The Ultimate Raiders Fedora?

ANZAC_1915 · Post by **ANZAC_1915** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 6:16 pm

Has this been discussed before?

I know AB will reblock and "AB-ize" a HJ --- what if either AB licensed the HJ name from SAB - or would take a HJ lining and sew it into an AB?

Then you'd have the top quality felt/block/cut/shape and the HJ lining.

(Some will say "what's the point"...)

agent5 · Post by **agent5** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:37 pm

What's the point?

ANZAC_1915 · Post by **ANZAC_1915** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:44 pm

....screen accurate lining, although I guess you never see the HJ logo clearly.

Castor Dioscuri · Post by **Castor Dioscuri** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 7:44 pm

I'm not sure I like the idea... I mean, just having the label there for the sake of having the label sounds like a cop-out to me. You either get a HJ, or you get an AB. Don't take this the wrong way, but pasting a HJ label on an AB makes it look as though you're ashamed of the AB label in a way.

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 8:00 pm

no CD, we're just ashamed of the HJ's resilience

i've pondered this many o times believe me. my ultimate raiders fedora comes in a box from steve delk.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 9:43 pm

That would be a insult to Mr. Delk.

eazybox · Post by **eazybox** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:01 pm

I think the only way to accomplish what you are suggesting is to buy both an AB and an HJ-- or, if you are willing to compromise some quality for the original name, go with Magnoli's HJ. But you can't have it both ways in the same hat.

fatwoul · Post by **fatwoul** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:16 pm

- - -

eazybox · Post by **eazybox** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:27 pm

It just seems to me as though you'd be almost attempting to deceive people (or yourself) for no good reason-- why bother?

Jack

fatwoul · Post by **fatwoul** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:33 pm

- - -

eazybox · Post by **eazybox** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:39 pm

It's unfortunate what has become of HJ; the vintage ones are SUPER hats! I think that's one reason why so many people are reluctant to let go of the name.

Jack

eazybox · Post by **eazybox** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:57 pm

Aeris_Canon wrote:Yeah, you can never go back.

If you're thinking, "####, Aeris, get some sleep." I can't argue.[/sTize]

That's one incredible hat. I hope my Magnoli HJ looks as good when it arrives.

Jack

agent5 · Post by **agent5** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 11:20 pm

Where'd you get that HJ, AC?

fatwoul · Post by **fatwoul** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 11:33 pm

- - -

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sat Sep 01, 2007 11:51 pm

Anyone who wants to own a todd HJ . A Authentic gear, please let me know. I will be more than happy to sell mine.

GCR · Post by **GCR** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 12:28 am

Aeris_Canon wrote:Yeah, you can never go back.

If you're thinking, "####, Aeris, get some sleep." I can't argue.

No doubt about it, that is STILL one of the best looking HJ's I've ever seen!

Jimmy did a fine job on the reblock, and of course your skills getting a Raiders bash out of a hat are the stuff of legends, AC.

AC with that awesome HJ wrote:In terms of money versus quality? The HJ is an overpriced hat for what's available from the fine vendors out there today.

Exactly. That's been my biggest complaint with the HJ ever since I found out what the heck an HJ was and what it cost to own one. Even the bargain you get from buying one through Todd still doesn't seem on par with the overall quality of the hat, from what I understand. Again, not having an HJ of my own, I wouldn't know for sure, but based on several firsthand accounts that I've heard over the years, they are indeed vastly overpriced considering the quality of the materials and construction. If these HJ's were priced in the same range as other rabbit felt hats like the Feds or Stetsons, I'd probably own 5 or 6 by now.

-GCR

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 1:24 am

Aeris_Canon wrote:Yeah, I've got an AB for sale too. Don't think it's the namebrand so much as who's done what with it.

I'm sorry, i don't understand???

GCR, very well said.

ydam · Post by **ydam** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 1:38 pm

great lid aeris!!! I have to say i am pleased with my HJ. My first was an SAB (still my favorite...if i could just change out this light colored band it would be perfect). I also own an AB and Todd's HJ. IMO HJ's are the only way to go and Aeris's fedora just reinforces why i think they are.

ANZAC_1915 · Post by **ANZAC_1915** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:27 pm

To amplify on my reasoning a bit, this thread here got me thinking. All that re-work to make a HJ into a decent lid, and then still with the questions around the material.

Ah you say, well just buy an AB.

