Indy IV Boots

Neolithic · Post by **Neolithic** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 2:12 am

Without discussing vendors, did anyone notice that Indy's boots look like they've got a different style to what we've seen before? Or am I just imagining it?

(I just edited the title as it's obvious Alden are back and I don't think this is an issue?)

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 12:17 pm

i noticed the boots more on that pic where hf is having coffee and his brim is flipped up.....looks like the same boots as he had in raiders but really, really distressed. i haven't seen them close enough to confirm if they are aldens or not.

Indiana · Post by **Indiana** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 12:39 pm

If you take a real colse look, they do look like incredibly distressed Aldens. I don't know why they wouldn't go with the Alden, since it is still available.

Dostacos · Post by **Dostacos** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 1:47 pm

Indiana wrote:

If you take a real colse look, they do look like incredibly distressed Aldens. I don't know why they wouldn't go with the Alden, since it is still available.

notice how the leather at the foot is wider than the sole, shaped like the foot more than a new pair? That iis the sign of a WELL worn pair of boots. those may well be from the last movie OR out of Harrison Ford's closet. At 65 he may not be up to breaking in a new pair, and those look to be NATURALLY distressed

my most comfortable cowboy boots had that same flair of top over the sole [contrary to popular belief, cowboy's spent a great deal of time WALKING and not just riding

spent my youth as a ranch hand]

Post by **Michaelson** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 2:19 pm

Keep in mind, Ford is the one who brought Alden 405's to the 'Indy party' in the first place.

Those boots could very well be his own personal Alden work boots from home.

Regards! Michaelson

Post by **Tennessee Smith** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 2:39 pm

My wife showed me a picture from one of her magazines earlier today. It showed Ford on the set and he was definately wearing Aldens. I tired to get the magazine to scan it but she already through it away. It's covered in coffee grounds.

Neolithic · Post by **Neolithic** » Sun Aug 12, 2007 11:16 pm

This is a relief!

Thanks, fellas.

Aldens rock!

Satipo · Post by **Satipo** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 1:33 pm

Hi Michaelson. I never knew Ford was responsible for the Aldens. What's the story behind that?

Adios,
Satipo

Castor Dioscuri · Post by **Castor Dioscuri** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 2:16 pm

Michaelson wrote:...the Aldens were boots that Ford himself brought to the character, as he was a wearer of the 405's as a carpenter before he became a star, so apparently he may have some problems himself. They're also good for folks who are on their feet a lot, so that may be the reason he liked them at that job. Regards. Michaelson

Satipo · Post by **Satipo** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 3:17 pm

Nice one, Castor!

Adios,
Satipo

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 3:26 pm

Hi Michaelson. I never knew Ford was responsible for the Aldens. What's the story behind that?

Adios,
Satipo

the costumer deborah nadoolman picked indy to wear red wing boots. ford was wearing alden 405's prescribed by his doctor from an injury that he retained from star wars. the boots were period correct and were insisted upon by ford so thats what he wore. the rest is gear history.

Satipo · Post by **Satipo** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:37 pm

Ah, I see. Thanks for elaborating, Indiana G. Well, I certainly love my Aldens. Very comfortable in a strange, rigid kind of way. Had them for four years now and still get a buzz while wearing them, particularly when driving or stepping on small, dark paving stones.

Just out of curiosity, what do the "Red Wings" look like?

Adios,
Satipo

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 4:58 pm

there's a number of red wing shoes that currently are really great close-enuff's. search the internet and ye shall find. i also believe that strider got a very nice pair of red wings from his grandma. search the posts in general gear and ye shall find.

the best ones that i have seen were red wings 100 year classics iirc which were only available in europe

Kt Templar · Post by **Kt Templar** » Mon Aug 13, 2007 5:03 pm

Indiana G wrote:there's a number of red wing shoes that currently are really great close-enuff's. search the internet and ye shall find. i also believe that strider got a very nice pair of red wings from his grandma. search the posts in general gear and ye shall find.

the best ones that i have seen were red wings 100 year classics iirc which were only available in europe

