Club Obi Wan

The jacket that is the subject of this thread, was sold as a "Original Pattern Striated Lambskin "Legend" Jacket"? But it is different than the other ones that are coming because it was custom-made for Sarge? It doesn't look like the jacket Weston is wearing (the yoke looks quite different as well). Totally confused, but I'm guessing we're not going to know exactly what the imports are going to look like until someone here has them in hand?

Correctamundo!!

That's not a lot of use if you think you're ordering the jacket as seen on the Wings web site only to receive one that looks like this one.... If I wanted a really inaccurate jacket I could go to a number of other makers.

Just trying to get some clarity here

That's true, DJD....and I wish I personally had something more definite. I've not seen one of the standard Imports in person and can't say....hopefully there will be some pics of some rolling in soon....given the number of people clamoring for them, it shouldn't be TOO much longer, should it? I can't imagine it being otherwise, can you?

If it's clarity you're seeking, though....the only jackets we've seen that we KNOW look like the Raiders jackets for certain are the US made....

However, we DO have the knowledge that the import jacket we've seen was NOT from the regular line....

Again...I just hope we get some of the regular line imports through here soon! I'm as ready to see them as everyone else is!!!

Regards!
Indydawg

Well, there is one import jacket on display, but it is not an SL (I'm speaking of Weston's Cowhide).
Is it fair to assume that the production SL Imports will be made from the same pattern as the cowhide imports?

At least I really hope my jacket ends up looking like that as it is the jacket depicted on the USW website.
If not, I will be really dissapointed. (Please, let my Import jacket look like Weston's Import! )

Well, there is one import jacket on display, but it is not an SL (I'm speaking of Weston's Cowhide).

That's true, K...I had forgotten that, thinking that all Weston's jackets were US made...good call!

That might be a safe assumption...but only time will tell the tale...

kwad wrote:Well, there is one import jacket on display, but it is not an SL (I'm speaking of Weston's Cowhide).
Is it fair to assume that the production SL Imports will be made from the same pattern as the cowhide imports?

At least I really hope my jacket ends up looking like that as it is the jacket depicted on the USW website.
If not, I will be really dissapointed. (Please, let my Import jacket look like Weston's Import! )

At one point I posted an email exchange from Sarge somwhere in the threads about the differences between the Imports and the US Made. Can't remember where is it but here's the email which Sarge said to post away:

The USA has a trimmer cut.. The reason is That Roz Schott used The Neil
Cooper Pattern 100 % and the import is by numbers.. Same pattern but numbers
only.. Roz had the Pattern in front of her!! Is the USA made jacket a better
jacket.. Good question.. If you want a 100 % SA jacket then the answer is
yes.
Regards,
Sarge

Although that was concerning the Cowhide version, but maybe it's safe to infer that this is for the Legend jackets in general.

I suppose whether any of the imports are the same pattern will soon be known when I received the Aged Cow Import next week if that's relevant.

I'm not sure why we have to guess what the pattern will be?

VERY relevant...looking forward to hearing about your Import and seeing pics!!!

I don't think Neo is suggesting we're guessing what the pattern will be....sounds to me like it's the same general pattern (Raiders characteristics, like the side strap and small top yoke in the back, for example), but not CUT as trim as the US made jackets...more for the "world" market, I guess?

I guess we are still unsure of exactly how the imports will fit, though...and will be until we see one ON someone that comes out of the factory..

Whats the deal here? Have the imports shipped to members yet? Has anyone received there new jacket? I was under the impression they shipped the imports. If so, come on people! Post the jackets!

The only one out there on the basis of this seems to be Sarges prototype. I'm not sure what to make of it all.

Heck, I thought the SL legends werevsold out and this is round 2?????

Weston has an antiqued cowhide import, doesn't he? kwad pointed that out yesterday, and I didn't remember it until he said so, but I believe there's a thread here showing it off...

Again, though...not a regular line item..but one made for Sarge that Weston got.

I think neo is saying his is on the way...which leads me to believe some are shipping.

As to why the first run hasn't shown up...guys, I just don't know....

Oh, and Sarge gave the 21st as the ship date for all COW orders...that I did get in an email....

Dawg, how could you forget about Weston's cowhide jacket?

Here is the thread with Weston's Cowhide http://indygear.com/cow/viewtopic.php?f ... &start=100

On page 3 of this thread, both TexanScott and Dr. Evil have reported already receiving (and loving) their Import Cowhides jackets. So it appears that the Import Legend COWHIDE jackets are already shipping.
REPEAT, ONLY THE IMPORTED COWHIDES ARE BEING SHIPPED AS OF THIS DATE!!