Then I saw this comment from Fedora in that thread:

Fedora wrote:The magic of the name is important to many of us, as that was indeed the brand Indy wore. Sure, it will never be the sort of quality hat that one would get from a pure beaver body, but if the hat is more durable and looks more accurate than the current HJs, many people will buy one.

thePawn · Post by **thePawn** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:31 pm

The best hat for a Raiders lid is a HJ. I think Fedora would agree as it has the best felt to make that floppy Cairo look.

GCR · Post by **GCR** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 10:08 pm

thePawn wrote:The best hat for a Raiders lid is a HJ.

Interesting perspective. Do you have one? Any pics?

-GCR

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 10:37 pm

If you get a good HJ, yes, but that's precisely the problem: HJ's are over-priced to begin with, but when you throw into the mix the fact that you aren't even assured that what you're getting will be able to handle what you throw at it (or even look the part for that matter) it's just not worth going for it, IMHO. :junior: -IJ

thePawn · Post by **thePawn** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 10:51 pm

I'll take some photos along with my Optimo for another thread tomorrow. I ordered a HJ from Todd's and was so impressed that I ordered another one. I'm going to bash the first one and distress it to look like the Cairo hat on screen, dusty etc....

I'm pretty picky when it comes to screen accurate felt. Before I ordered the two HJ, my favorite Raiders hat was a vintage Mercury Indy but its way too expensive to distress.

The Raiders hat has to be floppy, that's why its appearance keeps changing on screen. So far, the HJ has satisfied my needs for that look, but others may disagree. I'm waiting on my AB so I will be able to compare those also. I don't own a Federation so I can't comment on the felt quality.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:09 pm

AC, do you have any other pics of that hat?

GCR · Post by **GCR** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:38 pm

Aeris_Canon wrote:As in? What? The many ways it looks on? The instances where it looks worse than usual? In a state of being? Or in a pristine Raiders condition? What are you looking for in particular, Oak? I have a couple of different pics of it.

I'd like to see some pics of that HJ, specifically pics where the camera is exactly 2.75 meters away from the hat, and raised to a height of 6 feet, 5 inches. The hat should be positioned exactly 6 feet from the ground, in normal daylight, between 11 AM and 1 PM on any day between June 1st and October 1st, with the hat facing due West, and the camera facing North by Northeast. Head angle while wearing the hat should be precisely 42.8 degrees.

Have any pics like that?

Seriously though...I'd just like to see ANY old pics of the HJ of yours. That is definitely one of the "good ones".

thePawn wrote:I'm pretty picky when it comes to screen accurate felt

Screen accurate felt, eh? I'm curious as to what constitutes SA felt. Texture? Composition? Floppiness? Thickness? The way it responds to poking and prodding? Some combination of those five?

-GCR

ydam · Post by **ydam** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:42 pm

GCR wrote: I'd like to see some pics of that HJ, specifically pics where the camera is exactly 2.75 meters away from the hat, and raised to a height of 6 feet, 5 inches. The hat should be positioned exactly 6 feet from the ground, in normal daylight, between 11 AM and 1 PM on any day between June 1st and October 1st, with the hat facing due West, and the camera facing North by Northeast. Head angle while wearing the hat should be precisely 42.8 degrees.

Have any pics like that?

-GCR

LOL...ummmm...what he said

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:51 pm

wow, AC. Did I say anything to tick you off? I like to see how the hat looks from the side and maybe the back. I like to see how deep the top center crease is. The hat looks great no doupt about it. I would like to see it from different angles that all. Maybe from the same photo shoot.

fishmeok · Post by **fishmeok** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:18 am

ARRGH! you guys kill me. Every time I think I have my hat just right I see a pic of someone who has a better bash- then I have to spend half an hour re-shaping and fiddling with mine...
Cheers
Mark

Dr.Seuss · Post by **Dr.Seuss** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:52 am

fishmeok wrote:ARRGH! you guys kill me. Every time I think I have my hat just right I see a pic of someone who has a better bash- then I have to spend half an hour re-shaping and fiddling with mine...
Cheers Mark

Back to the drawing board...........

Much better...................

Sincerely,

Marc · Post by **Marc** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:03 am

The best hat for a Raiders lid is a HJ. I think Fedora would agree as it has the best felt to make that floppy Cairo look.

If you're talking about a vintage HJ, blocked on THE block, I'd aggree. Otherwise I can't, as all that the modern HJs have in common with what was used back then, is the name (and yes, I do have vintage HJs from the Raiders era).

