What is the more SA hat the Magnoli HJ or the AdventureBilt?

blueoakleyz · Post by **blueoakleyz** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:50 am

Yes I know the [custom] AdventureBilt is THE most screen accurate possible thing in existance of movie collecting but I'm referring to the original trilogy only. And particularly Last Crusade. Something you could say "That's exactly what Harrison wore" (or would have if the movie was made today)

Now I know they can't use the same sheets of felt they used on the originals etc but for me screen accurate would be the TYPE used. Ie. beaver versus rabbit.

[shade of] Color, brand (HJ), dimensions, bow material (both come with same bow right?), bow tie etc.

In the distant future I would like to order one entirely as a collectable.

The nice thing is that AdventureBilt basically builds both for the most part so taking Indy 4 in account either one would be extremely special/collectable for me.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 9:38 am

first three movies were rabbit and had the HJ logo. Indy 4 Ab beaver.

Both will look SA because they are made by Steve and block on the same block.

Sounds like to me the HJ/magnoli is what you are looking for.

John

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 10:35 am

Yeah, a magnoli would be the way to go - there are some differences in the way rabbit fur bashes from beaver fur, so it's easier to get that floppy Raiders look. That's not taking anything away from the standard AB which looks fantastic and will undoubtedly outlast the HJ, but if you want "the look," a magnoli HJ is the way to go. -M

Johnny Fedora · Post by **Johnny Fedora** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 11:28 am

For those of us looking for a perfect replica, nothing short of an exact replica of Harrison Ford's original Raider's (or Temple, or Last Crusade for that matter) hat will do. That hat is a Magnoli Herbert Johnson fedora made by AdventureBilt.

Even Herbert Johnson (Swaine Adeney Brigg) themselves, can't produce a replica of their own poet hat the way Fedora does for Magnoli. And the reason is that a Herbert Johnson hat made by SAB, is simply not the same hat as what they provided Harrison Ford with all those years ago. Over time they lost the block, went with a cheaper felt, lost the proper ribbon, and basically forgot how to make a hat like Indiana Jones' hat. That's one of the reasons why it's an AdventureBilt on Harrison's head this time around instead of a HJ. Steve however, gets unfinished Poet hat bodies, liners, and sweat bands from them. He then repounces the felt to a better finish stabilizing the felt against premature taper, adds better weather proofing, blocks (not reblocks, but blocks a fresh body) on his Raiders block, hand sews in the sweatband, turns the hat properly (if you wish) tacks on the original vintage ribbon and bow (that neither HJ, Todd nor Christies has, only Steve and Mark and John Penman have sourced, and use the proper vintage ribbon), and finally tack in the original HJ liner with an old style burgundy and gold label (currently HJ use just a gold script of their name on a plain white liner). You take all of that and what do you get? A Magnoli Herbert Johnson Fedora, the closest truly accurate replica of the hat worn by Harrison Ford in Raiders of the Lost Ark (or any of the original three films). Even the AdventureBilt is a close second in complete screen accuracy, as it is made of beaver and not rabbit. ;-)

Cheers!
Johnny

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:22 pm

Johnny, are you sure about Penman having the original ribbon - if I look at his ribbon, for some reason it really doesn't look like the stuff used by Steve and Marc. -M

Texan Scott · Post by **Texan Scott** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:43 pm

I'll play the opposite view for the sake of discussion. ;-) I would say none of them. In order to have the most SA fedora, particularly Raiders, you would need to source the felt from Curry, the Brazilian hat company that supplied rabbit felt for Herbert Johnson around 1980-81, used in Raiders, though 27 years removed.

About the only independent hat maker that sources this felt today is JPD. Again, though, it is 27 years removed.

indyrocks · Post by **indyrocks** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 1:23 pm

Steve has recently stated that the HJ bodies he's been getting are closer in feel, thickness, and character to the vintage poets he has handled/owned. He also stated he thinks they are better in quality than what he was getting when he first starting making these for Magnoli.

Although not exact, a Mag HJ is IMO (yes I own one) a 98% SA match to the Raiders fedora.

Johnny Fedora · Post by **Johnny Fedora** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 2:01 pm

Mulceber wrote:Johnny, are you sure about Penman having the original ribbon - if I look at his ribbon, for some reason it really doesn't look like the stuff used by Steve and Marc. -M

Yup. Looking at it over the web just isn't enough. I've scrutinized the ribbon closely in diffrent light (outside, inside, fluro light, incandesant), and in comparison to my HJ ribbon. That coupled with many disscussions of the ribbon over the phone with John, I can say that's the stuff. Steve and Mark didn't just give it to him either. He had to work for it. First he tried the whole dieing route (as Steve did with early Adventurebilts) but wasn't happy with the results. Then went through trying to find contempory sources for a closer ribbon, and never liked the results there. So wanting the right ribbon, he put hat making on hold and spent conciderable time and money in hunting down the right stuff. Now, he's been somewhat reticent about going 100% on record about the felt hat bodies he's using (the EXACT same as AB) and the ribbon (original ribbon), and blocks (Steve's original Raiders blocks) out of loyalty to Steve and Marc who've been his mentors, but I'll go head and out him here to anyone paying attention...it's the SAME stuff folks. John's making the best hat out there just below Adventurebilt! (And leaving a space for the Mag's Herbert Johnson.

