Indy Fedora Alternatives?

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:25 pm

Hey guys,

I am just starting out in my Indy collecting. So far I have a jacket being shipped and I'm looking to acquire other gear soon. Today I went to check out the 'Adventurer' hat by Akubra that David Morgan sells in the US. Unfortunately the hat looked really huge and silly on me. I have a smaller head size, so I'm wondering if all Indy-style hats would look too large for me.

I did end up buying a hat from David Morgan though, because it looked really good on me, that model was the Akubra Sydney. While I really like the hat, its 'regency fawn' color prevents it from being even a 'close enough' Indy fedora. So, I am looking for some advice from the experts on this board:

1. Are there smaller 'Indy-style' fedoras that might be well proportioned to a person with a small head in the ~$150 price range?
2. If #2 is not true, do you know any good, dark brown fedoras with similar dimensions as the Sydney? David Morgan's site lists the brim at 2-1/2" and a 5-1/2" crown.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Post by **Dr. Nebraska S.** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:29 pm

You might want to go with a custom-made fedora, to get proportions that fit you just right. Garrison Hatters is about the same price range as an Akubra.

Best wishes,
Dr. Nebraska S.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:33 pm

Dr. Nebraska S. wrote:You might want to go with a custom-made fedora, to get proportions that fit you just right. Garrison Hatters is about the same price range as an Akubra.

I'll check them out, thanks for the suggestion, Dr. Nebraska S!

jlee562 · Post by **jlee562** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:58 pm

Yeah, the Adventurer has a wider brim than the Indy hat, but the "standard" Indy hat is already 5 1/2" open crown with a 2 1/2" brim at the sides and 2 3/4" brim at the front and back, so the Sydney isn't much smaller than say, the Fed IV (which is actually 5 5/8" open crown, IIRC).

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:08 pm

jlee562 wrote:Yeah, the Adventurer has a wider brim than the Indy hat, but the "standard" Indy hat is already 5 1/2" open crown with a 2 1/2" brim at the sides and 2 3/4" brim at the front and back, so the Sydney isn't much smaller than say, the Fed IV (which is actually 5 5/8" open crown, IIRC).

That's a good point! I didn't realize their dimensions (at least on paper) were so similar. It's too bad that David Morgan didn't carry the Federation as well because I would have loved to try it. I'm a little concerned about ordering internationally because returning it might be an expensive proposition.

Geno · Post by **Geno** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:59 pm

I looked up the Sydney, and it's a tapered hat.

What that means is that the sides slope when viewed from the front. / \

The Indiana Jones fedoras are generally straight sided. | |
In my experience, wearing a fedora that's straight sided AND tall makes the tallness stick out all the much more.

I'm not the biggest hat aficionado around, but it's possible that it's not so much the crown height that's at issue, but the taper VS non-taper? I know that as a strict "Indiana Jones" fedora one would want to look for an untapered fedora, but as a general hat you may find that a tapered hat looks better on your head.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:04 pm

I was wondering the same thing, Geno. Wasn't the Temple of Doom fedora tapered? I know the ToD is not the community favorite, but at least I wouldn't be committing too much Indy-blasphemy if I ended up with a tapered crown.

Geno · Post by **Geno** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:18 pm

The ToD fedora was very slightly tapered, which has been posted about a number of times. It's certainly not as popular as the Raiders or Crystal Skull fedora, but there are people who specifically seek out hats to look like the one in Temple of Doom.

Something like the Sydney isn't strictly an "Indiana Jones" fedora. If you're looking for something that matches what you see on the screen, you'd be looking at a hat with no taper or very little taper. Honestly, the tall crown and straight sides are jarring if you're not used to that kind of hat. It takes a lot of getting used to.

However, it sounds like you're more interested in finding a general fedora that's "similar" to Indy's. If that's the case, then I personally think there's nothing wrong with finding a hat that suits your face. If you're gonna wear it often, you might as well be comfortable wearing it.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:29 pm

Also be aware that if you are not a regular hat wearer, or if you generally wear baseball caps, ANY older style fedora may look "huge and silly."

Depending on your frame and face shape, as you get used to seeing yourself wearing the hat something that started out looking like the brim was too wide may even start to look narrow.

The trick is to wear it until YOU are wearing the hat - not the other way around.

jlee562 · Post by **jlee562** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 8:04 pm

Yeah, I would say that tapered hats generally appear shorter, even if they are the same height. Although the shape of the top of the block can also have an effect.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:10 pm

Can you post a pic or two of you wearing the hat you got from DM that you like with the specs and ill try and help you out. Also can you provide your head measurements.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:58 pm

Sure, thanks for offering! I don't have the best lighting in my apartment, but hopefully these will do. Of note is that I am not looking for another snap brim.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/88536207@N02/9138298281/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.flickr.com/photos/88536207@N02/9138298807/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.flickr.com/photos/88536207@N02/9140527348/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.flickr.com/photos/88536207@N02/9138298305/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.flickr.com/photos/88536207@N02/9140527366/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:32 pm

Can you have one taken where the camera isn't bellow you? More straight on. It almost looks like you are taking the photos yourself and that never yields a real idea of how the hat looks on you.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:39 pm

BendingOak wrote:Can you have one taken where the camera isn't bellow you? More straight on. It almost looks like you are taking the photos yourself and that never yields a real idea of how the hat looks on you.

