LLS Rabbit Raiders Project (Hat Pics Added)

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Fri Mar 06, 2009 11:18 am

LLS, if you're officially taking orders now, then it's time to move that information along in a separate thread in the classifieds section. Michaelson runs that section, so if you have specific questions about how to set that up, give him a shout.

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Fri Mar 06, 2009 2:18 pm

good to hear things are moving along LLS.......i can't wait to see what your cook'n in your mad scientist laboratory!!!!

Caber · Post by **Caber** » Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:38 pm

You should make a web site LLS.

Caber · Post by **Caber** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:50 am

Are you going to make a website Mr. LLS?

JC1972 · Post by **JC1972** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 11:10 am

Local Land Surveyor wrote:Hey Mulceber,
Thanks for the question. I posted the cost of the hat in the Cairo Bazaar section. I don't want to cross the site rules and the intent of this thread is to discuss the upcoming hat itself. So just check out that thread and that will answer your question.
On another note, I have worn my AB for the last four years, as well as much close enough gear, and it has held up fantasticly. Quite a legacy to hold to.

LLS

MOD EDIT: viewtopic.php?t=37334

The link comes up invalid and no thread shows in the Cairo Bazaar

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 11:55 am

When the new set up came online, ALL the stickied 'product run' threads disappeared from the classified section, so you need to repost it, LLS.

Regards! Michaelson

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 2:35 pm

Hey

,
I re-posted in the Cairo Bazaar. I, also, tweaked an earlier post in this thread to reflect that.

Everyone,
I hope to reveal something by this weekend.

Hopefully a long wait is about to come to an end.

LLS

Caber · Post by **Caber** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:45 pm

I cant find you in the Cairo Bazaar. What name would be under

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:54 pm

viewtopic.php?f=40&t=39137

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 7:57 am

Hey Caber,
Pitfall beat me to the answer.
Thanks Pitfall.

By the way, I love your avatar art work. Very creative.

LLS

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:19 pm

Well, I just saw your new thread over in the other section and then I stopped in here to see if there was any new updates and saw Caber was having problems finding the other thread so I posted the link.

Thank you. I've gotten quite a few compliments on it. It's just something I did real quick using one of my gear pics.

Can't wait to see some shots of your prototype hat. $\:D/$

I've got another whip on order and getting another rabbit Indy hat is next on my list.

Caber · Post by **Caber** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 11:16 pm

Thanks alot pitfall for the help . Hay pit fall are you into whipp cracking too . Are you into the professional cracks?

What cracks can you do

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:39 pm

Hey Everybody,

Just wanted to update this a little. I was noticing the date of my first post in this thread. I can't believe that it has been over two months since I started it.

. I have been doing alot of this

and this

and this $\:D/$ and this

and this

. Thank you all for your patience. Mine has worn thin at times. I am working on my show prototype. Deborah said the "brim was a little too wide", so I changed it.

I do have a "reveal", though. Hope you like it.

http://i360.photobucket.com/albums/oo43 ... GE_285.jpg

The name of my company and the name of the hat. Shouldn't be too much of a surprise.
Cross your fingers. The prototype should be ready this weekend.

LLS

Hollowpond · Post by **Hollowpond** » Wed Mar 18, 2009 5:59 pm

Anxious to check it out!

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 12:42 pm

'The Raider', eh? You might want to double check that...I believe it was Broner who used that name for their first Indy hat back in the 80's, and may have claim to the name. I had one way back in the day.....

Just a thought...

Regards! Michaelson

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 1:36 pm

smithbilt hats here in calgary uses that name for the indy-esque hat that they make.........it use to be on their website.

guess who fed them the specs?

......don't worry, the thing can't hold a candle to any of the offerings here.

LLS, can't wait to see the prototype!!!..........make sure it's size 57 (then send it to me)

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:28 pm

I'll look into this

, Thanks for the 'heads up'.
I have been to their web site, but don't see a hat they call "The Raider". They do carry the "official hat" though, so I'm pretty sure I can't use that phrase.

At any rate, I know of at least one hat that this will be in.

Let me see.... size 57...size 57......hmmm.......
LLS

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:36 pm

Oh, and I made your announcement a stickie in the classified section, by the way....

Regards! Michaelson

Oklahoma Jones · Post by **Oklahoma Jones** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 8:42 pm

Michaelson, do remember how inexpensive those things were?? I must have bought 5 or 6 of those things from my(now defunct) army surplus store, and ruined them all trying to cut a dimensional brim.....

