calling out HH owners

Post by **Holt** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 8:47 pm

hi,

I have been busy reading alot of old posts considering the HH....

I am so in between leather right now...

the new washed goat or the HH for my custom raiders.

I know its really durable and smooths and soft....

but the only thing I am very conserned about is how heavy is it? do you really FEEL the jacket on?...like is it so heavy that becomes almost to much to wear....

any info would be great
Holt

IndyBlues · Post by **IndyBlues** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 8:51 pm

The HH is indeed a substantial leather. You know you have it on, but for me, it didn't bother me much. It bothered me more that my G&B lamb was way too lightweight for me. Could be because I'm built like an ox, and the added weight didn't seem that bad with the HH.

Tell you one thing, the Wested HH felt like I could wear it to #### and back if needed. Great leather, made into a great jacket, at a great price.
'Blues

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 9:12 pm

My Wested HH LC is one tough jacket......it's built like a tank and feels like you can pass it down to your great, great grandchildren. It's probably the heaviest of all the leathers around. What I also love about it is that it has that vintage "WWII look" to it without having any distressing on it. When you put it on, you definately feel the "weight" of the jacket on you, unlike lambskin or goat. HH is definately a "man's man" jacket.......not for wimps

Vivli · Post by **Vivli** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 9:31 pm

I'm pretty lightly built, and my horsehide jacket's never bothered me. Okay, admitingly, it's my only leather jacket, so I don't have much to compare it to (apart from an old cheap padded bomber jacket, but that was thick with padding, so it's kinda a moot comparison). And I carry a lot of @#$% around in it too, making it even heavier.

The weight isn't a problem. Yes, you feel it's on, but I like that in a jacket. To me, it feels like I always imagined Indy's jacket would feel, if that makes any sense. And it really does feel like it'll last forever!

I don't think it'll distress well, if that's what you're after. But it'll last for a very long time, and I personally love the feel of it. It definitely has a 'tough' feel to it, you can feel it hanging off you and such, but it's a good feeling, not a bad one.

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Mon Jun 02, 2008 9:41 pm

My Wested HH LC is the ONLY jacket I would wear during a brutal Chicago winter.....and the last one was BRUTAL. (but my HH weathered it like a champ!

)

Post by **Jens** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 3:11 am

Yes, the horsehide is quite tough and heavy ... but I made the experience that you won't notice this anymore as soon as you put the jacket on.

Of course it's quite warmer than a lambskin, so maybe not the first choice for a jungle trip or regular summer.

What makes the HH so special (in my eyes at least), is it's durability. It's really tough - even compared to the goatskin, but it gets a patina much faster than the goat ...

FLATHEAD · Post by **FLATHEAD** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:22 am

I don't think it'll distress well, if that's what you're after.

You ever see any WWII A-2 jackets, or the sleeves of B-3 jackets before?

Horsehide jackets get some of the most beautiful patina and leather
graining/distressing on them of any type of leather after they are used for many
years.

Flathead

Vivli · Post by **Vivli** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:16 am

FLATHEAD wrote:
You ever see any WWII A-2 jackets, or the sleeves of B-3 jackets before?

Horsehide jackets get some of the most beautiful patina and leather
graining/distressing on them of any type of leather after they are used for many
years.

Flathead

No, I honestly haven't. I'm really new to the whole jacket thing. I've wanted an Indy jacket all my life (I'm only 21, but seriously, even as a kid, I wanted that jacket), and finally got one for my 21st birthday. Only had it a few months, but I thought compared to how people talk about distressing things on here, I didn't think horsehide would do so well. I mean, it gets a good wrinkled look quickly, but I naturally assumed it wouldn't distress.

I'm really, really happy to hear I'm wrong, because I don't plan on owning multiple jackets, and want one I can wear for literally years, that really breaks in to become my own. So I'm really happy to hear that it will distress than that I was wrong! Thanks!

FLATHEAD · Post by **FLATHEAD** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:42 am

I'm really, really happy to hear I'm wrong,

Wrong? No you weren't. Not knowing something does not make you
wrong, it just means you did not know the answer.

Thats different than being wrong.

The Horsehide leather on your jacket is tough, and it does seem like you can't
distress it, or beat it up because its so strong.

But it will just get softer, more grainy, and have a very nice patina and
distressing on it as it ages.

Also, horsehide is more water repellant than Cowhide or lambskin. Its
not quite as water repellant as goatskin, but its not too far behind that.