What can I say, I love that hat.) The only diffrence is the expertese of Steve and Marc.

And oh yeah, price and lead times.

Johnny

DR Ulloa · Post by **DR Ulloa** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 4:25 pm

Mulceber wrote:Johnny, are you sure about Penman having the original ribbon - if I look at his ribbon, for some reason it really doesn't look like the stuff used by Steve and Marc. -M

I second that. It IS the vintage ribbon AB uses. You don't really get a feel for it through photos; you have to see it in person to really tell. Believe me, its the same.

Dave

eazybox · Post by **eazybox** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 6:05 pm

Over the last 24 years I lost count of the number of hats I tried on looking for a good Raiders replica, including HJ's made by Richard Swales. In all that time, the Magnoli was the first one that didn't disappoint me. Unless you can find a vintage HJ, there is really no other hat that would better meet the requirements you stated.

Jack

Johnny Fedora · Post by **Johnny Fedora** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 6:07 pm

Oh yeah...here's a recent pic of my baby. My one year old, Mags HJ Idol Grab fedora; Herbie.

Thanks again to Tony and Steve for my lid! I still love it to death!

Johnny

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:11 pm

eazybox wrote:Over the last 24 years I lost count of the number of hats I tried on looking for a good Raiders replica, including HJ's made by Richard Swales. In all that time, the Magnoli was the first one that didn't disappoint me. Unless you can find a vintage HJ, there is really no other hat that would better meet the requirements you stated.

Jack

Did you ever had a AB or ABD?

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:21 pm

Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking - I haven't had any form of HJ, but I couldn't imagine someone having a bad thing to say about an AB. -M

eazybox · Post by **eazybox** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:45 pm

BendingOak wrote:
eazybox wrote:Over the last 24 years I lost count of the number of hats I tried on looking for a good Raiders replica, including HJ's made by Richard Swales. In all that time, the Magnoli was the first one that didn't disappoint me. Unless you can find a vintage HJ, there is really no other hat that would better meet the requirements you stated.

Jack
Did you ever had a AB or ABD?

Yes, but I bought my AB after ordering the Magnoli, and it's the CS hat. Since Bluesoakleyz said he was looking for a replica that was as exact as possible, including brand name, to the first 3 films, I recommended the Magnoli, which is essentially a rabbit AB anyway.

Let me make this as clear as a Crystal Skull: I love my AB, too!

Jack

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 8:30 pm

eazybox wrote:
BendingOak wrote:
eazybox wrote:Over the last 24 years I lost count of the number of hats I tried on looking for a good Raiders replica, including HJ's made by Richard Swales. In all that time, the Magnoli was the first one that didn't disappoint me. Unless you can find a vintage HJ, there is really no other hat that would better meet the requirements you stated.

Jack
Did you ever had a AB or ABD?
Yes, but I bought my AB after ordering the Magnoli, and it's the CS hat. Since Bluesoakleyz said he was looking for a replica that was as exact as possible, including brand name, to the first 3 films, I recommended the Magnoli, which is essentially a rabbit AB anyway.

Let me make this as clear as a Crystal Skull: I love my AB, too!

Jack

The MAg/HJ/AB ( that hat has more names than anything).

Is what I said would be my take on it as well but I say this with all the respect as possible. It's still no AB.

eazybox · Post by **eazybox** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 9:24 pm

BendingOak wrote:
eazybox wrote:
BendingOak wrote:
eazybox wrote:Over the last 24 years I lost count of the number of hats I tried on looking for a good Raiders replica, including HJ's made by Richard Swales. In all that time, the Magnoli was the first one that didn't disappoint me. Unless you can find a vintage HJ, there is really no other hat that would better meet the requirements you stated.

Jack
Did you ever had a AB or ABD?
Yes, but I bought my AB after ordering the Magnoli, and it's the CS hat. Since Bluesoakleyz said he was looking for a replica that was as exact as possible, including brand name, to the first 3 films, I recommended the Magnoli, which is essentially a rabbit AB anyway.

Let me make this as clear as a Crystal Skull: I love my AB, too!

Jack
The MAg/HJ/AB ( that hat has more names than anything).

Is what I said would be my take on it as well but I say this with all the respect as possible. It's still no AB.

And Johnny just gave it one more name: Herbie!

No, I have to agree with that, if quality is your main goal, then AB trumps the Magnoli.

Jack

Johnny Fedora · Post by **Johnny Fedora** » Sat Oct 18, 2008 10:19 pm

And with all due respect to both AB, and Penman (my Penman hat is on my head as I type this), the Mags HJ is the pinnacle

of Original Films Screen Accuracy, with the AB and ABD the actual CS hat. For durability in material, the Penman Hat Co, and Adventurebilt CAN NOT be beat.

Johnny

Indiana MarkVII · Post by **Indiana MarkVII** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 9:51 pm

I think that this entire thread should be linked to one up above with a title along the lines of "Which hat should I get?"

blueoakleyz · Post by **blueoakleyz** » Sat Oct 25, 2008 4:52 am

I'd say durability should be only considered as in how good will it last in a display case.. hah yeah so I hope it'd stand up to that.

What is the more SA hat the Magnoli HJ or the AdventureBilt?

What is the more SA hat the Magnoli HJ or the AdventureBilt?

Hat quality and accuracy