Club Obi Wan

I don't understand why you're attacking me, when it's not me who's making the price. Do you think that it'll gain ME to sell less of them due to the high price?

I was TOLD to charge this price and believe it or not but the weak Dollar is NOT MY FAULT. Sorry that 450 Euro are no longer 375 $ and that due to the weak Dollar my hats don't cost 330 $ shipped to the US, but alas this is something that I cannot change.

Regards,

Marc

I dont think anyones is attacking you, I think people are just a little surprised (especially where exchange rates are concerned), just as you said yourself the price is high... BUT, theyre gonna be a pretty sweet pair of Indy boots and a month or two down the line Ill look at placing an order. Marc, no one here can ever thank you and Steve enough for how much you guys help us out and I know I speak on the behalf of everyone when I say thankyou for putting the effort into this boot! Your a great man to deal with and people will buy this boot!

No worries, my friend, I'm not attacking you , please don't misconstrue the direction of my sarcasm. It is directed toward Alden. I think you should have told them to jump in a lake with this offer, it's rediculous! The shoe is already expensive (worth it) but expensive, some would say (even me) excessive. I've purchased a pair, but I can't say I didn't have sticker shock or even buyers remorse,,it's a VERY expensive boot! But $700.00?! Who cares about the weak dollar (nice that we are the brunt of all unspoken jokes these days with the pathetic dollar our friendly "Federal Reserve" has left us with, but that's another story)
Anyhooo, even in Euro, that's too much!

That being said, I can't say that I feel it's worthy of Adventurebilt action! I don't think you guys should support that kind of pillaging of the fans here. Don't jump on that exploitive band wagon, please.
But, again, that's just me...

TR

Not only that,,,don't be fooled! I think Alden will just grab a different color leather , make the same boot and say Yankee Doodle, here's your "original" yada,yada..

I don't think they'll go above and beyond for 12 pair of boots (if there's even 12 people foolish enough to fall for it)

TR

Well I HAVE sold quite some already, so obviously there ARE people "foolish" enough to purchase them (incl. myself).

I give you MY word that they'll do EXACTLY as told. I've seen some VERY "special" custom made boots on Saturday and every(!) little detail was written down to ensure that I'll get EXACTLY what I want. Heck, they're checking the details of the order from the shop where Ford bought his before shooting to guarantee everything will be authentic (just in case I missed something). As I said: if John wouldn't want to do this favor to me, because he was amused with my pickyness or fascinated by my passion or whatever reason floated his boat, he would have told me off and I would have taken the ride of over 500 miles in total for a hot cup of coffee.

I trust not only John but also Alden as a company. The company is family owned in the third or fourth generation. The current owner is 53 years old and most probably wouldn't have to EVER work for a single minute in his entire life. However he spends every single day at the factory, checking the leather quality, the craftmanship, the finish, the stitches... everything. He's inspecting every single step he can to make sure that everything is done the way it should be done. To me this speaks VOLUMES. You won't find a lot of companies like that nowadays and I believe that they're very picky when it comes to adding a new retailer to their list (at least I was told so). You don't just walk in there, telling them to add you on the list and make the boot as you want it. In my case, I only got to speak to John due to him giving me a personal invitation to meet him. I had to proof ME being worthy of retailing THEIR products, not the opposite. And to start with wanting to change basicly everything on an existing product does not help

Regards,

Marc

WELL, when you say that price in euro it sounds totally different Marc
I paid 450 euro ordering from america + import taxes. If I would have known before about this future development I would have restrained myself for another year and buy them from you... original and accurate. DARN IT!
Afterall the euro price is not bad. It's really too bad for extra-european countries, really

To each his own, I suppose. I just don't see a few minor differences being worth another pair of $350.00 boots. We can have two pair of regulars for the price of one pair of these new ones, and I don't think there will be that much noticeable difference.

I'm just starting to see a pattern here of "THE" this and that along with THE price going up exponentially. It's beginning to look a little exploitive is all I'm saying.

I've owned a couple different pairs of Aldens, and they vary from pair to pair, depending (I assume) on which individual makes them. The man to which you are referring may have the best intentions, but when it comes to the actual employees, I don't think that very much will change. I could be wrong, I suppose we'll see when the product comes out.

