Club Obi Wan

Kittlemeier, if you're starting to think like me, give yourself the early Christmas present of therapy.

Seriously, RS, I hope you figure out what that stain is and that things work out for you. It does look like a grease stain to me from the pics...

binkmeisterRick wrote:

ReturningSon wrote: My Wested jacket, which I had right beside it, is fine..no marks or anything..

Maybe the Wested did it! ;-)

YES! that's the logical explanation, it floats too!

That darn Wested...always sneaking around...trying to castrate my other indy gear...why be so jealous....if I find it was the one who caused the spot of death so help me!!!!

haha, that was fun!

Maybe it's one of those "disappearing ink" stains....is anyone in your family a prankster?

I think it would be more comforting him if we just said the truth which is ouch.. and that I'd be going insane right now

Let me reiterate, I have talked to everyone in my family who could have possibly come in contact with the jacket and they all denied anything happened. Besides, none of my other stuff was messed with. And yes, I am going insane. I keep going into the backroom and looking at potential "spot-causing" hazards and I cannot find anything! I am waiting for Tonys reply, theres nothing I can do until I here back from him and since its near the holidays, he might be busy or with family...nothing can be done so I just gotta sit back and wait while looking at the "black spot of death"!!!

I've been wondering why these jackets are so hard to take off!

RS, sorry mate! Hope it works out for you!

ReturningSon wrote:Let me reiterate, I have talked to everyone in my family who could have possibly come in contact with the jacket and they all denied anything happened. Besides, none of my other stuff was messed with. And yes, I am going insane. I keep going into the backroom and looking at potential "spot-causing" hazards and I cannot find anything! I am waiting for Tonys reply, theres nothing I can do until I here back from him and since its near the holidays, he might be busy or with family...nothing can be done so I just gotta sit back and wait while looking at the "black spot of death"!!! :?

Okay - so stains happen. I have an expensuive oilskin jacket that never left my apartment. It ended up having white paint down one arm. At no time did I pass any wet paint - I only wore the jacket in my car once. At no time did I use any paint. It's one of those thing with a simple explination, I'm sure - liek yours. It's just that I don't know what that explanation is. &*&^% happens!

CM wrote:I have an expensuive oilskin jacket that never left my apartment. It ended up having white paint down one arm. At no time did I pass any wet paint - I only wore the jacket in my car once. At no time did I use any paint.

I am having a hard time understanding how you wore your jacket in your car once, if it never left your apartment. Do you park in your living room? I have heard of trying to have a close parking spot, but that is a little extreme.

ReturningSon wrote:Let me reiterate, I have talked to everyone in my family who could have possibly come in contact with the jacket and they all denied anything happened. Besides, none of my other stuff was messed with. And yes, I am going insane. I keep going into the backroom and looking at potential "spot-causing" hazards and I cannot find anything! I am waiting for Tonys reply, theres nothing I can do until I here back from him and since its near the holidays, he might be busy or with family...nothing can be done so I just gotta sit back and wait while looking at the "black spot of death"!!!

Yeah I'm sure that is a chemical reaction spot.. nothing that you or family could have done.

Bufflehead Jones wrote:

CM wrote:I have an expensuive oilskin jacket that never left my apartment. It ended up having white paint down one arm. At no time did I pass any wet paint - I only wore the jacket in my car once. At no time did I use any paint.

I am having a hard time understanding how you wore your jacket in your car once, if it never left your apartment. Do you park in your living room? I have heard of trying to have a close parking spot, but that is a little extreme.

Bufflehead Jones wrote:

CM wrote:I have an expensuive oilskin jacket that never left my apartment. It ended up having white paint down one arm. At no time did I pass any wet paint - I only wore the jacket in my car once. At no time did I use any paint.

I am having a hard time understanding how you wore your jacket in your car once, if it never left your apartment. Do you park in your living room? I have heard of trying to have a close parking spot, but that is a little extreme.

Actually, you're close. I have a car space that I drive into on the ground floor of my house, which leads to a short walkway right into my kitchen - kind of 1960's groovy. Still no wet paint though... ;-)

still no response from Big T..gettin a little anxious right now!

Maybe the special enzymes in the leather all died?

