On which Terry Leonard jacket was the Expo based?
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On which Terry Leonard jacket was the Expo based?
Was this Leonard's stunt jacket the one described in the new jacket write up from "order #3", or was it one of the others used? I understand that the jacket measured by _ (to produce the Expo) was pretty worn out - it must have seen some stunt action (not just used for double shots). I guess the point here is that order # 3 jackets were made to look just like the hero jacket, while the others floating about the film varied in small ways.
Does anyone actually know as opposed to speculation?
Thanks in advance.
Does anyone actually know as opposed to speculation?
Thanks in advance.
Last edited by CM on Fri Jun 27, 2008 4:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
- joeyofarimathea
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_ wrote:Yep - I know...
This is an excerpt from the draft Temple of Doom jacket update:
As an aside, I've since also examined Leonard's hero replica. The differences between it and the above referenced jacket from the second order was minimal. The gussets were constructed much differently. The zipper length was slightly different. The collar stand and storm flap attachment was identical......[of the original 14 jackets made by Leather Concessionaires] all but five original Raiders jackets have been [destroyed]... The hero jacket resides in George Lucas’ office at Skywalker Ranch. Vic Armstrong and Terry Leonard have their copies from the third order placed with Leather Concessionaires. Two other jackets made their way to Paramount [before preproduction began for Temple of Doom] – one was Martin Grace’s jacket from the third order [hero copy] and the other was a jacket in marginal condition that had Terry Leonard’s name written in its lining. Reportedly, this last jacket had been pulled aside in order to fit a Wilson’s jacket for Terry to wear during the truck dragging gag in Tunisia. The Martin Grace jacket and the “marginal” Leonard jacket (presumably the only surviving jacket from the second order placed with Leather Concessionaires) were auctioned for charity in 1984 by Butterfields in Los Angeles. Martin Grace’s jacket is lost, however the jacket with Terry Leonard’s name in the lining was located and examined in August of 2000 and was the basis for the Flight Suits Expedition as well as having contributed to the ultimate specifications for Todd Coyle’s designs in 2007.
hello _,
i was wondering about the "aside comment" you made? let me be sure i have this straight.....are you saying you compared the one that terry personally kept from the 3rd order (hero copy) against the marginal one from the second order that had terrys name in the lining (and later used as reference for FS and Todd? after writing this i do believe i have it right?
thanks for reading,
Joey
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joeyofarimathea wrote:_ wrote:Close... Not directly compared at the same time... About 7 years passed between...
ok now i see...thank you. but if the other one was auctioned off in 1984 how on earth did you guys manage to find it in 2000?
thanks, joey
How do you think the information on this site was found at all?
Ridiculous detective work...
Its what this site was founded on...
For example...it always baffled me how Lee Keppler tracked down Fredric's shoe store....in the 1980's! How's that possible...
Last edited by Mola Ram on Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:18 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Regarding the zipper length, was the hero replica's shorter or longer? I love all these details!_ wrote:As an aside, I've since also examined Leonard's hero replica. The differences between it and the above referenced jacket from the second order was minimal. The gussets were constructed much differently. The zipper length was slightly different. The collar stand and storm flap attachment was identical...
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I just picked up a copy of the March 2004 edition of "Architectural Digest" on ebay which features George Lucas's Skywalker Ranch and office. Not sure if the Raiders jacket will be seen in any of the pics, but I thought I'd get it anyway. If it's there, I'll be sure to scan the pic and post it here. Hopefully the magazine will arrive towards the end of the week.
Chris
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I wonder if this means Peter from Wested had a chance to copy the hero jacket he originally made for Raiders. Or was he only approached after Bernie came on board?_ wrote:Finally, prior to Bernie Pollack taking over as Ford's wardrobe person for CS, his "predecessors" had approached several vendors. They were presented with the original Raider's hero jacket to use under supervision for a very limited time in order to make jackets for submission.
That is an excellent question. Obviously a bunch of people were in a position to measure the thing.Satipo wrote:I wonder if this means Peter from Wested had a chance to copy the hero jacket he originally made for Raiders. Or was he only approached after Bernie came on board?_ wrote:Finally, prior to Bernie Pollack taking over as Ford's wardrobe person for CS, his "predecessors" had approached several vendors. They were presented with the original Raider's hero jacket to use under supervision for a very limited time in order to make jackets for submission.