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 5:09 pm

Hello Everyone,

Well, I have completed my prototype. I have spent many an hour working through the art of hat making and to my surprise, I survived.

Steve Delk has mastered a very old art and I am very thankful that he passed his art to me. As stated once before, as I worked through these last several weeks, I felt that this was surreal and that I must have had a relative in my past that did this, because I really enjoyed this learning journey. I have wrapped my mind around a lot of aspects of the craft that never occurred to me before and would get more excited about it the more I got into it. Working on the replication of the block was a single minded approach of mine, because I simply wanted this hat. Working to satisfy my mind's eye about the many details on this hat was an obsession. Thank goodness Steve was kind enough to entertain my theories.

Spending the few days with him to learn his craft was a joy and an honor. A big heartfelt "Thanks" goes to him.
Rubber meets the road, though. Watching someone good at the craft is one thing, doing it yourself.....that's another. Much like surveying, you have to develop yourself with the many skills to become the craftsman. To those who have taken advantage of the pre-order offer, THANK YOU!. I hope I don't disappoint.

Now, to the main show:

Cairo look in the sun

Standard turn look.

Looking up. I always noticed how uneven the front bashes looked in the movie. You really notice this as Indy looks up to see the temple start to collapse around him.

You could always see the center bash from a low angle. The Raven Bar hat had this, as well as, the Cairo hat when Indy goes in the Marhala bar the talk to Belloq.

The hat could look squarish, too.

More Pics:
http://i360.photobucket.com/albums/oo43 ... iders4.jpg
http://i360.photobucket.com/albums/oo43 ... iders7.jpg
http://i360.photobucket.com/albums/oo43 ... sFront.jpg
http://i360.photobucket.com/albums/oo43 ... rsBack.jpg
http://i360.photobucket.com/albums/oo43 ... ersTop.jpg

This rabbit felt is fantastic. It has some characteristic that you see on the film hat. For those who get one, you'll see what I'm talking about.

I have found a good balance in floppiness and yet, it will still hold a bash. The sweatband I use is wonderful. You don't feel like you have a hat on. Very soft and malleable. I am looking forward to how this hat will look after the bashes settle in more.
Let the production begin! $\:D/$

That's good. Box it up and let's get back to the office,
LLS

Indiana Green · Post by **Indiana Green** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 5:24 pm

Wow, I absolutely can NOT wait for my hat to come!

Mr. Garrison, your tireless efforts have served you well. And Mr. Delk, thank you as well for passing your craft to a worthy pupil

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 6:32 pm

Indiana Green wrote:Wow, I absolutely can NOT wait for my hat to come! Mr. Garrison, your tireless efforts have served you well. And Mr. Delk, thank you as well for passing your craft to a worthy pupil

Yours is processing away. Thanks for the compliment. All I can do is try hard.

LLS

theinterchange · Post by **theinterchange** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 6:49 pm

That's a pretty darn good looking hat! It screams Raiders especially in the back view off your head.

Randy

thecoolmiester · Post by **thecoolmiester** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 8:12 pm

Fedora wrote:What a hoot!

that book says "winston 360" what is that?

I've read on here a guy has a "Winston 360 hat" but
i searched and cant find a "winston" hat website or
anything.

i've even seen a video on youtube show casing a winston 360 hat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CC1q6lR ... re=related

Where can i get one of these "winston" hats?

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 8:30 pm

I think the 360 is the raw block he starts with before sanding it down to get his Raiders look.

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 8:40 pm

thecoolmiester wrote:
Fedora wrote:What a hoot!

that book says "winston 360" what is that?

I've read on here a guy has a "Winston 360 hat" but
i searched and cant find a "winston" hat website or
anything.

i've even seen a video on youtube show casing a winston 360 hat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CC1q6lR ... re=related

Where can i get one of these "winston" hats?

I was ribbing 3thoubucks on that. He came up with a block shape based on a Winston Churchill hat and the hat being straight sided all around the block. That is 90 degrees off the table straight sided. Thus he coined the "Winston 360". I thought this same thing at one time, but abandonded it when it did not produce the Raiders look to me. That "highly detailed" sketch from my field book was paying homage to his theory. My current block has little resemblance to the Winston 360. It was a joke. Contact 3thoubucks for his thoughts. I like his thinking.

LLS

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 8:44 pm

oops, bad guess.

jasonalun · Post by **jasonalun** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 10:26 pm

Whoo-hoo! Thanks for the preview, LLS! Those look fantastic! I was anxiously awaiting already, now I'm

! A true work of hat-making art.

