Squirrel and Hide

[Gadzooks]

That’s the name of my new roadkill based BBQ restaurant. What do you guys think?

Only kidding.

In reality I have a strange question! I’ve had a Wested LC in Washed Goat since (I think) 2008 or somewhere around there. It’s a fine old jacket with 3 problems:
1) It’s a bit light for these New England winters.
2) It hasn’t held up very well.
3) It has the most egregious case of flying squirrel I’ve ever seen.

So I’m in the market for a new jacket (not sure which movie yet, not a big deal for me...) with the big question in mind:

Who has the best underarm gussets???? I’d like something in horse or cow (preferably horse) - I know Wested has lots of skins and I won’t break the bank, but have they fixed their squirrel problem? I also quite like the look of the Magnoli white label jacket (although it seems a little light weight). I’d buy a US Wings but I’m a professor in real life and, as luck would have it, we don’t accrue very much fortune OR glory!

TL;DR : who has good underarm gussets in horse or cow? I don’t want to be a squirrel boy no more.


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[Adventure Dog]

Gadzooks,

I always thought the flying squirrel issue had more to do with where the arm holes were placed (the lower the more egregious squirrel look), and less with the gussets. Hopefully someone else will pipe in with more on that. Gussets would help with the flying squirrel look, but higher arm holes would be better solution.

I've had 2 jackets, a Todd's and a US Wings, both in size large. The US Wings, with it's lower arm holes always gave me the squirrel look (and caused the jacket to ride up very high when I moved my arms in any direction), but the Todd's, with it's higher (ala; more fitted) holes didn't give me the same problem.

With that being said, I've heard mostly good things about the Magnoli, which is a thinner cow. It's the jacket I'm currently saving up for.

Wested has always remained a mainstay in this community, and I believe you can request DOUBLE gussets on a custom jacket.

I've heard great things about the Steele and Jones jackets and their customer service, but I'm not sure how thick their hides are (it'd be worth the email certainly).

The trick is finding a jacket that fits, looks good, and can be layered with a sweater. I'm still searching!

[Michaelson]

Was your first jacket a custom or an off the rack?

If you provide any jacket maker with good measurements, they can eliminate the squirrel effect with proper sizing.

A LOT of OTR jackets have the squirrel effect.....not all, but most. It all depends on the pattern.

For example, I've found the Signature Series USW's jacket do that to me, and yet their Legend pattern is a perfect fit with no effect at all.

Can't add a thing to the recommendations above! Either custom jacket maker can make one that will fit you perfectly, and won't cost much more than an OTR these days.

Regards! Michaelson

[Gadzooks]

Was your first jacket a custom or an off the rack?

If you provide any jacket maker with good measurements, they can eliminate the squirrel effect with proper sizing.

A LOT of OTR jackets have the squirrel effect.....not all, but most. It all depends on the pattern.

For example, I've found the Signature Series USW's jacket do that to me, and yet their Legend pattern is a perfect fit with no effect at all.

Can't add a thing to the recommendations above! Either custom jacket maker can make one that will fit you perfectly, and won't cost much more than an OTR these days.

Regards! Michaelson

Gosh, I was in High School 10 years ago. I can’t even remember if it was off the rack or custom. Whatever the case, it fits abysmally and always has - the only upside being it’s always been roomy enough for a sweater underneath. I guess I’ll have to look around more at recent Wested purchases and search for signs of the dreaded flying squirrel.


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[Gadzooks]

Gadzooks,

I always thought the flying squirrel issue had more to do with where the arm holes were placed (the lower the more egregious squirrel look), and less with the gussets. Hopefully someone else will pipe in with more on that. Gussets would help with the flying squirrel look, but higher arm holes would be better solution.

I've had 2 jackets, a Todd's and a US Wings, both in size large. The US Wings, with it's lower arm holes always gave me the squirrel look (and caused the jacket to ride up very high when I moved my arms in any direction), but the Todd's, with it's higher (ala; more fitted) holes didn't give me the same problem.

With that being said, I've heard mostly good things about the Magnoli, which is a thinner cow. It's the jacket I'm currently saving up for.

Wested has always remained a mainstay in this community, and I believe you can request DOUBLE gussets on a custom jacket.

I've heard great things about the Steele and Jones jackets and their customer service, but I'm not sure how thick their hides are (it'd be worth the email certainly).

The trick is finding a jacket that fits, looks good, and can be layered with a sweater. I'm still searching!

What made you settle on the Magnoli, if you don’t mind my asking? I love everything on that wonderful man’s site - the only thing that worries me is the lightness of the leather. Now that G&B is out of the game, I’d like to get the most durability bang for my buck - hence, the horsehide idea.


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[Michaelson]

Only 10 years? Don't start with the bad memory jokes! I just got my invitation to my 45th H. S. anniversery, and still remember my first jacket from 1998.....though I can't remember where I put my car keys most days. ......

Prior to that, I was wearing a cowhide A2 Cooper, as we couldn't find Indy jackets but through Lee Keppler and magazine ads. Wested didn't come 'online' until 1998.

Anyway......

Seriously, if it's been that bad, I'd post it up for sale and let it go to a new home, then shop around for one that fits you.

Once you get something done 'custom', there's no turning back.

Regards! M

[donovan]

if you choose WESTED go with the raiders pattern. I've had their last crusade jackets with the gussets and they still suffered with the flying squirrel.

[Gadzooks]

if you choose WESTED go with the raiders pattern. I've had their last crusade jackets with the gussets and they still suffered with the flying squirrel.

