My first Wested Raiders (better pics in top post)

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:27 pm

The leather on the inside of the zipper... if it has it.

I wouldn't use any spurious pocket size excuse to get a swap. It if doesn't fit you have a reason, what I am trying to find out is, did you get the looser 'Raiders' cut or the slimmer ' ROLA' cut. Because it looks to me that the jacket does not need to be sized up. Also maybe measure the armhole diameter in relation to your arm diameter.

crismans · Post by **crismans** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:30 pm

I'm thinking if you can send it back without paying taxes for the return, I would go with a custom. If you're happy with the standard Raiders pattern that Wested has then a custom wouldn't run that much more and you can be more assured of getting a jacket that fits you. I'm lucky that OTR sizes usually work for fine for me, but not everyone has that luxury.

hankey01 · Post by **hankey01** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:37 pm

I'm honestly pretty nervous about getting a custom if I can't even get a simple thing like the chest size right.

I do think an exra inch or 2 across the back would help me a lot.

I got the ROTLA 145 pound version....well thats what I ordered anyways. http://www.indyjacket.co.uk/frjacket.html

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 7:29 pm

If you have ROTLA then you probably have the 80's fit. The regular OTR Raiders would probably fit better in the chest in you size 42.

crismans · Post by **crismans** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 7:54 pm

Raider S wrote:If you have ROTLA then you probably have the 80's fit. The regular OTR Raiders would probably fit better in the chest in you size 42.

I agree. The Raiders is a fuller cut which might be just what the Doctor (Jones) ordered.

hankey01 · Post by **hankey01** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 9:31 pm

Didn't see any leather on the inside of the zipper....

Measured the arm holes..they are 10-10 1/2 if I pull it tight. If the 44 is 11 1/2 then That would sure help..combined with the extra around the back..I think I need it.

Packing it up and going to post office. SIgh...I hate to wait..especioally when I had one in my hands..but if having a looser one encourages me to wear it more then I know thats the right answer.

Thanks for all the thoughts guys!

Edit...typed this post before we went on a walk to mail it off. It cost another $60 to send back..sigh. One week tho...

I asked for a size 44 in the ROTLA..but I maybe shoudl consider the Raiders. Ill do some reading.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 9:49 pm

edit. error

Holt · Post by **Holt** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 9:53 pm

ahh you have a ROLA. no wonder it is tight in the arms.

for some reason they make the arms really tight.

I have a ROLA 44 and the arms are just wide enough to have a thin sweather under it. but mbay they are a little tight cuz I work out alot.

I think the perfect ROLA of the rack would be with standard wide sleeves and a shorther backlength. that jacket would be the BEST of the rack raiders jacket from wested. no doubt

Piers · Post by **Piers** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 10:39 pm

Rats, I wish I'd read this sooner.. I'm in calgary, work downtown, and just received a washed goat ROLA OTR in size 44,
http://www.wested.com/new-in-raiders-ro ... -177-p.asp
and could have met up with you to try it out

It's a size up from my 42 chest. (41 actually, coming to 42 with a breath in). I figured a 44 would be comfy, and allow for a bit of shrinkage, but actually fit my longer arms a bit better..

Funnily, I ordered a ToD size 42 with custom measurements, it fits great, it's more form fitting of course, amd the shoulders don't feel as tight under the armpits like the OTR 44 does.. it's not quite as constrictive as yours looks

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:03 am

Hankey.... very important!! Remember to mark it as a RETURN, see the wested site about how it needs to be marked. If not they get charged tax and they WILL refuse it....

I also suggest including your tax paid documentation.... if the returned (to you) jacket has that information included to prove you already paid the tax you might get away with not paying..... And see if they will mark the outside of the new jacket as a "Return - Duty Paid" something like that.

Try small packet airmail.... may be cheaper.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:07 am

hankey01 wrote:Didn't see any leather on the inside of the zipper....

Measured the arm holes..they are 10-10 1/2 if I pull it tight. If the 44 is 11 1/2 then That would sure help..combined with the extra around the back..I think I need it.

Packing it up and going to post office. SIgh...I hate to wait..especioally when I had one in my hands..but if having a looser one encourages me to wear it more then I know thats the right answer.

Thanks for all the thoughts guys!

