A2 or Indy jacket?

Hatch · Post by **Hatch** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 10:42 am

Alphared, not familiar with Packards and quick search didn't turn up much ....have got a link or info ??

Hatch · Post by **Hatch** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 10:57 am

_ ,what personal sizing info do you supply and does it differ from the measurements you supply to say, TN ??

frogman · Post by **frogman** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 11:25 am

where can we find that form please?

that_dog · Post by **that_dog** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:10 pm

_, you've probably already heard this from a number of people, but as a true jacket aficionado (maybe THE jacket aficionado, at least on this site -- what was your jacket tally again?

) you owe it to yourself to check out John Chapman's work at Goodwear. It will blow you away. He's started making repro Navy jackets as well -- his Monarch M-422 is pretty sick.

I own one of his Broncos in goat, and it is an awesome, awesome jacket. (The one below isn't mine, but pretty much its twin.)

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:36 pm

crismans wrote:That is a sweet, sweet jacket, alphared!

And despite my post above, I've been looking at A2s. I'd like to have a Tales of the Gold Monkey look.

I really liked that show. Can't find any good DVDs of it though

that_dog · Post by **that_dog** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 1:54 pm

_ wrote:Yep - I've heard of them. But I've "scratched that itch" already. I'll wear my capeskin Aero Bronco now and then. The Avirex is the genuine article - a size 54 that was issued to a marine major in Vietnam. But I've heard good things about the goodyears. Just no reason to go there...

I envy you. For my own sake, I still have the A-2 bug (couldn't you tell?). I keep looking at the photos on the Good Wear site and find myself thinking things like, "Would it really be so crazy to get one of every pattern John makes?"

No, no, I'm only going to get one more... a Dubow in seal HH... Crown zip... then I'm done. Well, maybe a Star Sportswear. And you gotta have a Rough Wear, right? And the United Sheeplined pattern is really cool....

alphared6 · Post by **alphared6** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 1:56 pm

Hatch wrote:Alphared, not familiar with Packards and quick search didn't turn up much ....have got a link or info ??

OOPS!

My bad ... "Pecard's."
Sorry,
Mike

that_dog · Post by **that_dog** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:01 pm

_ wrote:Another issue with A2 is it uses the largest single piece of leather for the back of any jacket we talk about around here. At size 52 I outgrew it. I'm measuring at about a 56 chest right now.

Hey, you could always ask around to see if anyone tans Clydesdale hides....

crismans · Post by **crismans** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 5:12 pm

RCSignals wrote:
crismans wrote:That is a sweet, sweet jacket, alphared!

And despite my post above, I've been looking at A2s. I'd like to have a Tales of the Gold Monkey look.

I really liked that show. Can't find any good DVDs of it though

I've got a bootleg set of the series. Not the best quality but watchable. There is a set coming out in England so maybe an American version isn't too far away. From what I've seen it's held up fairly well. Cutter is certainly an Indyesque character (as he was supposed to be I guess) and, like alphared said, it does have a very period feel.

Some nice looking actresses as well.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Fri Sep 18, 2009 8:55 pm

crismans wrote:
RCSignals wrote:
crismans wrote:That is a sweet, sweet jacket, alphared!

And despite my post above, I've been looking at A2s. I'd like to have a Tales of the Gold Monkey look.

I really liked that show. Can't find any good DVDs of it though
I've got a bootleg set of the series. Not the best quality but watchable. There is a set coming out in England so maybe an American version isn't too far away. From what I've seen it's held up fairly well. Cutter is certainly an Indyesque character (as he was supposed to be I guess) and, like alphared said, it does have a very period feel.

Some nice looking actresses as well.

As I recall it actually predates Raiders, but was shelved in the late 70's (the idea anyway) until they saw that such a story (an adventurer in the '30s) might be popular after Raiders was released.

blueoakleyz · Post by **blueoakleyz** » Sun Sep 20, 2009 6:01 am

An A2 is the exact jacket I'd pick if I was going on an adventure. Secure sleeves, I feel secure in the jacket.