I am taking the photos myself

I have a tripod that I can pull out for my dslr, but its going to require flash. I'll see what I can do.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:54 pm

Can't make a good judgement without.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 11:00 pm

Maybe I'm wearing the band a little higher than most? Here's a pick with how I've been wearing the hat today:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/88536207@N02/9138684619/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

and here's a pick with the hat pulled down further on my forehead (sorry about the crappy flash quality):

http://www.flickr.com/photos/88536207@N02/9140922044/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:34 am

I don't like the tappered crown on you. What is the brim size?

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:59 am

Brim is 2-1/2" all around.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 2:02 am

Huh, well you guys have me intrigued that I could pull off a true raiders fedora! I have contacted and am waiting to hear back from Garrison Hatters. Knowing that I like Akubra as a brand and I know exactly what size I need, the Fed IV is also looking more promising.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:13 pm

I visited another local hat store today, Byrnie Utz, which is primarily a Stetson dealer. I tried on their defacto Indy hat, the temple, and it did not look huge on me. Stetson's own site makes no mention of this hat, so I'm not sure of its size specifications, but the brim was definitely shorter than the Akubra Adventurer. I think the brim length was just a hare (bad pun intended) too long on the Adventurer, leading to my issue with the hat's proportions.

On a side note, a member of the fedora lounge mentioned that the Akubra Fed IV has a snap brim. Is it possible to shape a snap brim to look like Indy's brim in raiders? I haven't been able to get my Sydney anywhere even close to that.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:47 pm

A snap brim hat is one one which the brim can be turned up or down. Frequently they are worn with the brim turned up in back and down in front.

The Raiders fedora is a snap brim hat.

Its main idiosyncracy is the dimensional brim, which the Federation has; and the fact the hat is "turned" so the brim is off center, which you can do with the Federation because it's usually shipped open crown. (i.e. uncreased)

So I guess the answer to your question is yes provided the dimensions are right.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:08 pm

Thanks for the info, Ridgerunner! I also sent an email to Akubra about it. They confirmed that the Federation has a snap brim, but the felt is soft enough that makes it easy to shape. I'm just about ready to take a leap and order the Fed.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:41 am

I went ahead and ordered the Federation. Thanks everyone for all your help!

Pete#9 · Post by **Pete#9** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:03 am

Good choice. A great quality hat at a fair price.

I wear my daily and love it.

Looking forward to the pics..

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:43 am

solbergg wrote:I went ahead an ordered the Federation. Thanks everyone for all your help!

You may also be happy to know 'we' here at Indygear had a hand in the creation of the Federation, so you chose....wisely.

Regard! Michaelson

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:06 am

Michaelson wrote: You may also be happy to know 'we' here at Indygear had a hand in the creation of the Federation, so you chose....wisely.
Regard! Michaelson

Awesome! I'm really excited for the hat to arrive. I decided to go with express shipping because I'm impatient

For current Fed owners: When you bashed yours did you need to steam it or was it possible to "dry bash"?

Charybdis · Post by **Charybdis** » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:10 am

I dry bashed mine and it's just fine. It has gotten a bit wet at times in some light rain, but nothing major. The dry bash holds up just fine for me but it's entirely up to you...

jlee562 · Post by **jlee562** » Mon Jul 01, 2013 3:18 pm

Steam shouldn't be necessary, although it can be helpful if you're trying to get, say a really tight Raiders pinch to hold.

I would suggest not using steam on the "first pass" of the creasing process, until you're sure you've got the crease you want. After you've tweaked it entirely to your liking, I would 'set' the crease with some steam or water.

backstagejack · Post by **backstagejack** » Mon Jul 01, 2013 3:58 pm

solbergg wrote:
Michaelson wrote: You may also be happy to know 'we' here at Indygear had a hand in the creation of the Federation, so you chose....wisely.
Regard! Michaelson
Awesome! I'm really excited for the hat to arrive. I decided to go with express shipping because I'm impatient

For current Fed owners: When you bashed yours did you need to steam it or was it possible to "dry bash"?

Yeah, dry bashing works great for a nice generic Indy look. If you want a specific look from a scene or movie, then you might have to steam it.

Great buy, btw. The fed is an amazingly tough hat and sharp looking.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 3:50 pm

The Fed IV arrived today! Now how do I shape the brim?

jlee562 · Post by **jlee562** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:03 pm

Depends on how you want to shape the brim.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:11 pm

jlee562 wrote:Depends on how you want to shape the brim.

