Club Obi Wan

Naturally, I will fill everyone in on whatever messages I receive. I'm hoping that he only didn't explain himself fully in his initial message because he really does have a lot to say. That said, I still don't think we're gonna get any real satisfaction. But I am somewhat satisfied knowing that we aren't crazy, and I don't have to feel guilty about calling the guy out. Lord knows I started off by praising the guy, then being patient, then defending him, then being concerned, but enough is enough. No one can say that I jumped the gun on this. I feel vindicated.

DHW

Daren,

If anything, that will at least bring a sense of closure.
Being strung along indefinately is worse than being told straight up that you are being ripped off!

Again, as Dan previously stated, Graeme has been officially stripped of his vendor status on COW. He is currently still a member as of now, but the staff has yet to hear back from him after sending an inquiry as to his status and whereabouts. That said, COW/IndyGear cannot provide any legal recourse or help anyone who is having issues with Midland Whips. As stated in the classifieds and rules of the site, it's caveat emptor, meaning you buy and sell at your own risk. COW/IndyGear is not responsible for any transactions. We still hope that anyone with outstanding orders can rectify their situation with Graeme or their financial institutions, but technically you are on your own in that regard. That said, we do not desire to have members or vendors who take advantage of the community associated with this site.

Fantastic Daren, Kwad, and others! Maybe there is some hope for you guys to get your money back. I wonder if he's bothered to log into COW lately....

I can't wait to see the reply and how things turn out.

*edit*
Looks like he hasn't come into COW yet to see all of this.

Bueller? Bueller?

Any replies from the guy yet?

Knowing Daren like I do if Graeme sent a reply it would be posted here already. but I guess we should still give it a little more time.

I got my message from Graeme,

He explains his situation, but he also promises to come on COW and explain himself, so publicly I'm going to let him do that.

DHW

Good to hear. You got your explanation...so now for the money.

Curious to hear his explanation and course of action.

OK guys, firstly let me say sorry to all of you. I cant say that enough because I have indeed been a royal F##K UP. I'm not going to lie any more or B.S you. This is my situation and I know most of you won't believe it and I don't blame you. I lost all my money, you could say yours too, in a deal that went really wrong and was left with nothing. I hit the bottle over Christmas and buried my head in the sand. My family don't know about this as I'm too embarrassed and ashamed of myself to tell them and you until now. I nearly split with my girlfriend and have been really down. Thank you Daren for kicking me up the ### and making me realize what I've done to you guys. I'm working 6 days a week in a job doing what I've done since school. I didn't want to face you guys as I really don't know what to do. I will refund any one waiting for whips from me but I need you to understand that I need to get the money first. I've been so close to jumping off a bridge and ending all this s##t thats happening to me, Mainly after hitting the bottle. I'm not expecting forgiveness and I am NOT taking whip orders anymore and never will again. I just want you all to get your money back but that will take time. I've tried for a loan to pay you all back but can't get one anywhere due to my bad credit. I don't know what else to say other than sorry again. Please feel free to say what you wish to me. I will not disappear again and will be back on here later and same time tomorrow. REALLY REALLY SORRY to you ALL. And sorry for sticking my head in the sand and ignoring all of you as I just couldn't deal with this.
Your truthfully from the heart,
Graeme the F##K up

Graeme, let me be the first to say that I'm glad you didn't jump off a bridge, and I'm not saying that out of a concern for my money or my order. I think I speak for all of us when I say that what matters most is your health and well-being. None of us want to see you split with your girlfriend, and I know that you are father to two beautiful little ones.

What matters is that they have a dad that cares about them and is going to stick around for a long long time. I wish you the best with that.

That said, I really appreciate you getting it together enough to come back and explain. It takes a big man to do that, and for the record, most men wouldn't.

Now on this next point, I can't speak for everyone here, but I can speak for myself: yes, I would like my order or my money, but I can wait. I don't care if I'm the last person you make this right with, but it would speak volumes if you made this right with someone as soon as possible so that they can at least vouch for you. That would certainly give the rest of us hope that you are true to your word.

