Club Obi Wan

Would be nice to see him here at the COW!

So, what you're saying is that the best way to welcome him back to the gearhead madness is by clogging his mailbox?

Yup.

That way, I'll get my gunbelt first. MWAHAHAHAHAH!

Seriously, I'll try to find out more details next week when I call him back.

Now that are good news! I'm really exited about these news! Hope to get a shirt!!!

I must say that as much as I love Peter's Shirt and Trousers I got to see a pair of Noel's trousers close up when I was working with Indy Ken on his movie. I like Peter's material better but the Pockets on Noels were so... Indy. I asked peter about the flaps which look standard modern cut and he said there are no plans to change the design so I for one would be interested in getting a pair of Noel's.

I've spoken to Noel again and he has confirmed that the prices on the Indy items will be slighly higher than they were before - as is the way of things. He also confirmed production of gunbelts, bags and bag straps etc. AND his attandance at the UK summit in October.

Noel's PC will be back by the weekend. I've forwarned him to expect a deluge of emails, but he was just fine about it.

So I expect that those of you who have emailed Noel will be hearing back in due course.

Like the Guiness adverts say, 'Good things come to those who wait'.

Al

When it comes to the Noel MKVIIs - are these bags he has made up, similar, I guess, to the WPG bags?

I think I read somewhere that Noel's bags were original MKVII Canadian issue bags......but I may be very wrong so don't quote me on it!

I'd be surprised, as the Canadian bags were more of a mustard color. At least the one I used to own was. Regards. Michaelson

Yeah Noel sources original bags, he doesn't make them - don't know if they are Canadian or British though - maybe both depending upon what he has in stock?

I ordered a Mark VII from Noel just before he left, and when it arrived, it seemed identical to the British bag I have (except for the dreaded 'black line'!) I have sold it to a fellow member since then, and can no longer refer to it for reference, however.

One can assume that he sells whatever he has in stock, and available to him. Mustard Canadian, British with black line, or perfect british green with no inner devider...supply and demand, baby..supply and demand.

Has anyone gotten a response from Noel yet?

Remember guys, his PC was broken when i talked to him and it had gone in for repair. He hoped to have it back soon, but who knows?

And when he does get it back, if he hasn't already he'll probably have like 500 emails to get through (he's also been off for several months abroad shooting a movie) so he'll have a lot to catch up with. I'm sure he'll get round to andwering individual queries eventually.

If no joy in another week or so, I'll call him again to find out the situation.

Al

He has a pretty good email track record. His responses were always pretty timely even during day here in the states. And, his shipments always arrived within 1-2 weeks.

Just my experience,
Pyro

schwammy wrote:Ha! I knew it! I predicted it

http://www.indygear.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4357 ...

The Great Schwammy knows all ... tells all.
OK Schwammy, just two things I want to know. When is Indy IV coming out and what are this weeks winning lottery numbers?

Thanks Al. Yes, please keep us updated. I realize he had computer problems and I'm not trying to hurry him up, I just wondered if anyone had gotten a message from him yet?
Never had a problem with him before so I'm not worried.

Alas, I have no insights into Indy IV or lotteries. Does anybody have an update on Noel's status?

Has anyone heard from Noel? I email him every few months just to check in. Occasionally it shows as having been read. At ther times, it is never read. In any case, I haven't received any reply since he closed MBA. Has anyone had better luck? I would love to purchase a couple of Raiders pants from him but, if he has permanently ceased production, why doesn't he pass on his patterns and fabric sources to someone who is interested in doing it? (such as Wested or others in the UK.)

Well, if he does go back into business. I hope he makes the gear more affordable, like Peter has done. My next purchase should be the Wested shirt anyway.

In this case, seeing is believing. I personally doubt that Mr. Howard will offer Indy gear again, and if he does, it won't be affordable, Wested kind of affordable.

Mr. Howard is not interested in us. Peter is. His gear is the best out there.

Mr. Howard is not interested in us. Peter is. His gear is the best out there.

If you're trying to imply that Noel Howard "abandoned" us in some way, then you're wrong. Noel Howard stopped making Indy gear because #1, he wasn't getting enough business and #2, I believe he said he wanted to return to directing. You can't blame a man for doing what makes him happy, and I find it more than a little irksome that you're trying to. :junior: -IJ

IndianaJones wrote:You can't blame a man for doing what makes him happy, and I find it more than a little irksome that you're trying to. :junior: -IJ

I'm not discussing whether Howard is happy or not, or what makes him so. I am also far from interested in blaming him for anything.