Don't cry G, I've never seen the 100 Y here and Redwings cost as much as Aldens in Europe

TheFedoraGuy · Post by **TheFedoraGuy** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:48 am

The 1910
http://www.redwingshoe-europe.com/Defau ... ?tabid=386

1912
http://www.redwingshoe-europe.com/Defau ... ?tabid=388

and 1908 are close to the 405s (and actually 1908, 1910 and 1912 do look pretty much the same). Regardig the unavailability in the US, there's also a vivid discussion on thefedoralounge.com ongoing. Personally, I live in Europe and got one of the last pairs of 1908s, which are absolutely great btw.

Edit: At least in Germany Redwings are cheaper than Aldens - the Gentleman Classic Traveler series is about 280€, Aldens for Europeans are 300US$ plus 50US$ international shipping plus at least 50€ tax and UPS fee

)

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:59 am

those 1912's are beautiful!!!

RichardSK · Post by **RichardSK** » Tue Aug 14, 2007 1:45 am

I didn't know the history of how the 405's got into the movies but I can certainly agree with the reason. As one who suffers from the beginning stages of arthritis and has a rebuilt ankle, the Aldens are the most comfortable shoe I own. I can walk and hike for miles in them and find them more comfortable than tennis shoes. I have even dyed a pair black for use at work as I am on my feet all day.

Jedinizar · Post by **Jedinizar** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 8:10 am

TheFedoraGuy wrote:The 1910
http://www.redwingshoe-europe.com/Defau ... ?tabid=386

1912
http://www.redwingshoe-europe.com/Defau ... ?tabid=388

and 1908 are close to the 405s (and actually 1908, 1910 and 1912 do look pretty much the same). Regardig the unavailability in the US, there's also a vivid discussion on thefedoralounge.com ongoing. Personally, I live in Europe and got one of the last pairs of 1908s, which are absolutely great btw.

Edit: At least in Germany Redwings are cheaper than Aldens - the Gentleman Classic Traveler series is about 280€, Aldens for Europeans are 300US$ plus 50US$ international shipping plus at least 50€ tax and UPS fee )

Thank you very much, I was looking for good shoes since... but was afraid by the costs to order Aldens... and I'm living in Frankfurt/ Germany and did never know about that shop...

Rundquist · Post by **Rundquist** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:09 pm

Indiana G wrote:
Hi Michaelson. I never knew Ford was responsible for the Aldens. What's the story behind that?

Adios,
Satipo
the costumer deborah nadoolman picked indy to wear red wing boots. ford was wearing alden 405's prescribed by his doctor from an injury that he retained from star wars. the boots were period correct and were insisted upon by ford so thats what he wore. the rest is gear history.

I’m not disputing that, but are you sure about your facts? I’ve never heard this (the Star Wars injury). Alden 405’s used to be a standard among carpenters and handymen in Southern California during the 70’s. Fritz (the man that sold them to Ford originally) told me that he used to sell a lot of them at that time. Ford did come in looking for boots because of issues he was having with his back, but I think he came in during his carpentry days. I believe that Sergie (a member on this board) took notes from Fritz as to when Ford first purchased the Alden 405. Cheers

ps- I see that Michaelson has already stated as much.

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:11 pm

I always heard it was from his carpenter days as well, and well before his SW stint.

Regards! Michaelson

Rundquist · Post by **Rundquist** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:13 pm

Michaelson wrote:I always heard it was from his carpenter days as well, and well before his SW stint.

Regards! Michaelson

You're fast!

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:20 pm

Nah, just hiding in the bushes again.