So you will also get a bit more protection from the elements from horsehide
than cow or lamb which makes it a nice all around leather to have.

Flathead

Vivli · Post by **Vivli** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:02 am

FLATHEAD wrote: Wrong? No you weren't. Not knowing something does not make you
wrong, it just means you did not know the answer.

Thats different than being wrong.

The Horsehide leather on your jacket is tough, and it does seem like you can't
distress it, or beat it up because its so strong.

But it will just get softer, more grainy, and have a very nice patina and
distressing on it as it ages.

Also, horsehide is more water repellant than Cowhide or lambskin. Its
not quite as water repellant as goatskin, but its not too far behind that.

So you will also get a bit more protection from the elements from horsehide
than cow or lamb which makes it a nice all around leather to have.

Flathead

Cool. Thanks for the info! I already know it's really tough. I've been drenched in it and not felt a speck of water through it, so I know it's pretty resistant. I have noticed in a few bits, around the collar specifically, that it's becoming more grainy, which is a great look, but I've gotta admit, I just assumed it had always been like that and I didn't notice!

Thanks for the info! The one single thing I didn't like about my horsehide jacket was that I thought it'd never distress, and always look new (other than that, I adore it), so it's fantastic to hear that's not the case. Makes it pretty much perfect, in my opinion.

Thanks again!

FLATHEAD · Post by **FLATHEAD** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:16 am

One great way to get the grain to start to pop out of a horsehide jacket
is to mash it up into a ball, and sit on it, or use it as pillow under your
head when your dozing on the couch.

Also, keep it balled up on the floor when your not wearing it instead of
hanging it up.

That will also bring out the grain.

What alot of the A-2 repro guys do with their VERY expensive horsehide
jackets is to get the leather wet with HOT water by putting the jacket
under a sink faucet one part at a time (like one sleeve, or the collar, or
the pocket flaps, or whatever) and then wring the water out of it.

Then, they will just "work" the leather in their hands, bending it, squeezing
it, crumpling it, and then let that part air dry.

This brings out the grain like you won't believe.

Also, in some of the extreme cases, they will actually get the entire jacket
wet with hot water, wring it out, and then wear it until its completely dry.

This makes the jacket a real custom fit to an individuals own body.

Its a bit extreme, but it works wonders, and the graining and softness
that comes out is amazing.

They can actually get their NEW jackets to look like 60 year old jackets
in a matter of weeks.

Flathead

nicktheguy · Post by **nicktheguy** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:20 am

Once you've had HH, you'll never look back.

Hunter Jones · Post by **Hunter Jones** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:28 am

I am 100% satisfied with my Wested Raiders HH. It is certainly built to take a beating. The HH is heavy, but at the same time that is comforting. It's good to know that you have a jacket that is meant to last.

Vivli · Post by **Vivli** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 10:47 am

Wow, thanks for the tips, Flathead. I tend to keep my jacket balled up on the floor, having heard hanging up is bad for it, but other than that, just want to let it distress naturally. There is already actually very slight wear on the edges of the back panels already, which suprised me!

But yeah, to move away from all this talk of distressing, I totally reccomend horsehide too. I mean, I went to Wested, and tried on all types of jacket, and before I went there, I was convinced I'd get lambskin, and never think about anything heavier. Soon as I tried on horsehide though, I knew that was the one. The weight is in no way uncomfortable. It just makes it feel like a 'real' jacket (which is great when you're spending a lot of money on one).

And I think the leather itself looks fantastic. Just the right colour, and the sleeves and everything wrinkle in a fantastic way.

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:06 am

If Indy really had his way in "real life," he'll wear a HH and HH ONLY!

Vivli · Post by **Vivli** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:25 am

PSBIndy wrote:If Indy really had his way in "real life," he'll wear a HH and HH ONLY!

Having worn HH on a sunny British day I dunno if I agree with that! I mean, sunny British days are like cold days anywhere else, and that was horrible.

I can't imagine wearing one in India!

Certainly be handy for the whole dragged beneath a truck thing, though!

kobol · Post by **kobol** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 11:57 am

I wouldn't say the HH is too heavy to wear, but you will definitely notice that you are wearing it. It's not near as light as the lambskins and goat. But as stated above, you definitely get the impression that this jacket was built to last.

Louisiana Jones · Post by **Louisiana Jones** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 1:00 am

nicktheguy wrote:Once you've had HH, you'll never look back.