And people haven’t had that problem with the raiders?


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[xmasters]

It's all about the size of the armholes. They are larger on the last crusade jacket. The Raiders are smaller and the Raiders Hero (more accurate) are even smaller than that. Make sure you buy the right fit for yourself though, the biggger the jacket the larger the armholes which will naturally be more noticeable.

[Kladdagh]

if you choose WESTED go with the raiders pattern. I've had their last crusade jackets with the gussets and they still suffered with the flying squirrel.

And people haven’t had that problem with the raiders?


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I don't have the flying squirrel effect on my jacket ... Batch 2009 ...

[Gadzooks]

At this point (after reading some horror stories on the forums) I may or may not have an e-mail inquiry in with S&J...


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[CM]

It's all about the size of the armholes. They are larger on the last crusade jacket. The Raiders are smaller and the Raiders Hero (more accurate) are even smaller than that. Make sure you buy the right fit for yourself though, the biggger the jacket the larger the armholes which will naturally be more noticeable.

Are you sure they differ? I thought Wested use the same torso pattern for Raiders and LC but just change a few of the cosmetic details. I had a 42 LC and compared it to 42 Raiders a few years ago and there was no difference I could see in the armholes.

[Gadzooks]

It's all about the size of the armholes. They are larger on the last crusade jacket. The Raiders are smaller and the Raiders Hero (more accurate) are even smaller than that. Make sure you buy the right fit for yourself though, the biggger the jacket the larger the armholes which will naturally be more noticeable.

Are you sure they differ? I thought Wested use the same torso pattern for Raiders and LC but just change a few of the cosmetic details. I had a 42 LC and compared it to 42 Raiders a few years ago and there was no difference I could see in the armholes.

This was the same thing the Wested rep told me. Lot of conflicting accounts flying around xD


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[xmasters]

It's all about the size of the armholes. They are larger on the last crusade jacket. The Raiders are smaller and the Raiders Hero (more accurate) are even smaller than that. Make sure you buy the right fit for yourself though, the biggger the jacket the larger the armholes which will naturally be more noticeable.

Are you sure they differ? I thought Wested use the same torso pattern for Raiders and LC but just change a few of the cosmetic details. I had a 42 LC and compared it to 42 Raiders a few years ago and there was no difference I could see in the armholes.

Definitely a difference since 2015.

And an undisputable difference with the Raiders hero pattern. It's copied from the Nowak jacket remember.

[Gadzooks]

The hour is late, the deed is done.

A deposit is in with S&J and I am (patiently) very excited.


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[Jeremiah]

Sorry to tell you, but even custom jackets produce the “flying squirrel look” to some degree. It’s the nature of how the jacket is cut. That said. How often do you find yourself in a position which shows that effect?

I can guarantee you that if Harrison Ford would have raised his arms with the jacket zipped all the Screen used jackets would have produced the same effect.

[Jeremiah]

if you choose WESTED go with the raiders pattern. I've had their last crusade jackets with the gussets and they still suffered with the flying squirrel.

And people haven’t had that problem with the raiders?


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I don't have the flying squirrel effect on my jacket ... Batch 2009 ...

Could you show us a pic of you wearing the jacket with your arms raised and jacket zipped?

[Gadzooks]

Sorry to tell you, but even custom jackets produce the “flying squirrel look” to some degree. It’s the nature of how the jacket is cut. That said. How often do you find yourself in a position which shows that effect?

I can guarantee you that if Harrison Ford would have raised his arms with the jacket zipped all the Screen used jackets would have produced the same effect.

In terms of position, I ride motorcycles so quite often. Every day XD With the added bonus of my back getting cold from being exposed. Here’s a pic of the jacket in the very extremest flying squirrel position. I think it has a lot with the armholes extending too far down - makes me look like I have gargoyle wings sticking up from my shoulders when really the jacket is hovering a few inches off my body. Def doesn’t happen with other jackets (my Todd’s does just fine, for instance, but it’s always been too short to wear much)


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[Jeremiah]

By “other jackets” so you mean other indy style jackets? I have A-2 jackets that fit me. It’s the nature of the beast. It’s the diameter and angle of where the sleeve length attaches to the body and the fact there are no gussets and we are dealing with leather. Unless one had a custom (non SA cut) which changed the way the sleeves attached to the body, you will get this effect to some degree. Again, I would love to see Harrison don the jackets and zip up and raise his arms like that. If he did, we all would be demanding the “flying squirrel effect”.

Can you show us a pic of you doing the same spread eagle while wearing your Todd’s? I’d wager it would still have that effect to some degree. For that matter, can anyone here who owns a “perfect fit” jacket made to specs provide a test pic with jacket zipped and doing the spread eagle?

I have a s&j LC jacket that if anything fits me more like a raiders jacket. I asked for it that way. So pit to pit, it’s made to my chest size. I still get that effect to a degree. If I went with a smaller pit to pit measurement the jacket would be too tight.

[Gadzooks]

I don’t have a Todd’s picture on hand but it’s certainly a LOT less severe. Keep in mind, one is LC and one is Raiders, tho. Made sure to tell Diego “arm-raisability” was a priority on the new order - I’ll be adding gussets as well. Not a sucker for SA as much as I am for functionality.


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[Jeremiah]

I gotcha. Yeah I like functionality over SA. And when I say “to a degree” I am meaning it’s there but not to a point where it looks like the chest area is just too big.

[Holt]

The Squirrel effect is an OLD topic around here. But it is a perfectly normal thing in this jacket. Fords jacket had it as well. To some degree.