There are MANY other hats out there, that will become just as floppy over time.

Regards,

Marc

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:30 am

If you're talking about a vintage HJ, blocked on THE block, I'd aggree. Otherwise I can't, as all that the modern HJs have in common with what was used back then, is the name (and yes, I do have vintage HJs from the Raiders era).

There are MANY other hats out there, that will become just as floppy over time.

Regards,

Marc[/quote]

Thank you Marc.

Fedora · Post by **Fedora** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:35 am

If you're talking about a vintage HJ, blocked on THE block, I'd aggree. Otherwise I can't, as all that the modern HJs have in common with what was used back then, is the name (and yes, I do have vintage HJs from the Raiders era).

Marc and I have always seen the HJs in exactly the same way. That should come as no surprise!!

Since we tend to be very anal here(I hate that word, and wish someone could tell me another word that "fit" so I would not have to use it.) let's get down to hard facts of analism.

The current HJ share with the original Raiders fedora only one thing. The name "Herbert Johnson" that is on the sweat. Now, what does it NOT share in common with the original hat. Take a peek.

1) Sweatband, leather and construction
2) Liner, material used
3) Hatter's crest
4) felt
5) same cut dimensional brim
6) ribbon and bow construction
7) block shape

And last but not least, the man who made the hat .

If you want a REAL Raiders HJ, you are gonna have to buy one from the era of Raiders. They are rare.

The current SAB is not the same company that the original hat came from. In the same way that an authenic Stetson, made by Stetson, has to be found on ebay, as Hatco is only using the Stetson name on their hats. And like the current HJ, this is the only tie that there is with the original.

But, to some, the name is very important, and I understand that. But take that newly blocked Raiders HJ, and wear it like Indy did, instead of as a dress up costume item. And then show us the pics. We would not be very impressed. Most folks want real hats. The HJ does not qualify. But it does make a dandy costume piece, perfect for pics in your front yard or Halloween. The choice of a hat really depends upon what you are gonna use it for. Just like any clothing item. For the backpackers here, that have been schooled in what to wear and what not to wear on a weeks backpacking trek into the wilderness, you guys know what I am talking about. You don't take a knife to a gunfight. Fedora

Dr.Seuss · Post by **Dr.Seuss** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:48 am

Fedora wrote:* * *Since we tend to be very anal here(I hate that word, and wish someone could tell me another word that "fit" so I would not have to use it.) let's get down to hard facts of analism.

I prefer, "fastidious" or "persnickety."

Sincerely,

Fedora · Post by **Fedora** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 11:58 am

There are MANY other hats out there, that will become just as floppy over time.

We mainly pay attention to the floppiness of the Raiders film hat. But, all hats in that film were not as floppy as some of the others. Costumers tend to take their hat supplies with them. The original HJ may not have been as floppy out of the box as we see it on the film. They aged the hat, by crushing it up, thereby breaking down the what stiffener was in the hat from the factory. In some scenes, I suspect they added stiffener back to the brim. They really do monkey with these hats during filming. The hat worn at the beginning of Raiders, the scenes filmed in Hawaii, and the last scenes to be filmed overall, you can tell they put a new HJ on Indy's head for outside of the temple scenes. Looks brand new, with little aging, if any. That hat looks stiffer than the SOC hat, and probably was. Regards, Fedora

GCR · Post by **GCR** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 4:12 pm

Aeris_Canon wrote: As soon as the HJ is mentioned, the first thing everyone does is jump on it and proclaim that so and so brand is far better. Wait!
They are. No one's disputing the quality of an Hj in comparison, but let's say someone - for whatever reason - decided to buy an HJ just for the heck of it. Maybe they like that cheap, rabbit felt, maybe they just want the HJ name thing, or perhaps the other hats that were supposed to end it all just didn't live up to their hype; whatever. Maybe they know - and they should - that a brand new HJ from the factory is going to be tapered, machine made, wrong bow, etc., and still want one.

I personally can't blame anyone for wanting one, as I've thought a lot about getting one myself over the years...just because. I will admit, it was the high price tag and constant reports of taper and poor quality craftsmanship that scared me off everytime. Despite all that, I still have an urge to get one someday.

Aeris_Canon wrote:The only thing left was a reblock at that point. But what I am saying is, after getting it back, and looking a bit better, it has not shrunken, tapered, or dissolved the way I thought it was supposed to. How is this one HJ out of the whole lot the only hat to look right? Am I that lucky? Because they're supposed to be horrible.

