Club Obi Wan

rick5150 wrote:Sometimes money accelerates that quest.

......or stops it dead in it's tracks.

Regards! Michaelson

Wow a whole nother page sense lunch!

Thanks Skippy! That makes my day. (see the picture below)

What's yours mesure (and what size is your jacket)?

Now Bink, I only count one person that was against Peter charging more for modifications. Have you been skimming again? I guess one counts as "some (not all)" though.

As for some one asking for a big list mods and demanding the base price, I would have told them, "that's the price, take it or leave it". (don't need to be loosing money)

And I do see now, with some examination, that the pockets aren't as easy to resize as I thought. I was thinking they were just cut and sewn on to the out side w/o any cutting to the major jacket pieces.

WOW We need to have a Steel Cage Indy Gear Summit!! Now THAT would work out some aggression, and weed out the tough guys from the not-so-tough guys. Let's have an East coast rumble, and a West coast rumble, and then we'll send the winners to the Battle Royal somewhere mid-US.

Wait, that won't work, we'd need the Euro-Contingent as well. Screw it, my money is on Canyon, whooping all your butts!
'Blues

Oh, come on now, Blues....we've all seen Raiders. The ones who own a Smith will just pull them out and blow away the ones who don't, and then we'd have made absolutely no progress in reaching a conclusion to any of the debates.



Regards! Michaelson

Darn, how could I forget the ol' S&W trick?? I guess a Battle Royale is a bad idea, with everyone packing firearms, lol. We'll have to think of something.
'Blues

At that time, though, you were the exception to the rule rather than the 'norm' in terms of unusual orders...so I'd request a half order of crow if I were you.

Regards! Michaelson

It's an acquired taste. I've eaten my share, and it kind of reminds you of chicken......but then, so does fried lizard, so take that for what it's worth.

Regards! Michaelson

_ wrote:A very patient, charitable, and beautiful woman (my wife) reminded me last night that I supplied a "laundry list" of mods to Peter in August of 2000. I'll take my crow medium rare please...

Michaelson, I don't see big lists as the norm now, at least judging by this thread. Some mods yes, but not like the crazy people. 8-[

I'd say Peter would be the best one to answer THAT one, old friend....but based on what we USED to do, and what's done and read about in post after 'waiting on my new jacket order' post, BELIEVE ME....it's changed tremendously in the past decade!!!

You just don't understand....the only points of information that we USED to be asked for was what off the rack size we NORMALLY wore, and what our weight and height was. Then we were asked what style jacket we were interested in. Period. End of order. That was entire exchange of information between ourselves and Wested.

Now YOU tell ME if things aren't different.

Regards! Michaelson

I don't frequent the new jacket posts much any more (and look what I've done with mine ) so I'm not up on what people are asking for. I was thinking x-box stitching and maybe to leave off the leather inside the zipper would be most frequently asked for. And even that is a change from what you discribed. I wasn't saying it's not different, just that my order isn't that common. (to my knowledge) And yes, Peter be the one that really knows what is actually common.

Understood!

Regards! Michaelson

Michaelson wrote:Oh, come on now, Blues....we've all seen Raiders. The ones who own a Smith will just pull them out and blow away the ones who don't, and then we'd have made absolutely no progress in reaching a conclusion to any of the debates.



Regards! Michaelson

I'm glad that I'm wearing a Raiders jacket and not Temple of Doom! Adds a whole new meaning to the "Doom" part.

Example: Have a painter come to paint your living room Flat White. When he comes to paint tell him I want the trim painted a different color I want one wall painted gray and while you are at it paint the Kitchen too.

See if his price does not double or triple on the spot.

The same applies here.

LOL!!! Hilarious, but also very true. Well put, G-MANN. I enjoyed that answer quite a bit.

I think that is what most people are saying in this thread. If there are add ons, people should be prepared to pay for them, and Peter should charge accordingly. I'm not one to nit-pick every single detail of the jacket. In my eyes, Peter makes the perfect jacket, and I'm happy with the basics.

Some people aren't, and want some customization.

Is that a bad thing???

Is it a bad thing for Peter to make extra money, if he puts in the extra work. I don't think so.

I love the Wested prices where they are, and I think Peter has been great at keeping his jackets affordable. I mean, where else on earth can you get a piece of film history like this, made by the creator of said piece??
I think everyone has a right to their opinion regarding this, without people flaming them, or threatening them with "if we discussed this in person, it would be a different story" mentality. There is no need for "threats", because they come through as uber lame on the internet.

