Is There An Easier Way To Determine A Hat's Size?

[IndyRiv]

I was wondering if there's an easier way to determine a hat's exact size. I own a couple of hats that fit me really well but don't have any markings that state their size. I've tried using a tailor's tape to measure the inside of the hat but if you've ever tried doing that, you know that after about a 1/4 way around the inside, the tape tends to slip and you don't get an accurate reading.

I've also heard that there might be a way to determine the hat's size by measuring the outside crown around the break point and somehow determining its size from that.

If there's an easier way to determine sizing, I'd love to hear about it as I'd like to use the measurements from these hats as my basis for ordering in the future.

Thanks!

[BendingOak]

A hatter hat size tool is the only true way to get an exact measurement but since you don't have one I will give this down and dirty way of getting a good measurements of your hats.

Take some blue masking tape like you use for painting. Line the sweatband closest to the brim break/ were the stitching of the reed to leather of the sweatband is. I hope that's clear????

Make a mark on one end and then loop it all the way around the sweatband until you meet that mark again. Over lap the tap and mark the other end of the tape. Pull it out of the hat and lay it down flat on a table so it looks like this l__________________l . Then measure in-between the to marks that you made. You should get a real good measurement this way.

John

[gwyddion]

I would like to ad, probably unnecessarily, that you should use the kind that does not stretch.

Regards, Geert

[jnicktem]

... and isn't permanent!

[Mike]

Its easy enough, just try on a few Susquehanna Hats.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THZV5g1CNZM" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[wellofsouls]

Its easy enough, just try on a few Susquehanna Hats.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=THZV5g1CNZM" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Great video - how'd you like to get inside that hat shop?

Which is also the best way to know your size. Lots of variables go into a hat's fit and if you don't live near a serious hat shop then order the closest size you think is right and DON'T hesitate to send it back for a larger or smaller one. If you stay within a brand, you'll generally be good to go. Then when you get a haircut it'll be too loose...

[Tennessee Smith]

Then when you get a haircut it'll be too loose...

Yep, and Thank God for foam inserts when that does happen!!!

[binkmeisterRick]

I knew you wore hair inserts, Erin!

[Hollowpond]

Its Lee Press-On Hair!!!!

[IndyRiv]

A hatter hat size tool is the only true way to get an exact measurement but since you don't have one I will give this down and dirty way of getting a good measurements of your hats.

Take some blue masking tape like you use for painting. Line the sweatband closest to the brim break/ were the stitching of the reed to leather of the sweatband is. I hope that's clear????

Make a mark on one end and then loop it all the way around the sweatband until you meet that mark again. Over lap the tap and mark the other end of the tape. Pull it out of the hat and lay it down flat on a table so it looks like this l__________________l . Then measure in-between the to marks that you made. You should get a real good measurement this way.

John

OK, after becoming bored out of my mind today, I decided I should fulfill my curiosity and tried John's suggestion. I should mention first that it was done on an Akubra (which I bought 2nd hand from someone else). The person I bought it from said it was a size 57 if I remember correctly, which would put it at a size 7 or thereabouts. However, I've read that Akubras run a .5 cm smaller than the advertised hat size, so a size 57 would actually then be a 56.5.

Now, with my Akubra, the sweatband is sort of "glued in" so I was afraid to peel the sweat inside out as much as I'd need to to follow John's suggestion for fear of wrecking things (trust me, I heard enough "crackling" and other noises which would make anyone cringe when trying to turn the sweat inside out ). So what I did was:

1) I "tried" (it wasn't easy) to overlap the edge of the starting point of the painter's tape over the sweatband seam and marked it with a line.

2) I then tried my best to stick the tape all the way around the bottom edge of the sweat.

3) Once I got the end, I overlapped the tape again and marked the seam line.

4) I then took out the tape, flattened it out on the table, and measured with a yard stick the inside of the two lines. I came up with 22" even which should be a size 57.

What makes me scratch my head is that this hat fits absolutely PERFECT but yet I've tried on other size 7/22" hats (including a beaver one) and it was too tight, so I had it stretched.