On the same thread (again page 3) Sarge said:

would love to see some pics.... BTW All USA Legend Striated Lambskin Jackets will go out 12-21-10 along with all USA Cow and Bison... The Import Striated Lambskin should go out about the same date! Please place your orders now if you have not already done so.. If you don't know your size give us your height and weight.. The Legend is the Neil Cooper Pattern 100 % Due to US Wings having a firm ship date all orders in our office will be charged and ready for shipiment the 21st of Dec. If COW members have not already done so Please order your Kids Little Legend because we are running out and will not have these Jackets much longer! Make sure to let us know you are a COW member for the discount.
Sarge

K-

You are THE MAN!! You know, I wish I had enough focus to maintain some continuity between every new Wings offering...looks like YOUR memory is better than mine!

Thanks for the post and the redirection, my man! And thank you for bringing this thread's theme back into focus.

High Regards!
Indydawg

RaidersBash wrote:Really not sure how that story makes me feel. I was the first one to say I wanted a Cooper Raiders in the original thread. I AMan Indy Gear Member, I Was "on the list" and confirmed in several emails with Myke and waiting patiently for when to send in the funds...super excited to get it for the super COW price of $195...

and whoosh...they're all gone.

Glad you got a super one made special for Sarge, but at the same time I'm sad that I don't have one of the production imports.

Yup, that's my story as well. I was n the list back in August and a number of mails back and forth made me wait and then... all gone

IndyBrit wrote:

RaidersBash wrote:Really not sure how that story makes me feel. I was the first one to say I wanted a Cooper Raiders in the original thread. I AMan Indy Gear Member, I Was "on the list" and confirmed in several emails with Myke and waiting patiently for when to send in the funds...super excited to get it for the super COW price of $195...

and whoosh...they're all gone.

Glad you got a super one made special for Sarge, but at the same time I'm sad that I don't have one of the production imports.

Yup, that's my story as well. I was n the list back in August and a number of mails back and forth made me wait and then... all gone

That's about the same story for me but had called them and talked with them via phone to make sure on what size to pick.

BendingOak wrote:

IndyBrit wrote:

RaidersBash wrote:Really not sure how that story makes me feel. I was the first one to say I wanted a Cooper Raiders in the original thread. I AMan Indy Gear Member, I Was "on the list" and confirmed in several emails with Myke and waiting patiently for when to send in the funds...super excited to get it for the super COW price of $195...

and whoosh...they're all gone.

Glad you got a super one made special for Sarge, but at the same time I'm sad that I don't have one of the production imports.

Yup, that's my story as well. I was n the list back in August and a number of mails back and forth made me wait and then... all gone

That's about the same story for me but had called them and talked with them via phone to make sure on what size to pick.

Same story here!

For all the criticism of other vendors there has been here over the years it seems odd that there's been no attempt to 'bash' Wings over this rather strange saga. I'm still not sure what to make of it.

Well, DJD-

Maybe folks are reserving judgement until the jackets actually arrive... ?

For folks that haven't followed eveything as closely as some of us (or been as involved)...maybe they are unaware, too....I mean the minute details are spread over so many threads at this point, a newcomer trying to put it all together would have a hard time.

But I still don't have an explanation for why the sold out jackets haven't shipped yet, all shown up, or why some have been getting theirs but some have not...I keep waiting for this glut of jacket picture threads to pop up overnight....but it just hasn't happened yet...

I can only imagine how crazy things are at the Wings store this time of year...or at Wested, Riley's, etc. for that matter...

Things should start to make more sense in a week or so....

Good to "see" you around...
Indydawg

indy1936 wrote:

BendingOak wrote:

IndyBrit wrote:

RaidersBash wrote:Really not sure how that story makes me feel. I was the first one to say I wanted a Cooper Raiders in the original thread. I AMan Indy Gear Member, I Was "on the list" and confirmed in several emails with Myke and waiting patiently for when to send in the funds...super excited to get it for the super COW price of $195...

and whoosh...they're all gone.

Glad you got a super one made special for Sarge, but at the same time I'm sad that I don't have one of the production imports.

Yup, that's my story as well. I was n the list back in August and a number of mails back and forth made me wait and then... all gone

That's about the same story for me but had called them and talked with them via phone to make sure on what size to pick.

