Buying an Indy jacket

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:11 pm

ok, I've spent the past few days reading as much as I could using the search feature, and still have a few questions about the coats. please feel free to correct me or add to what I "think" I know.

WESTED:
from what I gather, the wested may just be the best looking (under ideal circumstances), but the most problem prone, be it from shoddy stitching, order screw ups, whatever. this seems to be magnified by the fact that they're the hardest to deal with when something DOES go wrong (shipping times, communication issues, etc). this is a bit of a bummer, because I've wanted a wested for a few years now, but I have NO tolerance at all for internet exchanges, and think it's absurd to have to pay for shipping charges when it's the vendor's fault something is wrong. I really don't want to take a gamble here, even though I like the custom order option. this is kind of a moot point anyway, since I want the jacket for halloween, and there's no way it would be here by then.
PRICE: 5/5
LOOK: 5/5
SCREEN ACCURACY: 4/5
DURABILITY: 2/5
CUSTOMER SERVICE: 2/5
DELIVERY TIME: 1/5

US WINGS:
These jackets seem to be "good enough" for most people, but I have yet to see anyone going wild over them, or lavishing them with the same praise as any of the other jackets. which is weird, because they're NOT cheap, but people keep buying them. they seem to be some of the best constructed, especially for the money, which is why I don't get why they aren't more popular. is it the look? the feel of the leather? or just because they're not custom jackets. I'm aware of the sizing issue, and that's making me hesitant because again: I don't want to have to exchange it. also, they just look like they're bulkier than I want. but next to the others, how refined looking are they?
PRICE: 4/5
LOOK: ??
SCREEN ACCURACY: 3/5
DURABILITY: 4/5
CUSTOMER SERVICE: 4/5
DELIVERY TIME: 5/5

TODD'S COSTUMES:
I can't honestly say that this is really a choice for me... at least from what I can make out. First of all, it's cowhide, and I'm not really looking for a heavy coat, second of all, almost all the price seems to be in the fact that it's screen accurate. I'm noticing that they're nicely made, but are they THAT much better than the GB? or even the USW? that's a lot to pay for screen accuracy. I understand that they're made to order, but since I want it for halloween again, I'm not going to chance that.
PRICE: 1/5 (if it's just for accuracy)
LOOK: ??
SCREEN ACCURACY: 5/5
QUALITY: ??
CUSTOMER SERVICE: 4/5
DELIVERY TIME: 1/5

GIBSON-BARNES
This one is has really caught my attention. plenty of people swear by it, and there seem to be lots of reasons for it. Lee Keppler told me it's practically bulletproof in goatskin, and they seem to look amazingly sharp. I'm not sure about the screen accuracy, but that's the least of my concerns. seems to be all around good things.. but how does the overall "look" compare with wested?
PRICE: 5/5
LOOK: 4/5
SCREEN ACCURACY: 3.5/5
QUALITY: 5/5
CUSTOMER SERVICE: 4/5
DELIVERY TIME: ??

I know there's also the flightsuits jacket, but I'm considering that one the least... haven't heard anything about it that makes me think it's offering something someone else isn't, especially with a relatively high price tag.

mainly, I wanted a wested because of the reviews I read of how soft and smooth it is, coupled with how "tough" it is (not after what I've read). the other thing that appealed to me was a lightweight jacket that you didn't really notice on your shoulders. I do NOT want a heavy coat. how does the GB stack up to wested in this category? how about USW?

assuming I do go with the GB, what differences can I expect between the goat and lambskin? how drastic is the smoothness of each hide, and how much tougher is the goatskin really? how much heavier? lastly, I'm 6'2", 200 pounds. my chest measures 44" and my arms 34/35 bent. I want the jacket to be slightly form fitting, but I want room to wear a sweater underneath, and my chest will probably go up to a 45" in the winter. based off of this, is there anyone with measurements close to mine that can say what size GB would fit? or what vendor would offer the best off the rack fit?

sorry this was so long.. I really did do my research, just want to be positive I make the right choice. any help is greatly appreciated... I know I asked a lot, but thanks in advance. and I don't expect any one person to have all the answers, but anything any jacket owners can tell me would be awesome.

jeff · Post by **jeff** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:23 pm

It may or may not matter in your case, but Wested of course has that magic "they made the original" thing, which is really priceless to some, irrelevent to others.

