Could Indy Have Worn an A2 in Raiders?

[CM]

You guys really digging into this quite a lot..fact is..IF the jacket was out when Indy was living "which it was"...then yes,..he COULD have worn it..No matter how hard they were to come by..I mean,he was able to infiltrate Hitlers group in TLC..He knocks out guards and takes the clothes in more than one scene..As a kid,being adventurous,im quite sure he could have happened upon just about anything..

Sometimes digging is part of the fun of this hobby. You're right. Plausibility isn't the issue. It's a movie and I'm not interested in whether the character could have had X or not. For me it's more about why the creators made certain choices.

[CM]

I'm addressing the question. My point (there was one somewhere in this thread) is that the drawing is just as period accurate as what was in the movies. Meaning, it's not at all!! I am perfectly aware that it's a drawing...

Is it an amalgam of several different styles? Yes. Did it exist then? No. Is it cool? Yes!

Well, we're just not going to agree. I wasn't trying to say the drawing was an accurate reproduction of a specific 1930's jacket pattern, just that you could easily see what the artist was referencing - a period jacket. My mistake was bringing up a specific Aero model as comparison. But you're quite right, if S had drawn buttons on it instead of a zip it would have been accurate to a range of 1930's jackets. Of course then we could argue about whether the drawing of the jacket has hand warmers or not... let's not get started on that.

[Hollowpond]

It's all good dude! How boring this place would be if we all agreed...

[CM]

By the way H, how's your Logan's Closet Californian going? I love that thing.

[Hollowpond]

It is the jacket love of my life...

[youngjedi71]

You guys really digging into this quite a lot..fact is..IF the jacket was out when Indy was living "which it was"...then yes,..he COULD have worn it..No matter how hard they were to come by..I mean,he was able to infiltrate Hitlers group in TLC..He knocks out guards and takes the clothes in more than one scene..As a kid,being adventurous,im quite sure he could have happened upon just about anything..

Sometimes digging is part of the fun of this hobby. You're right. Plausibility isn't the issue. It's a movie and I'm not interested in whether the character could have had X or not. For me it's more about why the creators made certain choices.

Thats like asking why a fedora? or why a whip? I mean..it is what it is..we could ask "why" for everything in every movie,tv show,music etc..I realize the forums are dead and any activity is better than none,..Just not sure if a "why" will ever be answered without going to the actual source..

[CM]

You guys really digging into this quite a lot..fact is..IF the jacket was out when Indy was living "which it was"...then yes,..he COULD have worn it..No matter how hard they were to come by..I mean,he was able to infiltrate Hitlers group in TLC..He knocks out guards and takes the clothes in more than one scene..As a kid,being adventurous,im quite sure he could have happened upon just about anything..

Sometimes digging is part of the fun of this hobby. You're right. Plausibility isn't the issue. It's a movie and I'm not interested in whether the character could have had X or not. For me it's more about why the creators made certain choices.

Thats like asking why a fedora? or why a whip? I mean..it is what it is..we could ask "why" for everything in every movie,tv show,music etc..I realize the forums are dead and any activity is better than none,..Just not sure if a "why" will ever be answered without going to the actual source..

Huh? All we're having is a common sense discussion (as film fans often have with each other) about a particular item from a film we like. Not looking for the definitive answer to why but it is fun to ponder why not...

This being the jacket section I didn't mention the hat or whip. But, yes, a discussion about why a Herbert Johnson hat and why a dimensional brim (when they were not especially period accurate) would be just as intriguing for different reasons. We know they chose a whip because of the plot and he wears a hat because of the period but there are plenty more questions arising about these items- talking about them, I would have thought, is the point of this site.

[baddates1]

Every time I go on this thread, I always hope that a Photoshop of indy in an a2 will pop up. Now I honestly think that he would look great in one, but then there is the thing about accuracy...

[youngjedi71]

You guys really digging into this quite a lot..fact is..IF the jacket was out when Indy was living "which it was"...then yes,..he COULD have worn it..No matter how hard they were to come by..I mean,he was able to infiltrate Hitlers group in TLC..He knocks out guards and takes the clothes in more than one scene..As a kid,being adventurous,im quite sure he could have happened upon just about anything..

Sometimes digging is part of the fun of this hobby. You're right. Plausibility isn't the issue. It's a movie and I'm not interested in whether the character could have had X or not. For me it's more about why the creators made certain choices.

Thats like asking why a fedora? or why a whip? I mean..it is what it is..we could ask "why" for everything in every movie,tv show,music etc..I realize the forums are dead and any activity is better than none,..Just not sure if a "why" will ever be answered without going to the actual source..