Same story here!

Here's what I make of it...with all due respect. It seems I keep reading how the jacket is nice, but...this detail is wrong...that detail is wrong...it's not SA to my satisfaction, etc. Followed by...and why didn't I get one?

Anyone else see the flaw in that logic? This isn't the droid you were looking for, lol Why not just be happy for someone's (me) good fortune at purchasing a fine Wings jacket, knowing that, when yours arrive, they will be (most likely) exactly what you wanted. No one got short changed in any way. In fact, just the opposite. It seems steps are being taken to insure everyone has what they really want. It's just a matter of waiting a little longer for the overseas producer to provide the product.

Personally, I look forward with great anticipation to seeing other posted photos of the Wings Imported Lamb Legend that will soon be put here by other satisfied COW members.

And for the record, I was not yet a COW member. I paid full retail.

Thanks for that clarification and "reality check," Ray! I, for one, am VERY happy with your acquisition...happy for YOU!

Also...

Here is the thread with Weston's Cowhide http://indygear.com/cow/viewtopic.php?f ... &start=100" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

On page 3 of this thread, both TexanScott and Dr. Evil have reported already receiving (and loving) their Import Cowhides jackets. So it appears that the Import Legend COWHIDE jackets are already shipping.
REPEAT, ONLY THE IMPORTED COWHIDES ARE BEING SHIPPED AS OF THIS DATE!!

On the same thread (again page 3) Sarge said:


Quote:
would love to see some pics.... BTW All USA Legend Striated Lambskin Jackets will go out 12-21-10 along with all USA Cow and Bison... The Import Striated Lambskin should go out about the same date! Please place your orders now if you have not already done so.. If you don't know your size give us your height and weight.. The Legend is the Neil Cooper Pattern 100 % Due to US Wings having a firm ship date all orders in our office will be charged and ready for shipiment the 21st of Dec. If COW members have not already done so Please order your Kids Little Legend because we are running out and will not have these Jackets much longer! Make sure to let us know you are a COW member for the discount.
Sarge

A lot of people are coming at things from a LOT of different points-of-view...and one of the goals of the site is to ensure that ALL customers make educated and informed decisions about what they buy.

Part of that may be pointing out inaccuracies in a product so that IF someone is looking for a particular item, constructed a particular way, they know what will and will not satisfy their requirements.

I hope you don't think you, or your fine jacket, were being "knocked."

NOT anyone's intentions, I'm sure.
Regards!
Indydawg

djd wrote:Thank you and fully understood. So can you confirm that the US made jackets will follow the pattern of the wonderful looking one modelled by Weston? THAT was a great looking jacket!

Yes! Every Jacket made by US Wings Inc. in the USA is made by My Business partner Roz Schott of Schott NYC and we are 100 % union and the name of the Union is Unite. The Legend Jackets made in the USA and outside of the USA is the Neil Cooper Raiders pattern.. Our Import Legend made off shore has some inside the jacket changes and is still the Neil Cooper Raiders pattern but not SA... The good news this time next week those lucky Fans will have their made in the USA Legend.. Striated Lambskin.. Bison.. Aged Cow being sent to them with UPS tracking number in hand.Imported Legend Lambskin.. being made and will be sent ASAP.USA Longs after the first of the year !
I will not be able to post any other information until after X-Mas........Sarge

Yes! Every Jacket made by US Wings Inc. in the USA is made by My Business partner Roz Schott of Schott NYC and we are 100 % union and the name of the Union is Unite. The Legend Jackets made in the USA and outside of the USA is the Neil Cooper Raiders pattern.. Our Import Legend made off shore has some inside the jacket changes and is still the Neil Cooper Raiders pattern but not SA... The good news this time next week those lucky Fans will have their made in the USA Legend.. Striated Lambskin.. Bison.. Aged Cow being sent to them with UPS tracking number in hand.Imported Legend Lambskin.. being made and will be sent ASAP.USA Longs after the first of the year !
I will not be able to post any other information until after X-Mas........Sarge

YEEEEEEHAW!!!!

Great news, Sarge! We're ALL looking forward to those jackets arriving!!!


Indydawg

If anyone cares to look back at any of my previous posts they'll see I've always been a supporter of this Wings product. I've been enthusiastic about it since if was first announced and even after the big falling out there was, I never removed myself from the 'list' or engaging in getting stuck into Wings as a few others did. I have a US SL on order and paid for and if it looks like the one modelled by Weston I'll be very happy.

