S&W's Brand New Model 22-4; Real Close to Indy's

J_Weaver · Post by **J_Weaver** » Sat Aug 26, 2006 11:21 am

Excellent! I found the same with my Mountain Gun. At 25 yards they go where I tell 'em.

pigirondan · Post by **pigirondan** » Sat Aug 26, 2006 12:40 pm

The Pachmayr Decelerator grips are a beautiful thing. The piece came with "magna" grips that were a tad too small for me.

bleyd · Post by **bleyd** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 7:48 am

I don't own a single gun but do have a love of them.

My Uncle is a police Officer and carries a Sig Sauer but he says he ALWAYS carries his revolver as his backup. He's been in a few firefights and he says when it comes down to it, he'll rely only on the revolver which has never jammed on him. It's saved his life countless times and he'll never go out in the field without one.

J_Weaver · Post by **J_Weaver** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 4:45 pm

Revolvers are hard to beat. Sure autos have their advantages and are easier for most people to shoot, but generally speaking a revolver goes bang everytime with nothing to jam.

On a side note, I was at the range earlier today shooting my .38 Detective Special. I have to confess I did feel a bit outgunned by a few off-duty officers and their .40 cal Glocks.

P.S. Your uncle is a wise man.

Post by **Michaelson** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 5:27 pm

I'm a wheel gun man myself, but don't be lulled into the total belief that revolvers are 'fool proof'. They aren't.

I once owned a Smith model 29 .44 mag that I took target shooting at my father-in-laws home. After putting 12 rounds through the gun, it locked up tighter than a bank vault. It took several minutes to finally break the cylinder open.

Bottom line, and after some research, I discovered that the particular model I was shooting had a cylinder problem that some cylinders had left the factory set to far forward in the frame. After several rounds had been fired, powder residue builds up at the back of the forcing cone, in the area called the 'cylinder gap'. Unless you have enough clearance between the front face of the cylinder and the back of the forcing cone, this residue eventually jams the cylinder.

I had to have a cylinder 'end shake bushing' installed to give me the correct cylinder gap of .03" between the cone and cylinder face. If I had been in a situation where this gun had been required for self protection, I'd have been in deep, uh, stuff, as that cylinder locked up to the point of almost requiring hammering open. After the bushing was installed, no further problems.

This is NOT that unusual with Smiths!

Regards! Michaelson

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 5:38 pm

Michaelson wrote:This is NOT that unusual with Smiths!

Regards! Michaelson

Yeah, but the Jones always shot the bad guys!

Post by **Michaelson** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 5:45 pm

True....but they KNEW about that cylinder end shake problem.

Regards !Michaelson

J_Weaver · Post by **J_Weaver** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 9:04 pm

Very true Michaelson! I've seen primers back out enough to jam the cylinder.

Post by **Michaelson** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 11:23 pm

I actually had one do that in a Ruger Blackhawk....and backed out so far it actually went off IN the gun when I manually turned the cylinder and the primer hit the recoil shield!!

Fortunately it was behind a load of snakeshot....but if it had been behind a bullet and a full powder charge, it would have gotten REAL interesting REAL fast!!!

Regards! Michaelson

Bufflehead Jones · Post by **Bufflehead Jones** » Tue Aug 29, 2006 11:37 pm

Michaelson wrote:Fortunately it was behind a load of snakeshot....

Regards! Michaelson

Ummmm.....the way things have been going for me, I think I need to get me some of that.

Post by **Michaelson** » Wed Aug 30, 2006 8:13 am

I got 'cha covered, Bubba!

Regards! Michaelson

pigirondan · Post by **pigirondan** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 1:33 pm

http://www.handgunsmag.com/featured_han ... index.html

An Indy mention.

carebear · Post by **carebear** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 2:48 pm

I was watching Guns & Ammo TV last night and they had found a Smith and Wesson patent on half and full moon clips dated 1886. The Smith revolver at that time was the Model 3 (a break top like the Webley). Apparently the half moons gained ascendence because, with their flat side, they were manufactured and packaged more easily on the equipment of the time.

I never knew they went back that far. There really is very little new in firearms tech.

That was a neat Indy mention in the article.

J_Weaver · Post by **J_Weaver** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 7:43 pm

Thanks for psoting that Dan. One of these days, I'd love to add a Model 22 to the collection!

Post by **Michaelson** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 9:06 pm

pigirondan wrote:http://www.handgunsmag.com/featured_han ... index.html

No WONDER I didn't recognize the Model 22 designation. I DO know the model 1950 Army .45, but didn't know that they had renamed it in 1957!!

Excellent article!!

HIGH regards! Michaelson

cokewithvanilla · Post by **cokewithvanilla** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 11:35 pm

This is a little off topic, but I was surprised when I walked into a gun shop here in Tennessee for the first time. I just moved here and thought I would check it out.... there were shelves lined with assault weapons and the likes. Also, you are allowed to buy silencers here... their selection of silenced guns was pretty excessive...

Am I ignorant, or are silencers illegal in most states?