Edit...typed this post before we went on a walk to mail it off. It cost another $60 to send back..sigh. One week tho...

I asked for a size 44 in the ROTLA..but I maybe shoudl consider the Raiders. Ill do some reading.

The 2 otr cuts are "Raiders" and "ROLA" the ROLA does not have facings, so that was a way to identify it... is is cut with high tight armholes, sort of an 80's cut. The "Raiders" is generally looser but it has facings and also does seem to have deeper action pleats.

barry · Post by **barry** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 2:45 am

Kt Templar wrote:
hankey01 wrote:Didn't see any leather on the inside of the zipper....

Measured the arm holes..they are 10-10 1/2 if I pull it tight. If the 44 is 11 1/2 then That would sure help..combined with the extra around the back..I think I need it.

Packing it up and going to post office. SIgh...I hate to wait..especioally when I had one in my hands..but if having a looser one encourages me to wear it more then I know thats the right answer.

Thanks for all the thoughts guys!

Edit...typed this post before we went on a walk to mail it off. It cost another $60 to send back..sigh. One week tho...

I asked for a size 44 in the ROTLA..but I maybe shoudl consider the Raiders. Ill do some reading.
The 2 otr cuts are "Raiders" and "ROLA" the ROLA does not have facings, so that was a way to identify it... is is cut with high tight armholes, sort of an 80's cut. The "Raiders" is generally looser but it has facings and also does seem to have deeper action pleats.

just got my first wested jacket 48 and it feels a little tight in the sholders my first comment here but itsthe most beautiful thing i hve seen in a long time :?do i send it back or just shower with it

and how do you add photos

hankey01 · Post by **hankey01** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:18 am

Kt Templar wrote:
The 2 otr cuts are "Raiders" and "ROLA" the ROLA does not have facings, so that was a way to identify it... is is cut with high tight armholes, sort of an 80's cut. The "Raiders" is generally looser but it has facings and also does seem to have deeper action pleats.

I just got a reply from my email to Wested saying this :

Dear Jason,
You have ordered a standard raiders jacket and the raiders of the lost ark jacket are both the same. However if you would like the jacket thats £10 cheaper this would be the rola style which comes with an 80's fit which is a slimmer cut.
I will await your responce.
Thanks Gemma

So I guess I had the Raiders....but it seems like it was a ROTLA to me...AND isn't the Raiders 135 pounds? I paid 145 pounds which should be the ROTLA.

Holt · Post by **Holt** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:38 am

hmmm

she might have sent you the wrong one..it has happend in the past.. I know, she has sent me the wrong one

JC1972 · Post by **JC1972** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:49 am

You can order a ROLA and get the standard cut instead of the 80s cut, right? As long as you put it under special requests?

Holt · Post by **Holt** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:53 am

huh? that would really confuse them I think...

Rola is 80's cut. reg is full cut.

if you order a rola and get standard cut, you can just aswell order a standad full cut. its the same.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:38 am

hankey01 wrote:
Kt Templar wrote:
The 2 otr cuts are "Raiders" and "ROLA" the ROLA does not have facings, so that was a way to identify it... is is cut with high tight armholes, sort of an 80's cut. The "Raiders" is generally looser but it has facings and also does seem to have deeper action pleats.
I just got a reply from my email to Wested saying this :

Dear Jason,
You have ordered a standard raiders jacket and the raiders of the lost ark jacket are both the same. However if you would like the jacket thats £10 cheaper this would be the rola style which comes with an 80's fit which is a slimmer cut.
I will await your responce.
Thanks Gemma

So I guess I had the Raiders....but it seems like it was a ROTLA to me...AND isn't the Raiders 135 pounds? I paid 145 pounds which should be the ROTLA.

Hi there. They do not have one called a ROLTA. There is the 'Raiders' (larger) £145, or 'ROLA' (Slimmer/80's cut) £125.
(Plus many other variants in different leathers and different price points!).

If your jacket does not have leather facings it it likely to be a ROLA. Does it have facings or not? It 'looks' like a 'Raiders' to me.

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:39 am

I'm still wondering about the pockets. If these are all made in India jackets it seems as if they are sticking the same pockets on Raiders and LC jackets. This jacket looks just like an LC jacket without snaps on the storm flap.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:42 am

Raider S wrote:This jacket looks just like an LC jacket without snaps on the storm flap.