(ok, that's a bad joke)

Actually it's more like overactive enzyymes..

did you hang it in a spot that something could have dripped on to it? man, that would bug me or sure.......i hope you get it fixed.

nope, no drip. Thats what I thought too but theres nothing there but ceiling. Oh well, still awaitin' for Tony!

Hopefully, you can come to satisfactory terms on getting the jacket repaired. You might have to try to reach him directly. This is probably the worst time to need something from a vendor.

I know my department at work is pretty much on holiday mode. Good luck getting any real work done by us until after Jan 1.

I sympathize with the grease spot on a near $700 jacket, but I hardly think Tony Nowak owes you a new jacket. How can it be his fault?

SD

St. Dumas wrote:I sympathize with the grease spot on a near $700 jacket, but I hardly think Tony Nowak owes you a new jacket. How can it be his fault?

SD

Did he say that? As far as I know he only wants to ask Tony if it can be fixed or if the panel can be replaced. could be something i missed though

Speaking of which: I think it would be very hard to replace that panel. It might not be hard to actually do it, but the hard part would be getting a matching part of leather for that new panel: every batch of leather is varied slightly in texture and colour. so I think it's key to try and find out what the spot is, and how it can be removed.

Regards, Geert

St. Dumas wrote:I sympathize with the grease spot on a near $700 jacket, but I hardly think Tony Nowak owes you a new jacket. How can it be his fault?

SD

Personally I think everything should have better warranties than they do.. 5 year warranties for video game systems.. 5 year warranties for washer and driers... 10 years for cars etc

For a 700 dollar jacket I think there should be a good expectation it will be great for a long time. I think he should at least get that panel replaced since it is a chemical reaction because of the leather used.
I don't think it's a grease spot.
Hey he's even willing to pay the guy to fix it

blueoakleyz wrote:

St. Dumas wrote:I sympathize with the grease spot on a near $700 jacket, but I hardly think Tony Nowak owes you a new jacket. How can it be his fault?

SD

Personally I think everything should have better warranties than they do.. 5 year warranties for video game systems.. 5 year warranties for washer and driers... 10 years for cars etc

For a 700 dollar jacket I think there should be a good expectation it will be great for a long time. I think he should at least get that panel replaced since it is a chemical reaction because of the leather used.
I don't think it's a grease spot.
Hey he's even willing to pay the guy to fix it

That's crazy talk. Warranties are always limited. Workmanship is one thing - this is inconclusive.

If you got a new jacket everytime a stain appeared then makers would risk becoming victim to people who treated their jacket badly and then blamed the maker for any rips or stains they made.

Besides in this case we do not know what caused the stain. Unless you are a forensic scientist how do you know the stain is a chemical reation. This is pure speculation. It is still possible he accidentally stained it without knowing how. My friend owns a dry cleaners he hears at least 10 claims like this a week.

Cheers

ReturningSon wrote:still no response from Big T..gettin a little anxious right now!

Don't freak out too much - it's 2 days before Xmas - I'm sure he has a lot on if he's still trading before the break. Lots of businesspeople have already shut down for the holidays by now. I'm sure he'll deal with it fairly.

CM wrote:

blueoakleyz wrote:

St. Dumas wrote:I sympathize with the grease spot on a near $700 jacket, but I hardly think Tony Nowak owes you a new jacket. How can it be his fault?

SD

Personally I think everything should have better warranties than they do.. 5 year warranties for video game systems.. 5 year warranties for washer and driers... 10 years for cars etc

For a 700 dollar jacket I think there should be a good expectation it will be great for a long time. I think he should at least get that panel replaced since it is a chemical reaction because of the leather used.
I don't think it's a grease spot.
Hey he's even willing to pay the guy to fix it

That's crazy talk. Warranties are always limited. Workmanship is one thing - this is inconclusive.

If you got a new jacket everytime a stain appeared then makers would risk becoming victim to people who treated their jacket badly and then blamed the maker for any rips or stains they made.

Besides in this case we do not know what caused the stain. Unless you are a forensic scientist how do you know the stain is a chemical reation. This is pure speculation. It is still possible he accidentally stained it without knowing how. My friend owns a dry cleaners he hears at least 10 claims like this a week.

Cheers

Whenever I mention warranties everyone tells me "but warranties are always short and limited" and I'm like, but yeah, that's my point- they should be changed.