Huh? All we're having is a common sense discussion (as film fans often have with each other) about a particular item from a film we like. Not looking for the definitive answer to why but it is fun to ponder why not...

This being the jacket section I didn't mention the hat or whip. But, yes, a discussion about why a Herbert Johnson hat and why a dimensional brim (when they were not especially period accurate) would be just as intriguing for different reasons. We know they chose a whip because of the plot and he wears a hat because of the period but there are plenty more questions arising about these items- talking about them, I would have thought, is the point of this site.

Well then the jacket is of the period as well..so..no more questions on that I guess.. Just saying..you can ask how,when,how often,to what extent a million times..but then you have to stop and ask yourself...why....you guys have your own imaginations..use them..as for WHY Indy had the jacket he had,...well..its a jacket from that period..and still worn to this day. Along with the other 20 variations..

[CM]

Every time I go on this thread, I always hope that a Photoshop of indy in an a2 will pop up. Now I honestly think that he would look great in one, but then there is the thing about accuracy...

What thing about accuracy baddates1?

[youngjedi71]

After taking a chill pill..i wanted to come back in and say sorry for seeming like I attacked anyone here. I just have different feelings towards some things than others do..and sometimes I let my fingers type before asking myself "whats it really matter"...so..sorry if i made it sound like you guys are insane..

[CM]

After taking a chill pill..i wanted to come back in and say sorry for seeming like I attacked anyone here. I just have different feelings towards some things than others do..and sometimes I let my fingers type before asking myself "whats it really matter"...so..sorry if i made it sound like you guys are insane..

[Long John Tinfoil]

Insane is the number of people here who keep writing as if Indy is a fictional character.

LJT

[Texan Scott]

The underlying proposition is that when anyone opens a new thread and asks a question or makes certain hypothetical proposals, in essence "opening" it up to other comments, or draws conclusions, then you have to allow for other points of view. Otherwise, why open a thread to other pov's if your opinions are cemented? Not everyone will see it in the same way. Historically, the A-2 was not available. Practically, he could have just as easily been hiking through the dense 'jungles of Hawaii'... in a khaki/cotton jacket, if at all. I've been to Brasil several times and the amazon a couple of times, and trust me, the last thing you want on you is a leather jacket...but it fulfilled an ideal for the character in the mind's eye of GL and rounded out a costume. But I could see him wearing one in the desert where the temps drop in the evenings and into the night, winds (khamaseen), etc. One aspect that I did like about Raiders is that Indy was not wearing the jacket all the time, like in the streets of Cairo sequence, so a few aesthetics added a bit of dimension to the character, not as "cardboardish".

Buy more ice cream and get off your pet theories....

[baddates1]

Every time I go on this thread, I always hope that a Photoshop of indy in an a2 will pop up. Now I honestly think that he would look great in one, but then there is the thing about accuracy...

What thing about accuracy baddates1?

Well for most of us that are die-hard Indy fans, accuracy is an obsession. But if we are talking historically accurate, then the a2 is the best bet.

[CM]

Every time I go on this thread, I always hope that a Photoshop of indy in an a2 will pop up. Now I honestly think that he would look great in one, but then there is the thing about accuracy...

What thing about accuracy baddates1?

Well for most of us that are die-hard Indy fans, accuracy is an obsession. But if we are talking historically accurate, then the a2 is the best bet.

I think I understand. But really all this is just of speculative film buff interest. It hadn't occurred to me until a few days ago that Indy could have worn an A2. (remember here in Australia the A2 is rare) For the first twenty years after seeing the film I assumed the jacket was a period utility jacket. I didn't realize how film costumes were thrown together with a mix of intense design and pragmatic improvisation. If Indy didn't carry a whip they may well have gone with an A2. Life was so much simpler 30 plus years ago.

[baddates1]

I think that is the first time I have heard his whip being in the way of his jacket. I think he would look good in an A2.

[LZeitgeist]

The simple clean barrel cuffs are one of my favourite parts of the Indy jacket. Whenever I wear a jacket with knit cuffs I get that itchy polyester flashback to the 70s and 80s.

The twin waist vents are also a great feature that means I don't have a big elastic band around my waist/hips that keeps needing the Picard Manoeuvre.

Ditto. My thoughts exactly.

I've had a few different leather jackets (including a Navy G1) that have the knit cuffs and waistband, and the only reason i wasn't still wearing my Disney/Cooper Indy jacket was because my wife thought it looked horrible after so many years of daily use/abuse.

I was VERY happy to get my Wested last year and I wear that thing any time it's 60 degrees or below. Feels like coming home again every time I put it on...

[LZeitgeist]

My take on it was just like everything Indy wore... military inspired and custom made. Just like his shirts and pants, I reckon Indy saw an airman wearing the A-2 and liked it enough to have a replica made to his own specifications.

