FINALLY!!! I've found the correct color of Indy's web belt.

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:34 pm

Since 2008 I have been searching every nook and cranny of the internet for the correct color of the CS Indy's web belt in CS. That's when I came into this hobby. So many times the colors looked close in the online photos but when I received a sample piece of the webbing, or worse yet, 1 or 2 belts the color was just plain wrong. The samples here are just a few of what I've dealt with. They ranged in color from off-white, tan, olive drab, wheat etc., etc., etc..
This week I finally struck gold, er khaki. I had a good feeling from the online photo because I hadn't seen this color of khaki before and when they arrived today it was perfect!

Strait City Trading Co. #4002N khaki 50"
http://straitcity.com/display/webbing/m ... otton.html

Here I have the belt along with some previous purchases sitting on top of my new Todd's trousers. This is an outdoor shot with the sun down past the tree line this evening.

1. Vintage WWII army belt came with my authentic solid brass buckle and tip. (very harvest gold)
2. The correct color khaki belt
3. Sportsman's Guide made by Mil-Tec SEMS INC (advertised as khaki, but is light olive OD#3? possibly)
4. eBay military surplus vendor (photos looked like light tan or beige but VERY off-white)
5. WPG authentic MKVII bag with original web strap (real khaki, not olive drab)

Here the CS scene running from the BIG "D" ANTS! The color of this scene has a lot of yellow in it.

I honestly think I've found the right color. It looks just as good in real life, it's got that true khaki color with a somewhat flesh-tone to it. $\:D/$

more pics
https://www.flickr.com/photos/35223822@N08/albums

IndyRiv · Post by **IndyRiv** » Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:50 pm

Lantzn,

I cannot tell you how excited and happy I am to hear of this breakthrough. I, like you, am focusing on CS as well and this is one thing that's been dodging me for quite some time.

I've gotta run here, but I'll try to post again with some more reflections.

But in the meantime, would you be willing to share where you obtained the belt from? I'd be interested in acquiring one as well. PM me or if you're willing to post it for all to see, either is great with me.

Thanks and congratulations on your find!

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:11 pm

I compared the weaving with Kyles hero photo and it is right on the money. There are many different patterns, all like fingerprints.

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:47 pm

I took a photo of the webbing and re-sized it to about the same size as that of the Hero outfit photo from Kyle.
I feel the weave of this belt is the same as that from the movie.

IndyRiv · Post by **IndyRiv** » Sat Jul 02, 2011 11:44 pm

Thanks Lantzn for the comparison!

I hope you don't mind me getting this thread off to a running start as I'd like to post more with you on the web-belt in general.

Where did Kyle see the outfit at? Do you know if this is the same outfit that's on display at the Adventure of Archaeology Exhibition in Montreal? If it is, there are some slight differences as well in comparing that costume to real items such as web-belts. First, the costume is in a display case which filters and changes the lighting. Second, the lighting above the case itself is different than natural lighting or that of the film crew so the colors come out a little different.

I wanted to ask if you'd be willing to take an even closer picture or scan of the weave of your belt and be willing to post it? Your current one is great, but is a little hard yet to see the exact form of the weave.

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 12:18 am

IndyRiv
By all means jump in with whatever you have!

Kyle goes by Knibs7 here and I've pm'd him to see where the photo came from and if he had any others and in original resolution. This is what he had written when he first sent it to me quite awhile back.
""I took the pic when I got a special viewing of the hero costume" ~Kyle COW member"

Here's the original shots of the closeups of the webbing the light changes slightly.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/35223822@N ... 045459256/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/35223822@N ... 045459256/

wild_weasel · Post by **wild_weasel** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 1:38 am

Hello,

Thanks for the lead on these belts, just ordered a khaki and dark brown with antique brass hardware.

Cheers,
W-W

Mitch LaRue · Post by **Mitch LaRue** » Sun Jul 03, 2011 6:51 pm

SECOND that, lantzn!
Thanks very much for sharing your find! (And thanks for the research you've done on this!)
Great info!

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:28 am

IndyRiv
Can you post a link to a much larger version of this picture?

Is this the book this was taken from? I can't find any other complete guide.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/159474 ... T8GRCNN7P1

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Mon Jul 04, 2011 1:44 pm

I'd like to know if you are able to see the detail of the weave in the webbing in the books photo. One other thing I noticed is the bright brass buckle looks to be the same as that from the vendor as well.

IndyRiv · Post by **IndyRiv** » Mon Jul 04, 2011 8:10 pm

lantzn wrote:I'd like to know if you are able to see the detail of the weave in the webbing in the books photo. One other thing I noticed is the bright brass buckle looks to be the same as that from the vendor as well.

Lantzn,

With regards to a larger picture: I tried to enlarge the picture on my photobucket account but it just made things more hazy. So I wasn't successful in that route. If I can think of some other way to successfully come up with a good, larger picture I'll try it.