It's a matter of fairness. If someone buys say a Playstation 3 and it last 6 years... while another guy buys one and it only lasts 2.. that's just totally out of wack in my world view. These things should have some kind of guarantee they will be of a certain level of quality. Good lord what if microsoft hadn't extended the 360's warranty? SO many people would be crying right now. I don't know how leather jacket warranties work but $700 is a ton of money.. hopefully he'll at least work with him.

I was a science major for a long time in college (And have a science degree).. that's definitely a chemical reaction.. not a stain. I'm not asking anyone to guarantee a stain.. just if the odd chemical reaction happens in a short amount of time after purchase.

Besides how do we know it's a chemical rxn and not a stain? The guy says it is.. I think we should trust him.

gwyddion wrote:

St. Dumas wrote:I sympathize with the grease spot on a near $700 jacket, but I hardly think Tony Nowak owes you a new jacket. How can it be his fault?

SD

Did he say that? As far as I know he only wants to ask Tony if it can be fixed or if the panel can be replaced. could be something i missed though

Before speculation goes cattywampus, there is nothing here which states that Tony said much of anything. At this stage, it looks like ReturningSon is waiting to hear back from Tony regarding the issue and his request.

The guy says it is.. I think we should trust him.

And jails are full of guys that are innocent. Really, they are.
They said they are.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.

I believe it was an accident. They happen all the time, and sometimes
we don't even know when it happens.

The spot in question seems to me like its either an oil or grease based
stain.

If its almost consistantly dark throughout the entire stain, that indicates something
oily or greasy came in contact with the surface, and was allowed to soak in for awhile.

If it was a water based stain, it would be darker in the middle, and
lighter in color as it got further away from the center. Then when it dried,
the leather would have faded back to its original color.

Was this jacket worn in the car? Perhaps someone who drove the car
prior to you was eating in the car, and dripped something on the seatbelt.

And then, you got in the car, buckled up the seatbelt while wearing your leather jacket,
and that dripped something then got on your jacket. The stain is in the right location
for that to happen.

I have seen it happen more times than you think in my wifes car!! I
have to constantly check the seatbelts for all kinds of greasy what-not that she, or
her friends, drip onto the seatbelts after they have gone to the drive-thru
of fast food places.

And if you have kids that drive your car, the chances of this happening
go up greatly.

I hope you get it fixed up. I don't think its the leather. It can't just
all of the sudden spout something to cause a stain.

Flathead

blueoakleyz wrote:
I was a science major for a long time in college (And have a science degree).. that's definitely a chemical reaction.. not a stain. I'm not asking anyone to guarantee a stain.. just if the odd chemical reaction happens in a short amount of time after purchase.

I'm not a chemist so I'm not going to argue whether it's a stain or a chemical reaction. But in the case that it were a chemical reaction then all that would mean is that a new reactant was added at some time between when the hide was tanned/processed and when ReturningSon noticed the "altered" area of the jacket, no? Or are you saying it was like a "time bomb" type reaction where both reactants were introduced before ReturningSon's jacket even shipped and the full blown reaction came into full fruition after he took possession. I'm just curious where you think the burden should be placed in that scenario. I'm not sure how you could apply a clear cut warranty and return policy against such a thing that would favor the customer AND not force the business to raise prices even further on their product to cover such possible costs from being incurred by the business in such events.

Tony's a standup guy. If he can do something to help I'm sure he will. It might not be entirely free of charge but he'll do what he can to provide great service to a customer. He's a very small operation and if he's not having the opportunity to take a holiday breather then he's probably extremely busy trying to get some orders out the door! It's too bad it happened right before the holiday week. That's got to be truly frustrating! Hang in there, RS!

Ok, just heard from Big Tony, HE HAS OFFERED TO REPLACE THE FRONT PANEL OF THE JACKET!!!! Whew! So relieved. As for the cause of the black spot he states that it was "messed with". Well, I just don't know. I certainly do not have the balls, especially in this tough economy, to buy a $700 jacket and then grease a black stain on it to see if I could get a new jacket. Just doesn't make sense and Tony knows that. In the words of Nixon "I AM NOT A CROOK" (well....maybe shouldn't have used that quote ) But seriously, I am glad Tony has offered to replace the panel. He didn't mention anything about price so I assume its not going to cost me anything. Tony is the man!!!! If anyone is still on the fence about Tony, don't hesistate because, like I stated earlier, He is da man! I will bring up with me a bottle of wine and some stuff just to show my gratitude. However, if Tony wants me to hand deliver it to him instead of ship it, I won't be able to get there until Sunday due to the holidays. Anyway, just wanna say thanks for all of your guys info and support. Happy Chrismahanukwanzakah!!!!!