My issue is my usual one in any disagreements I have here. It's about equality of treatment. Not too many weeks ago we had a whole thread bashing Riley of TNO for his alleged sharp business practices. Apparently he has to specify an exact date of closure for TNO rather than his current vague one.

Over the years there have been numerous threads laying into Wested. Some justified and some not so much.

Here we have a situation where we've been told that a certain product has been sold out despite people being on a pre order list for it. The only evidence that the product actually even existed comes in the form of what turns out to be Sarges own prototype jacket. This was sold to a non COW member and not someone on the list. Now, I'm not dumb and at best this series of events is 'odd'. It's like no one wants to say that though. Certainly the usual vendor bashers are silent on the matter.

I've no axe to grind with Wings. They are a commercial outfit who have the job of selling product. In my dealings with them they have always been helpful and, I have to say, that it's been a good customer experience so far. I've no foot in TNOs camp either. I wanted to get a jacket from them but in the end I concluded I couldn't afford one. I did find Riley to be very helpful and understanding in my communications with him.

So my point, if there is one, are a) like you dawg I'm somewhat bemused by the saga of the SL imports. I can't see the logic of what has gone on or where these jackets actually are and b) I'd like to know that the jackets that actually turn up look like the pattern on the web site and not like the only import SL we've been shown. That's a trade description thing. The buyer should get what he thinks he's ordered.

It seems somewhat unfair to the community that the people who usually ask these questions are not in this case asking them. At least if they are, they're not asking them very loudly

That last was typed before Sarges reply and I appreciate the reasurrance on the pattern issue. Thanks

Wings has always been the red-headed stepchild of the jacket section since this site began. They've been kicked around for years, and it's refreshing that they're finally being given the respect they've always been due, and on equal footing with Wested or another OTHER jacket companies that has been discussed, be that good OR bad.

In the past anytime Wings was mentioned in a thread, anyone positive in their mention and description of the the product was immediately jumped on and pretty much run out of a thread.

So why hasn't anyone said anything derogatory lately? It's because Wings earned their place at the table, and did so long before many of the current people became members here. Folks are just now realizing it.

Regards! Michaelson

Well said, M!

I think it won't be too much longer until other doubts are reconciled....good to see you around today!!!!

Regards!
Indydawg

I don't want to get involved in a row. I only note that it was apparently 'ok' for senior people here to 'bash' Wings as recently as August. Something seems to have changed behind the scenes since then. I'm not suggesting wings or any other vendor should be bashed. I merely find the situation and the response to it a bit odd.

As you say, djd, things were reconciled between this site and the vender, and it was done due to the long history the membership has had with the vender.

It's disturbing to keep seeing these hints, and just as odd when things have blown up and been smoothed over between the so called 'seniors' and other vendors in the past, and has occurred dozens of times since this site began in 2002, and yet this has never raised any eyebrows.

I have no interest in starting a 'row' either. I'm just bothered this keeps getting tossed out there, as it implies impropriety on the part of the site, and once again goes to prove that no good deed goes unpunished on the part of the volunteers who help keep this site operational.

Once you cut off your lines of communication to the vendors, all you have left is each other to talk about gear or other topics....and that kind of talk, as pleasant as it may be for the short period of time it exists', eventually dries up and a site dies from disinterest, or turns on itself. It's a constant give and take on both sides, but without one side in that conversation, it's pretty much useless.

We work hard on trying to keep the status quo so at least the vendors ARE willing to come back and talk to their customers. One person's answer could be the answer a LOT of folks are looking for. There have been SEVERAL situations where the waters were attempted to be smoothed over between vendor and site after a blowup, only to discover we have individuals keeping the water muddied for their own personal reasons, and the vendors have kept their own council to themselves. THIS practice by members of late has been more 'odd' to me than anything I can possibly think of.

I certainly hope that this will be the end of that kind of talk, and the discussion will remain on either the merits OR the problems we experience with the acquisition of gear for this hobby. This so called clandestine existance between 'senior' member and the outside makes no sense to me, and the continuing of the myth baffles me even more.

Regards! Michaelson

I am locking this at this time as it seems the purpose of the thread has run its course and it's dividing itself at this point. Ray has expressed feelings that the tone is getting away from the original purpose, too.

So-she's locked down. Thanks, Michealson, for summing up the "heart" of the complications, too.

Regards!
Indydawg