By the way, nice gun.

Indy1939 · Post by **Indy1939** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 1:09 am

Sorry for keeping it off topic, but... silencers aren't illegal in most states as far as I know. I can tell you that here in South Dakota you cannot own one, however, without a class two firearms license that comes straight from the ATF.

carebear · Post by **carebear** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 1:08 pm

cokewithvanilla wrote:This is a little off topic, but I was surprised when I walked into a gun shop here in Tennessee for the first time. I just moved here and thought I would check it out.... there were shelves lined with assault weapons and the likes. Also, you are allowed to buy silencers here... their selection of silenced guns was pretty excessive...

Am I ignorant, or are silencers illegal in most states?

By the way, nice gun.

I don't know about most but many states regulate short-barrelled rifles and shotguns, fully-automatic weapons, suppressors (not "silencers" there is still noise involved) and "destructive devices" (which can include individual hand grenades) beyond the strictures of Federal Law.

As far as Federal Law goes, all of the above are legal to own with the proper paperwork (usually involving a background check and sign off by a local law enforcement official) and payment of a tax.

Also, as a side note, "assault weapon" properly only applies to fully automatic rifles. Military styled semi-autos are called that by alarmists who want to imply they are more "evil" than other semi-auto's based on their appearance and thus should be banned.

Welcome to one of the free states.

Post by **Michaelson** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 1:37 pm

I also thought only a class 3 collector could own a fully automatic weapon, as well as any supressor, whether it's on a gun or not. Those class 3 licenses were renewable annually, so it was/is quite a pricey 'hobby' to have one.

Regards! Michaelson

cokewithvanilla · Post by **cokewithvanilla** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 1:43 pm

According to my local dealer, if I have the cash to spend... I can get an fully auto AK-47 for roughly 10,000. I can also get the 100 round drum mag for pretty cheap. The semi-auto version only costs around $400. and a silencer ( as i will call it) would cost me the price to machine the barrel, and another 200-400 for the silencer, and 200 as a tax to the government.

As long as the laws stay this way, I think I could be relatively happy here.

oh, and in the laws, from what I've read, Assault Weapon applies to semi-auto weapons as well as full auto.

oh sorry, we are really getting off topic now.

carebear · Post by **carebear** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:51 pm

Michaelson wrote:I also thought only a class 3 collector could own a fully automatic weapon, as well as any supressor, whether it's on a gun or not. Those class 3 licenses were renewable annually, so it was/is quite a pricey 'hobby' to have one.

Regards! Michaelson

Nope, check the attached link (BATF faq's) and look at M15 on transferring possession. Just need it registered and have the tax stamp. You have to have a manufacturer's license to make them and a dealer's license to sell them retail. For all the Const. problems with regulation, the ATF actually has a pretty smooth practical system in place.

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#m1

cokewithvanilla,

Just because a state or federal legislator misuses a term, doesn't make that new invented definition correct. If you look at the definition of terms used in those laws they are all based on appearances (evil looks), not function. A definition based on function would make too many "hunting" rifles and shotguns banned, as semi-auto is semi-auto. It's smoke and mirrors to assuage those afraid of "evil black rifles". True "assault rifles" only come in full auto.

I too apologize for the off-topicality.

On topic, it'd be nice if the Mdl. 22 gets popular enough that fewer original Mdl. 17's get chopped up. Maybe if Taurus could get on board for an affordable, out of the box Indy gun?

cokewithvanilla · Post by **cokewithvanilla** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 3:53 pm

I apoligize if I am misusing the term with those gun magazines, but according to the dictionary I am using it properly under the second definition. However, I do see your meaning.

assault rifle

1. a military rifle capable of both automatic and semiautomatic fire, utilizing an intermediate-power cartridge.
2. a nonmilitary weapon modeled on the military assault rifle, usu. modified to allow only semiautomatic fire.

-Random House Unabridged Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2006.

carebear · Post by **carebear** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 4:43 pm

Yeah, the 2nd definition only came into existence with the Brady Law hype. I dislike imprecision in terms when laws are concerned (on any topic) because it enables the exploitation of the misinformed.

But that's waaaay general.

Where did you move from? If you had to pick a state Tennessee is one of the better ones. Still a nice bit of wilderness left.

I have in my head that most folks on this forum like getting outdoors with their gear.

J_Weaver · Post by **J_Weaver** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 10:41 pm

carebear wrote:Yeah, the 2nd definition only came into existence with the Brady Law hype. I dislike imprecision in terms when laws are concerned (on any topic) because it enables the exploitation of the misinformed.

Without straying further OT. I totally agree. I can't tell you how many folks I've come across that have a warped perception of "assault weapons" do to this "invented" definition of what an assault weapon is. The danger, as I see it is that if the supposed "assault weapons" are banned, then our semi-auto hunting rifles and shatguns are as just a step behind.

cokewithvanilla, I hope you don't think we're jumping on you, because that certainly isn't the case. Its a common misconception these days.