TR

..just ordered a pair It's about 130€ more expensive than the standard boot which costs me altogether $470 (boot 320 + shipping 50 + tax/fee 100), which is around 320€.

Maybe this got lost in the mix.

Is Steve interested in getting these so we don't have to pay twice for exchange rates/duties/etc?

Sorry, but we have the aggreement that anything NOT hats is via my desk.

Regards,

Marc

I was wondering that as well Kittlemeir, but he's so darn busy with hats that I doubt he'd have the time or the interest right now. I hope I'm wrong

Peace.

Good luck then and thanks for the offer.

bigrex wrote:$705 USD for a pair of shoes, impressive. That should cover any cost Alden's should ever expect to incur in their production. A little initial sticker shock. That's about par for the course though, no surprises there. I agree with Neolithic on exploring whether just the color could be changed to put it more in line with the current Alden pricing, within a hundred fifty bucks or so.

Nice item to have available but that price for a pair of shoes is kinda absurd really and they may as well not be available since 90% of the people interested in buying these probably wouldnt spend that much on shoes...

I appreciate Marc's effort to bring this product to fans/collectors and I also appreciate Alden's willingness to accommodate this request. As Marc describes, this is not something Alden "needs to do", and neither does Marc!

The standard 405's are still a great boot and are not being replaced. Marc is just offering to provide another option. More options = GOOD!!!

I hope this is a success as I plan on getting on board eventually and would hate to see negative feedback dissuade Marc or other entrepreneurs from pushing for something more, something better or even just something different! It's a great offer and I for one do not find it an "insult".

Tron

Well, I guess PT Barnum was right
The reason aldens (and other companies) can get away with reaming customers is because fans allow them to...im currently working out a deal to produce THE pencil Indy used onscreen , $350- line up folks internet special JUST FOR YOU , im sure i can sell one or two at least.

added:imho i think the boots should be more expensive, they should raise the price higher to 1500- say

I'm just glad there's finally a distributer in Europe that now will cater to the Indy fan. We've read post after post of complaints for years by members who live 'over the big water' about the outrageous price of gear that has to come in country from overseas due to taxes and shipping. Now they have someone close they can deal with.

Regarding the high price of Aldens.... 405's have ALWAYS been pricey, but they have always been a base shoe for insertion of corrective foot gear for the medical industry in the U. S. for decades. Aldens never sold that many until the introduction of the boot by Indy in Raiders. Their product sells out quite quickly now.....but the Tru-Balance system has always had that high price tag....that and the fact they're hand made, just like AB hats.

That's why they never really gave the color much consideration, as the boots were created for function rather than 'form'.

Regards! Michaelson

I'm really not understanding the animosity towards this deal. Sure, it's not a great deal for the US, but the EU has been paying HIGH dollar for regular Aldens for years. I'm thrilled for them they get a good deal on screen accurate boots.

If anyone here has a problem with the price, I wouldn't think Marc would begrudge you to step up and get them made yourself for state side sales. If you're not willing, don't beat up on him about it. Get on it or get over it.

My order has been placed! (I can be very persuasive when I try to talk myself into something!)

Now the wait begins, but like all things from AB I have no doubt the wait will be worth it!

Thanks Marc.

Tron

Tron, you really talked yourself in this one. I am glad you can afford to get these boots. Your really tempting me now, I need to wait though, I don't have the money right now. But I am glad Marc actually is getting us the real deal, thank you Marc. It is a great opportunity for those who live over there in Europe and I am glad Marc can provide something for those Indy fans out there. As for the price, look at Aldens other shoes, they are extremely expensive. You get what you pay for, and if you want the most accurate boot then Marc just opened a great opportunity for you. I just bought a couple of 405's 3-4 months ago so I cannot really justify getting these at the moment. Plus money is tight for me. I just hope I can get in on one of these runs later and just get one pair of these. Thanks again Marc for your stupendous work, outstanading. Hopefully this turns out to be a great success.