And while your whipmaking business may be ruined, I think you are a talented guy, and in time, if making whips is still something that matters to you, I think you can still turn this thing around. If not whips, please know that I'm pulling for you in whatever line of work you choose.

Thank you for coming back.

Daren

Thanks guys though I don't want anyone to feel sorry for me. I've done this to myself. I have your whips here made Daren. All I need to do is shellac the last one and I will do that Sunday and get my girlfriend ship Monday while I'm at work I PROMISE you. You will have the tracking number right away when I get home I mean it this time. No more lies. I will try my #### hardest to set things right if it takes me a year or more I will do it for you guys. I'm not a bad person or a thief. I have lied and I'm truly sorry. I am no con man either. The number on my site is an old one and I will give anyone here my number when I'm ready to face you voice to voice but I can't just yet, please understand. This is a small stepping stone for me and I feel so much better for facing you all. I'm sorry if I've gave whip makers a bad name as I know most of you are supered and a million times better than me.
Thanks again,
Graeme,

P.S please don't repeat any of this on face book as I don't want my family to know what I have done. I just can't face the look in their eyes if they Knew.

I'm so pleased to see Graham come to face the music. It's a really good sign. It's quite easy to slip into a deep dark hole and from there it's very easy to lose perspective.
Graham, "ALL THINGS MUST PASS" - whether it's good or bad, nothing lasts forever.Everything changes. And one day you#ll be in an altogether different position.
My best wishes to you, and everything WILL work out!

I know I have nothing new to add but...thanks for the reply Graeme.

I wish the best to you and hope you do make things right.

Graeme,

I'm glade you didn't do something stupid and hurt yourself or worse. You have children, you need to be strong for them and come clean with you family. People make mistakes and that is all to human. I can't speak for everyone here who you owe money or a whip for but this place has shown me that most members if you told the truth from the start, would have been forgiving and understanding.

I think trust has been thrown out the window and I'm sorry to say that about you. I like you very much and think you are a very skilled person. I went on a campiagn to promote you every way I could. I'm hurt by what has happened and it will be hard to build any trust by me and maybe others here.

I think you took the first step by coming in here and others places and posted ( what I hope is the truth this time). You will need to start making it up to all this people, one at a time and prove yourself once again. It will be a long road but I think you should have and should still lean on the folks here. Let them know, step by step what is going on. Keep them in the loop. You owe it to all these folks who are waiting for your product.

Here my number if you need to talk, any time of the day or night 971-246-1832. Don't worry about waking me up. I can wake up on a dime and function. Done it for years ( firefighter). Don't do anything stupid. You owe your family, your two little ones. Give up the drink first and for most. Again you owe it to those little ones. They are darn cute. Put a picture up in every part of your house, work, car, etc, etc. Draw strength from them.

Don't give up.

Give me a call.

Hey, Graham;

Just wanted to let you know that a couple of guys got word to me about what's going on via the inter-webs across the Indyverse and told me about your situation. I've been sober for 13 months and I have some idea what you're going through. I've screwed things up a lot, hit the bottle to numb all the emotions which just makes things worse. Then there's the keeping things hushed up and the sleepless nights wondering what would happen if anyone found out and what you would do then. We always assume that everything is going to turn out wrong; it's always the worst case scenario.

Fact is, it's NEVER as bad as we think it is. Things are never so horrible. I've been in plenty of scratches and I'm still here! If I can make it through all that life (and my pride) has put me through, imagine what you can do. Come on, guy!

• One, Admit that you were wrong and ask for forgiveness. OK - I've done wrong and I need to apologize to everyone here for my obnoxious behavior. I am sorry. You've admitted that, too. That's a huge step and you should at least be proud of yourself.
  
  Two - Fix the problem. Just do it. Stop the bad behavior, start/restart the good actions. Make good on your orders.
  
  Three - Forgive yourself. That's my hardest part. It's so easy to beat yourself up, but you need to stop. Guilt is a weighty luxury nobody can afford in our position.