Regards! Michaelson

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:31 pm

I’m not disputing that, but are you sure about your facts? I’ve never heard this (the Star Wars injury). Alden 405’s used to be a standard among carpenters and handymen in Southern California during the 70’s. Fritz (the man that sold them to Ford originally) told me that he used to sell a lot of them at that time. Ford did come in looking for boots because of issues he was having with his back, but I think he came in during his carpentry days. I believe that Sergie (a member on this board) took notes from Fritz as to when Ford first purchased the Alden 405. Cheers

hey rundquist, i'm just reiterating what my alden's salesperson told me. it's only as good as where his facts came from. maybe him injuring himself while jumping through the blast doors is all hype?

i do know he was still a carpenter when he auditioned for han solo though....the two timelines are quite close. perhaps sergie can clarify the story

ij1936 · Post by **ij1936** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:49 pm

I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade, but does it really matter how the boots got into the films? Whether Ford brought them on board or not is of no consequence; the point: they were used in the movies, they are quality footwear, they are part of Indy's gear (which is really the main point), and the look the period. Period.

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:23 pm

Not sure I understand your point there. If that were the fact, why would we care who made the jacket...where the hat came from...the whip....the bag....etc.?

The costumer has stated categorically that she spec'd Redwings to be worn by Ford, and that was the end of the conversation. She never HEARD of Aldens, and therefore, they were never used, according to her.

We know differently, and it's been proven over and over again, so that bit of history is there due to these discussions.

So, if we follow your line of thinking, why does this site even exist in the first place?

Personally I'm glad these tidbits ARE in the record, as they were used by certain folks to re-create the costume for the current film, as no specific records were ever kept by those who were involved IN the use of the costume years ago. WE have been the archive and source for the making of the new film.

If these items DIDN'T exist, Ford would be wearing Redwings and a Wilson jacket in this film (she never heard of Wested leather or Peter Botwright either, by the way, when it came to the history of the Raiders costume).

Regards! Michaelson

Indiana Jess · Post by **Indiana Jess** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 4:07 pm

Another little tidbit about the shoes is that original costume was to have Ford wear riding boots similar to Belloq. Ford argued that Indy was more of a "Blue collar" archaeologist who would have worn practical gear instead of fancier clothing of the spoiled rich like Belloq. I appreciate the fact that Ford was already giving a more common sense approach to the development of his character.

Rundquist · Post by **Rundquist** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 4:08 pm

I’m definitely not wanting to come off abrasive (at least in this instance).

I also have to agree with Michaelson. The story of the gear is one of the reasons I keep coming back to COW. I’m no longer interested in obtaining the “perfect” piece of gear.

But now that I know the source of the “Star Wars” story, I’m inclined to believe that it is false. Alden didn’t actually become involved with supplying shoes (beyond their product) until Last Crusade. Ford told the costumers to buy the shoes directly from Fritz (Fritz was an extremely likable guy). Fritz supplied shoes for both Raiders & Temple. There was a new costume person for LC and Fritz was not contacted. Cheers

ij1936 · Post by **ij1936** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:25 pm

I thought I made my point.

It doesn't matter HOW the boots, jacket or anything else got into the film. The only thing that matters (at least to me) is who made the costume items that were used in the films and where can I get those items? When I first entered into the sub-culture of Indiana Jones, I wanted the costume items made by the manufacturer who made them for the movie. I never gave it a thought as to how these items were chosen and honestly I couldn't care less. Lee Keppler was very instrumental at the start of my hobby. He had a wealth of information on who the vendors were back then, but my only concern was obtaining the costume from the actual manufacturers. Lee gladly helped and for that, I am grateful.

Whether Ford personally brought the Aldens from his own stash or not doesn't matter. They were used and that's it. Sure it's neat to hear little stories about how the boots might have been selected, or if the costumers never heard of Peter or Leather Consessionaires (Wested) when they were looking for the jacket, but the real reason we're here is for the WHO and the WHERE, i.e. WHO made the jacket and WHERE can I get one?, WHERE can I get the whip?...

The only how I'm interested in is: "That costs HOW much!?!

"

Castor Dioscuri · Post by **Castor Dioscuri** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 6:30 pm

ij1936 wrote:the real reason we're here is for the WHO and the WHERE, i.e. WHO made the jacket and WHERE can I get one?, WHERE can I get the whip?...

Perhaps knowing the who and the where is the point of the journey, but knowing the why helps bring it all into perspective.