IndianaChris

I want this project to succeed. Even those who can't or don't wish to take advantage of this offer will benefit. As stated before, more choice is ultimately a good thing. I don't believe this will result in a massive hike in gear prices or an attempt by vendors to take advantage of collectors with ridiculous offers.
This is a special project agreed to by a manufacturer that doesn't need it and brought to us by a vendor looking to fill a niche. I have several fedoras including some fairly expensive ones. I would love an AB Deluxe, but for me at this time I'm not prepared to spend the money. Many people gladly spend the money on the ABD and for others the choice may be a Federation.
Both great pieces of gear and both great choices. I could see people being upset if Alden were replacing the current 405's and hiking the price.

I'm sure once these boots are out there, someone (Magnoli?) will match them pretty close, creating even more choices!!!

Tron

Well, one thing's for sure (I would hope), you won't be distressing these boots! It would probably be more appropriate to but them on a little marble pedestal with a plaque rather than to regularly wear them and stink them up with toe jam. Just a little reflection there.

I'm sculpting my pedestal as we speak. (no that's not a euphemism!)

Tron

Marc, does that 450€ include tax that those outside the EU shouldn't have to pay?

WOW!!! Ok... whew... That's a lot of money for a pair of shoes! God knows I'd love to have a pair, but there are two tiny little hinderances: 1) the gov't doesn't pay that well, and 2) I had a hard time convincing the wife to let me replace my 5-year-old $100 Dr. Marten's. Sorry, Marc, but I'll have to wait 'til I hit the lottery to afford a pair of Aldens. I wish you all the luck in the world, though!

Regards, Andy

I understand everyone's reaction to the high price, but Marc really does have his hands tied here. I know of an Alden dealer who attempted to offer a special run of shoes at a discount and when Alden got wind of it they put a stop to it. It's an effort to protect all of their dealers.

Also, Aldens cost a premium in Europe. In Germany particularly they are very highly prized. Japan is another market where Aldens are greatly appreciated and they have special models that are availabe in Japan only. Aldens are the best made American shoes--period. Other than Allen Edmonds all the other great old American shoe companies have either gone under (eg, Nettleton) or gone offshore (Johnston & Murphy, Florsheim).

And as Marc says, Alden has been backlogged for awhile, and only take special orders on an individual approval basis. Marc is doing the community a favor with this project, whether you think so or not. I say all of this as someone who won't be ordering a pair of these, either. Keep in mind that to some (many) an AB hat is shockingly expensive.

Good luck with the project, Marc!

Why does Marc have his hands tied? He doesn't have to do anything, he's choosing to offer the over-priced "special edition" boot, not just a regular Alden 405. If he wanted, he could just be a dealer overseas for Alden, but he's choosing to try and get this "the" boot thing going.

TR

Well, if you've been following the history of Adventurebilt, we have never offered anything that could already be purchased elsewhere. Why should we? - What we offer is high end gear for the discriminating fan, as that is where we see ourselves. That's why we started making hats in the first place, that's why we started selling hand made holsters and that's why we chose to get this "the" boot thing going. I could have them copied in China for WAY less and they'd probably look just the same. Nothing wrong in that IMO, just not what SOME gearheads (incl. myself) think of when thinking of "the" boot.

If "close enough" floats your boat, PERFECT! Then you'll have WAY more to chose from then those who've think differently.

Anyway, the reason I ACTUALLY came here was to announce that I sold pair no. 13 this morning and that I'd kindly ask people to give me the size and width they desire. I'll then place my order beginning next month.

Thanks,

Marc

What does it take? - In order to get the boots made to the exact same specs. as "back then", it takes a min. order of 12 pair of boots. Once this amount has been reached, the order will be placed and the boots manufactured. Please understand that once the order is placed, I cannot re-order before the next dozen is full.

How much will they cost? - The retail price is 450 Euro plus shipping per Aldens request.

Then tell them they should name this Alden 450 (not Alden 405).
Really, I don't doubt they worth it, but for a color variation only I could live with the current model. Anyhow, I wouldn't mind buying them as long as I could afford it.

That's GREAT news Marc. Today 13 is my lucky number!