Just because you F##ked up doesn't mean you're a F##k up.

If you need help or advice, send me a PM or an IM. Also, John Penman has my number. I'm here to help.

I won't feel sorry for you Gaeme, but I will say it takes guts to speak up after all this time, with so much negativity flying about. You may not think so, but owning up to one's own... you-know-what... is a sign of strength. You may not want your family to know right now, but one day it will feel good to come clean and put it in the past. As for this community, as long as you work to make things right, I'm sure you will be able to mend the wounds. The people here are just that way.

Graeme, I'm glad that you came back and told us straight up what your situation is. It takes some guts to do that. I hope you the best, and that you can satisfy all your customers.

Fisk...
That was some of the best advice I've ever read on an online forum...(Admittedly, the "pool" isn't that deep for the most part, but still)..
Bloody well said.
Graeme, I said over on the Lounge too, but talking with people is always the best thing to do in a situation like that..No one will kill you for delivering late, or canceling orders, but hiding makes you lose a lot more than work....You lose friends too, and nothing is worse than that mate..
Good luck with the fix-up..

Graeme,
You spoke up - kudos! Shooting straight from the hip is the best way to do things. You've taken a big step forward - now keep stepping forward. It's not always easy, but you'll be happy that you did - you're already back on the good path. Life is full of lessons, and you're proving you are willing to own up - good on you!

I think the Bard wrote:
to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

--Hamlet

Welcome back Graeme


Having come back to admit your faults is a difficult ,humbling experience, but also one from where you will draw great strength. As far as financial setbacks, a lot of us here have been in that position, at least me anyway. Let me tell you if I may, money comes and goes, but the relationships you build with people are essentially what your life is. The bottle is never a good source of comfort, though it may seem so at first. I completely agree with Mr. Penman: draw your strength from you two little ones. They are counting on you. I also have two small kids and it is all for them.

If you can begin to show the people here through your actions that you want to rectify what you have done, then you will be on the road to recovery. You have a great talent for whip making, something that could go towards giving you more financial freedom and job satisfaction and enhance you ability to provide for your family. Start making things right here with people, and the rest will fall into place. It is never as bad as it seems.

Again, welcome back!

Bravo

Hi guys,
Thank you all for your advise and understanding. I am so sorry I didn't explain in the beginning as I should have had more faith in you guys. The drinking is a problem in its self that I'm trying to sort out for my kids more than anyone. I'm passed the stage of doing anything stupid, I am now stronger than that at least. After coming on here yesterday, I feel better and know I'm doing the right thing for you guys and it feels good. Admitting my mistake and situation has helped me. I will call you John but it will be the weekend when I'm able to get credit on my phone. I understand that the trust is gone and I would be the same. I'm sorry I lied to you and I'm a jerk for doing so. I have let everyone down. This is the truth and I know most won't believe me. I really want to make this right. All I can do now is put my words into action and hopefully, sooner rather than later you will see me making progress and giving back what I owe to each and everyone of you who have ordered from me. I'm going to do this and hopefully one day you guys can forgive me and let me back into the community as a fellow gear head and collector. NOT selling anything as a vendor or anything else. I know this is a long road and I'm ready to do right.
My deepest regret for the things I have done,
Graeme.

Hello Graeme,

It does take a lot of guts to man up and face the music.
I appreciate the fact that you were willing to do that.

I must admit however, that I am still angry and I do not yet trust you. (I'm sorry to sound harsh, but, I must speak the truth.)
However, those feelings may just change, depending on your future actions.

One thing I recommend, if I may, is that you contact ALL of your customers and speak to them directly. I think personally and privately contacting them may go much farther in healing the wounds then just posting the news in a forum thread.

Hopefully, you'll be able to make this right with everyone (including yourself) and put this whole bad spot behind you.

kwad wrote:Hello Graeme,

It does take a lot of guts to man up and face the music.
I appreciate the fact that you were willing to do that.

I must admit however, that I am still angry and I do not yet trust you. (I'm sorry to sound harsh, but, I must speak the truth.)
However, those feelings may just change, depending on your future actions.

