AB Aldens vs. SA Aldens

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Tue Oct 15, 2013 8:42 am

AB's leather color aside, now that Blu-ray has shown us that HF's Raiders Aldens did indeed have white moc and welt stitching and a (once) natural colored welt, are AB Aldens still considered the Holy Grail of Indy boots by the community?

(Disclaimer: this post is in no way intended to discredit Adventurebilt or any of its affiliates. It's merely a technical question in a technical forum.

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Post by **Michaelson** » Tue Oct 15, 2013 9:30 am

Sure. Why wouldn't they be?

They're still 405's, though Alden's changed the color and leather several times since the late 70's. Those boots were Fords personal pair, and would have come from stock made back in the late 70's, if you recall.

No one can control what Alden's does, and they've even tried to change their color/leather selection closer to what they originally made....but from their own report, the leather tanner they got that original leather is no longer in business, and they source their hides from where ever they can get it.

Heck, we went though an awful time when they came in pumpkin orange back in the mid 90's !!!!

Why they can't seem to get back to the original brown has always been a puzzler.

The seam line isn't as pronounced as it once was, but that's more due to the shift in leather color. The seam thread is exactly the same color as it's always been, and that has never changed. Most folks tried to darken that seam for years so it wasn't so noticeable, and you can find old discussions covering that very thing if you do some searching in the old 'gear car' archives.

Now folks WANT to see the seam!

For that matter, the lining has completely changed too. The only thing that hasn't changed is the fact these boots are the patented Alden 'Tru-balance' system for orthopedic platform construction, as they have always been intended to be used for since their creation.

So, as much as they've changed, they're still 405's, and that was the model used in all 4 Indy films.
That's not going to change, no matter what anyone wants or thinks. Anything else is a substitute....and what's 'Holy Grail' about that?

Regards! Michaelson

Obi Sean Kenobi · Post by **Obi Sean Kenobi** » Tue Oct 15, 2013 9:35 am

I have multiple pairs of Aldens, and, without a moment of hesitation, hands down believe that my chromexcel stock 403s after a year or so of natural wear are the most SA Indy boots I've seen.

I have had stock 405s and now have a brand new pair of the j crew 405s, and time and again the stock 403s are my boot of choice.

My .02!

Sean

Duck9000 · Post by **Duck9000** » Tue Oct 15, 2013 2:53 pm

Very interesting thread guys, thanks!

And perfect timing too, since I'm looking for nice pair of boots

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Tue Oct 15, 2013 6:25 pm

I have an older pair of 405s with the canvas lining that are pretty comfortable. My only complaint is the tongue migrates to the side - something that does not happen with the newer, leather lined 403s, etc. What they do all have in common is comfort. I can wear them all day and actually NOT be in a hurry to take them off when I get home.

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Tue Oct 15, 2013 9:05 pm

Great posts, everyone.

It makes plain business sense that with the current variety of Indy boot offerings (including the ABs), it's not Alden's priority to recreate a SA boot just for a limited market of fans willing to pay the price.

So my question still stands: color aside, is the AB boot still considered the Holy Grail of SA Indy boots?

Illinois James · Post by **Illinois James** » Tue Oct 15, 2013 9:16 pm

It would be cool to recreate that old stock brown from the older boots. To me, it looks like more of a pecan color, with an almost greenish tint. Maybe it could be done.

I've been trying to find the old ad with the original 405 and the 40 work shoe (which the new Indy shoe is patterned after), which you occasionally see in special batches. I'd like a pair of those, but they're hard to come by.

FWIW, the tongue in my 404's migrates as well, with the leather lining. It's also a problem in the shell boots for me.

TheExit148 · Post by **TheExit148** » Tue Oct 15, 2013 11:34 pm

I've contacted Alden regarding a custom run and they say that is on hold for the time being. I also contacted Leather Soul Hawaii to see if they could do a run but they are full up.