It's hard to focus on it, but a person can make out the general weave in the picture. But, like I just stressed, it's very eye-straining. I'm curious to know if a magnifying glass would help things so will give that a try here sometime soon and will let you know how that turns out.

Also, if it would help, I can post the weaves of both the Noel Howard Raiders/TOD and LC belts as I have samples of both. Given that the films try to carry over the gear from the previous film and try to keep many of the aspects the same, as well as Noel's gear still being considered "the precedent" even to this day among Indy gear-heads as the most accurate, I would think that the weave styling of Noel's LC webbing especially would be the same as that used in the film. I'm not saying it is as there was a big time-gap inbetween LC and CS and they had to basically recreate almost everything for CS so many things were bought more "new stock" than vintage stock - at least that's what I figure happened with the web-belt. So if you think posts of these two weaves of belts would help, let me know and I'll get them posted as soon as possible.

Lastly, I realize that it "should" be easy to find on the website, but would you be willing to post a link to the bright brass buckle you're referring to? I assume it's the 100% brass one and not the brass plated one. Also, I see that they offer an "antiqued brass" buckle which looks very "authentic". However, it doesn't say whether that's pure brass or brass plated.

IndyRiv · Post by **IndyRiv** » Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:36 pm

[quote="Tundrarider"]From the site:

"Buckles for both 1-1/2" and 1-1/4" belts. All are steel except for the solid brass buckle. Basic nickel polish and brass colors together with several alternative colors: black, antique brass and silver. "
quote]

Thanks Michael for the information. Most sites make sure they cover everything and I can see this is one of them. I just can't believe I overlooked that bit of information but I did I guess.

Thanks again for pointing that out.

I know most of the concensus about the buckle itself is that it should be pure brass, but what do all of you think it was:

- Steel with the antiqued brass finish
- Pure brass, artificially/naturally tarnished
- Brass plated (

to think LucasFilm with their penchant for accuracy and detail would use such a cheaply made item)

I guess given the posts by such esteemed (and I mean that genuinely and not sarcastically) individuals as you Michael, I'd go with pure brass as the belt is supposed to be pre-WWII or WWII thereabouts and that's what the WWII ones were made of, but the antiqued brass one looks really cool.

Also, I know there was some debate over the size of the buckle in your post Michael. I'm going to go and revisit your thread again. But if I remember correctly, you thought the buckle was the same size as the ones offered on the link you gave above (the newer style) in the films rather than the WWII style (which are shorter and more pudgy)?

Way off track for this thread's original purpose I know...

ThatManFromRio · Post by **ThatManFromRio** » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:36 am

Tundrarider wrote: Seriously, I don't think the wardrobe and prop makers put half the time and energy into their stuff as the folks around here do.

TMFR

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:01 pm

I took the pictures when they were on display in Houston... I got a private viewing of them out of the case.

Kyle

Flyderf · Post by **Flyderf** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 1:20 am

Nice find. I ordered 2. One in Khaki, one in taupe. Got one with a brass, and one with an antique brass. I just like these belts for every day wear.

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 4:03 am

I'm almost sure they used this buckle from the same company Strait City.
It looks like they might have used one of the many brands of brass antiquing liquids to age.
What do you guys think?

Has any gotten their belt? How do they look to you compared with the new photos?

darkhelmet · Post by **darkhelmet** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 4:23 am

I ordered five belts. Love the Indy 4 color and wear it all the time. Also got a Raiders brown and a LC light khaki and a couple of others.

tomek9210 · Post by **tomek9210** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 5:16 am

Can anyone tell me what is the white belt under the main webbelt?

BTW, great find!

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 6:24 pm

tomek9210 wrote:Can anyone tell me what is the white belt under the main webbelt?

BTW, great find!

Yeah I happened to notice that to, but I haven't a clue.
Maybe Indy wore 100% web underwear and that's the waistband.

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 6:30 pm

The more I look at that it seems as though maybe the mannequin's waist was to big for the belt and they sewed/patched a piece of white web belt to the end that goes into the back of the buckle. You can see the white webbing going right into the back of the buckle were those small 90 degree bent brass tabs are.

IndyRiv · Post by **IndyRiv** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:50 pm

Lantzn and Knibs (Kyle),

Thanks SO MUCH for posting/providing these pictures, especially of the larger resolution one when you click on the link Lantzn gave.

I, as well, noticed the white webbing and am still trying to figure that one out.

What's so interesting, and mind-boggling, besides the web-belt are the trousers in the picture. It's really easy to see the weave and diagonal pattern of the weave of the trousers in the large resolution picture and unless I'm mistaken with my own eyes, the weave looks NOTHING like cavalry twill. It may very well be a wool trouser, but I'm not seeing the signature cavalry twill weave in them which lends itself to the possibility of what others have mentioned in other threads that Indy's pants in CS "moved" in such a way as to be more reminiscent of cotton rather than wool. In otherwords, some people say that, especially when Indy is walking through the Peruvian marketplace with Mutt, his pants bunch up, crinkle, and move more like cotton dress trousers rather than wool cavalry twill.