One thing I recommend, if I may, is that you contact ALL of your customers and speak to them directly. I think personally and privately contacting them may go much farther in healing the wounds then just posting the news in a forum thread.

Hopefully, you'll be able to make this right with everyone (including yourself) and put this whole bad spot behind you.

I agree, trust is going to take a long time to build back. I think this is the first step but I'm not very trusting either. The question is would you have done it if Daren didn't force your hand. I don't think so. I know this is harsh but look at what has happened these past several months. You made this mess now it's time to fix it. I think you took the first step, thanks to Daren. Now I think kwad is right. You need to contact each person and tell them what's going on. Give them the option on how they would like things resolved. Take them one at a time. Person waiting the longest should go first. Then work done the list.

Again, if you are being truthful now my offer to help you is still out there for you to take.

John

kwad wrote:Hello Graeme,

It does take a lot of guts to man up and face the music.
I appreciate the fact that you were willing to do that.

I must admit however, that I am still angry and I do not yet trust you. (I'm sorry to sound harsh, but, I must speak the truth.)
However, those feelings may just change, depending on your future actions.

One thing I recommend, if I may, is that you contact ALL of your customers and speak to them directly. I think personally and privately contacting them may go much farther in healing the wounds then just posting the news in a forum thread.

Hopefully, you'll be able to make this right with everyone (including yourself) and put this whole bad spot behind you.

Hi Kwad,
Your right. I will do that. I know your angry and who wouldn't be. I'm not expecting any trust from you guys yet, I will earn it by doing you guys right, the right way. I will contact you all privately to sort this out on a 1 to 1 basis and keep you all posted and up to date on here. It will take a few days to contact you all as I only have a few hours each night after work and I'm still making things right with my girlfriend Samantha. Please allow a few days for direct contact as you know I have a lot of people to contact and set things right with.

John, I will try and call you before the weekend, about this time of day. I'll try tomorrow if thats ok with you? Any help/advice would be VERY welcome and appreciated. You guys are really great people and again I'm so sorry for what I have done.
If you have any questions please ask and I promise I will answer as soon as I come online.
Many thanks guys,
Graeme.

To all concerned,

I think that while Graeme completely understands that the proof is in the pudding, which will take time and patience for all those concerned, I think it shows a lot of character that he is back, listening, responding, and displaying a lot of humility. I mean let's face it, there's no real profit for him here except for him to get his soul in tact. He could have easily just kept on ignoring us. If he is truly is broke, as I believe he is, there's no monetary gain here in satisfying those of us with outstanding orders. Clearly he wants to make this right for righteousness' sake. Any profits he ever made in whip-making are long gone and he's doing this, I'm certain, so that he can live with himself and sleep at night. To that, I give a big BRAVO!

As I said before, I really do hope that in making things right and in finishing the whips that are yet to be plaited, you find hope and strength in your creativity, and that with grace, love and support, you won't have to completely turn your back on this talent. Ironically, in one of the messages I sent Graeme almost two months ago that I know he didn't read until a couple of days ago (well before I become concerned about the whereabouts of my order/my money) I urged Graeme to raise his prices. Everyone I've ever shown my Midland Whips kip hide 6 footer to agreed that it was a very well made whip, and that it was WELL worth the price. We all wondered how Graeme made any money though. Without speculating down that road any further I just want to emphasize, Graeme, your talent. While it may not be for business at this point, I do believe that your talent for whip-making is worth salvaging. Naturally, your health and your family and what's best for them matter most and should be your main focus always, but don't forget that we grow from our passions and our hobbies, and I know what a passion you have for this universe, its clear from your work.

While I don't regret going out of my way to get your attention, speaking ill of you as I did in my anger and frustration, if there is anything I can do to repair your reputation among our community or with your family, I will do it (once I get my whips, of course! )

God bless you, my friend. Stay on this path.


Daren Henry W

...And don't give up on your whips! From what I have seen and heard, you have great talent. I for one would STILL like to order one someday...
You are on the right path to correcting the problem. Communication is key! It always feels better to talk with friends when you are down.