I've found that size 7 hats are too tight for me, while size 7 1/8 hats are generally a little too big and therefore, by my novice powers of deduction, have determined that I must be somewhere between the two. I've got two hats ordered from someone (beaver felt if that helps - I don't know if the felt type makes much of a difference in the size or not) and since they're custom, they need exact measurements. I thought about using this particular hat, but it's now been shown to be a size 7. It fits perfectly, but I'm just extremely worried that if I give them the 22" measurement, that the hats will come back too tight.

Any suggestions, advice, etc. would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for all your help thus far!

[BendingOak]

Look like I will need to make a video showing how to do this so it's more clear for everyone. It's also not a 100% perfect.

Ok, after stating that, let's see what I can do to help. First sweatband can shrink, I have never seen any two hat companies that make hats off the rack or factory hats the same. One company call a 7 3/8= 59cm 23 inches and the next will call it 23 1/8 inches and then another will call it 23 1/4inches. Now 7 3/8 = 59cm is not any of them but closest to 23 1/4. The real funny thing is that cm is a measurement not a hat size. 59cm is = to 23.23 inches. Don't ask me why companies can't do the freaking math.

Ok, now that I got that all out. Let's try helping with the masking tape. We need to get on the same page when I say bottom. Keep the sweatband in the hat. Don't un-fold the sweatband at all. Leave it like you are about to wear it. Put the tape on the sweatband where the stitches are that joins the leather and the read tape. Let's say the leather sweatband is brown like the ones I use. There is a black part that isn't leather that is connected to the leather via these stitches.

like this....



I hope that clears things up. If you measure and lower ( into the hat further) it will measure smaller. Most sweatbands tapper as they go higher into the hat.

[BendingOak]

Admin/mods,

I wonder if we shouldn't save this for future reference?

I

[BendingOak]

Here are 3 examples of what I mean about hat size chats.


Hats direct size chat

cm inches UK Universal USA
53 21 6 1/2 x-small 6 5/8
54 21 1/4 6 5/8 small 6 3/4
55 21 3/4 6 3/4 small 6 7/8
56 22 1/8 6 7/8 medium 7
57 22 1/2 7 medium 7 1/8
58 22 7/8 7 1/8 med large 7 1/4
59 23 1/4 7 1/4 large 7 3/8
60 23 3/4 7 3/8 large 7 1/2
61 24 1/4 7 1/2 x-large 7 5/8
62 24 1/2 7 5/8 x-large 7 3/4
63 24 7/8 7 3/4 xx-large 7 7/8


as you can see they say 56cm/US size 7 = 22 1/8 inches. oops thats wrong because in fact its 22.05 inches.

Miller hats size chart states that ...........

56cm/ US size 7 = 22 inches. I'll go with that but they also state that 59cm/US size 7 3/8 = 23 inches. ooops. thats wrong because its 23.23 inches.

neither of these hat chats can be trusted.

lets go to yet another................ lets try village hat shop.

They sate on their chat that a 56cm/US size 7 = 21 7/8 inches. oops, once again we find another measurement that is wrong.

I can completely understand why people have such a hard time buying hats. I would be pulling my hair out at this point.


Thats why I suggest to everyone

-that you have someone measure your head for you a few times to get an accurate measure.
-don't take the measurements yourself looking into a mirror. you will never be accurate or can get a good look around you own head.
-give your measurements (not your hats size) to the hat maker or hat company for them to size you to a hat .
-sometimes people don't fit into factory/off the rack hats and should try a custom/handmade if they can.
- if you can't go that route better to go slightly bigger, than slightly smaller.


Here is a true hat size chart for all



cm = inches US size


49 cm = 19.29 inches 6 1/8
50 cm = 19.68 inches 6 1/4
51 cm = 20.08 inches 6 3/8
52 cm = 20.47 inches 6 1/2
53 cm = 20.87 inches 6 5/8
54 cm = 21.26 inches 6 3/4
55 cm = 21.65 inches 6 7/8
56 cm = 22.05 inches 7
57 cm = 22.44 inches 7 1/8
58 cm = 22.83 inches 7 1/4
59 cm = 23.23 inches 7 3/8
60 cm = 23.62 inches 7 1/2
61 cm = 24.02 inches 7 5/8
62 cm = 24.41 inches 7 3/4





again, might not be a bad idea to sticking these things somewhere.

[IndyRiv]

Look like I will need to make a video showing how to do this so it's more clear for everyone. It's also not a 100% perfect.

