Has anyone ever done this??

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 8:55 pm

I always hear about how people hate ruining thier crackers all of the time. So now that I know how to make my own I got to thinkin'.....Why doesn't anybody make crackers out of stronger stuff? Being the outdoorsman I am I thought of powerpro (a braided fishin' line made of spectra fiber). I though "it wouldn't hurt to try" so I did. Lemme tell ya. Because of how soft yet strong it is....It cracks VERY loud!! I'm not sure how long it'll last but I'm sure it will be longer than any other cracker I've ever used. Thought I would run this by some folks. Who knows...Maybe I'm on to something.

rjallen70 · Post by **rjallen70** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 9:06 pm

got pics?
Yes I am interested. What Lb test did you use?
R

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 9:12 pm

I used 30lb test 8lb diamiter.

I'll get pics up soon.

LemonLauren · Post by **LemonLauren** » Sat Mar 29, 2008 9:28 pm

Vegeta,

I've thought about this question before too, but I've never gotten around to trying anything new myself. There are definitely some new pretty amazing types of materials out there. Let us know how the spectra fiber stuff holds up - sounds like an interesting experiment.

Lauren

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 2:00 am

It's very late here in FL but as promised here are the pics of the cracker I made from 30lb test 8lb diameter powerpro. I did 5 loops for a combined total of 20 strands when complete but it turned out a little bit thinner than my nylon crackers bought from WSP. I'm either gonna go up one level in thickness or just loop it 1 or 2 more times to achieve the desired thickness. I'll keep yall updated on the durability....But this thing cracks like a beast!!

Weston · Post by **Weston** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 2:37 am

Looks like a great idea! I've made crackers out of bailing twine and nylon thread. I think that's going to work really well. How long ist that cracker? I like to make mine no more than 4" from the loop to the knot, so I don't have something heavy on the end wearing out my fall.

Weston

Satipo · Post by **Satipo** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 5:14 am

My main concern with seeking stronger cracker material is would it more likely damage the leather parts of the whip when it occasionally catches it?

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 5:18 am

Satipo wrote:My main concern with seeking stronger cracker material is would it more likely damage the leather parts of the whip when it occasionally catches it?

That is my main concern!!!! I definately don't wanna hurt my whip. I guess I'll have to see how it goes.

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 5:27 am

Weston wrote:Looks like a great idea! I've made crackers out of bailing twine and nylon thread. I think that's going to work really well. How long ist that cracker? I like to make mine no more than 4" from the loop to the knot, so I don't have something heavy on the end wearing out my fall.

Weston

Thanks for the compliment!!! The cracker is a little over 4 inches from the loop to the knot. It's a tad shorter than my cracker that came on my whip from Joe Strain.

WhipDude · Post by **WhipDude** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 1:36 pm

People have tried this before but it's just not well shared information really. Mainly because the damage it can cause. People have made poppers out of Kevlar. Stuff like that though could be overkill and maybe a little too dangerous. I would say try at your own risk.

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 3:22 pm

I was just outside crackin' one of my whips and hit the thong 2 times with the cracker. Didn't damage it at all. It left a little mark like my other crackers do, the ones you can just rub it out with your finger. I dont really put tons of power into my cracks to get my big cracks so maybe thats part of it. It's my feeling that if you're gonna hurt yourself with the whip....your skin will always give before the cracker does. It's not like a nylon cracker will break if it hits you.....It WILL cut you just as easily.

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:08 pm

Nice looking poppers Vegeta, where did you learn to make such good ones at?

It' alot of fun to experiment with different materials for poppers, Obviously you want to be careful about the materials you use though, as some stuff as mentioned will cut into the leather if you make a mistake. Better safe then sorry on an expensive whip.

How does that spectra fiber line fray out? Or does it stay pretty wiry like standard fishing line? It seems like no matter what material I try, I always seem to go back to regular bonded nylon.

That reminds me though, I once knew a guy who tried making a popper out of some piano wire, that was really stupid

and no it wasn’t me!

Dan

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:31 pm

Piano wire!! Holy cr@p thats crazy!! I actually just started making crackers 2 days ago

I'm not kidding you. I watched a video on myspace and just started doing it. The pic you see is the 3rd one I've made and the 2nd made from powerpro.