Nope, collar stand detail is Raiders.

Have you been paying attention?!

Go and study the LC collar.

FLATHEAD · Post by **FLATHEAD** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:42 am

hankey01 wrote:Thanks Flathead. Could you please do me a favor and measure the pocket and from one armpit to the other when layed out flat (my measurement was 24").

If my pockets are indeed too small if I send it back and point this out, maybe I wont be on the hook for shipping a second time..even if I go to a 44.

My pockets on the size 44 regular Raiders are 7 inches wide by 8 inches tall.

The chest from armpit to armpit is 24 inches. This is the standard military fit (4 inches of movement
room) for a size 44.

If the chest on your current size 42 is 24 inches, then its an anomoly, and its more like
a size 44 than a size 42.

And you said that your arm/shoulder to arm/body measurement is approximately 10 inches,
so that means a difference of almost 3 inches in diameter between what you have now, and
a size 44.

If you exchange your size 42 for a regular standard Raiders jacket in a size 44, you will get
the chest measurement of your current jacket, with larger armholes, which is just what it
looks like you need to make the jacket fit you better.

And as KT said, mark the OUTSIDE of the box, and all the paperwork with the words
"Return for replacement or exchange".

This way, you will not have to pay any more customs fees, because you are NOT getting
a second item, but just an exchange for the one you have. They should not hit you again
for the fees because you already paid them for the one and only jacket you will have.

I would also measure the sleeves on your current size 42 jacket, and request that Peter
use that dimension for your new jacket, since the sleeve length looks perfect for you.

Other than that, you can go with a standard size 44 Raiders jacket with no custom
features if you like everything else about your current jacket.

Oh, and just for reference, my size 44 has a back length of 25.75 inches. It started out
as 26 inches, which is what I asked for, but it has shrunk up a quarter of an inch over
the years due to wear and wrinkling.

What does your current size 42 measure at the back? What you have now also
looks like a perfect fit for you.

I know this all is frustrating, but in the end, you will end up with a great jacket
that fits you the way you like, and you will be comfortable in for years to come.

Unless you eat alot of pasta, and then all bets are off...

Flathead

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:45 am

Kt Templar wrote:
Raider S wrote:This jacket looks just like an LC jacket without snaps on the storm flap.
Nope, collar stand detail is Raiders.

Have you been paying attention?!

Go and study the LC collar.

Have you? Which pockets are those? They don't look like the Raiders I know.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:48 am

Raider S wrote:
Kt Templar wrote:
Raider S wrote:This jacket looks just like an LC jacket without snaps on the storm flap.
Nope, collar stand detail is Raiders.

Have you been paying attention?!

Go and study the LC collar.

Have you? Which pockets are those? They don't look like the Raiders I know.

Pockets have got bigger due to fan requests on Westeds Raiders. What makes them look particularly wrong is the flap usually is not deep enough. Should be 3" at the point.

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:54 am

Whoever is out there telling them to make pockets nearly twice as tall as they are wide needs to STOP!

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:58 am

I agree on the pockets though..

But then again I think its an impossible thing to have a vendor keep the exact same pattern all along after a while you automatically change stuff, every vendor does it!

JC1972 · Post by **JC1972** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:19 pm

I just called and spoke to Peter and he says that the 80s cut is slimmer in the stomach and tapered. He says its not smaller than the full cut in shoulders or arms.

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:41 pm

hankey01 wrote:

Here's my LC (pre-surgery to have the sleeves tapered to human size) to compare the pockets.

DJ, I own a Wested so why the shot? I'm not comparing Wested to anything other than Wested.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:50 pm

Yup, the pockets are similar.

Have you noted the collar differences?

Main one is, Raiders collar stand extends onto and is attached to the storm flap. The wested LC/CS stand/SF is separate. (Collar shape differs too).

I tend to order my sleeves tapered on Raiders jackets. No need on the ToD pattern. I didn't need to on the CS proto pattern either and I have pretty slim wrists.

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 1:07 pm

KT, I'm not really talking about the collars but the pockets. Even though mine are placed lower on the jacket, they don't look any taller than the ones on that Raiders.