Ok, after stating that, let's see what I can do to help. First sweatband can shrink, I have never seen any two hat companies that make hats off the rack or factory hats the same. One company call a 7 3/8= 59cm 23 inches and the next will call it 23 1/8 inches and then another will call it 23 1/4inches. Now 7 3/8 = 59cm is not any of them but closest to 23 1/4. The real funny thing is that cm is a measurement not a hat size. 59cm is = to 23.23 inches. Don't ask me why companies can't do the freaking math.

Ok, now that I got that all out. Let's try helping with the masking tape. We need to get on the same page when I say bottom. Keep the sweatband in the hat. Don't un-fold the sweatband at all. Leave it like you are about to wear it. Put the tape on the sweatband where the stitches are that joins the leather and the read tape. Let's say the leather sweatband is brown like the ones I use. There is a black part that isn't leather that is connected to the leather via these stitches.

like this....



I hope that clears things up. If you measure and lower ( into the hat further) it will measure smaller. Most sweatbands tapper as they go higher into the hat.

Gotcha John! Yeh, I'm confused as well why each particular hat maker has totally different measurements for certain sizes. It makes buying factory hats that much more difficult.

I'm pretty sure I did it exactly as you now just described as that seemed the most sensible thing to and it's with the sweatband inside the hat that is the true hat size (after all, one wouldn't wear the sweatband turned inside out - that's just CRAZY! ); however, I'll give it a couple more goes to get an average. Also, I think I'll also try putting "pieces" of tape in as smaller pieces will contour to the curves better than trying to paste in one long strip like I originally did.

I had someone try your measuring directions John on how to measure one's head for sizing and I "think" (can't find the slip I wrote it down on now) it was 22 1/8" it came out to. I've been hoping to find someone close to where I live that can properly measure my head but, alas, I live in an area where hatter's are far and few in-between. So I think I'll have to give that measuring another go.

Lastly, as an aside, I see in your other YouTube video that you recommend on the top of the crown to brush the whole top from front to back. However, David Morgan here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWmSqXwO ... re=related" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) states to brush the top of the crown in the same counter-clockwise motion as should be done to the rest of the top/sides of the hat. So I just wanted to bring that up to see if I could get some clarification on the two different directions of hat-brushing.

Thanks John!

[IndyRiv]

Here are 3 examples of what I mean about hat size chats.


Hats direct size chat

cm inches UK Universal USA
53 21 6 1/2 x-small 6 5/8
54 21 1/4 6 5/8 small 6 3/4
55 21 3/4 6 3/4 small 6 7/8
56 22 1/8 6 7/8 medium 7
57 22 1/2 7 medium 7 1/8
58 22 7/8 7 1/8 med large 7 1/4
59 23 1/4 7 1/4 large 7 3/8
60 23 3/4 7 3/8 large 7 1/2
61 24 1/4 7 1/2 x-large 7 5/8
62 24 1/2 7 5/8 x-large 7 3/4
63 24 7/8 7 3/4 xx-large 7 7/8


as you can see they say 56cm/US size 7 = 22 1/8 inches. oops thats wrong because in fact its 22.05 inches.

Miller hats size chart states that ...........

56cm/ US size 7 = 22 inches. I'll go with that but they also state that 59cm/US size 7 3/8 = 23 inches. ooops. thats wrong because its 23.23 inches.

neither of these hat chats can be trusted.

lets go to yet another................ lets try village hat shop.

They sate on their chat that a 56cm/US size 7 = 21 7/8 inches. oops, once again we find another measurement that is wrong.

I can completely understand why people have such a hard time buying hats. I would be pulling my hair out at this point.


Thats why I suggest to everyone

-that you have someone measure your head for you a few times to get an accurate measure.
-don't take the measurements yourself looking into a mirror. you will never be accurate or can get a good look around you own head.
-give your measurements (not your hats size) to the hat maker or hat company for them to size you to a hat .
-sometimes people don't fit into factory/off the rack hats and should try a custom/handmade if they can.
- if you can't go that route better to go slightly bigger, than slightly smaller.