The cracker is fraying out really well and the frayed part is really soft. It seems to take more time because each strand is braided. I was out cracking the whip earlier and I was wearing shorts. I was trying a new crack and experimenting and I hit my calf. It didn't really hurt at all and I was suprized I didn't see a huge red welt. I'll take pics of the cracker tomorrow to show how it's breaking in.

Cracker · Post by **Cracker** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 10:32 pm

Has anyone ever done this??

No, but now I'm gonna

rjallen70 · Post by **rjallen70** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:17 pm

Yeah braided fishing line is soft...yet very durable. I am going to try it myself.
R

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:26 pm

Awesome guys!!! Maybe I'll start a revolution!!!!!

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:00 am

I remember watching a martial arts video some years ago featuring a well-renowned Practicioner (think it may have been Tom Meadows)...It was all about using the whip in a defensive mode. To this day, my best friend and I repeat his response to the fact that some people have put piano wire on the end of a whip:

"You WILL cut your G-d D-mn ear off...."

...Truly, words to live by....

purewhips · Post by **purewhips** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:42 pm

These were the first crackers I was using when I was starting out making whips about 6 years ago.

They were really loud and durable. But I must have cut through at least 3 or 4 falls. Good stuff.

Gus Caicedo Jr.
www.purewhips.com

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:35 pm

purewhips wrote:These were the first crackers I was using when I was starting out making whips about 6 years ago. They were really loud and durable. But I must have cut through at least 3 or 4 falls. Good stuff.

Gus Caicedo Jr.

www.purewhips.com

I think it depends on how you tie the cracker on. I'll keep yall updated and I'm still gonna post pics later of how the cracker is fraying out.

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 5:24 pm

Here are the pics of how the power pro cracker is fraying. It's very soft and I really doubt it's gonna hurt my whip.

bluzharp · Post by **bluzharp** » Mon Mar 31, 2008 9:59 pm

Very cool! I'm always fascinated about what kind of materials produce different cracks. I make mine from home depot masonry twine, and it produces a good crack. I usually get about 50 - 75 good cracks before the popper frays to nothing.

I'm going to try this new stuff! BTW, I've been using Joe Strains measurements from his polyprop crackers; 9 in. total length, with appx. 3 in. from knot to end of fluff. Seems to work well for me on my Strain 8 footer.

Tim

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 4:09 pm

Good stuff!! I used Joes crackers as my guide for length too. This one came out a tad shorter but it cracks great.....No proplems yet.

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Wed Apr 09, 2008 8:35 am

I'm trying this with 65lb. Powerpro....And I also picked up some Berkley Gorilla braided line in 80lb. to try...Pix and results to follow.....

Always wondered about using Kevlar or Spectra for crackers, but I didn't know this stuff was available in stores! I've been talking about this for years....Now I get to try it!

thefish · Post by **thefish** » Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:03 pm

I've used kevlar bowstring material, and while the cracks are very bright and sharp from them, they don't BOOM the way nylon and polypro do.

They also have a tendency of really biting into the leather of the fall, and when they go flying off, they take bits of your fall with them.

THey also don't last quite as long as you'd think they would.

But if you're target cutting, they'll cut right through cucumbers! (but bear in mind, that also means that they'll cut right through your ear, or chin, or your partner's fingers...)

Price for performance, I don't really think they're worth it. Those Powerpro ones however look pretty rugged!

-Dan

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:14 pm

thefish wrote: they don't BOOM the way nylon and polypro do.

They also have a tendency of really biting into the leather of the fall, and when they go flying off, they take bits of your fall with them.

THey also don't last quite as long as you'd think they would.

-Dan

Thats not my experience so far.....I've found the best combo for me that ends up being the same thinckness as a my strain crackers. It hasnt cut through my fall yet, it cracks louder than my poly cracker and it's holding up too well.....I say too well because it's not fraying out fast enough...lol.

I've recently made another that is a little thicker than the one pictured. I put it on my my 10 foot roo and it crack LOUD!! I like it.

The expense is worth it too me...If it takes 5X longer (maybe more) to wear out then I think we're on to something. A spool of power pro is like 15.00. I'm not sure how many crackers you can get out of one spool though.