I honestly think a lot of the reason why you've had luck with your HJ might just be the size of the thing. You've got a hatsize south of 7 1/4, if I remember correctly, right? It's been speculated that HJ just mechanically stretches felt bodies out to make a larger hat size, rather than using a larger rawbody. That is also one of the possible reasons some HJ's shrink the way they do. Essentially (according to this theory) HJ would use let's say a 7 1/4 body to make a 7 3/8 hat, by stretching it out. Thus, that 7 3/8 hat will want to shrink back to that 7 1/4 size. But in your case, AC, your hat size being what it is, perhaps there isn't much, if any, stretching of the body, so the felt is more stable and doesn't feel the need to shrink? Just a theory (this would also explain why your brim seems very well proportioned compared to ydam's size 61 HJ). I honestly think hatsize is a MAJOR factor in getting a certain look out of a hat. Take the JPD, for example. As hard as I tried, I could only get a halfway decent Raiders look out of that hat. Yours, on the other hand, looked spectacular. I know you can bash a hat with the best of 'em, but I don't consider myself a slouch in that area, either. I just think Jimmy's blockshape was better suited to your hatsize and faceshape. But anyways, we're talking HJ's here...

And I know some of you are doing your best to get people to see the AB Deluxe.

Guilty...it's no secret Marc's hats are MY personal favorite, and the closest one can get to the Raiders hat, in my opinion.

But the determination in steering them toward hating their own hat is a bit excessive.

No clue what that means. I have no issue with people liking or hating their hats. My main issue is when folks tend to group the two AB's together into one category, despite the fact that they are completely different hats. I also take issue when folks play up a certain brand or item as being "the best" without consideration as to how it might be used or what needs to go into it to get it that way.

You guys have put a lot of work into finding a good Raiders hat, have come up with several other brands, but have generally been unsuccessful with the HJs. And again, straight from the factory, they're going to need work. They are not the best hat for the money, or the best felt, but some might like, or want them, anyway.

And more power to ya!

"Well yeah, but for real adventure, you'd want to wear a - "
For real adventure you'd want to wear anything other than a fedora to begin with.* If we're stepping that far into the real world sensibility of hiking, camping, Nazi chasing and idol seeking. Whether you wear one for costume or backyard pics or for rock climbing, if it's hot enough, you'll still pour sweat into 'em (and if you're not, you're probably not being as adventurous as you think out there in the wilderness with that tougher felt) In some cases, that lighter, cheaper felt may be much more comfortable.

A fedora for adventure is a fictional hat.

(* emphasis added)

Now you're really reaching. Sorry, but I doubt anyone around these parts is on their way out to battle Nazis or outrun boulders or get dragged behind a 5 ton truck. Granted, doing those things while wearing a fedora ISN'T very realistic, but wearing a fedora on the hiking trails, out camping, or doing any other sort of outdoor activity is certainly no stretch. I'm certianly surprised you feel that way. Anyways, some folks just want to wear a fedora because we like it. And we want one that looks like that cool hat we saw our favorite adventurer wear in Raiders. And we want to wear it the way it was meant to be worn. Sun, rain, snow. Out in the field and with a suit to the office. And we don't want to have to turn around and send it for a reblock every other week. That's why I gave up on rabbit felt, despite the fact that the Raiders hat was rabbit. It just didn't get the job done. And the barely imperceptable difference in texture between beaver and rabbit fur doesn't bother me. The fact that my ABD might not be quite as floppy as the Raiders hat was in some scenes does not bother me either. The felt is very pliable and can give me a lot of the same little "dings and dents" as the Raiders hat had in certain scenes.

A fedora for adventure is a fictional hat.

Anyways, what is the difference between a fur felt fedora and a fur felt cowboy hat? Or a fur felt slouch hat? Or campaign hat? What is it that makes the fedora such a NON-adventure hat, in your opinion?

Anyways, AC, you make good points. Perhaps the HJ is villified a bit around these parts. It certainly does seem that with the right TLC, and a lot of work, it can be a viable option for a good Raiders after all. I certainly don't fault anyone for liking the HJ, but for those of us who wear our hats day in and day out, can you blame us for being just a bit leery?

-GCR

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 4:38 pm

Now, I would believe all that had I not had one sent to me. (Yes, the one, lucky HJ out of the whole lot that started off just as cruddy, rated as horrible by the originial owner and tossed away.) The only thing left was a reblock at that point. But what I am saying is, after getting it back, and looking a bit better, it has not shrunken, tapered, or dissolved the way I thought it was supposed to. How is this one HJ out of the whole lot the only hat to look right? Am I that lucky? Because they're supposed to be horrible.