Frankly, I don't understand why you're taking my irksome little post so personally.

I merely stated that he is not interested in our group in the same way certain other vendors are. Other equally nice Indy clothes are available.

Should Howard begin to offer $240 wool pants - well, yay. As I stated before, seeing is believing. I may be wrong - Howard might jump out and begin selling fantastic stuff tomorrow. If so, well, my bad...

Forgive me, I don't know what came over me. I've just seen so many posts recently where old vendors are (possibly) coming back into business and COW members have been unwilling to really give them a chance. I know now that you are willing to give him a chance, but at the time that was unclear to me. Again, my apologies. :junior: -IJ

It's been almost a year since I typed the start of this thread and still no Noel Howard production, it seems?

Since my last post on the subject (many months ago now) I've not called Mr Howard so I don't know what the current state of play is.

To be honest, I have no real desire to pursue ths any further.

IF NH is indeed 'back in business' I think it's up to him to respond to the many emails which I'm sure hit his inbox following his announcement to me last year.

Because I happened to be the fellow to 'break the story' I feel responsible by proxy for all the unanswered emails which I'm sure people here would have sent.

I apologise for raising people's hopes with this thread. I was acting on first-hand information from Noel Howard, so I just don't know why this didn't transpire as promised.

Perhaps someomne else wants to find out.

Regards,

Al

IndianaJones - no need for apologies. I now see what you were saying and I'm sorry if I came out a bit harsh too...

Al - no need for apologies there either... you broke the initial news about the NH comeback, which is what any gearhead would have done and for which the community thanks you. For some reason, it never happened... if NH is interested in any business, it's his call now - as you stated, he should have a bunch of e-mails in the old inbox from future customers...

Noel was an interesting character when he was in business. Extremely friendly but, as far as I know, never posted on the forum. I got the feeling that he cared about the products he was turning out so much, he couldn't make a living off of it.

The shirts and pants weren't super-expensive but they were high enough that with the US-UK exchange rate made them really pricey.

Pyr.

Ob1al, don't worry about it.

Ever since I spoke to Noel on the telephone regarding last year's UK summit, I have not been interested in buying anything from him.
viewtopic.php?p=120183&highlight=noel+howard#120183

Don't get me wrong. I would love to get my hands on the original items, but not through him.

wasn't friendly to you Canyon? :junior: -IJ

that are really great news. Hope I can now finish my Indy collection. I only need the LC holster and a pair of aldens

Thanks Noel for coming back !

IndianaMike;
Before jumping up and down, check out the whole thread and se what's going on. Sorry to disappoint you, I think we all are.

Regards,
Swindiana

That's dissapointing. Canyon, I'm sorry you had a bad experience, but I spoke with Noel personally via phone a while back and my experience was much different; he was a total gentelman though he was quite busy running the business at that time. I had the same experience over email as well. And I didn't know he directed?!

I really hope that someday he returns to production because the textures and the colors of the fabrics he used for the Raiders pants (and even the shirt though the pattern wasn't perfect) was top notch and was the most accurate replica that's been made thus far. He worked from original movie patterns (probably TOD) and sourced the original fabric makers. And to my knowledge he didn't share this info with other costume makers. That's why I'm so interested in his products and will continue to email him occasionally.

UPDATE- I just checked the status and Noel did read my email last Friday, August 5th, but yet again didn't reply.

Update: Noel replied to my email! He was away on business for a while. He remains optimistic but is still not quite ready to jump back into the replica business. He told me to keep in touch. I really hope he does return especially in light of additional interest which is sure to come with Indy 4.

Now Children, Let me tell you a Story.
Once upon a time in the land of Indy a man called Noel Howard had a company called MBA which made shirts and pants, Belts and bags.
Unfortunately the big bad bank manager put him out business and the name MBA was sold to another.
Noel Howard retreated to the world of wardrobe whilst his little workers who actually made his products were made redundant. Sad!
Unperterbed the little workers clubbed together and formed a company called 'The Costume Workshop' and have worked in conjunction with Wested Leather on several film projects and are doing well.
How do you think that the pants and shirts are so accurate.
I have been asking Lee and Helen and the others if they want to supply the belts,bags etc that they made at MBA but they have until now out of respect leaving the door open for Noel. But time is up.
If you want to I suggest you contact Lee at The Costume Workshop
I can supply details on request.
Cheers Peter
The End

Now Children, Let me tell you a Story...

Go for it Peter!