\

Ain't that the truth!

If you're used to Indy leather jackets, than yes the HH will feel more substantial. To those of us who are used to heavyweight HH leathers (by the likes of Lost Worlds, Aero, etc..) the Wested HH feels like lambskin. I was shocked when I got my Wested HH LC in the mail.. I quickly contacted them and told them they must have sent me the wrong leather!! They assured me it was their HH.

So bottom line is that nomatter what, I doubt you will have any problems wearing a Wested HH Indy... it is nowhere near uncomfortable and practically feels broken in right out of the box (bag). I loved mine.. too bad it was too short!

LJ

nicktheguy · Post by **nicktheguy** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 1:17 am

HH is the best Wested leather IMO -- I love mine, and it isn't nearly as heavy as my Aero.

Louisiana Jones · Post by **Louisiana Jones** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 1:50 pm

nicktheguy wrote:HH is the best Wested leather IMO -- I love mine, and it isn't nearly as heavy as my Aero.

This is a little off topic but what model Aero do you have? FQ horse or something else? I've been eyeing one of their long half belts for a while now.

LJ

Louisiana Jones · Post by **Louisiana Jones** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:00 pm

Since this is a HH thread I figured I'd post some old pics of my HH Wested.

Here it is brand new... very shiny and just too new looking.

Here it is after some fine grain sandpaper. I wanted to take the shine off to give it a bit different look.. and then got too into it and distressed it too much (I'm not into giving my jackets a phony distressing job.. I got carried away and hated the fact that I did it!)

Here's just a pic of a real heavyweight HH jacket to show you how thin and pliable the Wested HH is. This picture is of the jacket at about a month old (worn every day), and it's barely started creasing and still stands up on it's own!

LJ

Raider S · Post by **Raider S** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:24 pm

I think I'd take that jacket you started to distress and take it to the next step. Really rough it up.

Post by **Holt** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 3:31 pm

wow thats one stiff jacket you have there(bottom picture) I'm glad the HH wested doesnt do this..

if you feel that the distressing is looking phony and is to ''white'' compared to the rest of the jacket...then just wetten the jacket and the distressing will blend out..

looks like a great jacket though...

bests
Holt

bobjones · Post by **bobjones** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 5:54 pm

Louisiana - I have an Aero FQHH since March and have absolutely beaten the #### out of it (rolled it, sat on it, kneaded it like dough, etc.) and as another poster said here once about theirs, the jacket laughed at me and said: "is that all you got, punk?"

I've considered calling Aero to see if they would make an Indy, and to explore if they would, what hides would they do it in, but it would probably be much less expensive to work with a vendor who already has set up their production to make one. Especially since I had to pay almost $70 in customs for the Aero.

HH is a tough hide, possibly the toughest, and a medium-weight HH would make for a superb Indy. SA issues aside, given that HH was the primary hide used for leather jackets in the US in the 1930s, Indy's REAL jacket would likely have been made out of HH. But given how tough it is, lamb or cow were likely chosen by the moviemakers as HH might not have been hand-distressable in the short time before film production began.

Louisiana Jones · Post by **Louisiana Jones** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:10 pm

bobjones wrote:SA issues aside, given that HH was the primary hide used for leather jackets in the US in the 1930s, Indy's REAL jacket would likely have been made out of HH.

You make a very good point. I completely agree.

Also, I'd be very interested to see the results of an Aero Indy jacket.. make sure to let me know if you ever go ahead with that idea.

And to the other guys who commented on my HH Wested.. I ended up selling it and now have a brand new one to distress naturally.

LJ

Post by **Holt** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:14 pm

is it a new LC style?

and...how well do you HH owners think it would age and distress naturally?

regards
Holt

Louisiana Jones · Post by **Louisiana Jones** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:22 pm

Indiana Holt wrote:is it a new LC style?

and...how well do you HH owners think it would age and distress naturally?

regards
Holt

Yo Holt! I ordered the LC style because I love the larger collar, but I honestly don't know what style this new one is. The collar and pockets are completely different from the first jacket I had. I posted a review and poll in the leather jacket section. Below is a picture of it. I went with novapelle this time, but for long-term wear I probably should have went with HH (HH is by far my leather of choice). Why novapelle? I don't know.. guess I just wanted to get it because it was new and everyone was talking about it. Who knows.. it's a great jacket though.

For long term durability I'd definitely recommend the HH. It'll take longer to naturally distress though.. probably a lot longer, but HH grains and patinas over time nicer than any other leather I've seen.