Sometimes it's not enough for an archaeologist to dig for the sake of digging; he must also know WHY he is digging. To use Indy's universe as an example, the former would be Belloq (get the idol, screw the rest), and the latter would be Indy (get the idol, and know why it's so important).

RichardSK · Post by **RichardSK** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 7:18 pm

Personally, I'm curious as to where his new gear comes from. We all know about the hat, but, were his shirt and pants made by a studio seamstress or were they purchased from someone we know? Where did his gunbelt and holster come from? Time will tell as the topic is off limits for the time being.

IndyFan89 · Post by **IndyFan89** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 7:42 pm

8138

These are really good close enoughs. Great Find!

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:02 pm

The only how I'm interested in is: "That costs HOW much!?! "

ij1936....i hear you loud and clear

indygear is officially budgeted in my books now....it has to be as many of you know.

Post by **Michaelson** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 8:07 am

I'm afraid that's where the message gets lost. To me it's NEVER been the cost, but the journey, and how close can I come until (or if) I decide to replace my 'close enough' with an example of the 'real thing'.

This is a community of fans about the gear and a fictional character....but in MY mind it's NEVER been trying to 'keep up with the Jones's'.

I'm more interested in the journey, and the stories about HOW that journey came about, and the reasons behind those items existance. In our films, it was not a matter of the designer or prop master just handing an item to Ford and away he went. There were a LOT of changes along the way, and a lot of odd things that caused certain items to BE 'offical'.

The boots were Ford's personal shoes. The gloves were borrowed from a grip working on a particular set at the time. The hat design in the first film came about from Ford constantly messing around with the bash to make it fit his head better, and NOT from primping by a costume designer during the shoot.....on and on.

If my stuff is 'close enough', or YOUR stuff is close enough, that's fine with me. I've said before, and I'll say again, if one member wears a paperbag on their head and calls it an Indy fedora, because that's all they can afford at that time, they're just as high in MY book as the guy who has 20 AB Deluxes in their stable. No difference in the ranking to me....one just has deeper pockets, or more debt.

Regards! Michaelson

Satipo · Post by **Satipo** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 8:48 am

The way I see it, it's ALL in the details. And, for me, the details are not just visible costume/prop details, but the reasons and circumstances behind their existence.

The "whys" and "hows" give history and character to the items we collect, elevating them to a level higher than mere movie costume and props, making them far more desirable.

Whether it be a car, building, painting or movie character's appearance, isn't it always fascinating to discover the influences behind the creation of things that have achieved classic status?

Adios,
Satipo

binkmeisterRick · Post by **binkmeisterRick** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 9:15 am

Michaelson wrote:I've said before, and I'll say again, if one member wears a paperbag on their head and calls it an Indy fedora, because that's all they can afford at that time, they're just as high in MY book as the guy who has 20 AB Deluxes in their stable. No difference in the ranking to me....one just has deeper pockets, or more debt.

Regards! Michaelson

I guess it's time we show the original Venice Pier hat:

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 11:54 am

I've said before, and I'll say again, if one member wears a paperbag on their head and calls it an Indy fedora, because that's all they can afford at that time, they're just as high in MY book as the guy who has 20 AB Deluxes in their stable.

well put sir

the bottom line is we all enjoy this hobby or we wouldn't be here reading this post. whether we go with close enoughs or the really really close enoughs

its all a matter of having fun finding them, getting them and enjoying them in your collection. i enjoy the really really close enoughs or SA stuff (i use SA loosely as i'm starting to believe that SA means screen used...and those are really hard to obtain

)....other folks love to hunt for the close enoughs......there's some great indyish stuff out there that are not westeds, aldens, nh's, etc and these people look fantastic (ie - pitfall harry).

this community is great and welcoming. no one is judged for the gear that they select so feel free to share as much as you can so we can build up our overall community knowledge. keep enjoying it....all of it....buying, waiting, sharing

ANZAC_1915 · Post by **ANZAC_1915** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 12:06 pm

I have to agree on the story and the context being an important part of the gear. I've greatly enjoyed the discussions I've had in person with David Morgan, Peter Botwright, Noel Howard and others.