Now back to your regularly scheduled program...

cokewithvanilla · Post by **cokewithvanilla** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 12:08 am

thats quite alright, I knew you guys weren't jumping on me... I was just validating my usage of the term.

I moved from Michigan. Yes, there still is a lot of land here. down the street from me someone is selling 902 acres. Of course that will be bought up by wal-mart and the likes. I am in the nashville area, and I fear that in a couple of years, especially after the Nissan move is complete, most of the land in this area will be sold to businesses.

Post by **Michaelson** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 9:01 am

Thanks for the clarification, carebear. Things have definitely changed since I was a dealer back in the 70's.

Regards! Michaelson

Fatdutchman · Post by **Fatdutchman** » Tue Oct 31, 2006 8:22 pm

I just called my local gunshop today to see if he could get me a model 22. He called a couple of his distributors and told me that since this is a brand new offering from S&W, they aren't really available yet. The distributors expect to get their first ones in 4 to 6 weeks. (the gun magazines always get "advance copies" to write up glowing reviews on...)

I MUST have one! I have wanted one for years anyway, whether it was Indy's gun or not! (you could easily pay well over a thousand dollars for an old one from the '50's or '60's...)

Indy's gun seems to have been a regular military model 1917 (5" bbl) that had an inch cut off, and a new band-type sight installed, hence the "banded muzzle". The military pistols had lanyard rings, the civilian ones did not.

pigirondan · Post by **pigirondan** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 10:43 am

Fatdutchman wrote:I just called my local gunshop today to see if he could get me a model 22. He called a couple of his distributors and told me that since this is a brand new offering from S&W, they aren't really available yet. The distributors expect to get their first ones in 4 to 6 weeks. (the gun magazines always get "advance copies" to write up glowing reviews on...)

I MUST have one! I have wanted one for years anyway, whether it was Indy's gun or not! (you could easily pay well over a thousand dollars for an old one from the '50's or '60's...)

Indy's gun seems to have been a regular military model 1917 (5" bbl) that had an inch cut off, and a new band-type sight installed, hence the "banded muzzle". The military pistols had lanyard rings, the civilian ones did not.

Your dealer is feeding you a line of BS. The Thunder Ranch 22-4 has been out for some time now.

Fatdutchman · Post by **Fatdutchman** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 11:37 am

There were two previous "Thunder Ranch" guns. One was the model 21 (in .44 special), and the other was the model 22 (.45acp). Both of these had the horrible round butt. I've seen plenty of these advertised. The 21 had a hideous gold medallion or something on the sideplate....UGH. Probably why so many dealers have them...they can't get rid of them. The new model 22 (though it is still called a "thunder ranch"...whatever the heck that is...) has the square butt and thankfully, no odd engravings or medallions on it. They may well be feeding me a line, but there ARE two different versions of this gun.

pigirondan · Post by **pigirondan** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:30 pm

Not true. The Thunder Ranch 22-4 is a square butt N frame. Always has been.

pigirondan · Post by **pigirondan** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 2:31 pm

Also, there are some square butt Model 21's starting to appear in nickle.

Fatdutchman · Post by **Fatdutchman** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:05 pm

Well, I see now that the 22 did have the square butt. The 21 has (had) the round butt. I thought that both of them did.

Maybe the 22 is coming out in a "second run" after the first one of last year, or whenever it was. OR, maybe they're not going to make them again at all...I don't know anymore.

I did find out that supposedly there were only 1200 of them made in the "first run".

I need to get to the next big Louisville Gun show. Dec. 9-10. Touted as the largest gunshow in the world. It may well be. It's HUGE. Hopefully, I can pick one up there.

The nickel model 21 was a Lew Horton (a distributor) special. Very few made, and I don't know just when they were done. Last couple of years, I assume.

J_Weaver · Post by **J_Weaver** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:24 pm

Fatduchman, I think your dealer may be refering to a second run. The first run came out back in Febuary or March. I nearly bought one, but I got a heck of a deal on a .45 Colt S&W Mountian Gun and bought it insted.

pigirondan · Post by **pigirondan** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:26 pm

Shot the Model 22 again today. It is splendid. I also shot my Springfield XD .45 ACP. Apples and bowling balls. Both good guns, but what a difference.

randystokes · Post by **randystokes** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 8:57 pm

Michaelson wrote:When I was a gun dealer back in the late 70's, early 80's, . . .

Regards! Michaelson

I just saw this thread. Michaelson, why don't you just list the professions you've had. That could be interesting . . .

1. spear carver
2. wheel maker
3. idol carver
. . .
37. buggy whip manufacturer
. . .

Randy

gunsmith · Post by **gunsmith** » Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:18 am

just a note to indy 45. Your holster is ready. And it is AWSOME. If anyone needs a left hand Indy holster, we have one for sale, the same quaility as the one that Indy would have REALLY used. Heavy leather, hand stitched with heavy waxed thread, aged to look correct, fitted to a 4 inch Smith and Wesson N frame revolver(indy 45's). It takes time to make the best.