LJ

Post by **Jens** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 5:13 am

Louisiana Jones wrote: For long term durability I'd definitely recommend the HH. It'll take longer to naturally distress though.. probably a lot longer, but HH grains and patinas over time nicer than any other leather I've seen.

I totally agree in terms of durability, but to me it seems my HH jacket distressed faster than my older goatskin. Maybe I treated it a bit harder than the goat, but the horse developed the typical wrinkles and worn borders earlier ... what is not a bad thing in my eyes.

Doeindy · Post by **Doeindy** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 9:14 am

What is a HH Jacket? Nerver heard of that one before

Post by **Jens** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 10:30 am

This is referring to the material ... HorseHide.

Doeindy · Post by **Doeindy** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 3:42 pm

Oh yeah Jens, I think Ii was just being stupid; I should have known that HH is Horse Hide

Post by **Jens** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 3:58 pm

No problem at all. Ask and you shall receive ...

jacksdad · Post by **jacksdad** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 6:20 pm

my question is,where do you live and how brutal are the winters. Goat is very durable and light,but horsehide is thick and warm.I have an indy goat and I'm not sure if it will be warm enough for a chicago winter.I have two A-2 horsehide jackets and have worn both in below zero weather,what I had on is a t-shirt,dress shirt for work and sweater with a scarf around my neck and baseball cap and the jackets made me almost sweat. Horsehide is the better choise if it's going to be your winter jacket. hope this helps.

nicktheguy · Post by **nicktheguy** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 11:30 am

Louisiana Jones
PostPosted: Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:50 pm Post subject:
nicktheguy wrote:
HH is the best Wested leather IMO -- I love mine, and it isn't nearly as heavy as my Aero.

This is a little off topic but what model Aero do you have? FQ horse or something else? I've been eyeing one of their long half belts for a while now.

LJ

My Aero is the WWI Aviator in a dark brown jerky HH -- It's great for my motorcycle riding and tough as nails.

bobjones · Post by **bobjones** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 12:08 pm

jacksdad wrote:my question is,where do you live and how brutal are the winters. Goat is very durable and light,but horsehide is thick and warm.I have an indy goat and I'm not sure if it will be warm enough for a chicago winter.I have two A-2 horsehide jackets and have worn both in below zero weather,what I had on is a t-shirt,dress shirt for work and sweater with a scarf around my neck and baseball cap and the jackets made me almost sweat. Horsehide is the better choise if it's going to be your winter jacket. hope this helps.

A goatskin or lambskin indy jacket, at least the ones I have tried on, cannot be considered sufficient for winter wear IMO.

I have to admit, that when I got the goatskin jacket from them I was stunned at how lightweight the jacket was. Up until this point, I have only worn much heavier leather jackets, bombers and such, and FQHH, so the goat felt almost like a shirt at first.

I recall a poster here posted a pic of them shovelling snow in an Indy, he must be VERY warm-blooded to do that

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 1:08 pm

You definitely have to layer under either choice when it gets cold....that's a fact!

Regard! Michaelson

Marv · Post by **Marv** » Wed Jun 25, 2008 2:50 pm

I also have 2 HH A2s and 2 GS A2s, the goat more water repellent than horse hence the USN adopting this type of hide for their M422a / G1 aviators jacket but the horse is more study and thick. However questions can be raised regarding the durability of horse as some say that goat is tougher and more hard wearing and I am likely to agree with this statement.
As for the REAL LIFE 1930's Indy jacket, it would would have most probably have been made from HH as the jacket has features taken from the USAAC/USAAF A2 flyers jacket ie. the pocket design but adding the two-way feature which wasn't present on the A2.
As HH was the predominent leather to use at that time hence the this hide being chosen for the A2, however there would have been a slim chance that goatskin may have been used at this came into play in the late 30's early 40's also.

Post by **Holt** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:44 am

ok so i finally got my first HH

and man this is one nice hide.

love it now after it is broken in and relaxed a bit

the thing is...since there is a little weight on this jacket,will this jacket stretch in length?...I dont think it will shrink in length since this is a pretty heavy thing...or will it??

so HH owners whats your experience on this?

bests
Holt

HDRnR · Post by **HDRnR** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:16 am

The woman who did the wardrobe for Raiders said that she was shown an A-2 and didn't like it for the movie but she liked some features on it like the pockets but not the fabric wrists and waist and it wasnt long enough. So what came out of it was basically a 30's work coat with A-2 type pockets, covered zip, and plain cuffs. I'd say Indies coat would have definitly been made of horse back then, I've never seen a jacket that old made from goat or lamb in that style. Just horse of different weights or cowhide. I think back then people would have laughed at you if you tried to sell them a work jacket made of lamb, when you bought a work jacket you wore it until it was worn out, that stuff was built to last. Goat would have fit the bill for durability also but I've just never seen it in any old work jacket.