Texan Scott · Post by **Texan Scott** » Sun Sep 20, 2009 1:01 pm

Try this link, Hatch:

http://www.pecard.com/mm5/merchant.mvc? ... pec-creams

It's Pecard. You can also get it on Ebay. This is not a paste, but something like, "goop". It is designed to be absorbed into the leather.

Post by **Michaelson** » Sun Sep 20, 2009 2:24 pm

Yep, there's less beeswax in this so called 'cream' than the regular stuff.

Regards! Michaelson

Hatch · Post by **Hatch** » Sun Sep 20, 2009 3:55 pm

Thanks Texan ... but.it was the 'Packards' misspeak that raised the question......Michaelson has already baptised me with the Pecards and I've got a good supply..

Texan Scott · Post by **Texan Scott** » Sun Sep 20, 2009 5:43 pm

That 'M' is on top of things once again!

Mark Brody · Post by **Mark Brody** » Thu Oct 15, 2009 2:38 pm

I've got an A2 that I wear as a uniform jacket. The first time I saw the A2, I didn't like the knit cuffs, but it grew on me. When the alternative was the CWU, the A2 is the most wonderful jacket in the world. The CWU only comes in small, medium, large, etc. Being a 41 Long, myself, it's nearly impossible to find a perfect fit - especially when all you have is small, medium, and large. The CWU I have is too big in the chest, and the sleeves are too short. My A2 is much more comfortable.

Comparing the A2 to the Indy jacket, I'll let you know when I get a new Indy jacket. I was disappointed with my first Indy jacket, so I'm trading it for some cash to get a different one, probably a US Wings (who made my A2).

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Thu Oct 15, 2009 3:15 pm

_ wrote:............

I actually prefer the navy jackets though. I have an. avirex G1 from 1967. I have several remakes of the M422a from Eastman, Aero, Real McCoy, and Flight Suits. The Avirex is my daily wear when winter hits. The inside pocket is the best!

I too like the G1. I thought that Avirex(now cockpit) didn't start up until the mid '70s? or was it a restart?

From my research Eastman now does custom sizing but there is an up charge.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Thu Oct 15, 2009 3:56 pm

Mark Brody wrote:I've got an A2 that I wear as a uniform jacket. The first time I saw the A2, I didn't like the knit cuffs, but it grew on me. When the alternative was the CWU, the A2 is the most wonderful jacket in the world. The CWU only comes in small, medium, large, etc. Being a 41 Long, myself, it's nearly impossible to find a perfect fit - especially when all you have is small, medium, and large. The CWU I have is too big in the chest, and the sleeves are too short. My A2 is much more comfortable.

Comparing the A2 to the Indy jacket, I'll let you know when I get a new Indy jacket. I was disappointed with my first Indy jacket, so I'm trading it for some cash to get a different one, probably a US Wings (who made my A2).

I never cared for the CWU

What was your first Indy jacket?

Mark Brody · Post by **Mark Brody** » Thu Oct 15, 2009 6:52 pm

Wested LC Cow. I know some people swear by their Westeds, but when I compare it to my US Wings A2, there's not question which one I'd rather wear. I only hope that when I get around to ordering the US Wings Indy, I'll be just as pleased.

alphared6 · Post by **alphared6** » Thu Oct 15, 2009 9:49 pm

I have an A-2 for sale for those interested:

viewtopic.php?f=40&t=43464

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 12:28 am

I just got a G&B Mark 41 horsehide A2 a few days ago! It's awesome!

I also have a Eastman Leather "Pearl Harbor" A2 on the way!

(and a Nowak Raiders Goat in progress!

)

CM · Post by CM » Fri Oct 16, 2009 6:44 am

_ wrote:Personally, I think the CWU is an awesome jacket. It does what it is intends to d and the materials are more appropriate. There is a reason the military dropped leather. It is not practical or even close to being the best protector or performer. It's cool, but it is not the best choice...