Mine's the first off my size block too

, so I'll be showing LLS's first run off soon as it arrives! Trying to put it out of my mind, so I won't

of anticipation!

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Sun Mar 22, 2009 10:46 pm

Man, I wish I had the cash to commit to one of those things! They looks SOOOO nice! -M

DR Ulloa · Post by **DR Ulloa** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 12:31 am

Thats a fine looking hat you've got there David. I'd say that you will be a fine competetor to the other custom hat makers out there. The felt looks great and that defintaley is the Raiders block. An observation, though. I may be wrong, but I think you have the center crease too low in the back. The profile arc of the hat looks off; too big a difference from the front to the back. I know its not the block becuase I've seen your block replicate the look to, what I think, is 100% Raiders SA. I may be wrong and it may just be the camera angle. Just thought I'd trough that out there. Again, that is a great looking hat. I'm really bummed out that I just can't justify another Indy hat. One Penman Raiders and one Crystal Skull AB (on order) is enough Indy hats for me. Maybe I can talk myself into it.

Dave

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 12:49 am

That's my problem exactly: 1 Raiders AB, 1 CS AB. I've got one Indy hat, one spare Indy hat, can't justify another. -M

DR Ulloa · Post by **DR Ulloa** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:17 am

I couldn't justify that in a good econoomy! If I was in the market for another Indy hat, however, this would probably be the one I'd get. David, if you get other color felts in, then we're in business, cause I gotta tell you, I really like that hat. If you feel the need to have one field tested, I'll do it for ya. I'm a 23 1/4''-er.

Dave

DanielJones · Post by **DanielJones** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:42 am

Man, thanks for the previews. That is one fantastic looking lid. I think the hat making process for you is like doing a retrace of a Public Lands Survey. You have to go back through the original notes, retrace their steps and find the information that was laid down in the past and add to it your interpretation of the original intensions to put the proper puzzle together. So basically you have had the mindset skills in place, you just applied them to a new craft. Super job sir!

Cheers!

Dan

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:02 am

I couldn't justify that in a good economy!

Keep in mind that I bought both of them back when they were $225 a piece... -M

Oklahoma Jones · Post by **Oklahoma Jones** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:11 am

Durn, LLS..............that is one pretty hat!!! I gotta get me one of those.............

Tyderium · Post by **Tyderium** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 4:17 am

A truly outstanding hat and great pictures LLS.

Mitch LaRue · Post by **Mitch LaRue** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 5:06 am

Well, THAT settles it:
Getting one of your hats has just jumped waaay up my "To Do" list, LLS!
I'll start saving right now and just hope the price is still close to where it is now once I get there.
WELL DONE on an Amazing looking hat!

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 9:52 am

Thanks everyone.

. I am a fan of this hat just like ya'll.

DR Ulloa, I believe it is the angle. I noticed that on Indy's hat that the left eye profile varies fron the right eye profile. The angle does have a lot to do this. The best example I can give you is the scene where Indy rushes to the wagon before heface the Cairo swordman. The first few frames show a great example of the right eye profile. As he retraces his steps from the wagon, you get a great view of the left eye profile. Note the front is slightly higher. The turned hat is the culprit. What also makes a slight difference is how far back you push the left eye bash at the top of the bash. This varies on the different styles that we name Raven Bar, Cairo, Well of Souls, etc.
23-1/4"

And as far as competitors goes, I am a greenhorn. I have some very big shoes, er Aldens, to fill. Marc, Steve, John have set the benchmark. I'll have to triple all my angles and distances to close in as tight as these guys.

Daniel Jones, on line, as always

, with that analysis. Surveyors just love to fit the pieces together. We take written evidence, parol evidence and measured evidence to reach a professional opinion as to where something is. And no matter what the theory is, if it does not produce a real life result, the theory is wrong. Sorry folks. When surveyors talk we get

Thanks again guys. The first hats wil be going out soon and then the real test begins. I'll try my best to be (everybody to your best Sean Connery) ........ up to the challenge.

LLS

DR Ulloa · Post by **DR Ulloa** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 10:03 am

Local Land Surveyor wrote:DR Ulloa, I believe it is the angle. I noticed that on Indy's hat that the left eye profile varies fron the right eye profile. The angle does have a lot to do this. The best example I can give you is the scene where Indy rushes to the wagon before heface the Cairo swordman. The first few frames show a great example of the right eye profile. As he retraces his steps from the wagon, you get a great view of the left eye profile. Note the front is slightly higher. The turned hat is the culprit. What also makes a slight difference is how far back you push the left eye bash at the top of the bash. This varies on the different styles that we name Raven Bar, Cairo, Well of Souls, etc.