After all, Peter has the last word in this. If he wants to do some special custom work, expect to pay for said work accordingly.

Me, I'll take a size 48reg.
'Blues

_ wrote: I'll take my crow medium rare please...

LMAO!!! This is just too much!!!

Why not not keep it simple. As an example, if you go on Dell's site to customize a computer, there are options which deduct from, add to , or don't change the final price. There are options that Wested should keep at no extra charge. Nothing additional, just things like sliders or D-rings, stitching, stuff that you do to basically finalize a Jacket. Peter should come up with a price list that if you want (blank) done it'll add (blank) to the final price. Doesn't have to be as elaborate as a drop down menu, but a simple list of all the possible options that have been spoken about on this forum. I'm sure there is someone here that would even volunteer their time and experience to assist with this if Wested needed any help.

For everyone else that's knocking these people for customizing their jackets, relax. This is supposed to be a CUSTOM jacket. What does that word tell you? It's supposed to be like you want it. Size, details, etc. However, if you ordered a jacket a certain way then get upset beucase things start to fail on the jacket, don't blame anyone but yourself. Don't go attacking Wested. It was made the way you wanted and that's that.

WhipWarrior,

I just calls 'em as I sees 'em.

Cheers,
G-MANN

Just to put on my administrator hat for a moment....this has been, in my opinion, a very fair exchange of opinions, and all given at the request of Mr. Peter Botwright of Wested Leather, who I'm sure is sitting back and watching this go along before he makes any decisions to change his price structure.

That said, and to address the points above, if ANYONE starts throwing flames at each other, regardless of who started what, ALL parties involved will be dealt with administratively, as this is NOT a battle ground to exchange barbs. It will not be allowed to continue, and as has been posted before in triplicate, will NOT be tolerated in the operation of the site. It takes two to argue, and to anyone who decides to make it personal, everyone who gets involved will pay the price, and that price is plainly posted in the rules of the site. Ok, everyone has been reminded.

Ok, that's been said....again.... ...so I'll put my regularily scheduled programming fedora BACK on and go sit in the corner to listen.

Regards! Michaelson

IndyDoc - That's interesting 5" yoke is about optimum I would say

I have a 40" chest Wested which is supposed to be a Raiders pattern, but the shoulder yoke/seam set up is TOD/LC, so the yoke depth is 6" I think (unfortunately I'm at work so I don't have the details to hand). Having studied the Raiders jacket on the screen, IMO I would put the yoke as being 4.5" - 5" in depth.

I have an old pre-authentic brown Wested in limbo with a friend in the US that I bought from Doug C here, which has many of the features you ordered, although I'm not sure the yoke is small enough as I don't have it in hand to measure it.

Sigh....Ok, you, let's go behind the barn...AGAIN...so you can kick my butt and get it out of your system.

(I wear _ down that way. To see the proper technique, watch the movie 'Princess Bride' to see how it is done to beat a giant. )

Bring it on, Big Boy!

High regards! Michaelson

.......as......you......wish......


Regards! Michaelson

'ello.

My name is _.

You touch my Wested.

Prepare to die...

I assume the 1" piece is considered part of the collar and not the yolk?

Re: Disrespect
I don't see that requesting modifications is disrespecting Peter. I'm not saying the changes are better than what he does standard. (which would be rather disrespectful) I think we all know why the jacket is made how it is now and that's to make it last longer and be more user friendly. I just wanted what I wanted and expected to pay extra for it.

The shorter yoke, is quite a 70's feature. If you are in the UK check out the leather jackets in "Life on Mars" Very nice fitted jackets, along with some shocking ones! LOL

Minnesota Jones wrote:'ello.
My name is _.
You touch my Wested.
Prepare to die...

HIGH regards!

Michaelson

Dang it......where's my old King avatar when I need it.

Regards! Michaelson

& back O/T...

Tone - Peter posted in Agent 5's Raiders jacket master thread that the yoke got extended to stop the jacket riding back on the shoulders & to make it easier to get the back out of one piece of leather, especially for those bigger people amongst us

I've also been told by Gerry at Wested that the higher shoulder seam can be more restrictive across the shoulders for arm movement.