Tron

I'm still REALLY curious as to what the changes are other than the color. Can someone please tell me? Nothing against Marc, I think it's a great idea. But you guys that are buying them...are you ever going to wear them? If you do, will it only be a Halloween/Premiere thing? The way I see it, if you wear them on a regular basis, they will eventually need to be polished. Once they are polished, the color will change slightly no matter how careful you are (trust me shoes are my business). Then guess what..no longer screen authentic. God, I have a feeling that I am about to get verbally B!+{# slapped by A LOT of you, but I think I can take it. I'm just askin is all...

Schmidty

I believe the changes are to be in the construction, as well. Exact duplicates of the way they were made back in the late 70's-early 80's.
Color, stitching, materials, soles, etc.
'Blues

Blues,
thanks that helps me out some. I'm still wondering though. The soles in Raiders appear to be neoprene, with the left and right orthopedic Thomas heels just like Alden is using now. You have to forgive me. This isn't a dig at Marc, this is a dig at Alden. I know about their 12 pair policy but why oh why are they sooo much more? Or is it just the Euros to worthless dollar difference?


Schmidty

Perhaps I'm missing it. But if Alden is having to disrupt their normal production in any way to compensate for the special nature of these shoes.....

....then I fully understand their reason for raising their prices.

Retail pricing is based on VALUE, not on "cost of goods sold". It doesn't matter if the actual cost of the boot is any higher than the regular Alden 405s that are in the catalog. It's a matter of supply and demand AND the fact that they are probably having to inconvenience themselves to some degree in order to produce the shoe.

As such, I think that -- like any other person offering a great product in free enterprise -- they deserve every dime they charge.

In other words, it's a simple issue of understanding free enterprise: something is worth whatever two people agree it's worth. And the easiest way to express one's disapproval of a price is simply to leave your money in your wallet.

Sorry for my soapbox. I just think that it's important to understand that -- just because the boots cost more -- doesn't mean that AB is making more money....or that Alden doesn't deserve to charge more for the custom boot.

Tony Rush

Tony,

THAT makes PERFECT sense. I was kind of led to believe that it was a materials thing. But YOU Sir, are absolutely correct. Hence, I will shut up on the subject.


Schmidty

I'm all ready to buy a pair but I'm going to practice a little patience and wait to see what they look like from the people who already bought them. I'm not in a rush to get a pair but if I'm going to spend that much I would rather wait an see what they look like. Marc I'm sure I will be getting a pair from you on your next go around

Marc wrote:

Well, if you've been following the history of Adventurebilt, we have never offered anything that could already be purchased elsewhere. Why should we? - What we offer is high end gear for the discriminating fan, as that is where we see ourselves. That's why we started making hats in the first place, that's why we started selling hand made holsters and that's why we chose to get this "the" boot thing going. I could have them copied in China for WAY less and they'd probably look just the same. Nothing wrong in that IMO, just not what SOME gearheads (incl. myself) think of when thinking of "the" boot.

I also thought the original slogan was "for the fans at an affordable price"
And don't worry, my friend, you'll ALWAYS find someone to pay these exhorbitant prices, just so they'll be able to "one up" they're fellow fans. This goes with every hobby/sport/collector/whatever. It's just that horrible human nature. People exploit that all the time. Not only that, it's the nature of sales to make people feel that they have an inferior product (regular Alden 405) so they'll pay a higher price for the new product ("the" boot).

TR

I thought the mission of Indy Gear was to find the most accurate gear out there? TR, Marc is not only finding the right gear, he's making it a reality. It *** that it is going to cost more if you live in the US, but there is nothing Marc can do about the conversion rate. The value of the almighty US dollar is dwindling. Marc can tell Alden to cram it, but then someone else will jump on this idea and run with it.....

That's it, TR!!! Contact Alden about making these for us in the States, and YOU can be the US supplier. That way everyone will be happy.
I bet you'll sell a bunch.
'Blues

***what a baby does to a bottle, or its thumb.

schmidty612 wrote:Tony,

THAT makes PERFECT sense. I was kind of led to believe that it was a materials thing. But YOU Sir, are absolutely correct. Hence, I will shut up on the subject.


