Seaplane/steps hat, gray or brown? That is the question.

[Kaleponi Craig]

I watched the movie last night and I hate to say this, but it looks to me that there is a bit of green in the hat...KC

[Fedora]

I am happy this thread is still going without it being locked down. I realize that some folks see this topic as funny, or even weird. To me it is not either. There would have never been a debate if the gray hat appeared brown. That is does not appear brown according to the poll here, shows regardless of what some folks have said, and the proof(some questionable) that has been presented, most of us will believe what the old eyeballs tell us. Otherwise, the old saw of "seeing is believing" would be null and void, and our perception would be practically worthless, on other things. I perceive that hat to be other than brown. I perceived that years ago when I first watched the film, and for me nothing has changed. What really interests me now, is how do some folks see that hat as being brown? The same brown as his main, advernture hat? Years ago, while in college, in some class long forgotten, we all had to take a test to determine if some were color blind. Now, I had been tested for this in the military, as it was necesssary in my job, and according to the military, I was not color blind. But, when I took the test in college, it turned out I was indeed color blind in certain shades of green and blue. Now, I can tell the difference between green and blue, but this test had numerous shades of both colors. I flunked. But, regardless of those results, I still do not believe it!!! I have come to believe the guy who invented that particular color blind test, was in fact, color blind himself. Fedora

[Harrison_Davies]

Well I've spent some time analyzing this and my findings are...there is a definite turning point at which the hat turns grey/gray.

I believe the transformation occurs as Indy steps into a beam of bright white light, which bleaches the hat...this is also backed up by his suit collar also bleaching gray/grey from the same downward pointing light...it is quite possible that the light is coming from one of the planes overhead cabin lights, although unlikely since I doubt it would cause the intense white light and bleaching...if you watch carefully you will see the point at which the hat hits it's tunring point and is bleached by the light..look closer and you 'll see this light also illuminate HF's face. And then later it bleaches his collar.

Exterior of the plane...brown hat
Interior start....brown hat
White Light...grey hat
White Light...grey collar
Gangway to seat...brown hat
Porthole....grey hat
Sits back...brown hat

Let's face it this hat does not like white light.



Thats just my twopence worth.

[bleyd]

Has anyone thought of going to oakland where the original aircarft is and try taking some photos with hats in the same area? I'm sure lighting would be differant but maybe the hat is picking up reflections of the interior. Just a guess that's all. It'd be a cool place to take pictures with Indy gear as well. I told my friend next time I was in that part of the state I want to make a pilgrimage and visit the plane. He promised to take pictures of the college used in Raiders as that scene was filmed in my hometown when he got his digital.

[Strider]

My whole position on this is that it's whatever color the person looking at it thinks it is. If they think it's brown, it's brown. If they think it's grey, it's grey. They'll get a brown or a grey hat and be happy with it, and stop caring after that. That's what I'd do.

[Last Crusader]

Has anyone thought of going to oakland where the original aircarft is and try taking some photos with hats in the same area? I'm sure lighting would be differant but maybe the hat is picking up reflections of the interior. Just a guess that's all. It'd be a cool place to take pictures with Indy gear as well. I told my friend next time I was in that part of the state I want to make a pilgrimage and visit the plane. He promised to take pictures of the college used in Raiders as that scene was filmed in my hometown when he got his digital.

Yes, someone thought of that.

[IndyFlyer]

I gotta go with grey, which is a large reason why I had to have one of AB's greys, it is a dead on match and more unique than another brand's standard grey. However, I still hold that Indy would not have been traveling across the globe toting a second hat box. Besides, grey or brown, either would have been just fine.

[Harrison_Davies]

I take it that that hat is a vintage HJ, and not a newer AB or other?

Also the lighting is all wrong...I can see what the intention is, but the comparison isn't anywhere close.

But hey musta been fantastic to have been there.

Yes, someone thought of that.

[McFly]

Does anyone one else see Indy's light brown coat that he is carrying or did i make that up?

Does anyone one else see Indy's light brown coat that he is carrying or did i make that up?

So that you don't have to say it a third time - I noticed the coat!




Would make sense to wear a brown hat with a khaki overcoat... wouldn't it? Too bad we can't see his hat in that shot! Outside light would be good in this scene, I think.

In Christ,
Shane

[hanson]

I don't see that we should be taking Deborah's words at face value. I have heard of her telling a good friend of ours that he 'was not supposed know that' about Indy's boot being Aldens. Also heard that she used to be super protective of her skills and sources;and, most disturbingly, that she was known in Hollywood as the 'wicked witch of the west'; all hearsay and I will not reveal my sources. But, I can see where the hat could be brown or grey. Remember how Peter O'toole(sic?) freaked Steve Railsback out during the rushes in the Stuntman? I like to beleive that the hat was grey,the suit was dark blue,and his shoes were black, as I have always heard that you do not wear brown shoes or belt with a blue suit unless the shoes are Cordovan(sic?) and it's before labor day or something. I just zoomed in on Indy's shoes on the steps and they appear to be brown. Now my Tv is over 10 years old and the color red sometimes turns blue, so I could be wrong. But, I think we should take Deborah's comments with a grain of salt and ask Indy Magnoli what the suit/hat/shoe combo would have been in that time period and what he thinks was on film. The facts are not always kind but should be respected. But I digress. hanson. PS a tan overcoat goes with anything, including over a wested in Nepal on the drive over to the Raven.

[Feraud]

But, I think we should take Deborah's comments with a grain of salt and ask Indy Magnoli what the suit/hat/shoe combo would have been in that time period and what he thinks was on film.