I never figured Indy had his stuff custom-made - why would he?

I always thought he'd get some stuff from military surplus, or use what he liked once he found something that worked for him. I figured his jacket was right off the rack - as it is, he'd have to have multiples of his regular gear, and he doesn't have Bruce Wayne money to do it with.

JMHO...

[backstagejack]

My take on it was just like everything Indy wore... military inspired and custom made. Just like his shirts and pants, I reckon Indy saw an airman wearing the A-2 and liked it enough to have a replica made to his own specifications.

I never figured Indy had his stuff custom-made - why would he?

I always thought he'd get some stuff from military surplus, or use what he liked once he found something that worked for him. I figured his jacket was right off the rack - as it is, he'd have to have multiples of his regular gear, and he doesn't have Bruce Wayne money to do it with.

JMHO...

My thinking behind it is because none of Indy's gear was ever issued by any military other than the Mrk VII bag (which before the 40s had to be custom as well). His shirt is military inspired like his pants and his jacket.
If Indy was wearing an actual officers shirt, with actual Officers pinks with an A-2 jacket than I would be more inclined to agree. But how it looks to me is Indy saw a style he liked, and had clothes custom made to his own specifications.

So, at some point between YIJC and TOD, Indy specifically sought out clothing that would have the same look as a man (Fedora in LC) he met when he was 15 years old in Utah that gave him a brown fedora (which I refuse to believe is the same fedora he wears throughout the years). A look specifically designed to replica someone that he was inspired by as a teenager.
That tells me that Indy is not above seeing something he likes and replicating it to his own specifications.

And as for his jacket (including the rest of his gear) where (especially in the 1930s - 1950s) could you find the same style of pants, shirts, and jacket for over 20 years? He has torn his jacket (the arm was shot in Raiders) and torn up his pants, shirts, etc..... Heck, in CS his entire gear was probably burned due to the radiation......... so at some point, he had to have his jacket custom made, just like his shirts and pants.

To me, supporting evidence that explains the differences in hats and jackets, pants, whips and shirts throughout the years..... it adds up to different gear, custom made to Indy's specifications.
As for the money issue.... well, he does sell his pieces to the museum (at least in ROTLA....).

I know this is getting way too into the "reality" aspect vs. "it's just a movie" rationale, but that's where my thinking led.

[Texan Scott]

From now on, I think we need to ban knits from the forum.

[CM]

My take on it was just like everything Indy wore... military inspired and custom made. Just like his shirts and pants, I reckon Indy saw an airman wearing the A-2 and liked it enough to have a replica made to his own specifications.

I never figured Indy had his stuff custom-made - why would he?

I always thought he'd get some stuff from military surplus, or use what he liked once he found something that worked for him. I figured his jacket was right off the rack - as it is, he'd have to have multiples of his regular gear, and he doesn't have Bruce Wayne money to do it with.

JMHO...

My thinking behind it is because none of Indy's gear was ever issued by any military other than the Mrk VII bag (which before the 40s had to be custom as well). His shirt is military inspired like his pants and his jacket.
If Indy was wearing an actual officers shirt, with actual Officers pinks with an A-2 jacket than I would be more inclined to agree. But how it looks to me is Indy saw a style he liked, and had clothes custom made to his own specifications.

So, at some point between YIJC and TOD, Indy specifically sought out clothing that would have the same look as a man (Fedora in LC) he met when he was 15 years old in Utah that gave him a brown fedora (which I refuse to believe is the same fedora he wears throughout the years). A look specifically designed to replica someone that he was inspired by as a teenager.
That tells me that Indy is not above seeing something he likes and replicating it to his own specifications.

And as for his jacket (including the rest of his gear) where (especially in the 1930s - 1950s) could you find the same style of pants, shirts, and jacket for over 20 years? He has torn his jacket (the arm was shot in Raiders) and torn up his pants, shirts, etc..... Heck, in CS his entire gear was probably burned due to the radiation......... so at some point, he had to have his jacket custom made, just like his shirts and pants.

To me, supporting evidence that explains the differences in hats and jackets, pants, whips and shirts throughout the years..... it adds up to different gear, custom made to Indy's specifications.
As for the money issue.... well, he does sell his pieces to the museum (at least in ROTLA....).

I know this is getting way too into the "reality" aspect vs. "it's just a movie" rationale, but that's where my thinking led.

Sorry long response:

It's not a question of it just being a movie - the question is what did the film makers want us to think Indy was wearing. We're not really meant to notice that Harrison's costume changes over the films/years. No one I know has noticed this except us. I believe they wanted us to think that Indy wore generic ex-military solider of fortune style clothing as per all those period films with characters wearing pretty much the same items; usually with an A2, by the way.