I have a HH Wested, the leather is very durable, no problems with stitching, but big problems with teh satin lining in the pockets - started to shred within a couple months of light wear.

I'm happy with it because of its provenance and I'd never get rid of it. But if I were to get another, I'd but the toughest thing I could get my hands on.

Dunno if this helps.

jeff

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:27 pm

jeff wrote:It may or may not matter in your case, but Wested of course has that magic "they made the original" thing, which is really priceless to some, irrelevent to others.
jeff

At one point this did matter... but to paraphrase what a particular vendor told me (without naming names), chevy makes the original corvette, but that doesn't mean it holds a candle to a lingenfelter version. it's hard not to agree with that.

zeus36 · Post by **zeus36** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:58 pm

Don't forget Indy Magnoli is supplying the jackets as well:

https://host385.ipowerweb.com/~indyprop ... 558313[url][/url]

agent5 · Post by **agent5** » Mon Sep 17, 2007 12:22 am

The Flightsuits jacket IS the Gibson/Barnes jacket.

I also think you have the durability of the Wested a bit low. Sure, some have had problems but from what I've ever read it's a small handfull of people compared to how many own them.

I also see you have the pricing of the G&B listed as a 5/5 when they're the most expensive jacket around.

I'm not trying to sway you one way or the other because for the money you'd be happy with the G&B for sure and you'd certainly be happy with the Wested if they got your order right. I just got a Todd's in lamb and I love it. I've seen some USWings and they're also pretty nice as well as all of the Magnoli stuff. You certainly have some choices to make and VERY little time to do it in, unless you're talking about Halloween 2008.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Mon Sep 17, 2007 3:59 am

I think your choices will be limited to now if you are looking for a jacket for halloween.

Wested get a lot of flak for 'mistakes' many of these are because they offer the most customability, without all the choices their headaches would be much less! They also really NEED to catch stuff before they go out the door.

I really think they should sit back review the pocket height and pleat depth. Oh, and lock up the D-rings!

Everything gets shipped around but the cost gets magnified if you are sending across the Atlantic. I believe Wested goes half way and pays for the return shipping on errors.

I've had 2 US wings jackets, one has a faulty popper the other had a large 1ft x 1ft 'bubble' in the leather on the back of the jacket they also too 2 months to deliver to an address in the States, and they were stock jackets. Both have the wings trademarked 'razor' zippers.

I've not dealt with G&B or Todd.

djd · Post by **djd** » Mon Sep 17, 2007 7:03 am

Well, I just sold my Wested (to someone in Japan) as I really like my Todd jacket so much better. It looks more SA in every respect IMO. As far as SA goes, I've not seen anything close to what Todd has done.

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Mon Sep 17, 2007 7:32 am

well, I appreciate everyone's feedback, and I think I'm still headed towards the GB.. but how long does it take to arrive? what size would I be best off with (I had assumed a 46, but someone told me that this would be too roomy for me), and what are the leather differences?

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 9:13 pm

just want to give this a bump.. I answered my last questions by contacting flightsuits directly, but now am thinking about a USW because of the five week wait time on the GB. however, only the goatskin USW comes in tall sizes, which ***** because I love the look of the lamb and cowhide with the larger, more distinguished pockets. is the picture of the goat on USW's website accurate? and why is the cowhide more expensive than the more exotic leathers?

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Tue Sep 18, 2007 9:51 pm

isnt that the same as the GB jacket?

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 12:03 am

Nope - US Authentic is in New York. He has used "creative" naming to approximate US Wings name, and also uses the name "Flight Jackets" to approximate Flight Suits name... I have struggled with doing business with him because he does this, but his jackets really are very nice...

very, very nice. well made and premium leather....but it comes with the premium price tag. though not SA in regards to the construction and pattern....a very well made, quality jacket. shaul's customer service was excellent when i dealt with him and i highly recommend his outfit...not for an SA indyjacket, but for a premium wwii styled jacket.