DarenHenryW wrote:To all concerned,

I think that while Graeme completely understands that the proof is in the pudding, which will take time and patience for all those concerned, I think it shows a lot of character that he is back, listening, responding, and displaying a lot of humility. I mean let's face it, there's no real profit for him here except for him to get his soul in tact. He could have easily just kept on ignoring us. If he is truly is broke, as I believe he is, there's no monetary gain here in satisfying those of us with outstanding orders. Clearly he wants to make this right for righteousness' sake. Any profits he ever made in whip-making are long gone and he's doing this, I'm certain, so that he can live with himself and sleep at night. To that, I give a big BRAVO!

As I said before, I really do hope that in making things right and in finishing the whips that are yet to be plaited, you find hope and strength in your creativity, and that with grace, love and support, you won't have to completely turn your back on this talent. Ironically, in one of the messages I sent Graeme almost two months ago that I know he didn't read until a couple of days ago (well before I become concerned about the whereabouts of my order/my money) I urged Graeme to raise his prices. Everyone I've ever shown my Midland Whips kip hide 6 footer to agreed that it was a very well made whip, and that it was WELL worth the price. We all wondered how Graeme made any money though. Without speculating down that road any further I just want to emphasize, Graeme, your talent. While it may not be for business at this point, I do believe that your talent for whip-making is worth salvaging. Naturally, your health and your family and what's best for them matter most and should be your main focus always, but don't forget that we grow from our passions and our hobbies, and I know what a passion you have for this universe, its clear from your work.

While I don't regret going out of my way to get your attention, speaking ill of you as I did in my anger and frustration, if there is anything I can do to repair your reputation among our community or with your family, I will do it (once I get my whips, of course! )

God bless you, my friend. Stay on this path.


Daren Henry W

Hi Daren,
Thank you again for understanding. I'm so glad you said the things you did to call me out because it gave me the push I needed to solve this huge problem I have caused. My sister is a hard case and forgot about that already. I think only I can repair my reputation here by doing as I've already stated, doing you guys right and proving myself with actions. I didn't make much profit at all but loved making whips and thats why I was doing it. I will always make whips as I do love it so much, though only as a hobby for myself. Obviously, only after this mess is cleaned up. I am flat broke and any whips or refunds could take months to sort out. I am explaining this in private messages to customers waiting. I will get around to messaging all of you really soon. I will stay on this path as long as it takes and forever after.
Hi coronado3,
It means a lot to me that you would still consider ordering from me after all this but I won't be selling whips any more. I have learned a huge lesson from this and think its best I stay a collector only.
Thanks again,
Graeme.

_ wrote:Just a recommendation? I'd think of locking this. You're at a place where you need to put this stake in the sand and move forward. You've done what you need to do here - and based on experience if you get stuck here at the "coming clean" part you never engage in the fixing it part.

Been here, bud. Happened when an affair came to light with my first wife. It was a bad time. It felt good to come clean, but you almost become good at apologizing - and scared to move on to the hard work ahead.

And RF's advice? Good framework from my experience. The hardest one is forgiving yourself. I couldn't. Because I couldn't, my marriage of 16 years ended. Still have not forgiven myself and don't know I ever will.

But my advice? Lock this and avoid it turning into a pity party. You have work to do. And I'm also available. I won't publish my cell number due to my own stalker out here. PM me if you'd like to hear a non-pep talk version of what you can expect.

Seriously - lock this thread. All these well-intentioned people are going to bog you down.

Regards,

-T

OK well said. I have said what I needed and had to say. Now on to proving I mean well. The hard work has started and I'm determined to get out of this hole I've dug for myself. I'm sorry to hear about your situation back then. OK no more replies here from me on this thread until I've sorted out the longest waiting customer. I'll prove myself to you all I promise. I'll speak with everyone waiting individually and shed light on my situation so you know whats happening. Thanks for that _. Any questions from anyone please PM me,
Kindest regards,
Graeme.