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yeah MR i guess youre right and just think Kepler was doing his detective work back in the 80's with BETAMAX and before fax machines (NO DVD or PC). Kepler really is a LEGEND, huh!!!!!
Thanks, JOA
Thanks, JOA
Mola Ram wrote:joeyofarimathea wrote:_ wrote:Close... Not directly compared at the same time... About 7 years passed between...
ok now i see...thank you. but if the other one was auctioned off in 1984 how on earth did you guys manage to find it in 2000?
thanks, joey
How do you think the information on this site was found at all?
Ridiculous detective work...
Its what this site was founded on...
For example...it always baffled me how Lee Keppler tracked down Fredric's shoe store....in the 1980's! How's that possible...
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_ wrote: "Each of Bernie's predecessors were fired by Steven, and those efforts went nowhere. The jacket went back to Lucas, and Bernie used a different approach..."
That's odd. Too bad Bernie chose to make a high quality Cooper jacket instead of showing Tony the original Raiders hero jacket from George asking him to dupicate it.
Since Bernie mentioned him by name on the video, at least we know that Steve, if he ever wanted to, could probably verify through Bernie that this grail jacket is in fact in Lucas' possession. Of course, this has probably already happened, either by him or through another source.
Good work _ - thanks as usual and looking forward to reading all of the jacket info once it's ready.
junior
That's odd. Too bad Bernie chose to make a high quality Cooper jacket instead of showing Tony the original Raiders hero jacket from George asking him to dupicate it.
Since Bernie mentioned him by name on the video, at least we know that Steve, if he ever wanted to, could probably verify through Bernie that this grail jacket is in fact in Lucas' possession. Of course, this has probably already happened, either by him or through another source.
Good work _ - thanks as usual and looking forward to reading all of the jacket info once it's ready.
junior
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Hmm, is it just me, or does it sound like perhaps Ford just really, really likes that Keppler jacket that was chosen for LC and KotCS? Perhaps Powell went along with the jacket that Ford liked during the making of LC, and later, during KotCS, Ford had some deja vu, picked out the Keppler again, and Pollack went with that as well? Just a thought..._ wrote:Simply stated, neither liked the original, nor the remaining ToD or LC jackets. Ford and Pollack chose the same jacket for CS that Anthony Powell and Ford selected for LC...
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Perhaps it has just survived the best over the years. Maybe the original screen-used Raiders jacket looks pretty bad now, kind of like the original screen-used fedora (would anyone have chosen that to base the latest hat on?).Castor Dioscuri wrote:Hmm, is it just me, or does it sound like perhaps Ford just really, really likes that Keppler jacket that was chosen for LC and KotCS? Perhaps Powell went along with the jacket that Ford liked during the making of LC, and later, during KotCS, Ford had some deja vu, picked out the Keppler again, and Pollack went with that as well? Just a thought..._ wrote:Simply stated, neither liked the original, nor the remaining ToD or LC jackets. Ford and Pollack chose the same jacket for CS that Anthony Powell and Ford selected for LC...
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Ford joked about not caring about that "cr@p", because he was a very rich man, on his last appearance on Conan. I guess he did want the stuff, at least for sentimental reasons._ wrote:Satipo wrote:Perhaps it has just survived the best over the years. Maybe the original screen-used Raiders jacket looks pretty bad now, kind of like the original screen-used fedora (would anyone have chosen that to base the latest hat on?).I think there very well could be a little of both, with a twist I was saving for the LC write-up - but what the heck...Michaelson wrote:Another off the wall theory of mine would be that maybe the Lucasfilm jacket just 'felt' familiar to Ford, as he OWNS a FS Expedition, and wears it often when home in Jackson, WY.....or so I've been told by locals there.
Lee and I struggled with this back at the QM. He sold two jackets, but Bernie swore there was only one like it in the archive inventory. Before Monty Berman died, he and I discussed his working with Anthony Powell and one of the items that came up was the prototype jacket Powell had brought from LFL. Powell would not let it out of his sight and would not allow Peter to take it apart. Just recently we confirmed with Ron Beck (wardrobe supervisor) that when shooting wrapped on Last Crusade, Powell instructed him to set aside several items for Ford. That complete list was:Something the FS jackets had going for them - they were made to be worn for years, not just to survive an 8 week shooting schedule. So, technically, he has at least 2 Flight Suits jackets. I do understand that the prototype for CS was returned to the archives.