I'm going to go through my archive of pictures as well as see if I can find any pictures on the extras dvd of CS to see if I can find a cavalry twill weave to the trousers.

I'm not doubting Knibs WHATSOEVER on his stating that he privately viewed and saw this costume up close and personal, but I'm really thinking this wasn't THE hero costume Ford wore in the film. I can't say for sure yet, but the color of the web-belt just seems different than that in the film or stills I've seen and with Pollack's penchant (with oversight by Spielberg and Lucas) for accuracy and consistency to the other films (in otherwords, if they tried to stay consistent with the look/materials of LC, then the trousers in CS should've been made in wool cavalry twill), I'm just not seeing the "cav. twill weave" in the picture posted which creates a lot of questions and head-scratching for me. Again, I'm just looking at the costume itself and NOT questioning any one person so I hope my post here doesn't offend anyone.

knibs7 · Post by **knibs7** » Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:52 pm

I think it's a rope tied under the web belt so that the pants don't fall off the mannequin

Kyle

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:46 am

From what I talked about in the pictures with Wade Eagan the gun belt is definitely a different belt. However he believe from the color, markings and defects that the holster is more then likely the real deal. I too thought the weave in the pants looked very much like some cotton slacks I own and nothing close to my Todd's pants, even though those are more Raiders in color from what others are saying.

But from my screenshots at the ants scene I still think the web belt looks to be correct in both color and weave. When the photos from Knibs turned out to be the same I am even more confident it's the web belt used. I have scoured my DVD and online and can't seem to find a closeup shot of the web belt. It's always from a distance or a motion shot.

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:57 am

IndyRiv,
I found a VERY large photo of Indy in the graveyard scene and compared the belt with mine.

Be sure to look at the larger versions here;

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6012/597 ... a9c4_b.jpg

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Sat Aug 06, 2011 3:17 am

BIG photo of the web belt in daylight. Hover over the belt and click on it with the magnifying glass to see the expanded view.

http://www.odysseeducinema.fr/galerie/I ... rane26.jpg

Mitch LaRue · Post by **Mitch LaRue** » Sat Aug 13, 2011 2:29 pm

Well, I just couldn't say "no" to these great looking belts from Strait City Trading Co., so a few nights ago I ordered Dark Brown, Khaki and Taupe belts with Brass Plate and Antique Brass Buckles...

... can't wait to GET 'em!

indyexpat · Post by **indyexpat** » Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:00 pm

lantzn wrote:Strait City Trading Co. #4002N khaki 50"
http://straitcity.com/display/webbing/m ... otton.html

4002N with no buckle or tip? Looks perfect but isn't what you ordered the 4002 khaki 50" with antique brass buckle?

Indiana Croft · Post by **Indiana Croft** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:56 am

I think it's a rope tied under the web belt so that the pants don't fall off the mannequin

Kyle

Isn't that what the belt is for,

Croft

bjw · Post by **bjw** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:20 am

Y'know, even after years and years in this hobby I still make the naive mistake of looking at a heading like the one at the top of this thread and thinking, "What's this guy talking about? It's a WEB BELT for gosh sakes! How hard could it be?!" And then by the time I've worked my way down the posts I'm feeling like this

as I realize that I know nothing. My hat is off to you guys down in the trenches doing the hard research.

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:42 pm

indyexpat wrote:
lantzn wrote:Strait City Trading Co. #4002N khaki 50"
http://straitcity.com/display/webbing/m ... otton.html
4002N with no buckle or tip? Looks perfect but isn't what you ordered the 4002 khaki 50" with antique brass buckle?

I ordered without a buckle because I have a number of vintage WWII solid brass ones I'm using. But I do plan on ordering a few of their brass solid buckles because I would like to use them to experiment with various "antiquing" methods on brass. Starting with identical items will give me the best comparison. There are a number of commercial and homemade solutions to try.

I just read about ammonia fuming brass which sounds very cool.
http://www.whitechapel-ltd.com/ganti.html

indyexpat · Post by **indyexpat** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:46 pm

Thanks for confirming. WWII you say.. (heads to eBay)..

lantzn · Post by **lantzn** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:20 pm

indyexpat wrote:Thanks for confirming. WWII you say.. (heads to eBay)..

indyexpat · Post by **indyexpat** » Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:19 pm

Ok, now you're showing off.. (items you wish to sell I hope). Look great!

IndyRiv · Post by **IndyRiv** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 11:34 pm

I've got a LARGE stock of these vintage WWII buckles I'd consider selling. PM me and we'll talk!