A pair in 9.5 just sold on ebay for close to $300 USD. They do pop up every once and a while, but never in my size; 10.5D. I'm still on the look ever since I found those images on a Japanese shopping site. They are deadstock 405 boots from the 70's, and I believe as noted in the other forum, that they are the boots Ford wore for Raiders, or at least one of the pairs. The white mocc toe stitching and naturalish coloured welt is SA to the Raiders boots IMO.

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:51 am

My answer, no, I never did think the AB Aldens were the 'be-all' versions. They were a huge step in the right direction, though, and that's for sure. If you lived through the pumpkin orange fiasco, they were indeed a breath of fresh air!!!

JMO, though.

Regards! M

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:46 pm

How comfortable are real Aldens? I have a pair of Todd's that I wore to comic con and I could not wait to get them off. Basically was walking on a hard slab of leather for the sole. had zero cushion at all. Was thinking about getting the AB Aldens

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:13 pm

Well speaking from someone who has not only seen a pair in person but own a pair and where them almost daily. Yes, they are all that and a bag of chips.

Post by **Michaelson** » Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:38 pm

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:51 am

Long John Tinfoil · Post by **Long John Tinfoil** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:37 am

How comfortable are real Aldens? I have a pair of Todd's that I wore to comic con and I could not wait to get them off. Basically was walking on a hard slab of leather for the sole. had zero cushion at all. Was thinking about getting the AB Aldens

I have a wonky knee, and when it goes bad on me while I'm walking, the resulting "compensation" as I move quickly results in pain in my hip and back, and some numbness in my leg (all this after half a dozen surgeries). This happens most often when I'm on hard and smooth surfaces like sidewalks or floors - in shopping malls, for example. For some reason it doesn't happen on irregular surfaces like dirt roads, woods trails, construction sites, etc.

I also have a pair of 405's, and I've learned to wear them whenever I know I'll be doing a lot of walking on those smooth surfaces. The orthopaedic quality of the Alden's seems to keep my knee in better alignment so that I don't have this issue, and comfort is never a problem. Mrs. Tinfoil frequently comments on the weight of the Aldens and wonders how I can stand them, but they're the one pair of boots I have that I can wear for 12 hours at a stretch and completely forget about. YMMV.

LJT

Indiana Bugs · Post by **Indiana Bugs** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 12:55 pm

I use inserts in all my shoes, sneakers, and boots, so the bed is rarely, if ever, a factor.

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:21 pm

Long John Tinfoil wrote:
How comfortable are real Aldens? I have a pair of Todd's that I wore to comic con and I could not wait to get them off. Basically was walking on a hard slab of leather for the sole. had zero cushion at all. Was thinking about getting the AB Aldens
I have a wonky knee, and when it goes bad on me while I'm walking, the resulting "compensation" as I move quickly results in pain in my hip and back, and some numbness in my leg (all this after half a dozen surgeries). This happens most often when I'm on hard and smooth surfaces like sidewalks or floors - in shopping malls, for example. For some reason it doesn't happen on irregular surfaces like dirt roads, woods trails, construction sites, etc.

I also have a pair of 405's, and I've learned to wear them whenever I know I'll be doing a lot of walking on those smooth surfaces. The orthopaedic quality of the Alden's seems to keep my knee in better alignment so that I don't have this issue, and comfort is never a problem. Mrs. Tinfoil frequently comments on the weight of the Aldens and wonders how I can stand them, but they're the one pair of boots I have that I can wear for 12 hours at a stretch and completely forget about. YMMV.

LJT

Well that sold me for sure...Todds are a very nice replica they look great but they are not good for walking for long periods of time. I was really hurting after walking in them for 12 hours at comic con.

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Oct 21, 2013 7:55 am

Indiana Bugs wrote:I use inserts in all my shoes, sneakers, and boots, so the bed is rarely, if ever, a factor.

That's not the point of the 'Tru-Balance' system, Bugs. It's not just the bed, but how it works.

That's why the front of the heel is shaped in the shape of an 'S'. As LJT says above, it also helps keep your foot/knee aligned and not rotate. There's a lot more to it, and that's why they're actually prescribed by orthopedic doctors. Insert used or not, the system is still doing something other shoes don't.