I was going to say much the same. The MA 1 is a good performer too. Leather is overrated... even if I do like the stuff.

Mark Brody · Post by **Mark Brody** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:21 am

The CWU does have its advantages. The pen pocket is great, and it is fire resistant (extremely important for pilots), but I think the A2 is much more comfortable. The smell is also a huge advantage. A Goatskin jacket will somehow smell like goatskin forever. It's not long before the CWU reeks of body odor. Flightsuits hold the same bad smell. It my even be a property of the Nomex material. Anyway, the flightsuits can just be thrown in the washer, but the CWU can't. There's also the sizing issue I mentioned earlier - the bane of being tall.

djd · Post by **djd** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 9:09 am

I had a lovely MA1 by Buzz Ricksons- sadly I outgrew it and the Japanese don't make very large sizes... Beautifully robust jacket that cost a fortune...

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 2:15 pm

_ wrote:Personally, I think the CWU is an awesome jacket. It does what it is intends to d and the materials are more appropriate. There is a reason the military dropped leather. It is not practical or even close to being the best protector or performer. It's cool, but it is not the best choice...

Don't get me wrong, I agree it's a great jacket for it's purpose in the military. It's not my pick for a regular jacket, and I'm not a fan of the design. It's even worse when it's done in leather.
I like what is often called a WEP (actually a misnomer) often worn my Marine helicopter crews in the past.
Leather is fine, but modern materials are 'easier' and can be made to provide better protection from fire etc.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 3:29 pm

I like Levi jackets, or did more when they were US made. They seem different now.
I still have a horse blanket lined and an unlined, Lee jackets. I can see I-J wearing denim jackets like that.

Hatch · Post by **Hatch** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 3:33 pm

_, or RC, have you had any experience with the Canvas Carhartt jackets.....they're really my serious 'dirty work, hunting etc 'jacket ...

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 3:42 pm

I have a horse blanket lined, canvas Wall's jacket. Tough as nails.

Sadly it looks like they also are no longer US made.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 3:54 pm

Get yourself a Raptor _

Hatch · Post by **Hatch** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 4:00 pm

_ wrote:
Hatch wrote:_, or RC, have you had any experience with the Canvas Carhardt jackets.....they're really my serious 'dirty work, hunting etc 'jacket ...

They're good working-in-the-muck jackets. I've just learned to avoid working in the muck?

Sorts like why I stopped buying pick-ups. I always ended up hauling stuff. Same reason I won't buy a sleeper sofa. Somebody will want to sleepin it.

I have issues...

So your 'Cowboy boots' are just for.........'Looking Cool'

Texan Scott · Post by **Texan Scott** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 12:12 am

Ropers are really comfortable. Riding boots not quite as much. You used to be able to find great deals on Tony Lama's from their outlet stores around El Paso:

http://www.google.com/search?q=tony+lam ... lz=1I7GGLH

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 3:16 pm

PSBIndy wrote:................
I also have a Eastman Leather "Pearl Harbor" A2 on the way!

...........

Nice. They are similar to a Roughwear pattern. Did you order it in horsehide or steerhide?

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 4:03 pm

RCSignals wrote:
PSBIndy wrote:................
I also have a Eastman Leather "Pearl Harbor" A2 on the way!

...........
Nice. They are similar to a Roughwear pattern. Did you order it in horsehide or steerhide?

The Pearl Harbor version only comes in Steerhide.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 4:41 pm

PSBIndy wrote:
RCSignals wrote:
PSBIndy wrote:................
I also have a Eastman Leather "Pearl Harbor" A2 on the way!

...........
Nice. They are similar to a Roughwear pattern. Did you order it in horsehide or steerhide?

The Pearl Harbor version only comes in Steerhide.