As far as using the 60lb powerpro. I tend to think thats too thinck. The thicker it gets the more ridged it gets. I tend to use the thinner sizes but with more strands. It's softer that way I think.

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:29 pm

Yeah, I'd agree...

I just got back from testing my Powerpro... Used 10 strands of 65lb. test...Cracks are bright and sharp, and it seems to take an eternity to break it in...But it cuts like buttah....Still like the noise the nylon twine makes, though...Yeah, the 'Boom' ain't there yet, but the Spectra is just breaking in....Barely even fraying yet...I'll have to see how it works out.

I've got to make one out of that braided Gorilla line next...Then maybe i'll post pictures.

Update: Man, this stuff may be the winner. It's made from 'Dyneema', which is identical in structure to Spectra...But it's totally soft like silk, unlike the Powerpro. I'm making crackers out of three or four strands of the stuff in 80 lb. test. Think I'll use it for normal tips---And the Powerpro for hardcore cutting. I'm still testing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra_high ... lyethylene

I'm really liking the Gorilla line cracker, man...

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 4:42 am

AWESOME!! I'd like to see pics if you have em...How many stands of the 80 did you use? I used 8lb diamiter 30lb test power pro...Its a bit softer. The moss coloured power pro is a bit stiffer because of the colouring. I actually took mine directly off of one of my reels so it was good and broken in...lol Much of the color wears off and it gets greyish when you fish with it....Gets softer too.

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 8:49 am

I used both 3 and 4 strands of the soft Gorilla braided line. The 3-strand configuration ends up making a cracker about the same diameter as the heavy nylon twine I make my 'Regular' crackers out of. The 4-strand config comes out a little thicker, and I'm gonna try it to see how it cracks as opposed to the (installed) smaller one.

My next Powerpro was made with 15 strands instead of 10. The 65# line seems just as flexible as any other, as it is made up of fibers just like the 30# (just more of them)....Yes, the moss green is bonded to keep it from backlashing, but It's softening up nicely... It's definitely apparent that the Powerpro crackers take a while to break in...While the Gorillas are ready just as quick or quicker than Nylon....Like I said, I'm really taken by these crackers...The stuff is softer than Nylon, but wears like Spectra....

Also, I'm shortening my crackers---these are coming out too long at around 11-12 inches. This from a strand length of 30". 24" for a strand length is working well now.

As promised, a photo:
At the top is regular nylon, Heavyweight Masonry twine.

Next up is the 10x65# Powerpro, just breaking in.

After that is the 4x80# Gorilla line, not yet cracked.

lastly, the 3x80# Gorilla, breaking in nicely....

http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj73 ... kersSM.jpg

I'd love to post audio comparisons with the different crackers, but I don't have anywhere to host it....

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 12:02 pm

Awesome bro!!Thanks for the pics......I'm gonna have to try the gorilla braid soon for comparison. Grood idea on that one.....Maybe we can start a new trend and make this the norm.

thefish · Post by **thefish** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 12:43 pm

Vegeta wrote: Thats not my experience so far.....I've found the best combo for me that ends up being the same thinckness as a my strain crackers. It hasnt cut through my fall yet, it cracks louder than my poly cracker and it's holding up too well.....I say too well because it's not fraying out fast enough...lol.

I've recently made another that is a little thicker than the one pictured. I put it on my my 10 foot roo and it crack LOUD!! I like it.

Since I stopped using the kevlar poppers, I've also changed how I make them. If I did them how I'm currently doing my nylon upholstery thread, they'd probably work much better. Plus, material-wise, the stuff that PB's using looks a lot more suitable than what I've been doing. I might have to give it another shot sometime soon.

-Dan

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 2:44 pm

More update...

OK, I tried the 15-strand Powerpro versus the 4-strand Gorilla, and here are my impressions:

First, pulling the 3-strand Gorilla cracker off the end of the 12' nylon i'm using to test, I found yet another plus for the Gorilla crackers: I was actually able to take the thing off with my bare hands!!! That's right. I use a self-tightening knot for my crackers, and I either have to cut them off or use pliers to loosen the knot. In this case, I was able to fairly easily get it off with just a tug or two with my fingernails...And I haven't noticed that it's had a tendency to want to slip off in use.