As far as the sleeves, mine is OTR so there was no way to specify. Here's a photo with the sleeves spread out more so you get some idea how big they really were. By the way, I really LOVE my washed goat jacket and even more so now that I got it tailored. It's the perfect lightweight jacket and fits great.

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 3:14 pm

I mean that other Vendors like Todd and TN also slightly change the way they make their jackets over a course of time. With Wested it seems their pockets become one standard, except for the Temple of Doom. Because I remember right up to the premiere of Indy 4 Westeds's LC/CS pockets where really close to what you see on screen.

Iam not speaking for anyone ! Its just something that you can tell.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 3:26 pm

Dutch_jones wrote:I mean that other Vendors like Todd and TN also slightly change the way they make their jackets over a course of time. With Wested it seems their pockets become one standard, except for the Temple of Doom. Because I remember right up to the premiere of Indy 4 Westeds's LC/CS pockets where really close to what you see on screen.

Iam not speaking for anyone ! Its just something that you can tell.

Really? What has TN changed?

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 3:35 pm

pocketflap shape and collar, i've seen jackets that came with a more CS like collar. its not big differences but when you compare them to the first jackets out they are noticeable.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 3:41 pm

Dutch_jones wrote:pocketflap shape and collar, i've seen jackets that came with a CS collar. its not big differences but when you compare them to the first jackets out they are noticeable.

You've seen what jackets that came with a CS collar? CS jackets?

The discussion is about Raiders jackets still isn't it?

TN has not changed his pattern at all for either jacket.

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 3:47 pm

Really, see for yourself: Changes.

just saying every vendor does that at a point ! I wasn't talking CS jackets Iam talking i've seen Indy 1's that seemed to have a CS like collar, on page 16 of the nowak owners thread and page 19
Orbs CS jacket and Indy 1 seem to have the same collar..

But sorry to hijack the thread, i wanted to point somehting out.

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 4:17 pm

Dutch_jones wrote:Really, see for yourself:
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y160/t ... _front.jpg
http://i584.photobucket.com/albums/ss28 ... /Front.jpg

just saying every vendor does that at a point ! I wasn't talking CS jackets Iam talking i've seen Indy 1's that seemed to have a CS like collar, on page 16 of the nowak owners thread and page 19
Orbs CS jacket and Indy 1 seem to have the same collar..

But sorry to hijack the thread, i wanted to point somehting out.

I don't see a CS collar. I don't see a pocket pattern change either.
There is nothing there that has been 'changed' and standardised as a new /different pattern from the original

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 4:19 pm

RCSignals wrote:
Dutch_jones wrote:Really, see for yourself:
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y160/t ... _front.jpg
http://i584.photobucket.com/albums/ss28 ... /Front.jpg

just saying every vendor does that at a point ! I wasn't talking CS jackets Iam talking i've seen Indy 1's that seemed to have a CS like collar, on page 16 of the nowak owners thread and page 19
Orbs CS jacket and Indy 1 seem to have the same collar..

But sorry to hijack the thread, i wanted to point somehting out.
I don't see a CS collar. I don't see a pocket pattern change either.
There is nothing there that has been 'changed' and standardised as a new /different pattern from the original

Haha!

POCKETFLAP, not pocket.

But its not something to discuss about it just happens to every vendor at a certain time, this thread was about the owners new wested sorry to to have hijacked it. I like your jacket ! it fits you great!

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 6:28 pm

Dutch, you're VERY tiring. You also seem to have no idea what you're talking about anymore. If all you can do is find lame reasons to harp on Nowak jackets (for whatever personal reason you seem to have) at least do it in threads about Nowak jackets instead of using smoke and mirrors to steer discussions away from observations about Wested.

Nobody was talking about collars but instead how the Wested OTR Raiders and OTR LC have nearly identical pockets. Can you come up with a reason for that?

orb · Post by **orb** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 6:40 pm

I can clearly say that my TN Raiders collar isn't the same as on my TN CS Jacket
Here's a picture which Asiana Jones took:

viewtopic.php?f=25&t=36638&start=0
As you can see the Raiders Collar is bigger as the CS collar. So it's also on mine.
Mine is also bigger at the neck.

I talked with Tony about my collar, because I thought it's too big. But it's like he said 3 1/8. He said that's correct. And I asked him twice.