ANZAC_1915 · Post by **ANZAC_1915** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 12:24 am

Wested shipping time for me was about 3 wks.

There were fit issues (puffy pleats, baggy shoulders) that Peter resolved promptly and even let me pick it up after hours (I understand not everyone happens to be in the UK every so often and I would not have been crazy about shipping it back and forth).

Peter was very responsive and helpful with the issues.

Quality seems very good. Communication was fine.

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:14 am

well, I'm still torn between the uswings goat and vintage cowhide. same questions as before.. are the pockets really that much different on the goat? is the cowhide worth the price? I really think that the usw lamb is a beautiful jacket, but no tall sizes *****.

I am interested in magnoli's jacket though.. anyone have one? what's the quality like?

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 8:32 am

My personal favorite is the VIP cowhide, but that's just me and my preferences. That's what I own myself. It's my cold weather winter jacket, as it is fairly heavy weight.

Regards! Michaelson

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 8:37 am

I think the durability you've scored on the Wested is wrong. It really depends on the hide. I get the feeling you've read a few threads where people have spoken of a mishap with a lambskin jacket, or something. Goodluck finding similar stories from people owning cow, goat or horse versions of the Wested.

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 1:27 pm

...or the veg tanned lambskin. this stuff exceeds their normal lambskin stock in strength by a country mile.

Falcon · Post by **Falcon** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 2:10 pm

Michaelson wrote:My personal favorite is the VIP cowhide, but that's just me and my preferences. That's what I own myself. It's my cold weather winter jacket, as it is fairly heavy weight.

I own one of those as well, and really like it a lot.

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 2:12 pm

HIGH regards!

Michaelson

Minnesota Jones · Post by **Minnesota Jones** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 2:47 pm

The US Wings Distressed Cow is on left, Flightsuit Seal Chrome Goat in the middle, US Wings Goat on the right.

The US Wings Goat is clearly the darkest color of all three. All three are very solid jackets. The Flightsuit was a custom job, the two US Wings were off the rack. The only thing is I had to do to the US Wings was bring up the sleeve one inch, the rest of it was perfect for me.

I'm also not sure why people don't go for the US Wings either. Yeah, they are more expensive than Wested, but so it the Expo from FS/Gibson and Barnes. I've sold off my US Wings Cow about a half year ago or so - but I love the Goat from US Wings. It's solid, and with the all cotton lining, a great Indy jacket in wintertime.

Don't forget, Wested made the jackets for Raider and LC. But Flightsuits was copied from an actual Raiders Stuntman jacket. AND US Wings makes the ol' Cooper, which supplied the jackets for Temple of Doom (althought the jackets have been tweaked a bit since then).

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 2:51 pm

_ wrote:And I see there is a 44 on the clearance section of the Flight Suits site in lamb...

This has been on their site for at least 4 months that I'm personally aware of, so I wonder if it really IS still in stock.

Regards! Michaelson

Minnesota Jones · Post by **Minnesota Jones** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:00 pm

_ wrote:MJ - This post sent chills up my spine. You really ARE a jacket-junkie!

Thanks man, you're making me blush! Flattery will get you everywhere!

coronado3 · Post by **coronado3** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:00 pm

The Vintage Cowhide from us wings kicks butt!!!! I have their goat as well and it is also a great jacket. I would recommend either...

The pockets on both are exactly the same size, too.

C3

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:04 pm

The 'Signature Series' has always seemed to have the best QC of their line.... at least all the ones I've owned and reviewed to date.

Regards! Michaelson

St. Dumas · Post by **St. Dumas** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:07 pm

Minnesota Jones wrote:I'm also not sure why people don't go for the US Wings either.

It's reason enough for me that the back panel on the US Wings jackets are short by about an inch on both sides. At least they are on every photo I've seen.

SD

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:22 pm

_ wrote:
And I see there is a 44 on the clearance section of the Flight Suits site in lamb...

This has been on their site for at least 4 months that I'm personally aware of, so I wonder if it really IS still in stock.

