Bapty & Stembridge Acquired! - What about the Webley?

Indiana Bond · Post by **Indiana Bond** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:25 pm

Great news that the 2 original S&W's revolvers known as the Bapty & Stembridge have been acquired by forum members. Congrats and thanks for sharing the great detaled photos!!

The question now is who has the original Webley WG that was used in "Last Crusade"? Could it be that the Webley WG shown in the latest "Crystal Skull" photo from Paramount is the same one that was used in "Last Crusade"?

Anybody know? Any comments?

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 3:40 pm

supposedly, it is still at bapty according to this pic:

http://www.longmountain.com/movieguns/Raiders

Jaredraptor · Post by **Jaredraptor** » Mon Dec 03, 2007 9:17 pm

Indiana G wrote:supposedly, it is still at bapty according to this pic:

http://www.longmountain.com/movieguns/Raiders

It also says that's the gun used in Raiders and ToD

That's probably just poor research though. I have no major doubt that that's the LC Webley.

Dostacos · Post by **Dostacos** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:10 am

cannot wait for the new movie as it looks like he is carrying a stock 5inch barrel and it looks NEW. with little or no loss of bluing so [after selling off other guns

] I can get a new 1917 S&W $\:D/$ $\:D/$

McFly · Post by **McFly** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:21 am

Aren't the Webley MkVI (LC) and the Webley WG (CS) different guns? Or are they the same gun with different names?

Also, Webley .455? He never used one of those!! ...did he? Certainly not in the first two films - and I think only the MkVI was in LC.

Shane

djd · Post by **djd** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:25 am

Indiana G wrote:supposedly, it is still at bapty according to this pic:

http://www.longmountain.com/movieguns/Raiders

That's never the LC gun is it?! It looks like the same model as used in CS but the LC Mark VI has a completely different shaped grip. It's just not the same gun at all!

McFly · Post by **McFly** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:32 am

Thought so!

I thought I was going crazy for a second. I KNEW it wasn't in Raiders or Temple, but thought to myself, "That was never in LC either... ...right...?"

Thanks for bolstering my near certainty.

Shane

dr. tyree · Post by **dr. tyree** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:42 am

The WG is definitely the gun in LC, guys. You can see the bird's head grip in a couple of places if you look closely. On the beach when Indy snatches it out of his waistband and realizes it's empty before Henry downs the plane with a flock of birds, and in the Grail temple when the good guys are captured. Indy has his hands up, gun dangling from one finger. Check it out.

djd · Post by **djd** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:52 am

I've never noticed that....? The gear section says it's the non birds head type... Confused now

The Raider net says this is the actual MKVI http://www.theraider.net/showimage.php? ... ver_01.jpg
This looks like the gun above rather than the birdshead type to me...
http://www.theraider.net/showimage.php? ... ver_04.jpg

graal · Post by **graal** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:04 am

http://www.jones-jr.com/cost_armes.html

djd · Post by **djd** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:18 am

Thanks! That's a great site. So is there any scene where it is a MkVI for sure?

Indiana Bond · Post by **Indiana Bond** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 2:38 pm

The Webley WG is the only gun used in "Last Crusade". The MK VI never appears. The Webley WG is also the gun that Indy is holding in the new photo for "Crystal Skull". Check out my posts here to see comparison pictures.

viewtopic.php?t=24838

Also just received my Webley WG today. It's sitting right next to my computer as I type this. Having it in my hand and comparing it to all the shots in "Last Crusade" I can possitively confirm that Indy's gun is the Webley WG!!! It is truely a MAGNIFICENT piece!!

McFly · Post by **McFly** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 3:24 pm

Wow...

I've been wrong for a long time... serves me right for not being a LC guy and then thinking I knew what I was talking about.

Shane

Post by **Michaelson** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 4:07 pm

Bear in mind, most of the information gained in the past have come from conversations, separate research, and articles written on the subject in various locations. This was before the era of high definition frame grabs and the like.