Actually of all these suppliers and people floating around, I have the impression that Noel (being at B&N in the middle of the supply chain between the costumer designer and sub-contractors) has the most of this context.

Why was this piece of gear chosen? What where the other choices? How did it stand up during filming? How was it distressed? How did they keep the whip on the belt? (lol) What changed between films?

A great example, the Aldens and the Wells Lamont gloves. They're real working man's clothes (albiet a little pricey on the Aldens) - knowing they were chosen because Ford's bad feet or back, and the gloves (maybe) came from a grip on the set, that tells me a lot about "do I want the same thing or just something that looks like them?"

The David Morgan whip chosen was Vic Armstrong's.... and he was already a whip owner/cracker. That's more important to me than "go buy a $770 whip from David Morgan".

So part of this assemblage of pieces was "the look" from the costume designer, but the other part to me was where the pieces came from and why.

My goal is not screen accuracy, but more "real life accuracy". i.e. If Indy was a real person (some on here shocked he is not!?

) , what would he actually wear on his adventures?

ob1al · Post by **ob1al** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 12:08 pm

That Venice Pier hat Bink posted a pic of has a Raiders block...

Rundquist · Post by **Rundquist** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:15 pm

ij1936 wrote: I thought I made my point. It doesn't matter HOW the boots, jacket or anything else got into the film. The only thing that matters (at least to me) is who made the costume items that were used in the films and where can I get those items?

You did make your point, and it’s a valid point for you (and perhaps for other people on this board). But not everybody is you, or thinks as you do.

ij1936 wrote: ....... but the real reason we're here is for the WHO and the WHERE, i.e. WHO made the jacket and WHERE can I get one?, WHERE can I get the whip?...

Try to be a bit more careful speaking for me (“the real reason we're here”). I can only assume that I’m included, as I’m part of the collective “we”. I would never presume to say that my criteria for selecting a jacket should also be your criteria, for instance. Cheers

PS- If guys like Lee Keppler and Michaelson didn’t care about the stories of where this stuff came from, Indy gear would not be a one stop shop where the whole costume is just a mouse-click away. We’d all be wearing A-2 jackets.

JerseyJones · Post by **JerseyJones** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:27 pm

ob1al wrote:That Venice Pier hat Bink posted a pic of has a Raiders block...

And look its GRAY !

Renderking Fisk · Post by **Renderking Fisk** » Thu Aug 16, 2007 7:07 pm

The stories about how what peice of gear came into the Gear Set is important because it's part of nailing down if an item is indeed the correct one. There are some folks who want to collect the most screne accurate Gear Set possible, so any and every detail... no matter how minor... is important.

Folks like IJ1936 only want to know two things: How much and where. That's enough for him because he's able to take it on faith that the Foks here on IndyGear are correct.

I personally love the stories about how what gear item came into being. One thing I want to know is, what other period boots did they have in mind?

swright007 · Post by **swright007** » Tue Sep 25, 2007 5:27 pm

"Hi Michaelson. I never knew Ford was responsible for the Aldens. What's the story behind that?

Adios,
Satipo"

In regards to the above quote, I met Peter Mayhew at a convention twice (2 separate years in a row). In talking with him, I found that Peter has ankle issues. He also told me that he wasn't the only actor that has foot trouble.. I asked if "he was referring to Harrison Ford because I had heard that the Alden shoes that he wears are to make a foot/ankle issue that he has comfortable. He is rarely ever seen without them." Peter told me that what I thought was more than likely the case but that he "didn't like to answer for other actors even if he knew I was correct"... hinting that I was on the right track.

Hope that helps a little.

Happy Gearheading,
Scott

McFly · Post by **McFly** » Tue Sep 25, 2007 5:48 pm

Renderking Fisk wrote:I personally love the stories about how what gear item came into being. One thing I want to know is, what other period boots did they have in mind?

Redwings!!