Regards! Michaelson

she's definitely older than that. that has been up there since i've checked their clearance items.....gotta be over 6 months.....perhaps 8.

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:49 pm

i was hoping she'd stay the same size but the sleeves shrank and the torso grew

Minnesota Jones · Post by **Minnesota Jones** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:50 pm

Indiana G wrote: i was hoping she'd stay the same size but the sleeves shrank and the torso grew

Happens to the best of us....

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 5:43 pm

try to reply to as much as I can here..

yeah, I'm sure most of what I listed as "info" was off to a good degree, but it's just what I gathered from reading the forums. if I'm ever going to own a wested at this point, it's probably going to be when I don't NEED the jacket like I do now. they're definitely hit and miss, and I understand that USW is also.. but at least USW is stateside, which is a huge difference.

I called GB about that clearance jacket, and had to leave a message, so we'll see what they tell me. if they do have it.. I'm praying that the sleeves are 35" on it, because then it would be perfect. so if that works out thanks a TON _..

if it doesn't, I don't know. GB said if I place an order by friday they guarantee I'll get the jacket by oct 22. which is something to consider, but it comes to $100 more than the USW, and if there is any sort of problem, I'm screwed. I know the money isnt a huge difference, but so far I've upsold myself on EVERY piece of gear and it's adding up quickly. I'm going to call USW about the lamb now and see how it goes.

can anyone tell me how far across the chest needs to be to fit me right? again, I'm a 44... I have a wilsons leather jacket thats 23" pit to pit and I think it's too big. it's also an XL, so I'm thinking maybe I'm measuring it wrong. aaaaaaaghhh!!!!

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 5:55 pm

ok.. spoke to someone at GB.. the guy couldn't find the jacket and he admits they haven't updated their clearance page in a while. and USW is only taking after-hours order calls now, so I have to wait until tomorrow to get lambskin measurements. I'm so frustrated at this point. either someone has quality control issues, or someone has sizing issues, or someone takes 12 years to make a jacket, or someone is way too much money... blah. maybe I'll bight the bullet for the lambskin GB.. I dunno.

ANZAC_1915 · Post by **ANZAC_1915** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 5:56 pm

ztmario wrote:try to reply to as much as I can here..

yeah, I'm sure most of what I listed as "info" was off to a good degree, but it's just what I gathered from reading the forums. if I'm ever going to own a wested at this point, it's probably going to be when I don't NEED the jacket like I do now. they're definitely hit and miss, and I understand that USW is also.. but at least USW is stateside, which is a huge difference.

I called GB about that clearance jacket, and had to leave a message, so we'll see what they tell me. if they do have it.. I'm praying that the sleeves are 35" on it, because then it would be perfect. so if that works out thanks a TON _..

if it doesn't, I don't know. GB said if I place an order by friday they guarantee I'll get the jacket by oct 22. which is something to consider, but it comes to $100 more than the USW, and if there is any sort of problem, I'm screwed. I know the money isnt a huge difference, but so far I've upsold myself on EVERY piece of gear and it's adding up quickly. I'm going to call USW about the lamb now and see how it goes.

can anyone tell me how far across the chest needs to be to fit me right? again, I'm a 44... I have a wilsons leather jacket thats 23" pit to pit and I think it's too big. it's also an XL, so I'm thinking maybe I'm measuring it wrong. aaaaaaaghhh!!!!

Here is another thought (bear with me): if you get the Wested, unless there is a major mix up, you can wear it for your Halloween event, and then send it back AFTER that if there are some small details that need fixing.

But again, I would not rely on email, I would call them on the phone.

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:00 pm

well, I e-mailed them twice with no response, to I would have to call them... and it's a possibility. I really want a wested, I just want one with no problems. after I get the measurements off of the lambskin USW tomorrow, I'll have to make a decision and place an order by friday, which is my GB deadline if I choose to go with them.

St. Dumas · Post by **St. Dumas** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:01 pm

ztmario wrote:if I'm ever going to own a wested at this point, it's probably going to be when I don't NEED the jacket like I do now. they're definitely hit and miss...