I figured as much. I have to go back and rewatch that part of the Cairo scene, as I've neve noticed that, but I try not to focus on gear too much when I watch these films so I don't lose the magic of ACTUALLY watching them.

Mulceber wrote:
I couldn't justify that in a good economy!
Keep in mind that I bought both of them back when they were $225 a piece... -M

I ordered my AB at that price too.

Dave

Pitfall Harry · Post by **Pitfall Harry** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 1:19 pm

Wow!

Man, I'm definitely going to have to get some extra cash and order one of those hats! That looks fantastic.

LLS, are you offering to style the hats for your customers or are you just shipping these out all open crowned? I may have asked that before so please forgive my lapse in memory.

Is there anyway right now you'd be able to tell what the "turn around" time will be for the hats. Like maybe a month or two of a wait time once you get rolling? Just curious...

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 3:14 pm

I ordered my AB at that price too.

Man, I remember back when I ordered my first AB, the wait time was 2 weeks. heck, when I ordered it, Steve already had a felt body for my size in stock, so I got my hat in less than 1 week!

Man, I know it may sound like I'm complaining, but I REALLY WANT TO GO FOR ONE OF THESE THINGS!!! They look amazing! [sigh] I guess I'm going to have to see if I can scrape together the cash. LLS, are you still taking pre-orders? Also, are you trying to make the color of your hats SA or are you doing what Steve does and making them darker so that when they fade they'll be the right color? -M

Mitch LaRue · Post by **Mitch LaRue** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 3:51 pm

Pitfall Harry wrote:LLS, are you offering to style the hats for your customers or are you just shipping these out all open crowned? I may have asked that before so please forgive my lapse in memory.

Yeah, I'd like to "second" PH's question:
Will you bash and shape these upon request or are they Open Crown only?
Fox

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 5:38 pm

LLS although your pics do look good they do seemed to be compressed slightly side to side, are you having some aspect ratio issues?!

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 6:58 pm

Kt Templar wrote:LLS although your pics do look good they do seemed to be compressed slightly side to side, are you having some aspect ratio issues?!

I am not sure KT. The pics with me wearing the hat are screen grabs from video I shot. That may have something to do with it.

LLS

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 7:38 pm

Looks like a ratio 1.2 would be better. ie 120% wide. Does that look better to you?

Mitch LaRue · Post by **Mitch LaRue** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 7:56 pm

Job well done, KT.
I know you're looking for feedback from LLS (it IS his face - and hat - after all) but that already looks more "real"... and more "right".
...To me, anyway.

And the hat, specifically, just got even BETTER looking!

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 8:26 pm

I see the slight difference, KT. I'm good with that.

I had my first field day with this hat. It performed well, I have made note of a few subtle things that I will adjust on the production models. Some are construction. Some are asthetics. Got rain moving in the next few days, so I'll put it through that test as well.

Thanks for the feedback.

For now, back to the shop.

LLS

P.S. I can bash the hat for you.

. I think that is a good way to go. Shipping may loose the bash, but it would be very simple to bash it back. Got something in the works on that issue.

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 8:39 pm

I'm sorry if these questions have already been asked/answered, but LLS, are you still taking pre-orders? Also, are you trying to make the color of your hats SA or are you doing what Steve does and making them darker so that when they fade they'll be the right color? Thanks, -M

Local Land Surveyor · Post by **Local Land Surveyor** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 9:24 pm

Mulceber wrote:I'm sorry if these questions have already been asked/answered, but LLS, are you still taking pre-orders? Also, are you trying to make the color of your hats SA or are you doing what Steve does and making them darker so that when they fade they'll be the right color? Thanks, -M

The pre-order is still on. Check the Cairo Bazzar for details.
For now, I am taking the Steve approach on the darker color that will fade with time. I do this because this is what I have grown accustomed to with my beaver AB's. They have weatherd very nicely. None of mine each have the exact same color. Time does tell.
To me, the Raiders hat has a life of its own. It takes on many charaters on its own during the flick if you think about it. I swear that hat looks as heart broken as Indy does outside the Marhala bar. (Psst. I think it already knows that there is something wrong with that monkey.

)

Later on, when I have some more experience under my belt, I may start a quest to render a SA color from the box. One step at a time, though.
LLS

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 9:32 pm

awesome prototype LLS....i love the rear center crease

you are gonna make a killing in the indy community my friend and i wish you much prosperity.

as for the name of the hat: how'z about the "return to indy g, calgary, alberta canada" hat?