The fact that Indy's clothing isn't genuine military isn't something they expected us to pick up. Just as so many movie A2's aren't genuine and to an expert look wrong. For instance, Harrison's A2 in Hanover Street. Or Sinatra's A2 in Von Ryan's Express. Fakes. Just because the A2's are fake doesn't mean we should jump to the conclusion that by some weird back story they were custom made for the character. We were never meant to realize they were "costumes".

Coming back to my original point was the question could the movie makers have put Harrison in an A2. I think we can say yes. And if the character wasn't needing to access the whip, they probably would have.

[Michaelson]

That is as good a theory as any, yes.

To prove your point, when I left the movie after first seeing Raiders in 1981, I DID think he was wearing an A2. It wasn't until my follow up viewings did I realize it wasn't......but then, I also thought he was wearing a black military belt with silver buckle, so take that for what it's worth.

Regards! M

[Tibor]

I think they wanted him to be specifically civilian and definitely non-military. His clothes matched the time period. As has been pointed out, it's a common look ... Leather jacket, fedora... from that period of history. It may read as "costume" to people's current eyes, but it was average street wear like jeans and a hoodie back then.

[CM]

I guess it's a costume in that it is carefully designed and selected to be worn by an actor to achieve a certain look. But I know what you're saying. I wouldn't say that look was as common as a hoodie but it was relatively common. But particular to certain fields like welding and metal work. Of course wealthier people in that era sometimes wore leather golf and bike jackets. Overall short woolen jackets were more common and cheaper.

[Michaelson]

It was also very common all the way through the late 50's/early '60's in railroad and steel mill towns in the Mid-West.

A leather jacket and fedora were standard dress for folks who worked in heavy industry, and something I was VERY used to seeing while growing up. It's one of the reasons I was wearing a fedora and leather jacket YEARS before Indy ever hit the screen, as it was just something we wore in our town.

A 'working man's' attire.

Regards! M

[Texan Scott]

what about the whip, big dawg?

[Tibor]

I think soldiers of fortune looked more like the French Foreign Legion at the time...

[backstagejack]

I think soldiers of fortune looked more like the French Foreign Legion at the time...

Similiar to Rick O'Connell's look in the first Mummy?

I always loved his gear and hair cut and I liked how it sometimes had noticeable changes througout the movies. Heck, by the last one he had almost an entire different look.

[Texan Scott]

hmmm....I wonder why no photo shopped images of Indy in an A-2 have ....cropped up yet, no pun intended...sorta?

say it with me....kinda' makes you go, hmmm....

[Michaelson]

what about the whip, big dawg?

What about the whip? I was talking about why the leather jacket and fedora was a commonly seen/worn outfit in the U.S at the time. Last I recall, there wasn't a whole lot of use for a whip in steel mills or railroad work, but then things may have been different down in Texas.

Regards! M

[Texan Scott]

a lil' ....ropin' dogies and a' bustin' broncs.

[CM]

It was also very common all the way through the late 50's/early '60's in railroad and steel mill towns in the Mid-West.

A leather jacket and fedora were standard dress for folks who worked in heavy industry, and something I was VERY used to seeing while growing up. It's one of the reasons I was wearing a fedora and leather jacket YEARS before Indy ever hit the screen, as it was just something we wore in our town.

A 'working man's' attire.

Regards! M

Would have loved to see those days in the US, M. have you ever read Suttree - set in Knoxville? It's kind of black but an amazing evocation of the 1950's.

[youngjedi71]

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-qcsY5YqBKhg/T ... jacket.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

YES!!! He could have worn that dang jacket..at least a close enough one...now lets move on to something a little more interesting like...whos hotter?...Jessica Beil,OR Megan Fox?..

[Texan Scott]

....no he couldn't!

Who was bootlegging A-2's in the trunk of their car recently? Now would be the time!

[Michaelson]

It was also very common all the way through the late 50's/early '60's in railroad and steel mill towns in the Mid-West.

A leather jacket and fedora were standard dress for folks who worked in heavy industry, and something I was VERY used to seeing while growing up. It's one of the reasons I was wearing a fedora and leather jacket YEARS before Indy ever hit the screen, as it was just something we wore in our town.

A 'working man's' attire.

Regards! M

Would have loved to see those days in the US, M. have you ever read Suttree - set in Knoxville? It's kind of black but an amazing evocation of the 1950's.

I have scanned through it, yes. Having been raised during that time period, it captured some of the era, but one can never really capture what it was really like unless you lived it....but then that can be said of all times.
Regards! M