Regards! Michaelson

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 3:22 pm

Topic update:

Stefan at AB recently advised that they're changing the leather color on the very next run to more closely match the latest screen grabs.

No word yet if they're changing the stitching and/or welt colors.

TheExit148 · Post by **TheExit148** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:01 pm

Cajunkraut wrote:Topic update:

Stefan at AB recently advised that they're changing the leather color on the very next run to more closely match the latest screen grabs.

No word yet if they're changing the stitching and/or welt colors.

This is interesting and good to hear! The welt and stitching should be natural and white, as far as I can tell from the blu-ray. If they make those changes, I would purchase again from them.

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:52 pm

TheExit148 wrote:
Cajunkraut wrote:Topic update:

Stefan at AB recently advised that they're changing the leather color on the very next run to more closely match the latest screen grabs.

No word yet if they're changing the stitching and/or welt colors.
This is interesting and good to hear! The welt and stitching should be natural and white, as far as I can tell from the blu-ray. If they make those changes, I would purchase again from them.

Exit,

As I told Stefan, you and I likely wouldn't be the only ones.

whipwarrior · Post by **whipwarrior** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 8:33 pm

Screen-accurate color AB Aldens? Interesting! How much $$$ to get these on my feet? Might be time to invest in a second pair of Aldens!

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Fri Oct 25, 2013 5:19 pm

that makes me excited. Been in contact with stefan trying to get my size correct and once we get that down I'm going to blow more money that I dont have

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 5:10 pm

Just got this email from Stefan. Very interested to see what the new boots look like. Just put in a order for a pair. He said they will ship q1 2014

"Dear Chuck,

yes we have received the scans with the scales well. Marc is about to determine the size and we get back to you shortly.
It's correct that we'll have a new leather with this batch that is closer to the new insights that came with the blu ray.

Kind Regards

Stefan"

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 6:33 pm

chuck2003 wrote:Just got this email from Stefan. Very interested to see what the new boots look like. Just put in a order for a pair. He said they will ship q1 2014

"Dear Chuck,

yes we have received the scans with the scales well. Marc is about to determine the size and we get back to you shortly.
It's correct that we'll have a new leather with this batch that is closer to the new insights that came with the blu ray.

Kind Regards

Stefan"

Got the same thing from him. I hope he's not overthinking this, as there are plenty of actual photos of the original Indy boot around. I sent him links to those as well.

I presume that Alden would be able to recreate the originals without having to guesstimate from screen grabs.

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 8:19 pm

These will be my first pair of Aldens so hopefully they do a good job with this new batch.

Duck9000 · Post by **Duck9000** » Mon Nov 11, 2013 10:24 am

chuck2003 wrote:How comfortable are real Aldens? I have a pair of Todd's that I wore to comic con and I could not wait to get them off. Basically was walking on a hard slab of leather for the sole. had zero cushion at all. Was thinking about getting the AB Aldens

They become my everyday boots and are really comfortable. My only complaint is, given the fact that I have to fly 3 to 4 times a week, that I have to be checked every single time I pass through security, because of the metal detectors. Other than that, they're perfect

TheExit148 · Post by **TheExit148** » Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:41 pm

Any updates from Stefan or AB on the new run of boots with the updated specs/leather?

I do have a previous run of AB Aldens, and may be interested in selling if someone is interested; 10.5D Let me know!

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:48 pm

I tried to get some info from him but he said Alden is keeping everything a secret untill they are ready to ship. He said should be done in febuary

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:25 am

chuck2003 wrote:I tried to get some info from him but he said Alden is keeping everything a secret untill they are ready to ship.

Of course they are. Only because I passed on the current AB's and bought some new 403's.

Watch 'em be 100% SA to the Raiders temple boot.

sneakertinker · Post by **sneakertinker** » Fri Dec 27, 2013 12:25 pm

I'd be interested if they are in fact SA to the raiders temple scene...Just like the pics that Cajun posted...If they are I'll take a pair Stefan...My 1st run AB's have seen better days anyway and are going to need a rebuild here fairly quickly...

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Fri Dec 27, 2013 1:04 pm

chuck2003 wrote:I tried to get some info from him but he said Alden is keeping everything a secret untill they are ready to ship.