My understanding is it was a gift not tossed away.

How about those other pics?

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 5:21 pm

yes it does. thanks for clearing this up. You nade it sound like it was going to tossed into the trash.

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:45 pm

I still like to see some other pics of it. I'll post some pics of the whip that John sent me.

fatwoul · Post by **fatwoul** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 6:50 pm

- - -

GCR · Post by **GCR** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 7:39 pm

Canon- I'd still like to see more pics of that HJ, too.

aeris_canon wrote:A fedora for adventure is a fictional hat.

GCR wrote:What is it that makes the fedora such a NON-adventure hat, in your opinion?

Still curious about your answer on this one. A statement like that sort of conflicts with certain fundamental basics of this hobby. It almost sounds more like the sort of argument someone would make who is afraid to wear their hat on an adventure.

Anyways, about those pics...

-GCR

G-MANN · Post by **G-MANN** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 7:47 pm

If I had know that HJ was going to cause such a ruckus I would have just sent it to the Marx Brothers

G-MANN

Mulceber · Post by **Mulceber** » Mon Sep 03, 2007 8:46 pm

A fedora for adventure is a fictional hat.

BS. If that were true, cowboys would never have been famous for wearing ten-gallon hats. True, those aren't technically fedoras, but for the intents and purposes of your argument, they might as well be (ie. people sweat just as much in a cowboy hat as in a fedora). If you think the purpose of wearing a fedora on an adventure is to keep cool, then you must have gotten heat stroke while we weren't looking.

Sweating never caused melanoma, but sun burn does, and that's what the fedora's supposed to protect you from when you're out there in all that heat. True, you could wear a straw hat, but from what I hear, those tear REALLY easily when they get wet.

If you're talking before the days of the cotton hats and the like that some rock climbers and adventurers wear these days, a Fedora (or cowboy hat) is really your only choice. :junior: -IJ

Fedora · Post by **Fedora** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 3:00 pm

So which is it? The HJ felt today does or does not move around like the old vintage stuff? That opinion seems to change depending on the thread and which way the amount of interest is generated

Yeah, if you get it from Todd or Magnoli, you get the softer felt that mimics the Raiders look better, at least the SOC hat. Softer felt tends to droop more.

Now, I would believe all that had I not had one sent to me. (Yes, the one, lucky HJ out of the whole lot that started off just as cruddy, rated as horrible by the originial owner and tossed away.) The only thing left was a reblock at that point. But what I am saying is, after getting it back, and looking a bit better, it has not shrunken, tapered, or dissolved the way I thought it was supposed to. How is this one HJ out of the whole lot the only hat to look right? Am I that lucky? Because they're supposed to be horrible.

Yeah, that's it. A reblocked HJ is so much better, i.e. more taper resistent than the stock HJs. So, a good route to go is to buy a soft HJ and have it reblocked. This really helps the felt out, as I don't think they are making these hats the old way. Now, they will still taper, like any hat, but you will get more miles out of it before you have to have it reblocked again.

You went the right route there Aeris. That is the key to the HJ. Get someone who knows what they are doing to remake the hat. (which is what a reblock actually does)

A reblocked HJ pulls off the Raiders look very well. Sure, it is a low quality hat, but it will still last you quite awhile. But if money is an issue, there are better hats out there, if you don't mind wearing one without the HJ name. Regards, Fedora

Texas Raider · Post by **Texas Raider** » Tue Sep 04, 2007 5:05 pm

I'll be one to attest to this theory of the hat being "not really" for adventuring.
I hike, climb, cave, and "adventure" a TON! When hiking on single track or no track at all, on just basic, flat ground (or up hills) a fedora is not an issue at all,,other than a big gust of wind taking it (but that would mean you're not a hero, right?