Why and why?!?
1 - Why "take with a grain of salt" what the costume designer who worked on the film said?? Do you not trust first person accounts?
2 - With all due respect to Indy Magnoli....why ask him?
You can ask.....me, Michaelson, Agent 5, Fedora, etc. or any of the other thousands of Raiders/vintage fans what suit/hat/shoe combo would have been worn in that time period and what we think was on film.

We all have our opinions and that is all they are. The people whose word I trust tend to be those who worked on the film. I have heard their stories have changed over time. This makes me think we may never find out what color the clipper ship hat is.

[Fedora]

I know we have reports of Swales stating he supplied two gray hats. Now, does anyone know who obtained this info? Was this covered back in the Indyfan days, prior to the Gearhead Exodus? If so, it should still be there in the vaults. Wish I had to the time to do a search there. I think some of our sources have been long gone from that time on the net. Fedora

[hanson]

Why you ask? how did this get started; someone asked. Your correct about opinions though, everyone has one and most of them stink. I guess you thought mine did. It seems the more famous one gets; the more their memories change. I just passed along some things I heard for discussion and entertainment. I will ask you, Michaelson, agent5,and anyone else you mentioned. Just out of curiosity;what were the combos on screen and what were they in that time period. I thought of Indy Magnoli because he makes and sales this stuff. Was I anywhere close to being fashionable correct? I would beleive Harrison's account over Deborah's. He probably doesn't remember either. And your right again, we may never know;but, at least it's fun and interesting to try to know what should have been correct.The only first person account I trust is my own;and,I can tell you exactly what I was wearing the second weekend Raiders played in June of 1981- 501 button-fly Levis,addias Superstar tennis shoes with black stripes:no socks, blue KANSAS Audiovisions concert shirt. I had a similar jacket made in Brasil with raglan sleeves and a pleat in the center back, so I was good for a jacket. I also hade a blue double-brested suit,black dress boots,belt,etc.,lots of khaki work pants,shirts and boots. But I didn't have a grey fedora to go with it, and spent and wound up spending years finding one. Why and why? You know why as well as I. LOL hanson.

[Indy Magnoli]

Since I've been called in as an expert witness, all I've got to say is...



"I... see... a ...grey... hat!"



Kind regards,
Magnoli

[PLATON]

The hat was gray.

But I was wondering what's the color of a brown hat under black light?

[Feraud]

Your correct about opinions though, everyone has one and most of them stink. I guess you thought mine did.

I absolutely do not think your or anyone else's opinion stinks!
I think the testimony we choose to believe or discount in some cases says more about what color we want the hat to be, as opposed to its actual color. The discussion is based on what we observe and the fact that people are seeing different colors!
For the record, I see grey. I tend to trust first person accounts given at the earliest time. If those statements change over time I will discount their accuracy. I may not stop believing what I see but am waiting for the final proof.

If you are interested in seeing the various combinations of suit, shoes, hat, trenchcoat, etc. men wore in the past check out The Fedora Lounge. There is a vast repository of knowlege to be found there.

[BendingOak]

indymcfly, didn't want to be a pain in the backside. IS someone else carrying Indy's suitcase in that shot????

[hanson]

Glad to hear it Feraud. You'll have to forgive my comments sometimes I work 24 hours over the weekend and don't take the time I should when I come on here. This is usually my 1st stop and I didn't have time to check out Fedora Chronicles yesterday and started rambling on once again. I hate it when this happens. I see grey also and was just wondering out loud about some stuff.regards hanson.

[Feraud]

Glad to hear it Feraud. You'll have to forgive my comments sometimes I work 24 hours over the weekend and don't take the time I should when I come on here. This is usually my 1st stop and I didn't have time to check out Fedora Chronicles yesterday and started rambling on once again. I hate it when this happens. I see grey also and was just wondering out loud about some stuff.regards hanson.

No worries!

[Renderking Fisk]

If it so pleases the Court Of Popular Opinion, I would like to approach the bench and make a request: I have what I believe is the definitive answer to this question. But first -I got a special request here - I need some screen captures.

If there's already a site or photobucket where this exists, please let me know.

First, I would ask that someone get me a few screen captures of Jones boarding the sea plane, inside the sea plane and in the end of the motion picture where He and Karen Allen are walking down the steps...

Second, I would like some pictures of the Nazi's in Cairo.

Knowing that by asking for these pictures in public might also help the case for the defense. But that’s the risk I’m willing to take in the effort to get to the bottom of this and finally find the truth, once and for all.

I won’t say another word until I’m able to use those pix for peoples exibits on behalf of the persecution. Thank you, your honnor. Thank you also to the jury.

[Bufflehead Jones]

The court will be in recess for one hour, while Mr. Fisk obtains some additional items of evidence.

All rise!

[binkmeisterRick]

RECESS!!!! YAAAAAAYY!!! I call first dibs on the swing set!!!

[Bufflehead Jones]

Ah, bink. Don't you want me to throw you down the slide....I mean....don't you want to go down the slide, first?

[BendingOak]

Just look though the thread. The pics you are looking for are already posted.

[Renderking Fisk]

I think I have all the evidence in my mailbox… I’m down loading some huge files now. I’ll have my testimony with in 24 hours…

[Strider]

Can't wait to see what he's got to say. Ren usually always makes some interesting points.

[Mulceber]

usually always

Okay, tell the truth Strider. How many drinks have you had? :junior: -IJ

[BendingOak]

not enough.

[Strider]

Everyone has their off days.

[Serial Hero]

And, off the wagon days