Cheers,

Marc

I love a good bedtime story, don't you? You learn an AWFUL lot, if you stay awake long enough.
Thanks, Peter! I learned a ton in that single post!!
High regards! Michaelson

Does this mean the shirts will finally be made again using the EXACT same materials and the EXACT same design as the MBA version?

Peter, with all respect, the jacket is perfection, you did a knock down job on the pants, but fell short on the shirt and I'd love to get several if they are made in the EXACT way MBA was making them back then.

Also, if they do decide to go ahead with the other geat, the gunbelt and holster could also use some updating. I'd be happy to send you ALL the necessary reference materials if you don't already have them. I'm guessing that if Noels old employees did the MBA versions, then it should not be hard to incorporate these slight changes to make them more accurate to the screen than they were. I really did enjoy this gear, but there were just a couple of very small things wrong in the designs and are incredibly noticeable if you just take a look at the film or any clear reference pictures that are available.

I, for one, am already in for 2 new shirts and holster if the decision to make these comes to light and these changes can be made for the better.

I own a Wested shirt, love it. The only thing I can say against it, is it's feel. It's kinda stiff even after several washings, does any one know how to make it softer in feel. I've worn it some and washed many times trying to get that soft cotton shirt feel.
Thanks.
Crfot

I could really go for some new shirts. I have a couple Wested and a couple MBA and I just like the feel of the MBA shirt better.

Mike

I'm not an expert in the shirt area at all, so I really cannot comment on the "screen-accuracy" between the MBA and the Wested shirt. To my general eye, the Wested shirts look GREAT and appear VERY screen-accurate...

I've owned one of the MBA Indy shirts. Personally, I would vote for the Wested shirt over the MBA shirt without a doubt. I own a Wested shirt, and it just "feels" more like an Indy shirt that could withstand a true-life Indy adventure. The MBA shirt, on the other hand, felt as if I was wearing onion-skin that could rip/tear fairly easy.

Just my .02 cents...
Kind Regards,
Captain D

I own a Wested shirt, and it just "feels" more like an Indy shirt that could withstand a true-life Indy adventure.

All I care about is getting a costume shirt. After all, that's all it was for the film. It never went on any true-life adventures so I don't have that expectation of it. Just look exactly like the one on the screen. Supposedly Noel sourced the ORIGINAL material used and the ORIGINAL color and as far as I can tell, the ORIGINAL pattern too. Wested did this with the jacket. Got it to perfection. The pants are an incredible match too, but the shirt is off in many ways. Now, it may be a nice shirt and plenty of people like it, but it's just not screen accurate and Peter had the chance to make it so. He was even given screen caps and plenty of advice but still fell short. Why he chose to go the route he did and not make them exactly as they were in the film, I don't know.
I know to alot of people it may not make sense but screen accuracy is what I really care about in this hobby. I do not want to take any of my stuff on 'adventures', I just wanna wear it at costume events and have it proudly displayed on my mannequin the rest of the time. I'm sure whatever MBA made can withstand that.

Thats true Agent5 that the gear used in the films were simply used for the "look," not for the life/longevity of that gear necessarily.

So, I agree, if a collector wishes to get EXACTLY what they see on screen (even if it is not made to withstand a true-life adventure), that is one of the elements that make this hobby fun and great from one collector to the next. To me, I tend to travel a bit, so if I can get a screen-accurate shirt, plus, have it durable/reliable enough not to rip/tear easily on a trip (I'm one of those accident prone type, lol) thats all the better for a collector like me.

I can't speak for Peter, but I think thats what he "may" have been going for since a lot of people may have voted for a more "durable" Indy shirt during his early phases/developments of his Wested shirts. If Noel comes back, thats GREAT because those who wish to go for the "costume" shirt can go for his, and those wanting a real-world type of Indy shirt have Wested.

I think it's interesting to chat with various Indy collectors and to hear their opinions. Just like you feel that the Wested shirt isn't very screen-accurate, I may feel different. Just like the Wested jacket for example: You may feel that Wested has made it "to perfection." I, on the other hand, feel that it is not quite exactly "perfection." I own both, the Flightsuit and Wested, and I see many differences. I'm not trying to bash Wested in any way shape or form. Myself, like a lot of other people here, know that Peter bent over backwards to help make his jacket more screen-accurate. I love Peter and respect him dearly as a vendor. I love his shirts and pants, but I personally prefer the Flightsuits as far as what I see in screen-accuracy in the jacket...