You know, after reading this again, my Spidey sense started tingling.

How is it that Alden are the ones keeping everything mum when AB are the ones spec'ing out and paying for what's essentially just a custom boot order?

j_m_t · Post by **j_m_t** » Fri Dec 27, 2013 10:43 pm

And I of course got a pair just a year ago, and absolutely no way will my wife let me get another pair...even if I could afford it.

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Tue Feb 04, 2014 9:47 pm

Update: Stefan advised that the welt and stitching will remain dyed.

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:36 pm

Cajunkraut wrote:Update: Stefan advised that the welt and stitching will remain dyed.

Hmmm and what is the overall consensus about the original hero boot ? Was the welt/stitching dyed as well or was the boot dirtied and distressed to make them appear dyed ?

TheExit148 · Post by **TheExit148** » Wed Feb 05, 2014 3:17 pm

I definitely feel that the original boot had the natural welt, and white stitching. When I found those images of the deadstock boot and compared to the blu-ray screen captures I did, its pretty clear. Throughout the filming (and as any owners of 405's can say) with hard wear in the dirt, rain, snow, polishing etc the welt colour will darken.

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Thu Feb 20, 2014 10:56 am

Some good news....Stefan from AB has just informed me that Alden has finished the boots and are currently on the way to AB which will then be delivered to me some time in march!

TheExit148 · Post by **TheExit148** » Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:11 am

We need to see some pics of the new batch of AB boots.

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Thu Feb 20, 2014 11:49 am

As soon as I get them in the mail I will post them up some time next month

TheExit148 · Post by **TheExit148** » Thu Feb 20, 2014 12:00 pm

chuck2003 wrote:As soon as I get them in the mail I will post them up some time next month

Maybe try to get Stefan to post something up. Would be good to see them posting again.

RayROnline · Post by **RayROnline** » Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:06 pm

chuck2003 wrote:How comfortable are real Aldens? I have a pair of Todd's that I wore to comic con and I could not wait to get them off. Basically was walking on a hard slab of leather for the sole. had zero cushion at all. Was thinking about getting the AB Aldens

I have a pair of Aldens 405's about 2 years old and a pair that are unknown years old (great eBay buy) with the original duck lining and really broken in. Both are incredibly comfortable, but my favorite is the old duck interior. And I am amazed at how water resistant they are.

(Man voice recognition really screwed up my original post, lol)

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Post by **Cajunkraut** » Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:51 pm

chuck2003 wrote:
Cajunkraut wrote:Update: Stefan advised that the welt and stitching will remain dyed.
Hmmm and what is the overall consensus about the original hero boot ? Was the welt/stitching dyed as well or was the boot dirtied and distressed to make them appear dyed ?

Per the link I sent you, as you now can see, the Raiders Temple boot initially had white stitching and a natural welt. Dirt and weathering will of course change the appearance of both.

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:10 pm

TheExit148 wrote:
chuck2003 wrote:As soon as I get them in the mail I will post them up some time next month
Maybe try to get Stefan to post something up. Would be good to see them posting again.

I asked him to let me know once he receives them. So once he does I will ask if he can send a picture to me

whipwarrior · Post by **whipwarrior** » Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:42 pm

Today I took my Aldens to the local shoe & luggage shop to be re-heeled with original-spec Montello heels, and they only charged me $5. Sweet deal, considering that last time I had them re-heeled (about 6 years ago) the price was $8. On the flip-side, the shop has a 3-week waiting period, so I won't get my boots back until March 14th.

Illinois James · Post by **Illinois James** » Fri Feb 21, 2014 10:39 pm

I'd be calling every 4 days. Who knows, they might get them done early, on accident!!

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 4:34 pm

I asked Stefan if he could possibly send me a picture this is what he said. "hehe, your anticipation is highly appreciated. We'll see what we can do once they arrive!"

chuck2003 · Post by **chuck2003** » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:24 am

Dear Chuck,

good news:
The boots arrived yesterday. We'll take some picture tomorrow and prepare the shipping.

Best,
Stefan