Even Guns and Ammo magazine identified the revolver in LC as a Webley MK VI rather than the WG in their Q&A section back in 1989. (I still have copies of the article). That also stated the only revolver used in Temple of Doom was a Colt New Service. Truth was, the Colt was a rubber 'stunt double' that was tossed out the car window and seen bouncing off the side of the door.

Lots of things are being corrected as we go along, but it was the best information we had at the time.

Regards! Michaelson

Indiana Bond · Post by **Indiana Bond** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 8:57 pm

So back to the question at hand, is there a way to find out if the WG used in CS was the same one used in LC? Who has the gun now that they have finished filming?

Any Ideas?

djd · Post by **djd** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 3:50 am

Bother! So now I need a new replica Webley for my holster!

Curator Rick · Post by **Curator Rick** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 11:09 pm

The Webley in Last Crusade was supplied by Bapty as filming took place in England and Tunisia. Since Crystal Skull was filmed in the States it is highly unlikely that the revolver was rented from Bapty, but more likely from one of the Armories in California. So the odds of it being the same Webley for both movies is very, very slim.

Also to clear up a possible bit of confusion. There was a Webley used in Temple of Doom. It is a nickel plated Mk. III used by Chen to shoot Wu Han during the cork popping scene in Club Obi Wan. I have that very pistol purchased from Bapty with the CoA from them as to its use.

Indiana Bond · Post by **Indiana Bond** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 4:50 am

Great the actual Temple of Doom Webley MKIII !!! What caliber and do you have any photos to share? Would love to see what you got!

graal · Post by **graal** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 7:18 am

http://www.propstore.com/img/products/7 ... olDVD1.jpg
http://www.propstore.com/img/products/7 ... ol11WM.jpg
http://www.propstore.com/img/products/7 ... ol12WM.jpg
http://www.propstore.com/img/products/7 ... ol2-WM.jpg
http://www.propstore.com/img/products/7 ... tol3WM.jpg
http://www.propstore.com/img/products/7 ... tol5WM.jpg

Curator Rick · Post by **Curator Rick** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 7:27 am

Thanks GraaL, ya beat me to it.

Bink and I are getting together shortly to do a photo shoot of about 20 screen used props and I'll post more detailed photos of the Webley III in a separate thread so it can be "stickied"

By the way, it is .38 cal.

CR

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 8:32 am

CR and I were also talking last night that with export laws and such, the Bapty Webley would have to be deactivated in order to leave the UK for the US or most other countries, or if they were to sell it. If you look at the Bapty S&W, you'll notice a strange ring inside the chambers. When they deactivate the pistol, they weld this into the chambers, making it impossible to load the gun with anything:

The LC Webley would receive the same treatment if they were to try to bring it to the US for filming, making it useless for anything other than a display piece. Because of this, I am pretty confident that the Webley seen in IJ4 is a completely different gun.

tnitz · Post by **tnitz** » Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:25 pm

Just got added to forum! Thanks.

Ironically, I had just watched LOC the night before I saw this entry a couple weeks ago and had noticed, for the first time, that Indy was NOT using a Mk VI as everyone once thought. I actually suspected it was one of the Naval versions of the Mk I that had 5 inch barrels, but found that you all had already figured out that it was a civilian model.

I am not sure that this has come up before, but long ago I noticed that the last three digits of the serial number appear on the rear of the cylinder of Indy's Webley in the scene on the beach. This means that Indy's revolver in that scene remained in .455 configuration not cut for .45 ACP or AR. This, of course, makes sense and is what I suspected since there was no reason to cut a revolver that stayed in England. The cutting was typically done when imported into US. All of my .455 Webleys are so cut, but you can actually find both cut and uncut here in the states if you are patient. I can't quite make out the numbers, but I think they are something like "624" or something.

As for the new revolver in Crystal Skull, I haven't looked at it close enough. If a birdshead, then it is either another civilian model or a naval version of the Mk I, I*, or II, that came with 5" barrel. I've never actually seen on of those, but I would guess that the front sight will be the easiest way to figure it out from screen shots or stills. Also, the military revolvers had black scales, while the civilian models often had brown. The standard and common MK I and II has 4" barrels.