I understood that even though it says that on the web site you can specify horsehide. No matter, it's a nice jacket either way.

sallah4 · Post by **sallah4** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:07 pm

I have both but I prefer the Indy Jacket

alphared6 · Post by **alphared6** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 8:15 pm

sallah4 wrote:I have both but I prefer the Indy Jacket

For me it depends on my mood. As an Indy fan and former adventurer I do like the Indy jacket. But as a retired Army officer, and current military historian/museum curator, I also like the A-2 and the fact that anyone with at least a high school diploma will recognize it as the WWII jacket.

sallah4 · Post by **sallah4** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 8:25 pm

You got that right Alpha.

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 10:44 pm

I also like both my Indy and A2 jackets......it depends on my mood. My G&B horsehide Mark 41 A2 feels incredible and when I put it on, you get a sense of nostalgia and history that you don't get with an Indy jacket.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sat Oct 17, 2009 10:49 pm

well the Indy and A-2 have a kinship.

I know what you mean PSB. Does your horse hide have the wrinkly effect that some original HH A-2s had?
HH usually starts fairly stiff but softens up quickly with wear.

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 11:11 am

RCSignals wrote:well the Indy and A-2 have a kinship.

I know what you mean PSB. Does your horse hide have the wrinkly effect that some original HH A-2s had?
HH usually starts fairly stiff but softens up quickly with wear.

Well my G&B HH came out of the box fairly stiff (and glossy). After wearing it now for about 10 days, it's gotten more pliable. This HH is one TOUGH leather!

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 2:46 pm

_ wrote:Something to be aware of with Eastman. They have been caught red-handed several times selling steerhide as horse. The only jackets they've ever properly labeled are the PH jackets. They were forced to prperly disclose due to the relation of the jackets to the movie and the associated licensing through Disney. Licensed products through Disney require proof of origin and material components. They don't want Disney miniatures to come from china containng lead. The same disclosure requirements led to Eastman actually admitting they used steer for the PH jackets. There is a very strong belief that all oftheir HH is really steer. Is there a performance difference? Likely not.

That's interesting. There may not be a performance difference but there is a difference in look and feel.
Steer is also less cost and easier to source. Shame on them

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 3:45 pm

Yeah, hard to believe a high-end leather apparel company like Eastman could do something like that. A chinese company maybe, but a boutique British company?!

matt black · Post by **matt black** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 6:22 pm

Do you really find it necessary to keep having a dig at the British _? There are quite a few British members here and your comments are pretty hostile in what is for the most part a very friendly place.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 6:41 pm

matt black wrote:Do you really find it necessary to keep having a dig at the British _? There are quite a few British members here and your comments are pretty hostile in what is for the most part a very friendly place.

If it's truthful is it hostile?

Post by **Holt** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 6:46 pm

play nice boys!

just a reminder..

matt black · Post by **matt black** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 6:52 pm

If it's truthful is it hostile?[/quote]

If it is truthful, does it make it necessary to have to say it? If someone for instance is bad at something you don't have to go and tell them so.

Post by **Holt** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 6:54 pm

and with that back on topic!

Piker · Post by **Piker** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:47 am

I have an LL Bean "Flying Tiger" from 1993. Well before I got into Indy at all. It fits great!! But it is from 1993. Back then Bean sold them in even chest sizes 42, 44, 46 etc. Today they are S,M,L,XL.

The knit cuffs are great in cooler weather and driving a convertible. Can see why aviators liked them back in the day.

Trying to figure out a way to get an Indy jacket and get around "wife block"! "You have a Leather Jacket already, dear...."

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:49 am

You have quite a collectors item. As I recally, the company that made those jackets for LLBean didn't deliver a lot of the promised inventory of Flying Tiger jackets, and it was quite a fiasco in the jacket industry. They were supposed to be fantastic jackets, but it was one of those situations were the subcontractor had bitten off more than he could deliver.

Regards! Michaelson

Piker · Post by **Piker** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 12:09 pm

Got lucky for once then! It is a fine Jacket, and since the Tigers started as a volunteer force, I don't mind the baggy fit.

It was baggy in 1993...... Not anymore!