Here is a true hat size chart for all



cm = inches US size


49 cm = 19.29 inches 6 1/8
50 cm = 19.68 inches 6 1/4
51 cm = 20.08 inches 6 3/8
52 cm = 20.47 inches 6 1/2
53 cm = 20.87 inches 6 5/8
54 cm = 21.26 inches 6 3/4
55 cm = 21.65 inches 6 7/8
56 cm = 22.05 inches 7
57 cm = 22.44 inches 7 1/8
58 cm = 22.83 inches 7 1/4
59 cm = 23.23 inches 7 3/8
60 cm = 23.62 inches 7 1/2
61 cm = 24.02 inches 7 5/8
62 cm = 24.41 inches 7 3/4





again, might not be a bad idea to sticking these things somewhere.

Thanks for this info John.

I've always actually thought to write to you and just bring up the suggestion of the possibility of you posting a good, official "sizing chart" on your website. I know hatsdirect, villagehatshop, David Morgan, etc. all have them, but it would be great if there was a highly reputable and accurate place to go to determine THE right hat size.

[BendingOak]

About David Morgan, I love the guy and owe him a lot for all his time he gave me on strand cutting, braiding and all his knowledge of whip making. He a a mench in my book. He isn't a hat make just a retailer when he comes to hats and I'm sorry to say he is wrong. Unless for some strange reason akubra pounces their hat like that.

The chat I posted that I made is correct. Even had mr. Kitter double check my math for me.

Don't take me the wrong way. I think one can buy hats via the Internet and from off the rack but they should follow the list I stated in my post earlier.

You do not need a hatter to get an accurate measurement. Go to my site under ordering process and watch my videos on how to have someone to take your measurements.

Just remember a tight tape is a tight fitting hat. A lose tape is a lose fitting hat.

After you had someone take your measurements a few times. A number should pop out at you. Then take your tape measure and tape it together to make a crown at what ever average you got. Put it on your head and see if you can get ONE FINGER TIP under the tape IN FRONT of one of your ears. If you can't, it's to tight. If the tape slips down before you put your finger tip under the tape it's to large.


I hope that makes things clear.

[IndyRiv]

About David Morgan, I love the guy and owe him a lot for all his time he gave me on strand cutting, braiding and all his knowledge of whip making. He a a mench in my book. He isn't a hat make just a retailer when he comes to hats and I'm sorry to say he is wrong. Unless for some strange reason akubra pounces their hat like that.

The chat I posted that I made is correct. Even had mr. Kitter double check my math for me.

Don't take me the wrong way. I think one can buy hats via the Internet and from off the rack but they should follow the list I stated in my post earlier.

You do not need a hatter to get an accurate measurement. Go to my site under ordering process and watch my videos on how to have someone to take your measurements.

Just remember a tight tape is a tight fitting hat. A lose tape is a lose fitting hat.

After you had someone take your measurements a few times. A number should pop out at you. Then take your tape measure and tape it together to make a crown at what ever average you got. Put it on your head and see if you can get ONE FINGER TIP under the tape IN FRONT of one of your ears. If you can't, it's to tight. If the tape slips down before you put your finger tip under the tape it's to large.


I hope that makes things clear.

Indeed, it all does!

And I hope my question with regards to David Morgan wasn't offensive. I just saw two different ways of brushing the hat so wanted to inquire a little more.

Thanks again and I will give all these things a try.

[BendingOak]

Not offended in the least. I good question and deserved an answer.

[Indiana Jeff]

Here is a true hat size chart for all



cm = inches US size


49 cm = 19.29 inches 6 1/8
50 cm = 19.68 inches 6 1/4
51 cm = 20.08 inches 6 3/8
52 cm = 20.47 inches 6 1/2
53 cm = 20.87 inches 6 5/8
54 cm = 21.26 inches 6 3/4
55 cm = 21.65 inches 6 7/8
56 cm = 22.05 inches 7
57 cm = 22.44 inches 7 1/8
58 cm = 22.83 inches 7 1/4
59 cm = 23.23 inches 7 3/8
60 cm = 23.62 inches 7 1/2
61 cm = 24.02 inches 7 5/8
62 cm = 24.41 inches 7 3/4





again, might not be a bad idea to sticking these things somewhere.

Bink added this chart to the stickied Fedora FAQ thread at the top of the hat section.

Regards,

Indiana Jeff