Firearm Simulators

parsa · Post by **parsa** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 4:29 am

I live in California where you can't even carry a toy gun that looks like a real gun. Even an orange cap is not enough here, it has to be some bright color or transparent. (However, if you step over the line into Arizona, there are no laws about non-functional guns, and you can carry a real gun in your belt.)

I can, it seems, have a "firearm simulator." That is a replica that is a bright color such as blue or red:

"For these purposes, 'imitation firearm' does not include:
Historically significant nonfiring collector’s replicas offered with a wall plaque or presentation case; BB devices; or devices where the entire exterior surface of the device is white, bright red, bright orange, bright yellow, bright green, bright blue, bright pink, or bright purple, either singly or as the predominant color in combination with other colors in any pattern, as provided by federal regulations governing imitation firearms, or transparent or translucent as provided by federal regulations governing imitation firearms."

Does anyone here own a gun such as a Bluegun or an ASP Red Gun? Most run for around 35-40 US dollars.

Anyone know of other options?

S&W 4" K Frame Red Gun:

S&W 4" K Frame Bluegun:

More detail: http://www.botach.com/images/BlueGuns/bluegunFSK.jpg

Browning High Power Red Gun:

Browning High Power Bluegun:

More detail: http://www.botach.com/images/BlueGuns/bluegunFSBHP.jpg

Parsa

Andiana · Post by **Andiana** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 4:43 am

I live in California where you can't even carry a toy gun that looks like a real gun. Even an orange cap is not enough here, it has to be some bright color or transparent.

Um, well, I live in Southern California, and I even took the caps off while shooting a film, and i didn't get in trouble. Hec - a police officer was like "Hey, I hope your film comes out nicely, look like a REAL action film!" As long as you don't take a toy gun into a store, mall, bank, and point it at people, then you really have nothing to worry about. I mean, I wouldn't walk around your street carrying a toy gun either...

Indiana Williams · Post by **Indiana Williams** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:03 am

i live in so cal too and i know we have strict gun laws but i find it hard to believe that you have to have one of 'those' rubber fake guns.

parsa · Post by **parsa** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:10 am

Read this

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/imit.htm

Especially, the parts about infractions, misdemeanors, and $10000 fines!

Here's a PDF of the full set of 2005 laws:
http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/forms/pdf/cfl.pdf

Parsa

Merrick · Post by **Merrick** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:22 am

I have nothing to add except; welcome back to Parsa after a long absence.

skywlkr · Post by **skywlkr** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:19 pm

Get an airsoft bb gun that looks identical to the real thing plus orange tipped barrel and you're good to go in California.

Luke

crazylegsmurphy · Post by **crazylegsmurphy** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:28 pm

Makes you wonder why no one paints real guns bright red....(pssst...they probably shouldn't let anyone have a real gun...but that's just my crazy Canadian brain working again!

)

Couldn't you get any replica and paint it?

Zach R. · Post by **Zach R.** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:29 pm

I think the point is that you can't have it shipped into California.

crazylegsmurphy · Post by **crazylegsmurphy** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:32 pm

Can't you just go get it? I mean, who is going to stop you from driving to the state over, grabbing it, and driving it back?

crazylegsmurphy · Post by **crazylegsmurphy** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 12:39 pm

This actually gets me thinking. I wonder what the laws are regarding moulds?

Like what if you were to sell the moulds of guns instead of the guns? What if you even included a little bottle of resin to complete the package....do you think they would allow that?

Zach R. · Post by **Zach R.** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:17 pm

I'm pretty sure you could do that.

I think the whole thing with importing things like that into Cali is that they come through the mail as already finished guns that look like the real thing.

parsa · Post by **parsa** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 4:00 pm

I could probably find a BB gun and have it, but you couldn't put it in a holster without someone thinking you were toting a real gun. You'd be OK in the desert or something I guess.

I read on one web site critical of the new laws exactly the argument about painting real guns. Police could still never be sure, because someone could paint a real gun pink or something. Chances are that nobody would freak out if they saw a pink gun in your holster, but if you pointed it (or a cap gun, or a GPS receiver, or a rubber chicken) at a police officer here, they're going to shoot you.

Incidently, I also saw a review of the Blueguns and Red Guns on a web site selling training equipment, and they said the red guns tended to scratch you when you grabbed them. The edges are sharper.

Parsa

Post by **Jens** » Tue Jul 05, 2005 4:12 pm

parsa wrote:... but if you pointed it (or a cap gun, or a GPS receiver, or a rubber chicken) at a police officer here, they're going to shoot you.

Parsa, I guess that a lot of policemen all other the world would do that in such a situation.
I know that I would be afraid if someone would point a gun (or soething that looks like a gun) at me (thank God, that never happened). So, I have to say, I'm not that unhappy with the law concerning guns we have other here ...

Just my 2 ct.

Texas Raider · Post by **Texas Raider** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 5:15 am

Post by **Jens** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:13 am

Sorry, didn't want to offend anyone.
Just my opinion.

