My keeper came off.

[Caber]

Ok the keeper loop at the end of my stock whip handle came off. ( the loop you put the thong through ) I wrapped it the way the book said with the sinew the kit gave me . but it came off any way What is the best way to wrapp the loop and keepin place ?

Caber

[Caber]

I for got to put this . I have got the Turks head down but when i role it with a board it gets messed up . Should i role it with my hands or do i need to role it with a board ?
Caber

[nammann]

Howdy caber,

I would say either the keeper is not tied on tight enough, the string you use to wrap around the leather keeper at the end must be tight almost to the point of hurting your fingers while wrapping it on, I use a wooden piece of dowel rod and wrap the string around it and use the dowel as a handle to help wrap the string around that way you can pull really really tight and for the knot it is either being rolled too hard or the knot is not tight?? but I am not sure, do you have any photos you can put online, Its much easier to tell what happened if you have photos??

Nick

[Kiscien]

Hi Caber,

Do as Nick sad to You, or simply nail keeper, and then tightly wrap with some cord or something. It should be very tight.

After you plait turks head, you had to tight it. Take some durable and tapered spike, and going along the strand take all loose part of it. I hope You understand what I mean.

Regards,
Karol

[Marhala]

Oops. So it was the keeper and not the fall hitch?!

One thing that has worked for me, is as Nick said: you should use the dowel to stretch the thread and avoid cutting your fingers, or tie the string to a hook or wall and wind the handle around the string. Another thing is to make a couple of turns OVER the keeper's leather, say five, then lift the two flaps and wind another five turns over the cane only. Fold the flaps down and again five turns over the leather. Keep alternating between these two ways and finish with an "over the keeper's leather" step and that will work ok.

But as Kiscien said, the most secure way is to use a couple of tacks.

All the best,

Aldo.

Here's a pic of a similar method to the one I've described.

[Caber]

Ok so it is ok to tack the keeper down and then wrap it . I didn't do this because I thought the tension from cracking it would cause the nail to make a hole in my leather

Karol I think if I’m understanding you right your saying to put a tack in the loose strands on my tuks to keep them from moving right ?
Can you make it tight and not tack it down?

Caber

[Kiscien]

Hi,

I was trying to say that You need to tight that turks head , not tack loose strands to the whip . And You can do it using stiching fid for example (http://www.eleathersupply.com/lacetools.shtml fid at the bottom of the site).

Regards,
Karol

[nammann]

Turks head knot: after you have tied the knot on go back with a lacing fid and take out any slack that is left in the knot, i do not use any tacks to hold these in place as these should be held on by the pressure of the knot so everything must be tight just like braiding the thong you want it tight because overtime it could loosen up a little if not properly tight.
For the keeper you will find it easier if you have a bench vice and take the cane handle and clamp it in the vice with a piece of leather WRAPPED around the cane handle to protect it and this should give you 2 hands to work with.

[Caber]

OOO I got ya . My bad Karol.
I’m not sure what you are talking about when you refer to a lacing fid

OK last question . What do I do with the left over strands. I know to cut them off but what do I do with the little bit of strand that is left over

Thanks for the help so far guys
Caber

[nammann]

Caber,

Ok what you want to do with this after you have completed the last pass of the knot is to cut the strand VERY CAREFULLY as close as you can to the knot. A little bit might show but that is ok. You want to make it look as if you cannot see the beginning and ending strands sticking out of the knot.

A lacing fid:

[nammann]

if you check out this knot that I have done, you can see where the last part of the lace is tucked under another pass of the knot lace and it is cut off flush.

[Caber]

So just cut it close to the knot . ok got it .

How do you use the Fid? Do you stick it under a lace and pull up. I have an awl that looks alot like those fids , cept it has a place for tread to go through at the end. Will it work ?

Caber

[Kiscien]

Hi,

You can use anything, that will not bend. Yes, stick it under the lace and pull up. Be carefull to not pull out begining of the lace from the knot . After You finish tying all up, take some pliers and pull both ends.

If You asked me, I will put working end of the lace behind whole knot, and if You do that remember to make that before You will tight up your knot .

[louiefoxx]

be careful using an awl...they can be very pointy and can cut or damage the lace. Also some fids have a sharp point.

The fid that Joe Strain sells http://northernwhipco.com/lacing_fid.htm is a great one, it's made by the Osborne company and has a blunt tip.

Louie
http://bullwhips.org

[Caber]

Ya I ended up not using the awl. I used a small flat screw driver. It worked pretty good .

When you tighten up the strands do you pull on each individual strand ? I started from the bottom strands and worked my way up

Caber

[louiefoxx]

When I first started making whips I used a small flathead screwdriver instead of a fid. To tighten the knot, start at the beginning of the strand and work around the knot following the path of the strand.

Louie
http://bullwhips.org