But agreed, a Raiders jacket isn't a Raiders jacket without the short yoke

IndyDoc - Yes, that 1" is the collar stand & not the yoke

Had another TWO full paged special request order today.
twenty request specified everything including pocket sizes,flaps size & placements facings, collar size at tip in centre etc etc.
Having read ALL this and checked with my patterns 90 per cent of it was standard sizing anyway so why give me all this when all I ask for is height, chest, sleeve and jacket size.
This person could and should have checked all this out himself and given me about half a page worth instead I have had to read and check it all.
See what I mean including a special nickel zip which I do not have.
So my thinking is this two tier system of a custom SIZED jacket as per my existing order form at £149 and a custom MADE with extra specs starting at £169. Not much more for those who want more and can afford it and a small increase for those of lesser means.
How does that grab you.?Also do you think the crusade pocket made to hold the diary should only be on LC and the raiders & TOD the original piped pocket?
Cheers Peter

As a point of order then, where would a request such as mine fall, Peter....longer sleeves and a zip on the inside pocket.

Is it custom 'sized', or custom 'made'?

As to the pocket question, I ALWAYS thought the LC jacket just had the diary pocket, and the Raiders/Temple jackets the smaller pocket. That's the way it SHOULD be, in my opinion. Placing the larger pocket on all the jackets may be one of the factors confusing folks when they get their jackets and can't seen to figure out why proportionally they don't match what they're seeing on the screen.

Regard! Michaelson

Yes sir, Peter, the two tier system seems fair to me. If a person wants custom changes then they should expect to pay a "custom" price.

I also like the idea of each jacket having its original pocket size.

My fedora is off to you for putting up with all of us crazy people!

Sounds good Peter. I also think the LC pocket should only go on the LC jacket unless requested other wise. I think Michaelson is right, that it is confusing to get LC on a Raiders jacket when you expected Raiders pockets.

I wondered how much of the "screen accurate" list was standard and that pretty much answers that. The only reason people are specifying is that we DON'T know what the standard mesuremens are. I wouldn't have listed everything I did if I knew that they were standard.

These long lists....are they L.O.U.S.es?

Peter,

I'm being dense here, when you say "piped" pocket, you ARE talking about the outside cargo pockets aren't you?

You're not talking about the "minimal facing" pocket on the inside are you? That could be construed as a "piped pocket" to dumb-dumbs like me.

Best regards,

Kt.

PETER wrote:How does that grab you?

I'm also interested in the answer to Michaelson's question...having slightly long arms.

PETER wrote:Also do you think the crusade pocket made to hold the diary should only be on LC and the raiders & TOD the original piped pocket?
Cheers Peter

Yes!

And the two tier thing sounds very fair and logical to me.

Has anybody heard from Tone lately? I'm getting worried about him...


...okay, I'll give it a shot.

What is the definitive difference between an 80s fit and a regular?

I'm assuming you want an answer from Peter on this, eh? Otherwise, the standard answer is that the 80's fit is 'slimmer' or more athletic. I.e., no extra room, more form-fitting in the body. But as to your original question, I haven't got clue one how this would affect the yolk.

Tone, I've often wonder the same thing. Hopefully the MAN himself will chime in and put this one to rest.

Kt Templar wrote:Peter,

I'm being dense here, when you say "piped" pocket, you ARE talking about the outside cargo pockets aren't you?

You're not talking about the "minimal facing" pocket on the inside are you? That could be construed as a "piped pocket" to dumb-dumbs like me.

Best regards,

Kt.

Actually I think you may be right KT. I think the piped pocket is the inner one with out the extra leather.

Tone,
Peter is probably asleep by now. (I think it's about 2 am over there) Give him a day or three. (we've gone through two pages sence his first post to the second one. )

I was actually refering to the the inside pocket which on the LC was made bigger and with leather surround to hold the diary, but I also take on board the larger LC cargo pockets which we have been putting on all jackets as standard for some years as folks complained that on the original Raiders pocket the hand warmer part were too small for the hands. and of course it was more practical for us.But as it appears there is a need to differ maybe we could have Michealson or someone of great knowledge have a poll on this subject and I will react accordingly.