Since you're looking for testimonies, I can tell you that I've ordered four Westeds in the past (two for myself), and they were all very good quality, and each time, Peter's customer service was very good. I disagree with your conclusion that Westeds are hit and miss. I know that some of the COW members have had more experience with Wested than I have had, and you should obviously factor their testimonies into your decision, but in my case, Peter's 4 for 4 and I wouldn't hesitate recommending that you buy a Wested. I've never owned a GB, so I can't compare the two, but for me the US Wings' back panel takes it out of the running.

SD

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:06 pm

St. Dumas wrote:
ztmario wrote:if I'm ever going to own a wested at this point, it's probably going to be when I don't NEED the jacket like I do now. they're definitely hit and miss...
Since you're looking for testimonies, I can tell you that I've ordered four Westeds in the past (two for myself), and they were all very good quality, and each time, Peter's customer service was very good. I disagree with your conclusion that Westeds are hit and miss. I know that some of the COW members have had more experience with Wested than I have had, and you should obviously factor their testimonies into your decision, but in my case, Peter's 4 for 4 and I wouldn't hesitate recommending that you buy a Wested. I've never owned a GB, so I can't compare the two, but for me the US Wings' back panel takes it out of the running.

SD

ok, I'll call wested and see if his off-the-rack sizes will fit me. lol but how do I call england? my cell phone spits that number back out at me.

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:08 pm

call the operator to connect you to england. you will have to give them your credit card no.

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:11 pm

St. D, have you ever owned a Wings jacket?
Just curious, as you always state you base your opinion on photos rather than first hand experience.

I've never owned one with the 1 inch short back panel that you state you see in the pictures, and I've owned and reviewed several over the years.

Regards! Michaelson

St. Dumas · Post by **St. Dumas** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:13 pm

Wested should be 1-0044-1322-660654. Or maybe drop the "00" before the "44".

SD

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:15 pm

Don't forget the time difference between where you're calling from and Wested, located in England.

In Central time, it's already after 11 P.M. there at the time of the writing.

Regards! Michaelson

ANZAC_1915 · Post by **ANZAC_1915** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:16 pm

St. Dumas wrote:Wested should be 1-0044-1322-660654. Or maybe drop the "00" before the "44".

SD

On your cell phone just go +44 1322 660654

St. Dumas · Post by **St. Dumas** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:17 pm

That's good to hear, Michaelson. It's kind of a chicken-and-egg thing: I never considered buying a US Wings because every single photo I've ever seen (on their website or on COW) have the huge gaps on their back panel. Many of the COW members reported good things about the quality. (Now, if only they brought back the Cooper TOD specs...)

SD

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:54 pm

WELL put, my friend!

It's been interesting to read how some folks have problems, and others always receive sterling examples from vendors, and there's no rhyme or reason to it either.

HIGH regard! Michaelson

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:26 pm

ok, I managed to talk to some more people at GB, and VERY good news. they have a clearance goatskin that *should* fit me the way I want, and at a good price. but I got two different stories as to why it's clearance.. one being that it was a return from when they did custom jobs, and one that it has a defect. I'm going to call them back tomorrow and sort it out.. but if everything looks good, I'll place the order. keep your fingers crossed on that. now I just need a shirt, belts, holster, and hat. and probably new whip lol.

ztmario · Post by **ztmario** » Thu Sep 20, 2007 12:35 pm

_ wrote: Call G&B back and ask for Dave Marshall. Tell him Todd _ said to give him a call and that I would consider it a personal favor if he could grease the skids and find out what they might have in stock for you... Let me know how it goes...

well, I didn't have to resort to name dropping just yet, but I did place an order for a goatskin expo that they had in stock. it's a 42R, and I'm praying that it fits the way I want. from everything anyone's been able to tell me, going a size smaller will give me the more fitted 'raiders' look. I think I drove those people nuts looking for jackets and measuring things, I even had the salesman wearing it while he was on the phone with me. I will say though, that they're some of the most helpful people I've ever dealt with.

the jacket should be here within a week, and if the fit doesn't work out, I will definitely try to get them to grease the skids. and thanks for all the help.. that goes to everyone but especially _.

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