Regards

orb

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 6:46 pm

Raider S wrote:
Nobody was talking about collars but instead how the Wested OTR Raiders and OTR LC have nearly identical pockets. Can you come up with a reason for that?

I think that has to do with whoever machines the jacket, at first the jackets had really great looking pocket flaps, but over the time they changed and changed and now they look exactly like the raiders pocket flaps. Hard to say why, maybe if they where pointed to it, it might be good again for a while, but who knows for how long.
But then again we here at cow might be the only ones to notice. To the untrained eye they look like the jacket indy wears, and people will buy them regardless.

Orb thanks for the info

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:21 pm

Someone just posted a washed goat Raiders and since I believe it's OTR it would also be from the same place as the one in this thread. The pockets on that look tall as well.

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:25 pm

you know its not the tall pockets thats really the bad thing, its the small flaps thats don't compensate with the tall pockets.

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:32 pm

Holt · Post by **Holt** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:35 pm

Dutch_jones wrote:you know its not the tall pockets thats really the bad thing, its the small flaps thats don't compensate with the tall pockets.

actually I agree with dutch.

orb · Post by **orb** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:37 pm

Dutch_jones wrote:you know its not the tall pockets thats really the bad thing, its the small flaps thats don't compensate with the tall pockets.

I think this is really the point. The flaps look terrible. It destroys the look of every jacket. It can't be much harder doing the pocketflaps right to the size of the pocket.

Regards

orb

Dutch_jones · Post by **Dutch_jones** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:39 pm

Yeah Exactly.

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:55 pm

Look at the top photo of hankey wearing his jacket and you see the pocket slightly from the side and you can see past the flap. Even if the flap is slightly narrow, the pocket is still quite tall and the top of the flap isn't much higher than the top of the pocket.

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:03 pm

Adding 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch to the depth of the flap would make quite a positive difference to the whole look.

Cutting 1" of the height of the pocket too would also help. (but then we get back to people complaining they can't use the handwarmers).

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:49 pm

Dutch_jones wrote:
RCSignals wrote:
Dutch_jones wrote:Really, see for yourself:
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y160/t ... _front.jpg
http://i584.photobucket.com/albums/ss28 ... /Front.jpg

just saying every vendor does that at a point ! I wasn't talking CS jackets Iam talking i've seen Indy 1's that seemed to have a CS like collar, on page 16 of the nowak owners thread and page 19
Orbs CS jacket and Indy 1 seem to have the same collar..

But sorry to hijack the thread, i wanted to point somehting out.
I don't see a CS collar. I don't see a pocket pattern change either.
There is nothing there that has been 'changed' and standardised as a new /different pattern from the original

Haha! POCKETFLAP, not pocket.

But its not something to discuss about it just happens to every vendor at a certain time, this thread was about the owners new wested sorry to to have hijacked it. I like your jacket ! it fits you great!

What are you Hahaing and clapping about?

Pocket flap is a component of the pocket, and there is still no pattern change from TN. There is no significant difference there
You've stated all vendors have made changes to their patterns, including TN, when TN has not changed his patterns.
I get it, it's always the same from you, any tiny thing to take a snipe at TN and his Raider jacket. It gets very old.

Todd's jackets in fact are very consistent in the pattern, even his outsourced 'standard'

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:40 pm

KT mentions the useable size of the handwarmers and here's a photo I just made to illustrate something.

Excuse the image quality, but I put my index finger as far to the top of the handwarmer pocket as I could on each jacket. You can see how one jacket nearly goes to the top while the other stops farther from it. This is true on the bottom edge of the pockets as well.

So even though my Wested pocket is taller than the other jacket, the handwarmers are actually smaller than the other jacket.

EDIT: My USW jacket pockets are about the same as the Nowak and I've included it because I'm tired of the same jackets always...well...

hankey01 · Post by **hankey01** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:56 pm

Forgive my ignorance here....but you can stick your hands in the sides of the front pockets (thus handwarmers)???

RCSignals · Post by **RCSignals** » Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:56 pm

hankey01 wrote:Forgive my ignorance here....but you can stick your hands in the sides of the front pockets (thus handwarmers)???

Yes, that's it. You know, American gloves.