As for 80's cut we raise the back yoke by 1" and a little out of the waist as for the sleeves we have recency tapered the pattern for all models as standard.
http://www.indyjacket.com/indyjacket/images/pocket1.jpg

RE 2 page specs.
ANOTHER ONE TODAY AND THE PENNY HAS DROPPED! SHOOT AGENT 5!
Just kidding but I have suddenly realizied that they are emailing me copies of the agent 5 ultimate screen accurate specs list.
Two things are wrong an 8.75 inch side strap is far too long and with a leather inside facing the zip CANNOT go to the bottom only to the bottom of the facing where it joins the hem.
I am off to Italy/Greece for ten days from tomorrow on business and will sort any or all the new specs and prices on my return. That gives you time to debate and let me know what to do.
Cheers
Peter

PETER wrote: So my thinking is this two tier system of a custom SIZED jacket as per my existing order form at £149 and a custom MADE with extra specs starting at £169. Not much more for those who want more and can afford it and a small increase for those of lesser means.
How does that grab you.?

!

PETER wrote: As for 80's cut we raise the back yoke by 1" and a little out of the waist as for the sleeves we have recency tapered the pattern for all models as standard.
http://www.indyjacket.com/indyjacket/images/pocket1.jpg

RE 2 page specs.
ANOTHER ONE TODAY AND THE PENNY HAS DROPPED! SHOOT AGENT 5!
Just kidding but I have suddenly realizied that they are emailing me copies of the agent 5 ultimate screen accurate specs list.
Two things are wrong an 8.75 inch side strap is far too long and with a leather inside facing the zip CANNOT go to the bottom only to the bottom of the facing where it joins the hem.
Cheers
Peter

There you go Tone!

Thanks for informing us on the zipper lenght Peter. Just tell us what can't or won't be done and we'll (or at least I'll) not ask for it. I think the reason for asking for the 8.75" straps is so they can be doubled back so they point backwards. Is that right Agent 5? Hope you have a good trip Peter.

So, if I'm understanding this correctly, a request for a poll regarding which cargo pocket should be put on the jackets is the question?

That's what I'll put up then, but if I'm reading this wrong, please let me know via PM asap, and I'll pull it down and post a correct one in it's place.

Stay tuned.

As to the INSIDE pocket...I've NEVER had an issue on that one and it's size, so don't change a thing about that one....with the exception of my fondness for a zipper on occasion. (grins)

Regards! Michaelson

I hope everyone realizes how lucky we are to even have someone like Peter willing to work with us on these jackets or for that matter even offer them to us at all.

I was suprised when I first saw how much the jacket was selling for because it was a jacket made by the same company that supplied the film and to sell it at such a low price was amazing to me. Anyone else would sell something like this for $500 or more.

I love my jacket and I ordered within the choices given to me on the website.

I can understand special requests because of size issues but the other stuff has me a bit puzzled.

Unless I wear my jacket with my other gear no one knows it's an Indy jacket. They all just think I have a nice leather jacket. Who besides yourself is ever going to know all the detail that you requested be put into this jacket?

Who besides maybe another COW member is ever going to appreciate what all that means. Try explaining all these little jacket details to an average person and then begin to watch their eyes glaze over and realize that they are probably thinking they need to call the police!

I'm not trying to be mean or make anyone feel foolish. I just think maybe some people need to step back away from this "Grail" their after and look at the big picture and realize we've got a pretty good thing right now why blow it by obssesing over every tiny detail.

"Indiana.....Indiana....It's just a jacket!"

Wonderful jackets they are too =)

I'm perfectly happy with my 'standard' temple goatskin...however I do really wish I knew about an option to make the pocket smaller. When I ordered I wasn't even aware the pockets were bigger than the actual temple/raiders jacket.

Oh well.

Pitfall Harry wrote:I hope everyone realizes how lucky we are to even have someone like Peter willing to work with us on these jackets or for that matter even offer them to us at all.

I was suprised when I first saw how much the jacket was selling for because it was a jacket made by the same company that supplied the film and to sell it at such a low price was amazing to me. Anyone else would sell something like this for $500 or more.

I love my jacket and I ordered within the choices given to me on the website.

I can understand special requests because of size issues but the other stuff has me a bit puzzled.

Unless I wear my jacket with my other gear no one knows it's an Indy jacket. They all just think I have a nice leather jacket. Who besides yourself is ever going to know all the detail that you requested be put into this jacket?

Who besides maybe another COW member is ever going to appreciate what all that means. Try explaining all these little jacket details to an average person and then begin to watch their eyes glaze over and realize that they are probably thinking they need to call the police!

I'm not trying to be mean or make anyone feel foolish. I just think maybe some people need to step back away from this "Grail" their after and look at the big picture and realize we've got a pretty good thing right now why blow it by obssesing over every tiny detail.

"Indiana.....Indiana....It's just a jacket!"