Raiders style

jlee562 · Post by **jlee562** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:18 pm

solbergg wrote:
jlee562 wrote:Depends on how you want to shape the brim.
Raiders style

See this video from John Penman: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozJKQVCgeZ4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:26 pm

jlee562 wrote: See this video from John Penman: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozJKQVCgeZ4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thanks, but I'm looking for the brim, not the crown.

backstagejack · Post by **backstagejack** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:40 pm

solbergg wrote:
jlee562 wrote: See this video from John Penman: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozJKQVCgeZ4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks, but I'm looking for the brim, not the crown.

Part of the raider's brim design is also dependent on how the hat is turned thus effecting the crown....

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:54 pm

backstagejack wrote: Part of the raider's brim design is also dependent on how the hat is turned thus effecting the crown....

In that case it sounds like I should shape the brim first then bash the crown. Thanks!

Still looking for tips on how to shape the brim, though. In screen captures the bend of the front of the brim seems to start pretty far back into the hat. I'd say more than 1/3rd of the way in from the front, see below:

To pull that off, it seems like I would have to bend the headband as well.

jlee562 · Post by **jlee562** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 6:14 pm

backstagejack wrote:
solbergg wrote:
jlee562 wrote: See this video from John Penman: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozJKQVCgeZ4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks, but I'm looking for the brim, not the crown.
Part of the raider's brim design is also dependent on how the hat is turned thus effecting the crown....

Exactly. You have to do "the turn" BEFORE you do ANYTHING to the crown, or else you won't get your pinch centered.

In my experience, the Fed's brim won't snap down that severely out of the box. But the same general techniques apply: steam or water.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 6:14 pm

No. Follow the video as suggested. The brim is flanged already. When you crease the hat off center like I show in the video. The brim will warp like the raiders hat. No need to really shape the grim by hand. Watch the video a few times. Pay close attention to every step.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 6:35 pm

Sounds good, John. After work I'll have my iPad, a mirror, and the fedora and I'll do my best. Hopefully the result will be something like this:

Indy is skeptical of solbergg's ability to follow instructions

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:23 pm

If you follow the video correctly you brim will be that way. It's very simple if you don't over think it.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 10:25 pm

If you follow John's video you should end up with decent results.

Below, top to bottom are my Federation IV Deluxe, my every day Penman, and an Adventurebilt.

Obviously different felt - the Penman and the Adventurebilt are both beaver - but I think the appearance is fairly close.

One thing I have almost always done, and I started trying to copy this hat before Temple of Doom came out, is work the brim, rolling it and unrolling it with my fingers to loosen it up. Makes it easier to get the slight curl up at the edges even though the brim angles down from the brim break at the bottom of the ribbon.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Tue Jul 02, 2013 11:40 pm

Post that shot I like of you wearing it ridgerunner.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 12:11 am

You mean this one ?

Is it any wonder that this is the one I grab most often?

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:22 am

That's the one. Hats always look better on someone.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:49 am

Nice looking hats, Ridgerunner! Thanks for the brim rolling tip, I'm definitely going to start doing that.

I've had some success with my bash, though I can't seem to get the sides of the crown to look right yet.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 11:43 am

Even if you manage to get it looking as you think it should by pushing and prodding, as you wear it the hat will change shape as it adapts to your head and how you wear a hat.

I don't think my every day Penman is a dead ringer for any particular one of the movie hats, but it's the one that makes me look . . . welll, more like me - so it sees the most use.

Get it close and wear it - try to resist the temptation to constantly tinker - time on your head will handle the rest.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:09 pm

Ridge, That shot you posted looks very Raiders.

Ridgerunner58 · Post by **Ridgerunner58** » Wed Jul 03, 2013 9:02 pm

It's definitely a Raiders hat as opposed to a TOD, Last Crusade or CS. What I meant was it's just not specifically a waterfall, Temple, Idol, Raven, Cairo, Well of Souls, Truck Chase, etc. hat.

It started as a great Raiders hat, but it's become something that "happened" from the way I have worn and used it.

It's still a Raiders hat - but it's more. It's MY Raiders hat.

Of course the way it has mellowed and evolved is mostly a testament to the quality of the materials and workmanship that went into it. I've had other hats over the years that I've worn a lot and they always end up losing their shape and just looking beat up. This one just gets better.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Thu Jul 04, 2013 1:28 am

This is the single most reason when I make myself a Raiders hat I don't crease it to one scene. I crease it to get that oval all look of The Raiders look because after you wear it and handle it, it starts to take on a life of its own. It will always be a Raiders hat but it will be the wearers Raiders hat. I see it as being piontless to crease it to any one scene anymore. This doesn't mean I won't do it for a customer but I don't do it for me anymore. The only way I would make a Raiders hat for myself and crease it to one scene is I was going to put in on display and never wear or touch it. As anyone who knows me, I want my hats to be worn.

solbergg · Post by **solbergg** » Fri Jul 12, 2013 2:10 pm

Just wanted to give an update on this now that I have had the Fed IV for a week. When I first put it on it still looked a little large on me, but after a week of getting used to it I think it's exactly the right size. I still wouldn't wear it with a collar-less shirt, but it looks fantastic with a collared shirt or jacket.