What color was the TOD & LC whips?

IndyFan89 · Post by **IndyFan89** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 5:43 pm

And what style. Where they much diffrent from Raiders?
;0

Indiana G · Post by **Indiana G** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 5:48 pm

check out bernardo del carpio's website. he has a really good overview of all the whips used in the trilogy.

i forgot the exact address but it is in the vendor announcement section.

Indiana Jerry · Post by **Indiana Jerry** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 5:49 pm

A TOD whip is pictured here: http://www.indygear.com/gear/whip.shtml

VP · Post by VP » Wed Jul 25, 2007 6:01 pm

http://delcarpiowhips.com/bullwhips_00.html

whiskyman · Post by **whiskyman** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 6:15 pm

There have been pics posted here before of a screen usede LC whip - and in the European summit pics (I think Pandora's) there are pics of a TOD bullwhip. Basically these whips were darker than the Raiders whips. The LC whip was also a slightly heavier built whip compared to the whips of Raiders. Morgan has developed his whips over the years, and one of the differences is that they are now somewhat thicker than they used to be. The 2 Morgans from the early 90s that I owned were slimmer than the 2 Morgans I owned from 2002 /2007. The Raiders whips were slimmer still.

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 6:45 pm

These can all be answered by reading though this site and the forum archives.

All the whips used were the series 450 Bullwhips by David Morgan in various lengths, they where ALL done in natural tan. This leather darkens with age, use and exposure to sunlight that’s why they look darker & lighter depending on the scene. One whip used in the last crusade was dyed black with a red handle

Raiders of the Lost Ark Bullwhip

It's believed that some if not many of the bullwhips used in Raiders of the Lost ark where made from Kip side, the leather from adolescent cattle, due to a embargo on Kangaroo leather in the U.S. where as the subsequent bullwhips for the following films where made from Kangaroo hide after the ban was lifted.

Temple of Doom Bullwhip

Last Crusade Bullwhips

Keep in mind that as they are handmade, even the bullwhips used in the same film can differ slightly in appearance if you look closely enough. However for physical & cosmetic differences in the appearance of whips between the films as they changed over time see Bernardo’s webpage, I think he does a very good job categorizing them.

Lastly one of my Morgan bullwhips for comparison

Dan

Bernardodc · Post by **Bernardodc** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 1:58 pm

Some of the TOD whips were dyed (not all) dark brown. Some LC whips appear to have been dyed as well (again, not all).

As Whyskyman said, the thickness and weight of Morgan whips have been increasing over the years. They say a picture is worth a thousand words, right? Well, here are some pics definitely worth looking. They were taken by my good friend and fellow whipmaker Paul Nolan. Hope he doesn't mind me posting them

as they are really good pics.

He recently got an old Morgan whip for repair, and I asked him if he'd be so kind to take some pics for me, specially comparing it against his Morgan made in 2000. Well, once again, Paul delivered, and some of the resulting pics are below. They are awesome.

The oldest (darker one) is an 8 footer (manufacture year unknown) and the other is Paul's 10 footer. It's features are consistent with my own 8ft Morgan made in the same year, 2000.

In the older whip you can see the thinner and slightly tapered handle, the thong is thin as well. As we all know, the ring knot is placed right at the end of the spike. I find that its style will fit both Raiders and TOD style bullwhips. Its dimentions closely match those of the Raiders whip Sergei documented some time ago, posted above by Dan.

Anyway, hope you all enjoy the pics.

Regards,

Bernardo
www.delcarpiowhips.com

whiskyman · Post by **whiskyman** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 2:08 pm

Great pics!!

That really showcases the differences very well. Just look how much wider the strands are on the more recent whip!

WhipDude · Post by **WhipDude** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 3:56 pm

Awesome pictures! Thank you for sharing them. I'm digging that older DM whip. Like the color. I wonder why exactly DM's whips change like this? Are they updates to make the whip better constructed? Just preference of the maker? By accident? Different supplies and ways of making the whips?

midwestwhips · Post by **midwestwhips** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:10 pm

Thanks for posting the pics Bernardo! I completely forgot to post them.

It was great to see that older Morgan in person, it had a lot of similarities to the Raiders whip I saw that Mark Allen had.

Whiskyman, the diameter is much larger on the more recent whip as well.

WhipDude, I think part of the reason we notice so much difference in Morgans whips is that he only makes one style of whip. He has made so many over the years that the small differences are even more noticeable.

Major things like the placement of the transition knot, and the major diameter differences can be accounted for changes to the construction, but most of the minor differences are due to the leather itself. Some hides are thicker even if it is just a little bit, and throughout the layers of the whip, it adds up. Also stretch, and minor differences in the cutting due to natural human "error"(for lack of a better word).

Those are things that are different in almost every whip for every whip maker. Just something to keep in mind.

Regards,

Paul Nolan
www.midwestwhips.com

genexs · Post by **genexs** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 10:54 am

Great post, folks. Very informative and very interesting. Just last week I had someone who came to a whipclub practice, who was interested in the minor (for lack of a better word) changes of the whips construction through the films. I'll point him here.

cheers,
Gene
http://www.signalwhip.org

Post by **BullWhipBorton** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:15 pm

Great pictures Bernardo, thanks for taking them Paul and for adding in.

I wonder why exactly DM's whips change like this? Are they updates to make the whip better constructed? Just preference of the maker? By accident? Different supplies and ways of making the whips?

I think Paul pretty much answered this question, but to chime in. If you ask any whip maker they will tell you whips change over time. They evolve; sometimes the changes are on purpose sometimes they are just by natural progression. If you look at a whip by Joe Strain from 10 years ago and compare it to one made today, they are different, same holds true with Terry Jacka, Chris Bar, etc and just about every other whip maker I know of. David Doesn’t really make the bullwhips he makes because they where used in movies, He makes them to make strong durable readily cracking whips for performers, stuntmen, collectors, reactors and Indy fans too, but his first goal it to make a good whip so in addition to variations in the materials, over time he's found things that work more to his liking.

I suppose what ever whips where supplied for this new move made today, will be screen accurate again. But Its kind of neat to look at a whips David made from every other year or two over time, the changes are very gradual, much less noticeable then just comparing a bullwhip he made say 30 years ago to one made recently.

Dan

louiefoxx · Post by **louiefoxx** » Sat Jul 28, 2007 10:51 am

Speaking of David Morgan, I've heard some news that in the near future (a few months) he's putting out a book that will go in detail on how he makes his 450 series whip...more than the 2 1/2 pages that are in Whips and Whipmaking.

Possibly he will go into why he's changed what he has in that book...maybe not.

xoxo

Louie