4:24 pm

Freakin' awesome Bernado

You truly took this to the next level!!!

HIGH regards,

Marc

IndyFrench · Post by **IndyFrench** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 5:12 pm

Is there any way to label the box so customs will know not to ruin the whip???? This is infuriating news! I am so fed up with the ignorance that has run rampant and resulted in this kind of destructive apathy....

ST · Post by ST » Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:05 pm

That is a beautiful whip.

Is there a safe way to ship a whip to Canada?