I couldn't agree with you more Pitfall. I felt so lucky when I stumbled across Wested and found the jacket I've been looking for for 25 years -- and made by the man himself (or at least his company!) I too ordered within the selections provided. The only extra I asked for was horsehide, and Wested fortunately had some in stock. It wasn't until after I ordered the jacket that I realized so many people on these boards were practically redesigning it with all the extra detail and special tayloring, zippers, collar sizes and such.

Peter sounds like a great guy to put up with it all and now he's raising his prices as a result, even for non-custom orders. That's his right and perogative, but I can't help but think if it weren't for all the laundry lists of special orders, people would still be able to purchase a stock jacket at 145 quid and not the 149 quid it will now cost. It's a shame really. I'm glad I got my jacket when I did. OK, four pounds is not a lot, but it's still like $10 or so, and for some people, it will make a difference. Having said that, at the new price, it will still be a great deal.

Let's here it for Wested. Cheers!

Actually, I want to correct something. I did ask for reinforced stitching on the pockets and handwarmers which I believe wasn't part of the list and was a request, but.....I only requested this after reading about some other people having trouble with theirs coming unstitched.

To me it was kinda like putting an extra lock on the front door, just added protection.

I can understand some of the requests if their actually noticable like larger or smaller pockets or collars but the really minor stuff that can't even be seen is going a bit to far in my mind.

Where does it end? I could see someone requesting a jacket with Kevlar lining because they want to make sure they don't get hurt incase their shot at!

ANOTHER ONE TODAY AND THE PENNY HAS DROPPED! SHOOT AGENT 5!

D'OH!!! Sorry, Peter. Had no idea of the controversy it would cause...the shockwaves...the ripples that span across oceans...

OK. I'll stop.

Just kidding but I have suddenly realizied that they are emailing me copies of the agent 5 ultimate screen accurate specs list.

I honestly didn't think people would just be copying my page and mailing it out but now I can see I was foolish for not thinking so. I hope this does not cause you unwanted problems, but it appears it's doing just that. My honest appologies if it's messing with your head. I honestly though that these mods were things you and your staff have done in the past without question and done well. Besides the yoke placement and the aluminum zip ( screen accurate but doesn't work...I know), I considered all the requests on my page basic as to what Wested has done in the past. The good news is you can just put on your AB and the magical properties in it will make your headache go away.

Two things are wrong an 8.75 inch side strap is far too long and with a leather inside facing the zip CANNOT go to the bottom only to the bottom of the facing where it joins the hem.

I just wanted to address this.
The side strap size was taken off an older Wested of mine (circa 1999-2000) and seemed to be a standard size back in the day. It was when you started using the sliders that the size was shortened becuase the straps did not have to slide back under, they went straight through the slide, thus making the strap seem too long.
Doc is right that this length is to copy the length of the straps in Raiders which do get tucked under the side buckles twice, not once so the extra length is warranted IF you want it to look as it does in the film. At the standard Wested length you cannot double up the strap when sliding it into the buckles.
I know you've said in the past that the zipper cannot go ALL the way to the bottom doe to the seam, but as you have personally told me in the past, does go as far down to the seam as possible, which is great. You did mention that moving the zip up an inch or so diminishes the stress put on at the bottom if you have it zipped and I fully understand that. I just want it as it was in the film...as far down as you can possibly place it.

I'm going to have to write a full disclaimer for my jacket post so that people understand the reasons for the changes over the years and why they occured. I thought I did so in my initial post but I guess some people are skipping over vital info as far as understanding the significance of some of the changes I've posted and how they can affect their jacket order.

Pitfall Harry wrote:I could see someone requesting a jacket with Kevlar lining because they want to make sure they don't get hurt incase their shot at!

Kevlar where do I sign up?!

With some of the possible changes in what will be offered for what jacket and facts we've gained from Peter through this thread, I'd have to say there will be many fewer changes if I need to make another Wested order.
No more Lists Of Unsusual Size!

The kevlar jacket has been done I think. At one point, our own _ wanted one, but I believe the wait was outrageous. US Wings did offer one at one time, but I could not find it. I thought I remember someone actually getting one though...

rick5150 wrote:The kevlar jacket has been done I think. At one point, our own _ wanted one, but I believe the wait was outrageous. US Wings did offer one at one time, but I could not find it. I thought I remember someone actually getting one though...

Oh, man....I was joking.

Wow, I can't believe they actually ever offered something like that.