I attached the 15-strand Powerpro and headed to the backyard. It performed very well, cutting hard targets with ease. I could get some nice cracks out of it, but yet again it takes forever-and-a-day for these crackers to break in...I barely had 'fluff' at all at the end of the session.

In taking the Powerpro cracker off, I DEFINTELY had to use pliers....

I then attached the 4-strand Gorilla cracker. Again in the backyard, I was amazed at how well these things work. I had a nice, full fluff after just a few cracks, and the cracks themselves were nice and full-bodied. The only thing I've noticed about the Gorilla line that could be a negative is that Berkley (who makes the line) puts a green polyester tracer filament in it ---which frays MUCH faster than the Dyneema body. This isn't necessarily a dealbreaker, but I'll have to see what happens to this thing after another week or two of good use.

I'm keeping this one on as my standard, unless I decide to do some hardcore cutting. The Powerpros will definitely go with me in my whip bag, though...Those things look like they'll last forever....

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 4:26 pm

Good stuff man!! Great tests and input for sure!! I see you make your crackers a bit different than I do. I dont know if that makes a difference or not in how they preform. Either way....I'm definatetly gonna try different combos of the gorrilla braid.

I tend to lean toward the thinner suff and use about 10-12 strands for a total of 20-24 total strands when done.

I use this method I learned from this vid to make my crackers http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fusea ... ID=5787754

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 4:30 pm

I just noticed you live in tampa!! I live in St. Pete!! We're like 30 mins or less away from eachother.

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 4:43 pm

I thought you knew that...I posted it in the reply of another topic!

...Do you go to the whip enthusiasts meet? They're in like seminole or something...Your neck of the woods....

I was totally making them a different way....Your way looks much easier. Always wondered what the hook on the swiss army knife was for---Now I know!!!

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 6:30 pm

You're right...I remember now. I used to get the updates for those meets but I took myself off of the email list. I wanna start going but I couldn't find the site again.

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 7:43 pm

It's WWW.TBWE.net ...Last time I was there, it hadn't been updated in a long time, but the meeting info was still current...They've been meeting in the same spot on the same day for years....

I haven't been in a few months, but i'm trying to get out there for their next meeting on the 20th. If not then, I'm absolutely a lock to go on May 18th, the week of the premiere....

Come to think of it, they usually do some sort of pioneer/heritage event that weekend---on Saturday---so that meeting is usually not very full....But I'm going anyway...Oughtta see if I can hit the Pioneer thing, too... Whip-stravaganza!

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:27 am

Ah. It looks like even though the site is still there, it's been woefully neglected---not updated in years, and the buttons don't work.

Here's the link to the Yahoo forum that's more current....

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TBWE/

You'll find info on meetings and such...But you have to join to see it, I think...

They meet the 3rd sunday in Lake Seminole Park, 11-1 or so...

Vegeta · Post by **Vegeta** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 10:13 am

Awesome.. Thanks for the links bro.... How are the crackers holding up??

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 11:39 am

So far, so good...think I'm keeping the 4x80 Gorilla on to do in-depth testing....May become my cracker of choice!

I'm gonna try to make it next Sunday out at Lake Seminole park...You oughtta go. I'm also hoping to have my 10' done by then...Of course, i'd have to start it first...

Lucky1406 · Post by **Lucky1406** » Tue May 13, 2008 7:55 pm

Where did you buy your gorilla line? I can't find it at any store in my area, and everyone is sold out of the 80lb on-line. Can you recommend anywhere that has some for sale? Or could I buy some from you perhaps? thanks,
Nick

PyramidBlaster · Post by **PyramidBlaster** » Wed May 21, 2008 2:16 pm

Actually, I'm still on the fence. There's one more major difference I've noticed in comparing the PowerPro and Gorilla Line crackers: the Gorilla line is 'Sticky'...

What I mean is, I do a lot of 'tree-trimming' as target practice. The Gorilla line has the tendency to stick to branches and not come loose---Or, stick to the whip itself...It then has to be dislodged by hand. The PowerPro crackers, on the other hand, are very tangle-free.

I'd say try Wal-Mart Supercenter, or any sort of sporting goods store--Sports Authority, Di<k's sports, or Academy come to mind.... Then try online retailers like Outdoor World/Basspro or Cabelas, if that fails...PowerPro seems easier to find than the Gorilla line.