Great news! I'm glad it's working out for you.

Swell! I am glad that everything is resolved.

yeah, heart attack averted!!!!!

I had no doubts, and as I keep telling folks, you need to have a little patience. Things can and will eventually work out if you give folks a chance and the time to respond. ;-)

I'm glad your Holidays weren't derailed by this. Merry Christmas!

HIGH regards! Michaelson

Now stop eating mayonnaise with your jacket on! Lesson learned.

Pork chops, agent5, pork chops!

Glad everything is resolved to your satisfaction!

If it's a manufacturer's flaw then you have every right to have it fixed/replaced. If it was something that happened since - then you will have to find ways to deal with it or fix it yourself. If it arrived without the spot and then the spot appeared after a few months.....that'll be tough to prove you didn't do it.....

If the spot was to look like the face of a holy icon, then you could ebay it for thousands....

The happy ending speaks volumes for his customer service. After Christmas I'm going to start researching his coat.

nicktheguy wrote:If it's a manufacturer's flaw then you have every right to have it fixed/replaced. If it was something that happened since - then you will have to find ways to deal with it or fix it yourself. If it arrived without the spot and then the spot appeared after a few months.....that'll be tough to prove you didn't do it.....

If the spot was to look like the face of a holy icon, then you could ebay it for thousands....

dude, dont get me started with that. I sent pics and everything but Peter just wouldn't believe that Mother Mary was on the back of my Wested special....hurm..what can one do right?

What would be funny is if the jacket that TN makes for Indiana Jones 5 has that exact stain as part of the story line. For instance, we find that it is spilled fuel from an interdimensional space vehicle.

To think that you had that in your hands and had it fixed...

That is some incredible customer service, congrats!!! Also, it's going to go along way in the PR department here, granted Tony appears to have already won most people over by his craftsmanship.

Michaelson wrote:I had no doubts, and as I keep telling folks, you need to have a little patience. Things can and will eventually work out if you give folks a chance and the time to respond. ;-)

I'm glad your Holidays weren't derailed by this. Merry Christmas!

HIGH regards! Michaelson

Hear, hear! Spend some time away from this place (if you can), then come back, read through hot threads, and see (since the beginning) that patience most often wins the day! Patience, grasshoppers! And heartiest tidings of the season to all!

Henry Jones, Sr.

binkmeisterRick wrote:

gwyddion wrote:

St. Dumas wrote:I sympathize with the grease spot on a near $700 jacket, but I hardly think Tony Nowak owes you a new jacket. How can it be his fault?

SD

Did he say that? As far as I know he only wants to ask Tony if it can be fixed or if the panel can be replaced. could be something i missed though

Before speculation goes cattywampus, there is nothing here which states that Tony said much of anything. At this stage, it looks like ReturningSon is waiting to hear back from Tony regarding the issue and his request.

Hey Bink, I just wanted to say that the "he" in my post was referring to Returningson as I read SD's post as saying that Returningson stated that Tony owed him a new jacket, so no speculating on my part. ;-)

Well, Tony has proven himself a great customer-care guy once again! In all honesty I didn't think he would be able to reply before christmass, but he evidentely found the time to do so. Great to hear the spot issue is going to be resolved Returningson!

Regards, Geert

Nice to hear eveything worked out. But for $700, to me, that kind of response should be expected.....it shouldn't come as a surprise. Would anyone expect anything different from Peter if a Wested jacket had a similar problem?

gwyddion, I ended up copying both posts instead of just the first one. I know what you meant. No matter, though, since Tony has responded and appears to be taking care of things. ;-)

ah, no worries then

Merry christmass Bink!

Regards, Geert

ReturningSon, I'm sure you're thrilled beyond words! Your jacket was only "mostly dead". It's awesome that Miracle Max I mean Tony will be able to fix you up!.

I believe that Tony is doing this more because he honestly wants everyone to totally love the jacket that he has made for them and less because the cost of the jacket obligates him to do so. I'm not saying that cost is not a factor at all just that some things mean more to him than money. We've had long talks about this before the KotCS hit the theaters and also recently. It's not about the money to him. Some that have ordered from him and talked to him get this and some apparently do not.