) anyhooo,
as for real climbing, I can tell you the hat sometimes gets in the way,,mainly obstructing your view for handholds,footholds,or fitting into narrow passages, etc. And if a gust takes your hat and you try (instinctively) to grab for it,,you may be on your way down a long ways. Caving can sometimes prove a bit cumbersome as well, as you hit the hat on virtually every low,narrow wall or ceiling constantly. Not to mention the heat factor in warmer climates,,the sweat literally fills up my hat as the sweatband makes a good seal on my head, to where sweat pours down my face when I adjust or take off the hat.
Now, the hat's not as dangerous as the bag when climbing, but that's another story.
Bottom line, if referring to someone such as Indy, being dragged by trucks,flying planes and especially FIGHTING, etc, a fedora is COMPLETELY unrealistic! It would NEVER stay on. Just watch the outtakes of Ford riding the horse, it repeatedly flys off of his head. This is what would really happen. I've actually riden horses with my lid, but didn't do anything too strenuous to make it fly off, so it obviously can be done, (cowboys do it, although some have a neck string and let the hat lay back on their shoulders while briskly riding) but chances are, it'll fly off eventually.
Anyhooo, just thought I'd put in my 2 cents worth.
Me personally, I'll put up with the problamatic issues that "adventuring" with a fedora causes, just because I love wearing one while I'm doing it,and there a few benefits,,keeping the sun off of me being the biggest here in the desert, but the problems are there, I just deal with 'em. It's the price we pay for being an Indiana Jones fan (read "wannabee")

TR

Fedora · Post by **Fedora** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:33 am

Yet, back once upon a time, everyone wore hats, and they even wore them while exploring and adventuring. That a hat can get in the way was well known back then.

I recall a passage from a book, written by Colin Fletcher, who hiked Death Valley, along with the Grand Canyon, and other places, solo. He ran into an old desert rat, and prospetor. A really old guy. When he noticed Colin did not have a hat on(he had lost it) he told Colin to hurry up and get another one. He told Colin that most of the dead folks they find in Death Valley, were almost always.........hatless. Those old timers definitely believed in wearing hats, no matter how hot it was outside. Felt hats. Regards, Fedora

BendingOak · Post by **BendingOak** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 11:47 am

I had to share this beauty.

We have a saying around the firedepartment.........If you can't take the heat .......become a cop.

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 11:53 am

I'll be under the Plymouth. I think I hear some incoming rounds, BOak!

Regards! Michaelson

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 11:58 am

Quick! Somebody divert Buff from this thread! Fire in the hole!!!!

GCR · Post by **GCR** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 12:44 pm

I think a lot of the debate hinges on what sort of adventure you're involved in. I can come up with a whole list of fun and adventurous things that would be virtually impossible to do while wearing a fedora (or just about ANY hat for that matter). Skydiving, hang-gliding, scuba-diving or snorkelling, and like TR mentioned, rock climbing and spelunking. Yet there are plenty of others things to do that are fun and adventurous were wearing a hat isn't just possible, it's probably a GOOD IDEA. Hiking, backpacking, camping, fishing, hunting, kayaking, canoeing (sp?), horseback riding (as long as it's pulled down tight

), etc.

Wearing hats while doing fun and adventurous things isn't a new concept, so why is wearing a particular type of hat "fiction"? What makes a fedora such a poor choice for "adventure"? Is it the fact that the fedora as we know it was not intentionally designed specifically as an "adventure hat"? These days, most folks think of fedoras as "dress hats", something to wear if you're getting dressed up in a suit and you want to add some vintage class. But a fedora is not just a "dress hat". Back in the old days, men wore hats ALL THE TIME, not just while wearing suits (even though suit wearing was more common back then). But my point is, the fedora was designed to be WORN, not just worn on special occassions. Maybe it wasn't designed to be a rugged adventurers hat, but it WAS intended to serve a very real purpose day in and day out: to protect the wearer from the sun and elements (looking good was, of course, a bonus

). As fedoras fell out of fashion, and the methods of construction and materials changed (for the worse), fedoras became relegated more to the "dress hat" role, a role that didn't require a hat to stand up to rain and snow and sun like it used to, as it probably saw very limited use, mostly in good weather. Then WE came along...the gearheads who actually wanted to WEAR the gear. We're not reinventing the role of the fedora here, we're merely trying to bring things back to the way they were. In the old days, you COULD wear a hat in the elements, day in and day out, without it withering away. That's all most of us want these days. It doesn't need to be an "adventure hat", just a REAL hat.

Tone - I'm still waiting to hear your opinions as to why you think the fedora as an "adventure hat" is "fiction". Don't you have a section of your "adventure-realm.com" website advertising fedoras as "fedoras to be worn on adventures" or some such?

Still waiting on those HJ pics, too.

-GCR

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 1:07 pm

to me, life is an adventure....so why not dress accordingly?

i'm claiming rights to that saying just in case we get our sigs back.....wink wink...nudge nudge.