Club Obi Wan

I've got a question for those of you who make or use nylon whips. I've made my second nylon bull whip. The first was a 6ft, and this one is 8 ft. I've seen on some of the whip makers sites that some of them wax and some don't. What is the conscience of this board? And does it make the whip perform differently if it is waxed or is it just cosmetic?

Cracker:

Cannot help on the wax advice. Slightly off topic, but, what resources/guides/manuals, etc., , did you use, when making your whips.

Sincerely,

I personally prefer the look of a waxed nylon whip. I think it looks more like leather at a distance then, (and I prefer the look of leather whips to nylon ones. Just a personal taste thing.)

In the practical sense, wax would also act as an added protective layer for keeping the elements out of the nylon: Water, mud, oil, etc. etc. etc. depending on where you were cracking it. Would also act as an extra layer against abrasion, and would give the whip a little bit more of a grip with wraps, (and if you're wrapping people for shows or stunts, it would add a little smoothness to prevent the "rope burn" effect you can get from nylon.)

Just my two cents!

-Dan

Slightly off topic, but, what resources/guides/manuals, etc., , did you use, when making your whips.

I used a combination of things to learn. Ron Edwards book and Bernies tutorial on his site were the main resources. I tried to craft it somewhat like a leather whip, which I hope to do before long. I read all the sites I could fine on nylon whips to see how they were made and then kind of went by the seat of my pants from there. The whip has a steel rod handle. The core is two paracords filled with #6 shot. One is 2ft long and the other is 4ft long. These were combined with a 7 ft paracord that still has the center intact. These were then wrapped with black duct tape to a length of 6ft. I then wrapped imatation sinue tightly around that. Then another tight wrap of sinue (wrapped very closely together) about three inches long at the handle/thong junction. Another wrap of duct tape went the length of the handle to 1 ft past the handle/thong junction. Gave it a good roll. The first belly was a 6 plait 3 ft long from the end of the handle. Gave it a good roll. The second belly was an 8 plait 5 ft long. Gave it a good roll. The overlay was suppose to be 12 plait, but I didn't have enough cord left, so I had to settle with a 10 plait that drops to 8 plait, then 7 plait, and finally to a 6 plait 3 feet from the end. The last foot doesn't have any belly, just a tight 6 plait. Gave it several good rolls. I now have mucho respect for all the whip makers out there. My other 3 whips are all 6 footers and since I have an 8 ft on order from Bernie, I wanted one to practice with. I was very pleased with how the thing cracks, it very very loud and I'm not worried about hurting it.

Dan, once you get the wax hot, how long to you keep the whip submerged in the wax?

Cracker wrote:

Dan, once you get the wax hot, how long to you keep the whip submerged in the wax?

"I don't know. I'm making this up as I go"

I'm strictly speaking from the point of view of a whip cracker. I have no practical experience making them, and even less general experience with nylon. I just know that for me personally, I prefer a waxed nylon whip to a non-waxed one.

Maybe a nylon maker her can shed a little better light on things.

-Dan

Hi Cracker,

I've been building nylon whips for a few years and have experimented with a number of different methods for every aspect of the construction. As far as waxing the whip, I myself don't do it, but have in the past.

As Dan said, it is a matter of preference. In my opinion, a whip that is correctly dipped in paraffin or beeswax can give the appearance of a leather whip. But having handled my own whips and other nylons that were waxed, I don't believe they feel like leather, not even close. It's true that it can add a protective layer on the whip. But depending on the experience of the handler, whether or not the whip is striking the ground or other objects, the wax can quickly crumble and flake off. Also, if you're not careful, you can damage the strands of the whip. The heat from the wax actually weakens the fibers in the strands a bit.

Some makers have said that it adds a bit of weight to the whip. Again, once the wax flakes off, then I suppose some of the weight is lost, too. Any thong weight should be built into the whip itself, i.e. the core, and not added to the whip once completed constructed. Another has said that it helps with aerodynamics & movement, such as the way race cars are waxed, surfboards & skis. Myself, I don't think so. The movement and energy transfer within a whip is created through the taper and build of the whip itself.

The only real benefit, IMO, is what Dan stated, the added protective layer. But the portion of the whip that would really benefit from this is the last couple of feet and the twisted fall section if it has one, and still, the stuff flakes off pretty quickly. Then it must be done again. It can be a messy process the first time you do it, and may take a little more time than it's actually worth. Some whips that have been sent to me for repairs have all had to do with the last foot or so. These are usually due to newer whipcrackers hitting the ground very much, damaging this portion of the whip. Waxing wouldn't really help prevent this all that much.

Here's a link to a site of a nylon whipmaker, giving some good points on making your own whip, including some info on waxing.

http://www.dallasdogsled.com/Whips/CowWhip.htm

Hope this helps a bit and haven't been too longwinded.

Steve
www.neawhips.com

Thanks Steve, not too long winded at all. I really appreciate your response and now I don't think I'll try the wax thing. Your site is one I've been on numerous times and marvel at your skill with plaiting para cord. If you don't wax, that's good enough for me.
I'm very satisfied with the way the two whips I've made perform and don't think wax would add anything to that either. Now if someone could just come over and hold mine hand and teach me to make a decent looking turks head, I'd be set.

Sure thing Cracker, you're welcome and thanks for the kind words! Tying any kind of turk's head was a challenge at first, so I know what you mean. It does help if someone can show you in person, but until then, keep tying them and trying to improve. I used a mandrel to practice a few th's at first, which helped quite a bit.

Steve,
www.neawhips.com

One way to practice tying a turks head is to keep a lenght of lace in your pocket and practice tying it with your right hand around your left index and middle finger.

It's amazing where you can find time in your day to wrap some lace around your finger (Long holiday store line, post office, waiting for a bus, while listening to a boring story...)

Also I think Ron Edwards book has the easiest to follow directions for tying a turks head...and the bruce grand book is pretty easy.

xoxo

Louie

Thanks Louie, that is a good idea. I've tried following Ron Edwards illustrations but keep getting lost in them, but I'm not giving up.

Jim

Ron's book has clear pictures and Bruce Grant's has good text. So in my opinion they work great together. Tying the knots over my fingers is how I memorized the steps to tying them. You only need to do one pass to get the right idea, all the other passes are exactly the same.

xoxo

Louie

Thanks Louie, just ordered Grant's book.
Jim