HDRnR · Post by **HDRnR** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:18 am

Indiana Holt wrote:ok so i finally got my first HH

and man this is one nice hide.

love it now after it is broken in and relaxed a bit

the thing is...since there is a little weight on this jacket,will this jacket stretch in length?...I dont think it will shrink in length since this is a pretty heavy thing...or will it??

so HH owners whats your experience on this?

bests
Holt

Horsehide won't stretch. The grain is way too dense which is why its practically waterproof.

Post by **Holt** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:19 am

how about shrinking?

HDRnR · Post by **HDRnR** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 12:05 pm

Indiana Holt wrote:how about shrinking?

I don't think it would shrink either unless it got extremely dried out, like left in a barn or something for twenty years. I have my grandfather's horsehide jacket which is gotta be over sixty years old and I've never treated it with anything and its perfect. Matter of fact I have several vintage horsehides from that era which I have never treated with leather conditioner and are fine. On the other hand I have an old California Highway Patrol jacket that looked like it was sitting out in the elements for a long time and that needed some conditioner to loosen it up a bit especially in the sleeves because it was so thick and the sleeves were so crinkled. In general tho horse will stand up to anything with minimal care. The real heavy front quarter horsehide tho is real tuff to break in.

mark seven · Post by **mark seven** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:06 pm

FLATHEAD wrote:

Horsehide jackets get some of the most beautiful patina and leather
graining/distressing on them of any type of leather after they are used for many
years.

Flathead

Ain't that the truth..

Kentucky Blues · Post by **Kentucky Blues** » Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:18 pm

mark seven wrote: Ain't that the truth..

Ya know, when I woke up today, I didn't want to hurt anyone... but I Just want that jacket too much. Sorry, Mark Seven...

-KB

Post by **Holt** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 12:53 pm

wow what a cool jacket..and I love the aged look of it..

but what about if the Horse gets wet..I mean really wet..soaked thru...

will that hurt it? will it stretch?...shrink?

just wondering

IH

Louisiana Jones · Post by **Louisiana Jones** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 3:11 pm

Nah don't worry about the HH... it's tough stuff.

LJ

PSBIndy · Post by **PSBIndy** » Sun Jul 20, 2008 5:08 pm

My only gripe with HH is that when I had my Wested HH, it was a little "stiff" even after some Pecards treatment and doesn't drape or distress as well as a lamb or goat. That being said, it was a great jacket to wear in very cold weather. After I got my Novapelle, I compared the two and it was clear to me that the Nova had the better look, color, drape, and overall fit and comfort.

JimL · Post by **JimL** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 8:26 am

My moto jacket is a custom Schott Front Quarter Horse Hide and that thing feels like it would stop a bullet...

On their Blog area, there are testimonials of those unfortunate enough to test the durability of HH when they went down on their bikes. Needless to say, it's tough stuff...

Thise testimonials, as well as the fact that it is the 'traditional' leather of the original biker jackets, was what sold me on it.

The Schott leather is Italian origin, so VERY smooth and tanned in the ancient manner. My undertanding is that the Wested HH is MUCH thinner, but also of Italian origin. From the posts above, it sounds as if the finish is not as 'nice' (durable) as the Schott; however this is a good thing if you want accelerated weathering, because you will need a sand-blaster to weather the Schott HH!

So, I've had mine for over a year (maybe two now?) and it still looks as good as the day I opened the box, with maybe a few more wrinkles. Shiny, black leather...

Horse Hide is the best leather in my opinion. Is it the best for an Indy jacket? That is up to the purchaser...

Doeindy · Post by **Doeindy** » Mon Jul 21, 2008 3:17 pm

Mark Seven: How old is your HH jacket?; the leather on that looks like the most beautifull skin I have ever seen. I would say that it reminds me allot of the TN KOTCS jacket.

I love the orignality of your jacket.

Great post.

Paul.

calling out HH owners

calling out HH owners

Re: calling out HH owners