I suppose it's all a matter of personal preferences, what each person sees on screen, and what that person hopes to do with their gear in their lives. It's not my intention to to pick-and-choose sides with anyone, just stating my personal opinions with respect to everyone involved...

Kind Regards,
Captain D

I suppose it's all a matter of personal preferences, what each person sees on screen, and what that person hopes to do with their gear in their lives. It's not my intention to to pick-and-choose sides with anyone, just stating my personal opinions with respect to everyone involved...

Oh, I agree and I fully respect your opinion as well as everyone elses. I'm not trying to bash Peter either as I'm sure he has his reasons. BUT, the shirt (bottom line here) is just not screen accurate. Just look at the sleeve cuffs, for example. I recall very clearly that when Peter said he was doing the shirts people sent him multiple screen caps for reference, including the corner of the cuffs. In the film they're rounded, but for some reason, Wested chose to make them squared off.

WHY?

I dunno. I'm not sure if there is a reason for this or not. Is it easier to make them square? Did he just overlook it? If so, how in the heck could you? Could he have not seen the pics of the cuffs? I don't see how anyone could miss it. Perhaps they simply think it's not too important as I'm sure that the majority of people here don't so long as the shirt is pretty darn close. I'm not in that camp, but it is the majority who'll buy the product then.

I'm not at all bothered that Wested didn't make the shirts 100% to the screen, I just don't have to buy it. I think it's awesome that they make them and that we have a source for them. I think the more vendors, the better off we all are. I just happened to like the shirts Noel was putting out and if Peter has Noels people working for him then I'd love to see them make the EXACT shirt they were making before as well as the shirts Wested is currently making. I know alot of people like them over the NH shirts, so as I said, the more the better.

I think it can only be better for Wested. If they can make a profit with both, of course. Gotta be able to make a profit to stay in business.

The reason for the inaccuracies in the Wested shirt is that Peter wanted to offer an affordable shirt for the Indy fan. Agent5 mentioned the squared-off cuffs - the straight-cut pocket flaps are a similar issue. When I asked Peter about this, he explained that scalloping the flaps would mean an increase in production cost, which eventually would make a difference on the pricetag, something Peter felt didn't stand in proportion to the - in his opinion - unnecessary alterations of the basic shirt. Guess that goes for the cuffs as well.

I'm quite happy with the way the Wested shirt came out. It's affordable and I'm planning to get a couple more some day. I'm also pleased with owning an MBA Raiders shirt, thus having "best of both worlds" in my collection.

agent5 wrote:...Just look at the sleeve cuffs, for example. I recall very clearly that when Peter said he was doing the shirts people sent him multiple screen caps for reference, including the corner of the cuffs. In the film they're rounded, but for some reason, Wested chose to make them squared off.

WHY?

Hmmm, the corners of the cuffs on the shirt I just got from Wested a couple of months ago are rounded, could they have finally incorporated the change? In fact, one of the reasons why I picked Peter's shirt over Jerry's at WPG was that Jerry's cuffs weren't rounded. Also, the pocket flaps on my shirt are pointed, not squared off. And both of these details are clearly illustrated on the Wested web site. Are you referring to an earlier version, or is there some subtle point I'm missing?

Sorry to butt in, but I don't understand.

Cheers!

Baggers - the pocket flaps are pointed indeed, but not curved as in the MBA shirt.


Top pics show Wested pockets, before and after my little alteration. MBA pockets (bottom pic) have a slight curvature on the flaps. This subtle inaccuracy is what I was referring to in my last post.

And what do you know - my cuff edges are also rounded! And it's a 1st gen Wested shirt... in other words, the production shirts have this little detail corrected.

Ah, I think I see what you mean -- a very slight concave scalloping of the pocket flaps either side of the buttonhole?

Just to clarify, I got it wrong. I meant to say the original shirts had the squared off cuffs and the Wested made them rounded.

D'OH!!!

Wouldn't this meant then that it would cost them less to make them the original way?

Baggers wrote:Ah, I think I see what you mean -- a very slight concave scalloping of the pocket flaps either side of the buttonhole?

Yes, that's it.

agent5 wrote:Just to clarify, I got it wrong. I meant to say the original shirts had the squared off cuffs and the Wested made them rounded.

D'OH!!!

Wouldn't this meant then that it would cost them less to make them the original way?

He he... just checked my MBA cuffs... squared they are...
Yes, by the "cutting cost" rationale, it would indeed be cheaper to make accurate cuffs...

Yes, by the "cutting cost" rationale, it would indeed be cheaper to make accurate cuffs...

D'OH!!! (again)