- The Zippo Lighter
10-foot hero whip
Hero gunbelt and holster
A specific fedora in which Powell had put his card in the sweatband
Hero bag
Hero jacket
Prototype jacket
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If Ford has an FS Expo, I guess that kind of gives it a new reason to buy one? Maybe inside, in some deep sub-conscience corner, he wishes that that was how original jacket should have been. And he has said that Indy is one of his favorite characters to play. I mean could any jacket at any price he wanted you know. I wounder if he wears it when he does searcha nd resue for the sheriffs dpt over there?
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"If" he has an FS Expo? No, he HAS one.
That wasn't a theory. That's fact. I remember when it was presented to him by FS.
He's seen wearing it at the Jackson airport when he goes to fly quite often.
That's another reason why his 'I don't wear that c!@#, I'm rich!' statement made me smile when I first read it. He DOES wear 'this c!@#'!
Regards! Michaelson
That wasn't a theory. That's fact. I remember when it was presented to him by FS.
He's seen wearing it at the Jackson airport when he goes to fly quite often.
That's another reason why his 'I don't wear that c!@#, I'm rich!' statement made me smile when I first read it. He DOES wear 'this c!@#'!
Regards! Michaelson
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Michaelson wrote:"If" he has an FS Expo? No, he HAS one.
That wasn't a theory. That's fact. I remember when it was presented to him by FS.
He's seen wearing it at the Jackson airport when he goes to fly quite often.
That's another reason why his 'I don't wear that c!@#, I'm rich!' statement made me smile when I first read it. He DOES wear 'this c!@#'!
Regards! Michaelson
Thanks Michaelson for clarification.
I meant my :if" to be an "if-then" statment, "if Ford has one, then I'm going to get one"; maybe it should have been a "since-than" statment, "since Ford has one, then I 'm going to get one." Good enough for him, i.e. "Indy himself", then it's good enough for me
Anyway, it's way cool that he does have one. I think that the whole "i'm rich" thing s just a presentation. I think he's type that if he needed a new work shirt for the ranch he'd rather go down to the feed store in Jackson and buy one himself kind of thing. You know what I mean? I am only a few hours from Jackson, maybe I should hang out there a little more....
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Since Ford owns and regularly wears an Expo and enjoys it, it's strange that G&B didn't make it to the Indy 4 jacket considerations. You wonder why Ford didn't say - "I have a great jacket right here... why don't we run with it?" Heck - his would even have been predistressed.
Last edited by CM on Thu Jun 26, 2008 8:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
And I should also add that the Nowak jacket looks less cool to me than a standard G&B... I'm sure, good as the Nowak might be, it'd have to be about the same quality as a G&B, certainly no better. Looking at the Nowak side straps - they seem much less robust. I guess we'll know for sure in... 10 years?
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I know hardly anything about the jackets, but what a great post. Thank you _ and Michealson.
I really enjoyed the read.
So Mr Ford wears a Indy jacket in his spare time? The man has good taste. Where did he get the idea from?
Maybe Mr Ford is a member of COW. (SAID IN A PARONOID VOICE): Its you Michealson; your real name is Harrison Ford is'nt it?
Paul.
I really enjoyed the read.
So Mr Ford wears a Indy jacket in his spare time? The man has good taste. Where did he get the idea from?
Maybe Mr Ford is a member of COW. (SAID IN A PARONOID VOICE): Its you Michealson; your real name is Harrison Ford is'nt it?
Paul.
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I was wondering about something along these lines...in the G&B catalog, they mention that they took an original jacket form the movie, and had "3 experts" examine their copy and critique it, "perfecting" their version.
What did they mean by "perfecting" it, did this mean they made it more exact to the original, or more durable and wearable in the real world?
Who were the "experts" they consulted, and what changes did they make?
What did they mean by "perfecting" it, did this mean they made it more exact to the original, or more durable and wearable in the real world?
Who were the "experts" they consulted, and what changes did they make?
Top men, Jones, they were top men...bobjones wrote:I was wondering about something along these lines...in the G&B catalog, they mention that they took an original jacket form the movie, and had "3 experts" examine their copy and critique it, "perfecting" their version.
What did they mean by "perfecting" it, did this mean they made it more exact to the original, or more durable and wearable in the real world?
Who were the "experts" they consulted, and what changes did they make?