Schmidty

Just to clarify, my post wasn't directed at anyone in particular. But, thank you for taking it in the spirit in which I intended it! It wasn't meant to offend...just another perspective, hopefully.

Tony

marc,

a question for you....as many of us know, the boots are made in the states. will the lot be then shipped to you where you then have to ship back to the states (for the customers state-side of course)?

if this is the case, would there be any cost savings to be had to ship directly to the customers?

forgive me if you are already making arrangements for alden to ship directly to your north american customers. i was just curious to see if the boot pricing had some shipping costs tacked on which could be minimized.

Texas Raider wrote: I also thought the original slogan was "for the fans at an affordable price"
And don't worry, my friend, you'll ALWAYS find someone to pay these exhorbitant prices, just so they'll be able to "one up" they're fellow fans. This goes with every hobby/sport/collector/whatever. It's just that horrible human nature. People exploit that all the time. Not only that, it's the nature of sales to make people feel that they have an inferior product (regular Alden 405) so they'll pay a higher price for the new product ("the" boot).

Perhaps, but even Adventurebilt is forced to raise prices due to demand. It's simple economics. Supply is not infinite thus the price must go up when demand reaches a certain point. Lots of countries have tried price controls so everyone can have [fill in the blank] at an 'affordable' price. That's when supply dries up so no one has it at any price.

I have no dog in the fight as I'm not a customer of Marc's nor am I going to order these boots. But remember, Marc conceived of the project, took the initiative to contact Alden, convinced them to do it and then they said it's going to cost x-amount. Should Marc have said, okay, although I know some people would be willing to pay this amount I'm going to tell Alden to stuff it in the name of the little guy so that way no one will ever have these boots? Should we be angry because Marc sources the very best materials for his AB Deluxe and thus is forced to charge more? Is our attitude 'I can't have it so no one can!'?

Again, good luck, Marc, and a thank you to you and the other vendors who take the initiative to make things happen for the fan community. Keep up the good work!

Kittlemeier wrote:

Tron7960 wrote: My 405's are a fantastic color that appear to me to look very much like the boots indy wears in the desert truck chase. That they don't appear to mach the color in other scenes is OK with me.

Those were probably on a stuntman's feet on a second unit shoot. Having said that I actually like my brickish Aldens but I wouldn't mind having a proper brown pair.

Not to derail but I know of at least two Alden dealers who have special editions of the 405s and other Alden shoes produced just for their shops so I don't think it's that big of a stretch except for the fact that AB isn't an established Alden dealer. The pair I'd most like to have is cigar cordovan but you have to visit the shop in HI to buy them. They're $650. They have an "ultimate Indy boot" coming out soon and I'm curious that that'll be.

Here's a pic of the cigar cordovan. Hopefully the AB Aldens will look like this without the ridiculous pricetag(or trip to get them, not that I wouldn't want to visit Marc or Steve).

Those are beauties. Here’s a pick of mine. They’re from about Last Crusade era (the brown ones), from the man that turned HF onto them back in the 70’s. Cheers

Indiana G wrote:marc,

a question for you....as many of us know, the boots are made in the states. will the lot be then shipped to you where you then have to ship back to the states (for the customers state-side of course)?

if this is the case, would there be any cost savings to be had to ship directly to the customers?

forgive me if you are already making arrangements for alden to ship directly to your north american customers. i was just curious to see if the boot pricing had some shipping costs tacked on which could be minimized.

Now that is very reasonable inquiry.

Texas Raider wrote:I also thought the original slogan was "for the fans at an affordable price"

Well... if we're talking about Adventurebilt Deluxe.... then it makes perfect sense that people would be paying a premium price for a premium reproduction. Have you faulted him for charging double (and then some) of Steve's price for fedoras? It's really not fair of you.

I know I'm a new guy around here with a lot to learn about Indy gear, particularly the history of Indy gear, but it seems to me these new "old" Aldens have really struck a nerve with some. Some of the opinions expressed and directed towards Marc in my opinion are disproportionate to the subject. Texas Raider, I obviously don't know you from "Adam", but having read all of your posts on this subject and many of your previous posts in other threads, I have to say you are always entertaining. I'm not sure how to interpret some of this. Maybe you just enjoy being the guy who says outrageous things to stir the pot! If you are serious, then Wow! They are just boots, and "optional" at that!