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:46 am

skywlkrinc wrote:Get an airsoft bb gun that looks identical to the real thing plus orange tipped barrel and you're good to go in California.

Luke

I have one (airsoft bb) similar to the 1911 if anyone is interested i put it in the classifieds with pics
It is called delta something

but i'm not an expert

JAN · Post by **JAN** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:48 am

This road have been opened before, and it leads to no good.

We europeans just can´t get into our thick heads why firearms has to be
"everymans possesion" in major part of the US. That You actually
see armed civilians in You local grosserystore - and You are not in Afganistan!

But as much as we are alike across the Atlantic, this is one thing where
evolution took two different directions...

I rest my case...

Best regards

JAN

Erri · Post by **Erri** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:58 am

Well seems to be a long debate and i dont want to annoy any american guy of this forum with my european ideas so i just offer my harmless silly airsoft bb gun to anyone interested

Post by **Jens** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 7:11 am

I think JAN was commenting on my thoughts above, and I think you're right, friend. I didn't want to start this discussion again.

You (in the US) have your laws and rights depending guns, we have ours. We don't have to like it, but we have to live with it.

Peace and regards

-- Jens

JAN · Post by **JAN** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 8:51 am

Peace, brother

Best regards

JAN

parsa · Post by **parsa** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 9:01 pm

JAN wrote:We europeans just can´t get into our thick heads why firearms has to be "everymans possesion" in major part of the US.

Now if you Europeans would stop killing everybody around with second-hand cigarette smoke...

Parsa in California

J_Weaver · Post by **J_Weaver** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 10:40 pm

JAN wrote:We europeans just can´t get into our thick heads why firearms has to be
"everymans possesion" in major part of the US. That You actually
see armed civilians in You local grosserystore - and You are not in Afganistan!

Ah, these thick headed Europeans!

I just want to clarify one thing, I've never seen an armed civilian, unless they were hunting or at a shooting range.

Without getting into a debate, I would like to give my personal reasons for owning firearms.

1. I don't know about the wild life in Europe, but I don't think you have the amount of (if any?) dangerous game that we do in the US. Obviously, this doesn't apply to everyone in the US, but I my neck of the woods I carry a firearm while hiking for safety. In my area, we have several potentially dangerous and deadly species: Bears, coyotes, and wild dogs to name a few. I feel much more at ease knowing I can defend myself.

2. Marijuana. A lot of it is grown in the remote mountains of WV. Again, I feel much more at ease knowing I can defend myself. I know this as a fact from both sides of the law I'm ashamed to say.

3. Simple enjoyment. I've grown up around firearms. I enjoy spending a day at the range just as much as many people enjoy a baseball game. I do a little hunting. I also collect historical firearms. (Thus the reason I didn't whack the barrel off of my S&W HE) Its a hobby, just like Indy Gear or any other hobby.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 3:12 am

J-weaver my friend don't even go there. I thought you were smart guy. Don't you know there are three things you shouldn't ever get in the middle of.

wan't to take a stab at the three ?

I agree with you.

but for other reasons.

skywlkr · Post by **skywlkr** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 11:32 am

J_Weaver wrote: 1. ...Bears, coyotes, and wild dogs to name a few. I feel much more at ease knowing I can defend myself.

You forgot cats.....big wild cats. Mountain lions are rampant in the mountains in northern California.

J_Weaver wrote: 2. Marijuana. A lot of it is grown in the remote mountains of WV. Again, I feel much more at ease knowing I can defend myself.

Same in California. In fact a couple years ago when I was hunting deer I found myself walking into one such "garden". I instantly went back the way I had come, all the while keeping my gun at the ready. (We get illegal Mexicans who come here to grow and guard their Marijuana with fully auotmatic weapons here in nor. Cal.) I made it safely back to my jeep, noted where I was on my map, drove around til I could get a signal on my cell phone, and called the police. The "garden" was seized the next day in a huge police raid.

J_Weaver wrote: 3. Simple enjoyment. I've grown up around firearms. I enjoy spending a day at the range just as much as many people enjoy a baseball game. I do a little hunting. I also collect historical firearms. (Thus the reason I didn't whack the barrel off of my S&W HE) Its a hobby, just like Indy Gear or any other hobby.

I love hunting, I grew up with it. My family came from the Ozarks in Arkansas, where if they didn't hunt, they didn't eat. My grandparents were the first to move out west to California in the early 1950's. Hunting is a well honored tradition in my family. Wild game meat always tastes better to me than store bought, it always has and always will.

Luke

(Edited for spelling)

J_Weaver · Post by **J_Weaver** » Fri Jul 08, 2005 12:06 pm

Yup, you guys have the big cats out west. We really don't have any around here.

Oh, you were lucky to get out of there!

skywlkr · Post by **skywlkr** » Mon Jul 11, 2005 11:48 am

Yes we have the big cats. They were added to the protected list a decade or so ago and have gone rampant since then. They can kill and eat one deer a week, and as such the deer population in California is shrinking considerably.

Luke

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