If you're not buying into that at all then maybe believe that this instance might just be in the giving spirit of Christmas.

Merry Christmas, all (or whatever greeting your faith practices!)

blueoakleyz wrote:

CM wrote:

blueoakleyz wrote:

St. Dumas wrote:I sympathize with the grease spot on a near $700 jacket, but I hardly think Tony Nowak owes you a new jacket. How can it be his fault?

SD

Personally I think everything should have better warranties than they do.. 5 year warranties for video game systems.. 5 year warranties for washer and driers... 10 years for cars etc

For a 700 dollar jacket I think there should be a good expectation it will be great for a long time. I think he should at least get that panel replaced since it is a chemical reaction because of the leather used.
I don't think it's a grease spot.
Hey he's even willing to pay the guy to fix it

That's crazy talk. Warranties are always limited. Workmanship is one thing - this is inconclusive.

If you got a new jacket everytime a stain appeared then makers would risk becoming victim to people who treated their jacket badly and then blamed the maker for any rips or stains they made.

Besides in this case we do not know what caused the stain. Unless you are a forensic scientist how do you know the stain is a chemical reation. This is pure speculation. It is still possible he accidentally stained it without knowing how. My friend owns a dry cleaners he hears at least 10 claims like this a week.

Cheers

Whenever I mention warranties everyone tells me "but warranties are always short and limited" and I'm like, but yeah, that's my point- they should be changed.

It's a matter of fairness. If someone buys say a Playstation 3 and it last 6 years... while another guy buys one and it only lasts 2.. that's just totally out of wack in my world view. These things should have some kind of guarantee they will be of a certain level of quality. Good lord what if microsoft hadn't extended the 360's warranty? SO many people would be crying right now. I don't know how leather jacket warranties work but $700 is a ton of money.. hopefully he'll at least work with him.

I was a science major for a long time in college (And have a science degree).. that's definitely a chemical reaction.. not a stain. I'm not asking anyone to guarantee a stain.. just if the odd chemical reaction happens in a short amount of time after purchase.

Besides how do we know it's a chemical rxn and not a stain? The guy says it is.. I think we should trust him.

Sorry Blue. I don't agree at all. Let's move on - it's all sorted now.

Ease up on them hammers, boys, Tony has already said he's going to fix it, so let it go.

Regards! Michaelson

I think you're very lucky and this shows the benefits of buying from a top class person. If you're a scientist you'll be familiar with the principle of Occam's Razor which basically states that the simplest explanation is generally the right one. No weird, undocumented chemical effects or anything like that. There's a mark and somebody's put it there. Simple as that. If it wasn't there when you received it, it's happened since then.

Anyway enjoy your jacket.

ANZAC_1915 wrote:Maybe the special enzymes in the leather all died?

(ok, that's a bad joke)

funny, but it's not a raiders jacket

ReturningSon wrote:Ok, just heard from Big Tony, HE HAS OFFERED TO REPLACE THE FRONT PANEL OF THE JACKET!!!! Whew! So relieved. As for the cause of the black spot he states that it was "messed with". Well, I just don't know. I certainly do not have the balls, especially in this tough economy, to buy a $700 jacket and then grease a black stain on it to see if I could get a new jacket. Just doesn't make sense and Tony knows that. In the words of Nixon "I AM NOT A CROOK" (well....maybe shouldn't have used that quote ) But seriously, I am glad Tony has offered to replace the panel. He didn't mention anything about price so I assume its not going to cost me anything. Tony is the man!!!! If anyone is still on the fence about Tony, don't hesistate because, like I stated earlier, He is da man! I will bring up with me a bottle of wine and some stuff just to show my gratitude. However, if Tony wants me to hand deliver it to him instead of ship it, I won't be able to get there until Sunday due to the holidays. Anyway, just wanna say thanks for all of your guys info and support. Happy Chrismahanukwanzakah!!!!!

I knew Tony would handle this.
I can understand him thinking it was 'messed with'. It wasn't there when it arrived, you didn't notice it the few times you tried it on in the house, and apparently it wasn't hanging beside something in the closet that could cause the mark.
Something happened from the time you hung it up to the time you took it down. There may be someone (other than you) who just isn't spilling the beans out of fear