Tron

as many of us know, the boots are made in the states. will the lot be then shipped to you where you then have to ship back to the states (for the customers state-side of course)?

if this is the case, would there be any cost savings to be had to ship directly to the customers?

Gil, the boots will be shipped to me and I'll then forward them to the customers. Lemme tell you a story that John from Alden told me: One day the personal assistent from a famous Hollywood actor called up Alden and said that they want a pair of 999 for Mr. Celebrity The gal at Alden look at the retailer list and told him that no, Mr. Celebrity wasn't listed as an official retailer. The assisten continued that he'd be the personal assisten of Mr. Celebrity in Hollywood and that he'd like to get a pair of 999 for Mr. Celebrity. Oh, Hollywood the gal replyed. Yeah with got a retailer there. Please contact that shoe shop directly. And that's it Alden doesn't deal with the end user (well, the exception being me who also ordered a pair for myself) and they won't ship to them neither. Unfortunately.

@Adam: the left ones are pretty darn perfectly the color I'm going after Adam! Very nice flat brown. Thanks for sharing!

Regards,

Marc

Who's angry? I'm not angry in the slightest.Hey, you guys do what you want,I really don't care if he charges $2000.00 and you guys still buy them (which you would). I'm just trying to make a point which no one is hearing. Remember, when you say 'they're just boots', remember that when the $700.00 chunk comes out of your checking account, and nobody can tell the difference of the boots but you. Aahhh the satisfaction ;-).

TR

Texas Raider wrote:
and nobody can tell the difference of the boots but you. Aahhh the satisfaction ;-).

TR

That can be said about every piece of the gear, really. You could buy the $99 Route 66 look alike Indy jacket, or a Tony Nowak $1000 Crystal Skull jacket, and the no one but a serious gearhead will know the difference. No one said we were a sane group of fans.
'Blues

As much as I wan't to wait for a pair of these I may have to bite the bullet and buy some this time around...

Texas Raider wrote:Who's angry? I'm not angry in the slightest.Hey, you guys do what you want,I really don't care if he charges $2000.00 and you guys still buy them (which you would). I'm just trying to make a point which no one is hearing. Remember, when you say 'they're just boots', remember that when the $700.00 chunk comes out of your checking account, and nobody can tell the difference of the boots but you. Aahhh the satisfaction ;-).

TR

Texas Raider, when I see you using language like "exploiting" and "that horrible human nature", it makes me wonder why you're even on the forum at all.

Surely you understand that this entire forum is nothing more than a demonstration of "that horrible human nature" and our desire to pursue something that we WANT and do not NEED. I can't help to be a little amused at your argument that it's okay for the "human nature" that allows you to spend $320 on a regular pair of Aldens.....but that everyone else's "human nature" is faulty for allowing them to spend a higher price on a more screen-accurate boot.

So, I'm confused. While you say you "don't care if they charge $2,000"......it seems to me that you care enough to continually invest your time and energy in this debate. Do you feel that you have some responsibility to this situation that extends beyond your OWN choice not to buy these custom boots?

I'm not trying to make you "wrong" for your opinion. But, I would also say that you shouldn't be making other people "wrong" for being willing to buy something they want.

Because -- at the end of the day -- NONE of this is essential to our day-to-day living. It's just a hobby. It's not like we're curing cancer here. Or claim to be.

Tony Rush

Tony, you need to understand that this forum is for the discussion and debate of both pro AND con of the gear...not just 'yay, new gear' discussions.

Yes, TR does chooses strong wording when he posts his thoughts and opinions, and your point is well taken, but that aside, his points are based on his thoughts on the topic, and that's why this forum and site was created. THAT'S why he's here. You too, this being a hobby or not.

Individuals are dropping some big bucks on some of these items. A balanced discussion is needed before someone writes that check.

Thank YOU for posting your opinion.

Regards! Michaelson